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Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: stickyfingers101 ()
Date: June 1, 2021 18:19

Monterrat still exists. It's a wonderful place.

That story about Keith and the gun under the pillow and sending in his son Marlon to wake him sounds like BS to me.

no idea about the knife thing...

He's 5'8" and 150lbs....given that, I guess it makes sense he'd want/need knives and guns around to intimidate people...

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: June 1, 2021 18:24

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LeonidP
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georgie48
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Taylor1
Keith is a great artist but trying to make him a tough guy with a knife is laughable.When has he ever got into a fist fight with anyone? He’d probably have trouble with Elton John.When has anyone ever challenged him to a fight and Keith complied? This stuff about him pulling knives on people is ridiculous

Well Taylor1, you missed out on Keith' magnificant swing with his guitar when an overexited fan managed to get on stage to "go after Mick". Don't mess with Keith!
smileys with beer




keef guitar incident

Keith was known to point is gun too, supposedly when he was sleeping late and a show was about to start, everyone was afraid to be the one to wake him, knowing the risk of Keith pulling out the gun under his pillow. They would send in his son Marlon to wake him, knowing he wouldn't do that to his own kid.

As for Taylor1 stating when was Keith known to pull his knife, in Ronnie's own autobiography, he states that Keith once held a knife to Ronnie's throat(quote). Pulled a knife on Ronnie? Big deal.Did he ver pull it on a stranger or get into a physical altercation with anyone? The answer is no.Stop trying to make him this tough guy.It’s silly .Or Elton John might get mad.If you pull a knife on someone, you’d better be careful they don’t reciprocate with deadly force. I doubt Keith could take Elton in a fight



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-01 18:26 by Taylor1.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Mariuana ()
Date: June 1, 2021 18:28

I'm seriously surprised that some people think that Keith using a knife is so cool. First, it is NOT. And telling those stories how he threw a knife or threatened people with it for pretty much nothing is a freaking crime, no matter if you are the Keith Richards or a John Smith from elsewhere. Second, him bragging about it is ridiculous as all his "tough guy" image is staged, mostly by himself and his PR-team.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: jbwelda ()
Date: June 1, 2021 18:36

I found out a long time ago that it is folly to fight someone and expect to win just based on physical condition. Willingness to kill you comes into play here...if you are half hearted in it and your opponent is all in, you are going to most likely lose even if you are 50 lbs and 6" on your opponent. Same with car racing, we are not talking Sunday driving, if you are willing to hang it out on the edge of disaster more often than your opponents, you are most likely going to win the race.

And Elton John? That fat ass Pillsbury dough boy would be down in the first ten seconds.

jb

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: His Majesty ()
Date: June 1, 2021 18:44

Keith and his whole gun and knife hardman shite. eye rolling smiley

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: stickyfingers101 ()
Date: June 1, 2021 18:47

Quote
jbwelda
I found out a long time ago that it is folly to fight someone and expect to win just based on physical condition. Willingness to kill you comes into play here...if you are half hearted in it and your opponent is all in, you are going to most likely lose even if you are 50 lbs and 6" on your opponent. Same with car racing, we are not talking Sunday driving, if you are willing to hang it out on the edge of disaster more often than your opponents, you are most likely going to win the race.

And Elton John? That fat ass Pillsbury dough boy would be down in the first ten seconds.

jb

agreed.

coke-fiends, meth-heads and speed-freaks are the worst people to get into a fight with....you basically have to kill them to end it.

drunks are more a simple-annoyance b/c they get Beer Muscles and think they are Mike Tyson....but most of the time they are sloppy and rely too much on the haymaker...predictably easy to defeat....

I still think I could take Keith....

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: jbwelda ()
Date: June 1, 2021 18:58

>I still think I could take Keith....

I think in most cases Keith would not even bother, he would just sic his bodyguard on you and let him take care of the matter professionally. Keith would have better things to do than fight some random fan with a taste for publicity as the person who "got away with punching KR". Probably been there and done that way too many times by now.

jb

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: June 1, 2021 19:07

Have you all forgotten "the other" knife incident?

The blade Keef showed a dude from the recording crew during the DW sessions? (I guess it was Dave Jerden).Said dude made the mistake of using Varispeed on one of the album songs and Keef noticed it.

"Nobody messes with the tempo of my songs!!" WHACK! grinning smiley

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: HonkyTonkJan ()
Date: June 1, 2021 20:20

Quote
Hairball
Quote
Taylor1
Keith is a great artist but trying to make him a tough guy with a knife is laughable.When has he ever got into a fist fight with anyone? He’d probably have trouble with Elton John.When has anyone ever challenged him to a fight and Keith complied? This stuff about him pulling knives on people is ridiculous

In my neck of the woods, them are fighting words....


Keith looks in really good shape here. Slim waist, muscular shoulders/arms. Never seen him look so strong before or since. His arms are really quite skinny nowadays.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Nikkei ()
Date: June 1, 2021 20:21

Quote
dcba
Have you all forgotten "the other" knife incident?

The blade Keef showed a dude from the recording crew during the DW sessions? (I guess it was Dave Jerden).Said dude made the mistake of using Varispeed on one of the album songs and Keef noticed it.

"Nobody messes with the tempo of my songs!!" WHACK! grinning smiley

Honestly hearing about that one now, the whole thing does become sort of whack



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-01 20:22 by Nikkei.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: June 1, 2021 20:22

Quote
Mariuana
I'm seriously surprised that some people think that Keith using a knife is so cool. First, it is NOT. And telling those stories how he threw a knife or threatened people with it for pretty much nothing is a freaking crime, no matter if you are the Keith Richards or a John Smith from elsewhere. Second, him bragging about it is ridiculous as all his "tough guy" image is staged, mostly by himself and his PR-team.

We're telling stories as we've heard them (or read them). Who said anything about it being cool?

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Mariuana ()
Date: June 1, 2021 21:09

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LeonidP
Quote
Mariuana
I'm seriously surprised that some people think that Keith using a knife is so cool. First, it is NOT. And telling those stories how he threw a knife or threatened people with it for pretty much nothing is a freaking crime, no matter if you are the Keith Richards or a John Smith from elsewhere. Second, him bragging about it is ridiculous as all his "tough guy" image is staged, mostly by himself and his PR-team.

We're telling stories as we've heard them (or read them). Who said anything about it being cool?

I dunno who are the WE and why would you take it personally. But I saw some people who tend to cheer or excuse that behaviour because it's Keith Richards, you know. He CAN. Nope, he can't.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: jp.M ()
Date: June 1, 2021 21:11

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tomcat2006
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Duked
By the way the guy could be easily right: I love Mixed Emotions but the Chris Kimsey 12" mix (back then and still now) is freshier, more energetic and simply better than the album cut.

[www.youtube.com]

Agreed! The 12” is awesome, way improved!

....for me too ....a great Stones track...

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: June 1, 2021 22:14

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Mariuana
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
Mariuana
I'm seriously surprised that some people think that Keith using a knife is so cool. First, it is NOT. And telling those stories how he threw a knife or threatened people with it for pretty much nothing is a freaking crime, no matter if you are the Keith Richards or a John Smith from elsewhere. Second, him bragging about it is ridiculous as all his "tough guy" image is staged, mostly by himself and his PR-team.

We're telling stories as we've heard them (or read them). Who said anything about it being cool?

I dunno who are the WE and why would you take it personally. But I saw some people who tend to cheer or excuse that behaviour because it's Keith Richards, you know. He CAN. Nope, he can't.

? You seem to be taking it personally, no? He's been known to pull his knife and/or gun, documented multiple times. Some seem to be questioning it. It is a debate about that, not about how cool it was or whether or not it was a crime.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Mariuana ()
Date: June 1, 2021 22:33

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LeonidP
Quote
Mariuana
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
Mariuana
I'm seriously surprised that some people think that Keith using a knife is so cool. First, it is NOT. And telling those stories how he threw a knife or threatened people with it for pretty much nothing is a freaking crime, no matter if you are the Keith Richards or a John Smith from elsewhere. Second, him bragging about it is ridiculous as all his "tough guy" image is staged, mostly by himself and his PR-team.

We're telling stories as we've heard them (or read them). Who said anything about it being cool?

I dunno who are the WE and why would you take it personally. But I saw some people who tend to cheer or excuse that behaviour because it's Keith Richards, you know. He CAN. Nope, he can't.

? You seem to be taking it personally, no? He's been known to pull his knife and/or gun, documented multiple times. Some seem to be questioning it. It is a debate about that, not about how cool it was or whether or not it was a crime.

What idicates it was me who took it personally? Was I referring to you? It was you who replied with "WE" hence YOU took it personally. Once again, I met people who excused Keith's dangerous behavior because he's a "badass" and he can. Was it you?
I'm not gonna tolerate this shit and since it's a free message board, I'll be expressing my opinion on the subject. Since you seem to have problem with it and try to drag me into personal argument, I can assume you're among those who think him pulling a knife on people is fine and not a crime. Well, then I can see why would you want to argue with it.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Mariuana ()
Date: June 1, 2021 22:48

Actually it's funny how you say it's not okay for anyone to behave like that and not ok to tolerate it just because it's Keith and then you get someone trying to turn it into argument or smth. For those who seem "whatever" with Keith pulling a knife on peaceful people like a DJ, engeneer or a fellow musician I would recommend to watch him in Altamont. He looked like a pussy staying behind and joined Mick just once with his short remark that they would not play. Later, he was not the one to oppose the HA actions on behalf of the Stones.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: June 1, 2021 23:02

Quote
Mariuana
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
Mariuana
Quote
LeonidP
Quote
Mariuana
I'm seriously surprised that some people think that Keith using a knife is so cool. First, it is NOT. And telling those stories how he threw a knife or threatened people with it for pretty much nothing is a freaking crime, no matter if you are the Keith Richards or a John Smith from elsewhere. Second, him bragging about it is ridiculous as all his "tough guy" image is staged, mostly by himself and his PR-team.

We're telling stories as we've heard them (or read them). Who said anything about it being cool?

I dunno who are the WE and why would you take it personally. But I saw some people who tend to cheer or excuse that behaviour because it's Keith Richards, you know. He CAN. Nope, he can't.

? You seem to be taking it personally, no? He's been known to pull his knife and/or gun, documented multiple times. Some seem to be questioning it. It is a debate about that, not about how cool it was or whether or not it was a crime.

What idicates it was me who took it personally? Was I referring to you? It was you who replied with "WE" hence YOU took it personally. Once again, I met people who excused Keith's dangerous behavior because he's a "badass" and he can. Was it you? ...

Well I brought up the story of him threatening Ronnie, so yes you were referring to me. You are taking it personally, obviously by the tone of your responses, lol.

Did Keith pull a knife on Ronnie? I have no clue, Ronnie says he did, maybe he just wanted to sell copies. But there are stories like this and others out there, deal w/ it.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: harlem shuffle ()
Date: June 1, 2021 23:19

There is alsov a story from Ronnie years ago,about Keith pointed a gun against Jagger,but if it,s true,i dont now.Maybee it,s only a story

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: jbwelda ()
Date: June 2, 2021 00:06

Quote
Mariuana
Actually it's funny how you say it's not okay for anyone to behave like that and not ok to tolerate it just because it's Keith and then you get someone trying to turn it into argument or smth. For those who seem "whatever" with Keith pulling a knife on peaceful people like a DJ, engeneer or a fellow musician I would recommend to watch him in Altamont. He looked like a pussy staying behind and joined Mick just once with his short remark that they would not play. Later, he was not the one to oppose the HA actions on behalf of the Stones.


Bullshit. I was at altamont, not that it particularly matters, and I for one will attest that the Rolling Stones, as a unit and as individuals, proved how tough they were that evening. Keef looked like no "pussy" as he stood there and challenged them right there and then. Do you actually know any HA, then or now? I seriously doubt it or you would not be running their names out of your mouth right now.

It might be a crime to pull a gun or knife on someone but guess what? The Rolling Stones have generally had a pretty close relationship with criminality, probably far beyond what we know because they tell us.

I do admit that Altamont should have taught them several lessons, among them being whom to trust, but it did not seem to and the fact they emerged from the evening not bleeding or dead is testiment to something, baby, because let me tell you, they was all alone up there on that tiny stage feet away from the unwashed masses. Just a shot away, for real.

jb

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: June 2, 2021 01:07

Anyone who puts a knife to someone’s throat unless to defend oneself against imminent physical harm is a criminal and or psychopath, unless the victim knew he wasn’t serious.But even in those situations it can lead to tragedy.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: GJV ()
Date: June 2, 2021 01:57

If someone want to try out Keith's skills with his knife, just take a bite from his shepherd's pie and see what happens next.winking smiley

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: ProfessorWolf ()
Date: June 2, 2021 02:13

i think most of this is probaly image and myth that keith and others have built around keith for half a century or so its fun if you don't take it to seriously

that being said i'm sure keith carried a gun and knife with him in the 70's thru the 80's for protection the people around him (or that found there way near him) especially when he was a herion addict where not people you wanted to f-ck with i'm sure in his mind it payed to have something to protect himself with around them whether he ever flashed it to deescalate (or escalate) a situation or just prove what tough sh-t he was i don't know but there way to many stories out there for it to all be bullsh-t

i do think the story from the steel wheels sessions probaly happended but i bet he just threw it into the floor

i agree with you though taylor1 holding knife to anyones throat is not a joke i can't imagine ronnie forgiving keith if that really happened i wouldn't



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-02 02:59 by ProfessorWolf.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: dead.flowers ()
Date: June 2, 2021 13:00

All these knife and gun incidents are not funny at all. On the contrary, they are way uncool and criminal on top. No excuse for that.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: June 2, 2021 16:42

Quote
dcba
Have you all forgotten "the other" knife incident?

The blade Keef showed a dude from the recording crew during the DW sessions? (I guess it was Dave Jerden).Said dude made the mistake of using Varispeed on one of the album songs and Keef noticed it.

"Nobody messes with the tempo of my songs!!" WHACK! grinning smiley

Actually I came across that "speed" story when I was trying to find the answer to my question...

BY THE WAY - I UPDATED THE FIRST MESSAGE TWO DAYS AGO WITH THE ANSWER for those who read sideways before posting away

...but there were no knives involved and it's Lillywhite who changed the speed : "When we were mixing in New York, Steve Lillywhite changed the speed in one song, sped it up a little bit, and it was hardly anything. Keith walked in and he just went ballistic. He goes Nobody, @#$%& nobody, @#$%& with the Rolling Stones! That tempo was cut at that speed and it stays at that speed!" source : [www.timeisonourside.com]

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-02 16:44 by gotdablouse.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: June 2, 2021 18:50

Quote
ProfessorWolf
i think most of this is probaly image and myth that keith and others have built around keith for half a century or so its fun if you don't take it to seriously
...
Normally I would agree, but there are just too many stories for them all to be just myths, including some in autobiographies.

Another I just found, check the preview and go to pg. 136:
[books.google.com]

----------------------
Keith Richards in particular was not happy with the situation. As Stanley remembers, "I remember them tearing the hall up. Keith was pretty angry."

He was even angrier with Jason Cooper, a jovial, ginger-bearded giant, ex-footballer nicknamed "Moke." Keith never liked Cooper, according to multiple sources, and this was the final straw. Cooper had been Dave Mason's manager - which helped explain Mason's appearance on Gimme Some Neck - but things had now gotten out of hand; as Gary Schultz explains, "Managing a tour with a couple of Rolling Stones was a different matter."

There are versions of what happened next: Memories are clouded by the adrenaline of the moment, time, and maybe other things. Stanley remembers sitting with security man Michael Mauer of the 727 after the show when Ronnie came running down the aisle calling for help - "Keith's pissed off and he's pointing a .44-magnum pistol at Jason," he remembers Ronnie shouting. Others remember it being a switchblade, but either way, the intent was clear. The situation was defused, with the result that Jason Cooper was off the tour and out of a job.
---------------------

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: jbwelda ()
Date: June 2, 2021 18:55

Here's something, you discharge a .44 on an airplane mid air and bad things happen not just to whoever you are pointing at. A blade is a lot more benign in that situation. I doubt Keef is lame enough to shoot a gun in an airplane if indeed it was off the ground. Still, I figure he made his point either way.

jb

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: June 2, 2021 23:16

Oh really, how about the murders in London done by knife wielding terrorists.In America there have been cases of knife wielding killers killing multiple people at one time with one knife. Threatening people with a knife not in self defense is a crime and dangerous.I doubt Keith has ever been in a fistfight let alone a knife fight.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: hopkins ()
Date: June 3, 2021 03:06

He shot water rats. He couldn't fight it out like a man. He scratched his nuts and destroyed nature.

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: hopkins ()
Date: June 3, 2021 03:07

I'm back

Re: Details on the "Knife Incident" during "Steel Wheels" sessions ?
Posted by: jbwelda ()
Date: June 3, 2021 04:05

Quote
hopkins
He shot water rats. He couldn't fight it out like a man. He scratched his nuts and destroyed nature.

For reals. But the geese got fed.

Thanks.

jb



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-03 04:06 by jbwelda.

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