[bestclassicbands.com]

Is this accurate? Did the tongue logo just "turn 50"?

Of course it was designed earlier, but if the article is true, it was first used 50 years ago.

Maybe that's the reason the band changed their profile photo on social earlier this week...

A little bit of London geography for those who may not know.

The Royal College of the Arts is next door to the Royal Albert Hall.

The Royal Albert Hall is pretty close to the Victoria and Albert Museum (down Exhibition Road), and that's where the Pashe's artwork for the logo lives these days.

ie All in quite a small area of London. See [goo.gl]

--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan

Thank you . very interesting. The John Pasche's interview is great.
Best logo the in world.
Rockandroll,
Mops

Quote
Topi

Is this accurate? Did the tongue logo just "turn 50"?

Not quite - the logo (originally designed by John Pasche) was officially used end of 1970 on a Rolling Stones Records letterhead - [iorr.org] - so the logo turned "50" already in 2020.

Thought so Thanks!

Commercially it just turned 50.

The article appears to be correct in that it was the "first public" usage of the logo.
Sure, the internal letterhead pre-dates it, but the launch of it publicly is arguably when the anniversary should be celebrated.

Would LOVE to get ahold of one of those VIP passes, couldn't have been many printed up.

"The Stones first used the tongue logo on VIP passes given out for their March 26, 1971, concert at London’s Marquee club. The image first came into view on a wide scale when the band used it on the insert inside the Sticky Fingers LP, and the record label itself, just weeks after the London show."

Pasche was paid roughly £50, or $75, for his efforts, with no further claim to royalties.

Now thats a ripoff

Quote
NilsHolgersson

Now thats a ripoff

No, John Pasche got later more money for the Tongue & Lips logo - [iorr.org] .

You can support him financially regarding the T&L logo - [iorr.org] , [www.Instagram.com] .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-03-27 17:40 by Irix.

Quote
MisterDDDD

The article appears to be correct in that it was the "first public" usage of the logo.

And the "large audience" saw then the logo exactly 3 weeks later, 16-Apr-1971, on the 'Brown Sugar' - Single.

"The Stones first used the tongue logo on VIP passes given out for their March 26, 1971, concert at London’s Marquee club." - [BestClassicBands.com] .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-03-27 17:55 by Irix.

Quote
Irix

Quote
NilsHolgersson

Now thats a ripoff

No, John Pasche got later more money for the Tongue & Lips logo - [iorr.org] .

Yep, and by the way, in 1971 I paid 75 pennies for my Colston Hall (Bristol) Rolling Stones quality ticket. So £ 50 would equal 66 concert tickets
Pasche did get and additional £ 200 somewhat later (267 concert tickets )
Pasche eventually sold his original design for, I think, around £ 45.000 to V&A museum. How many concert tickets would that be
And Nils, ripoff was an erotic theater show in London

I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town

Quote
Topi
[bestclassicbands.com]

Is this accurate? Did the tongue logo just "turn 50"?

Of course it was designed earlier, but if the article is true, it was first used 50 years ago.

Maybe that's the reason the band changed their profile photo on social earlier this week...

Yup.. Happy 50th to the tongue and lips!

Explains your earlier question re the switching of their social media avatars to the tongue. Shoulda used the Pasche one imo.. wonder if there is any legal or contractual reasons not to. Not likely I suppose.

"On March 23, 2021, the Stones updated the profile pic of their Facebook page. The image? Their classic tongue and lips logo."

Quote
MisterDDDD

"On March 23, 2021, the Stones updated the profile pic of their Facebook page. The image? Their classic tongue and lips logo."

Could be pro-active for the 50th Anniversary of 'Brown Sugar' and 'Sticky Fingers' in April 2021 as well, which includes also the Tongue & Lips logo.

Quote
Irix

Quote
MisterDDDD

"On March 23, 2021, the Stones updated the profile pic of their Facebook page. The image? Their classic tongue and lips logo."

Could be pro-active for the 50th Anniversary of 'Brown Sugar' and 'Sticky Fingers' in April 2021 as well, which includes also the Tongue & Lips logo.

Indeed.

As has been noted in various threads, the first real version appeared in The Beatles Songbook by Alan Aldridge, 1969. The pic below posted by Irix in this thread back in 2015: Beatles tongue
As for when the Stones first used their version, 1970 seems to be the answer, but also seems clear what actually inspired it - that being the Beatles Songbook from 1969.



_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
Hairball
As has been noted in various threads, the first real version appeared in The Beatles Songbook by Alan Aldridge, 1969. The pic below posted by Irix in this thread back in 2015: Beatles tongue
As for when the Stones first used their version, 1970 seems to be the answer, but also seems clear what actually inspired it - that being the Beatles Songbook from 1969.

There is some truth in what you suggest, Hairball, but not time wise.
Pasche had nothing to do with the Aldridge drawing, but Braun clearly did. He received the primitive Pasche version by b/w fax and verbal information from Marshall Chess (on colours f.i.) in late Autumn 1970, and that doesn't come even close to "the Beatles tongue". However, when Braun was forced (there was a lot of pressure on releasing Sticking Fingers as quick as possible, due to the then very popular "fashion" of bootlegging) to create a suitable version, he remembered the Day Tripper image by Aldridge and "added" that to the existing Pasche version. The result (also credit to DiMiceli and Velez) is the all famous "USA" version.

I'm a GHOST living in a ghost town

Quote
georgie48

Pasche had nothing to do with the Aldridge drawing, but Braun clearly did.

Edit: But how to explain the vast similarities between the 1970 rubber-stamp logo (used by Rolling Stones Records) and Alan Aldridge's 1969 Day-Tripper-illustration ?


[iorr.org] , [iorr.org]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-03-30 16:50 by Irix.

As has been discussed in various threads (like that alone makes something true) Pasche was inspired by a picture of Kali that Mick gave him as inspiration.

Wonder if it was this artwork the article pictures and credited, or another?


The Indian artwork on which the Stones’ logo is based

Always assumed it was from this more common depiction.

Quote
Irix

But how do you explain then the vast similarities between John Pasche's 1970 rubber-stamp logo and Alan Aldridge's 1969 Day-Tripper-illustration - [iorr.org] ?


[iorr.org] , [iorr.org]

Not to put too fine a point on it, but mouths and tongues and lips are pretty common. Almost everyone has one. As are their sizes.
Bound to be hundreds of thousands of drawings of mouths with their tongues out.

Quote
MisterDDDD

Not to put too fine a point on it, but mouths and tongues and lips are pretty common. Almost everyone has one. As are their sizes. Bound to be hundreds of thousands of drawings of mouths with their tongues out.

But they have not the same contour/geometrics like Alan Aldridge vs. Rolling Stones:



Examples: Album-Cover Carmen McRae (1954) ; Tom Wesselmann, 'Mouth' series (1966/67) - [iorr.org] , [iorr.org] , [iorr.org] .



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-03-30 22:55 by Irix.

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MisterDDDD

Wonder if it was this artwork the article pictures and credited, or another?

Looks like it's the one from the Interview-Video with John Pasche, Pos. 3:39 - [www.YouTube.com] , since John Pasche did in 2020 a similar 'Kali doodle detail':


[Gramho.com] , [iorr.org]

Quote
Irix

Quote
MisterDDDD

Not to put too fine a point on it, but mouths and tongues and lips are pretty common. Almost everyone has one. As are their sizes. Bound to be hundreds of thousands of drawings of mouths with their tongues out.

But they have not the same contour/geometrics like Alan Aldridge vs. John Pasche:

Popular style in the sixties/seventies. Peter Max et al.

Quote
Irix

Quote
georgie48

Pasche had nothing to do with the Aldridge drawing, but Braun clearly did.

But how do you explain then the vast similarities between John Pasche's 1970 rubber-stamp logo and Alan Aldridge's 1969 Day-Tripper-illustration - [iorr.org] ?


[iorr.org] , [iorr.org]

Obvious similarities and nearly identical - the general shape, the highlights, the bottom lip, the direction of the tongue itself, etc. - not sure how anyone could disagree, and say "Oh, there's been lots of mouths out there".
And the myth of Pasche being inspired by a picture of Kali is a fantasy that some people buy in to for whatever reason, though the truth of what inspired the Stones tongue is right before our eyes in the comparison above.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
georgie48

Pasche had nothing to do with the Aldridge drawing, but Braun clearly did. He received the primitive Pasche version by b/w fax and verbal information from Marshall Chess (on colours f.i.) in late Autumn 1970, and that doesn't come even close to "the Beatles tongue". However, when Braun was forced (there was a lot of pressure on releasing Sticking Fingers as quick as possible, due to the then very popular "fashion" of bootlegging) to create a suitable version, he remembered the Day Tripper image by Aldridge and "added" that to the existing Pasche version. The result (also credit to DiMiceli and Velez) is the all famous "USA" version.

Braun is an interesting character in all this for sure, appreciate the insight on this as there may be some truth to this account, but again, Braun is an interesting character who has had more than one story over the decades, not read this one (link?).The real tell is the lack of any legal action by Aldridge et al.

Alls well that ends well.. no reason on earth Mick and Pasche would conspire to tell some wild tale about hindu goddess's and the process, Congrats again to Mr. Pasche on the 50th anniversary of his creation. Conspiracy theories are still awfully popular it seems.

Art of the Rolling Stones: Behind That Zipper and That Tongue

"Both Mr. Braun and Mr. Pasche are pleased with the results of their overlapping contributions to rock mythology. Initially paid just 50 pounds ($76 at current rates) for the design, Mr. Pasche sold his copyright to the band for £26,000 (about $40,000 at the time) in 1984. In 2008, the Victoria and Albert Museum in London bought his original artwork for £50,000 ($92,500).
[www.nytimes.com]

Quote
georgie48

Quote
Hairball
As has been noted in various threads, the first real version appeared in The Beatles Songbook by Alan Aldridge, 1969. The pic below posted by Irix in this thread back in 2015: Beatles tongue
As for when the Stones first used their version, 1970 seems to be the answer, but also seems clear what actually inspired it - that being the Beatles Songbook from 1969.

There is some truth in what you suggest, Hairball, but not time wise.
Pasche had nothing to do with the Aldridge drawing, but Braun clearly did. He received the primitive Pasche version by b/w fax and verbal information from Marshall Chess (on colours f.i.) in late Autumn 1970, and that doesn't come even close to "the Beatles tongue". However, when Braun was forced (there was a lot of pressure on releasing Sticking Fingers as quick as possible, due to the then very popular "fashion" of bootlegging) to create a suitable version, he remembered the Day Tripper image by Aldridge and "added" that to the existing Pasche version. The result (also credit to DiMiceli and Velez) is the all famous "USA" version.

Given the massive popularity of the Beatles (even to this day), there's a high probability that even Pasche had seen the Aldridge version while browsing through the popular Beatles Songbook from '69.
They're too similar to think otherwise. And then there's the Ernie Cefalu story - not so sure about the details surrounding that controversy, but I do recall that evidently he claims the tongue was fully and solely his creation.
I also recall roller99 (a member here) getting all worked up about it, and was adament it was Ernie Cefalu's design 100%, but I think he was basing that certainty on Ernie's words alone.
Whatever the case, thankful for the Beatles book and Aldridge, as without either the Stones design wouldn't come to exist as we know it.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
Irix

Quote
MisterDDDD

Wonder if it was this artwork the article pictures and credited, or another?

Looks like it's the one from the Interview-Video with John Pasche, Pos. 3:39 - [www.YouTube.com] , since John Pasche did in 2020 a similar 'Kali doodle detail':


[Gramho.com] , [iorr.org]

Good point.. the article likely sourced the version Mick presented.

Almost bought one of the signed Pasche drawings.. forget the price but couldn't justify it at the time.
Bought a signed 50th logo done by Shepard Fairey and love it, this would make a nice accompaniment.

Quote
Hairball

Given the massive popularity of the Beatles (even to this day), there's a high probability that even Pasche had seen the Aldridge version while browsing through the popular Beatles Songbook from '69.
They're too similar to think otherwise.

Whatever the case, thankful for the Beatles book and Aldridge, as without either the Stones design wouldn't come to exist as we know it.

Outstanding! Rarely have I agreed more emphatically with a posting.

--
Captain Corella
60 Years a Fan

Quote
Hairball
And then there's the Ernie Cefalu story - not so sure about the details surrounding that controversy, but I do recall that evidently he claims the tongue was fully and solely his creation.

That's been established as 100% bullshit.

........... barcode tongue



ROCKMAN