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Four Stone Walls

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Big Al

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Four Stone Walls
This is an odd thread really.

There is a difference between paedophilia and an underage person having consensual sex.

I expect that most of us here had some form of consensual sex before they were 18.

Rape is a non-consensual situation, isn't it?

I know nothing about paedophilia and don't want to either.

I do know thatJohn Phillips wrote a song called 14 about his daughter. Mick Jagger sung it. Keith plays on it. And Mick T I think, though in '76.

That is properly Stones- related.

Two minors engaging in a sexual act together is totally different.

An adult engaging in sexual conduct with a minor is considered to be rape. One party is underage, so, legally, it cannot be consensual.

Well what's law got to do with consensual love for example

Anyway, going back to the music, but enjoying Rickman's succinct and to- the-point posts here .....

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RollingFreak

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Stoneage
Of course legalities do not matter here. Allen can't win this even he wins in court. In the eyes of the public he is doomed anyway. Which I'm sure Allen is painfully aware of.

He's won for the last 30 years so I wouldn't be so sure of that. We knew almost all of this for 1/3 of a century. If people weren't paying attention, thats one thing, but it looks like, as evidenced by this thread, people have made up their minds one way or the other and aren't budging.

As I mentioned, its sad either way, and I think its short sighted, even if it is convincing, to say this was not one sided. Objectively, it was, and they aren't even hiding that fact. Doesn't necessarily prove he did it. There's a great 2 and a half hour YouTube video that tells the exact opposite story. Both are compelling. Robert B Weide did a documentary on Woody 15 years ago and combed through this stuff and came to the conclusion Woody is innocent. Is he right? Who knows. But IMO, his opinion is as justified as this new documentary's. There's murky stuff on both sides. I don't necessarily believe any of them fully. I think to fully blast someone for their beliefs on this matter is pretty unnecessary. Its one of very few cases I can think of this publicly where there's evidence on either side to justify people's feelings, and screaming about why they're wrong doesn't help anything.

The nanny's changed their statements after the trial, claiming Mia forced them to testify the way they did. There's plenty of stuff not in the doc thats compelling the same way all court documents referencing the train are compelling. I also appreciate that they contextualized Dylan's "coaching" that's been made such a thing all these decades. Perfectly makes sense if she was questioned 9 times about the matter. Do I think she was? I have no idea, but I appreciate the logical argument otherwise which I feel has been absent from the discussion forever.

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RollingFreak

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wonderboy
Allen began a 'relationship' with the adopted daughter of his partner when she was in high school. That's enough for me. Any teacher or parent knows that's a taboo, a betrayal. Even more so when you take her background into consideration.
That was enough for me to conclude he's a @#$%& creep.

I'm not in any way gonna condone it as normal. I think its sick and was wrong of him. Having said, does the fact that they've been married for 30 years mean nothing in that regard? Again, not defending it, and I'll never understand it, but an argument could be made that maybe they knew something was there given that its lasted all these decades. Just saying. I also really don't rate it as any less strange than what Bill Wyman and his son did. Creepy is creepy, I don't really know why people have different rules depending on who they like.

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wonderboy

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RollingFreak

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wonderboy
Allen began a 'relationship' with the adopted daughter of his partner when she was in high school. That's enough for me. Any teacher or parent knows that's a taboo, a betrayal. Even more so when you take her background into consideration.
That was enough for me to conclude he's a @#$%& creep.

I'm not in any way gonna condone it as normal. I think its sick and was wrong of him. Having said, does the fact that they've been married for 30 years mean nothing in that regard? Again, not defending it, and I'll never understand it, but an argument could be made that maybe they knew something was there given that its lasted all these decades. Just saying. I also really don't rate it as any less strange than what Bill Wyman and his son did. Creepy is creepy, I don't really know why people have different rules depending on who they like.

I know a woman who fell in love with her teacher while she was in high school, began a relationship with him after graduation and they have been married for 30 years. So I see what you are saying, and there are exceptions to every rule. In Allen's case, however, the young woman was basically family, and because of her upringing and circumstances was really in no situation to understand what was going on. The fact they are still together suggests to me that he has total control over her. Allen also betrayed Farrow; she was somebody he loved and he completely messed with her. He's a cruel man. ... I coached high school girls soccer a few years ago. The only reason a man can do that is that the parents trust that the male coach won't prey on their daughters. Some coaches do and it is always a huge betrayal and scandal.

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Pietro
If you want to know what's really going on here and how Woody Allen is being railroaded, you can read this blog post by Moses Farrow, one of the couple's adopted children.

A SON SPEAKS OUT By Moses Farrow

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dcba

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Pietro
If you want to know what's really going on here and how Woody Allen is being railroaded, you can read this blog post by Moses Farrow, one of the couple's adopted children.

A SON SPEAKS OUT By Moses Farrow

Funny nobody commented on this one...

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"It was common knowledge in Hollywood that my grandfather, the director John Farrow, was a notorious drinker and serial philanderer. There were numerous alcohol-fueled arguments between her parents, and Mia told me that she was the victim of attempted molestation within her own family. Her brother, my uncle John, who visited us many times when we were young, is currently in prison on a conviction of multiple child molestation charges"

"Most media sources claim my sister Tam died of “heart failure” at the age of 21. In fact, Tam struggled with depression for much of her life, a situation exacerbated by my mother refusing to get her help, insisting that Tam was just “moody.” One afternoon in 2000, after one final fight with Mia, which ended with my mother leaving the house, Tam committed suicide by overdosing on pills. My mother would tell others that the drug overdose was accidental, saying that Tam, who was blind, didn’t know which pills she was taking. But Tam had both an ironclad memory and sense of spatial recognition".

"When I didn’t give the answer she wanted, she slapped my face, knocking off my glasses. She told me I was lying and directed me to tell my brothers and sisters that I had taken the tape measure. Through my tears I listened to her as she explained that we would rehearse what should have happened. She would walk into the room and I would tell her I was sorry for taking the tape measure, that I had taken it to play with and that I would never do it again. She made me rehearse it at least a half-dozen times"

Do you need more evidence to prove this lady is completely crazy? He must a cockroach-mother on the level of Joan Crawford...

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Big Al

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Four Stone Walls

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Big Al

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Four Stone Walls
This is an odd thread really.

There is a difference between paedophilia and an underage person having consensual sex.

I expect that most of us here had some form of consensual sex before they were 18.

Rape is a non-consensual situation, isn't it?

I know nothing about paedophilia and don't want to either.

I do know thatJohn Phillips wrote a song called 14 about his daughter. Mick Jagger sung it. Keith plays on it. And Mick T I think, though in '76.

That is properly Stones- related.

Two minors engaging in a sexual act together is totally different.

An adult engaging in sexual conduct with a minor is considered to be rape. One party is underage, so, legally, it cannot be consensual.

Well what's law got to do with consensual love for example

Anyway, going back to the music, but enjoying Rickman's succinct and to- the-point posts here .....

Are you serious? Are you suggesting that if, say, a thirteen-year-old and a forty-something are in a ‘consensual’ sexual relationship, it’s okay? it’s never okay in such circumstances. That’s why there are laws.

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24FPS

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Pietro
If you want to know what's really going on here and how Woody Allen is being railroaded, you can read this blog post by Moses Farrow, one of the couple's adopted children. He writes, "...given the incredibly inaccurate and misleading attacks on my father, Woody Allen, I feel that I can no longer stay silent as he continues to be condemned for a crime he did not commit."

By his account life was torture in the Farrow household and Farrow encouraged her children to hate and vilify Allen.

A SON SPEAKS OUT By Moses Farrow

And many witnesses, who were there, dispute what he says. The other children say he was never abused. It's not 'what's really going on', it's just another person's beliefs. Many others, who were there, deny Moses' assertions. So Dylan Farrow, whose story never changed, was never molested by Woody? She simply decided one day to come up with this story so she would never have to see Woody again? A man she adored, until then? And what about the time Allen was caught with his head in her naked lap, sniffing her crotch? Are those witnesses liars? Is Dylan, who maintains her story as an adult, a liar? What would she have to gain? It's not like she got some kind of civil settlement.

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NilsHolgersson
Woody Allen had sex with his girlfriend's adopted child who was still in highschool and nobody in Hollywood thought anything of it and wanted to work with him..

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Stoneage
He may win on every account in court - it doesn't matter. Suspicions will still be there. And courting and marrying your step daughter is still a taboo in the society.
The stigma is there. Doesn't matter what he says or what happens in court. I'm sure Allen himself is aware of all this. He is a very intelligent man.

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24FPS
Finished the four part HBO series on Woody Allen versus Mia Farrow. It appears he did molest their seven year old daughter. I can't watch his films now without his abhorrent behavior coloring my perception of him, and his work. Some of his work reveals his predilection for underage girls, not necessarily children. As often occurs with rich, privileged, celebrities, Allen got away with it, and no charges were ever filed, though the prosecutor found 'probable cause', but didn't want to put the child through more trauma.

On the subject of underage girls, Jimmy Page, Bowie, Mick and Bill, Elvis, Ted Nugent, and others, are all guilty of statutory rape. They all had affairs, or just sex, with girls under the legal age. Is it no hanging matter? No capital crime? Or just more entitled celebrities getting away with rape? And does it color your enjoyment of their music, or do you just accept that their creeps? Poor Gary Glitter.

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24FPS
I don't remember that ever coming up that she was coached. I definitely remember a report that said she wasn't coached. Her story at 7 is the same at 35. And that Parental Alienation has been shown to be an insidious way for abuser to get away with it by claiming Parental Alienation. Moses was one child of 9. He wasn't there when Dylan claims to have been abused. He is not a witness. I'd like to know what his current relationship with Woody is. If he's been rewarded for being on his side.

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Redhotcarpet

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24FPS
Finished the four part HBO series on Woody Allen versus Mia Farrow. It appears he did molest their seven year old daughter. I can't watch his films now without his abhorrent behavior coloring my perception of him, and his work. Some of his work reveals his predilection for underage girls, not necessarily children. As often occurs with rich, privileged, celebrities, Allen got away with it, and no charges were ever filed, though the prosecutor found 'probable cause', but didn't want to put the child through more trauma.

On the subject of underage girls, Jimmy Page, Bowie, Mick and Bill, Elvis, Ted Nugent, and others, are all guilty of statutory rape. They all had affairs, or just sex, with girls under the legal age. Is it no hanging matter? No capital crime? Or just more entitled celebrities getting away with rape? And does it color your enjoyment of their music, or do you just accept that their creeps? Poor Gary Glitter.

Allen didnt molest anybody. Farrow is/was part of that whole incest cult/regressed memories therapy cult. And he didn’t marry his own daughter, he did however marry his ex’s adopted daughter. Bad move but Farrow is a manipulative nut.

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His Majesty
It is very interesting how the Stones have mostly escaped the MeToo and cancel culture etc though.

The odd article here and there, but nothing comes of it. The upsurge in shock and horror and calls to boycott via Twitter etc etc just doesn't get going.

Maybe it's a sign that they are just too ingrained in us and liked or perhaps they are just not relevant enough to the wider social justice movement.

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Redhotcarpet

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24FPS
Finished the four part HBO series on Woody Allen versus Mia Farrow. It appears he did molest their seven year old daughter. I can't watch his films now without his abhorrent behavior coloring my perception of him, and his work. Some of his work reveals his predilection for underage girls, not necessarily children. As often occurs with rich, privileged, celebrities, Allen got away with it, and no charges were ever filed, though the prosecutor found 'probable cause', but didn't want to put the child through more trauma.

On the subject of underage girls, Jimmy Page, Bowie, Mick and Bill, Elvis, Ted Nugent, and others, are all guilty of statutory rape. They all had affairs, or just sex, with girls under the legal age. Is it no hanging matter? No capital crime? Or just more entitled celebrities getting away with rape? And does it color your enjoyment of their music, or do you just accept that their creeps? Poor Gary Glitter.

Allen didnt molest anybody. Farrow is/was part of that whole incest cult/regressed memories therapy cult. And he didn’t marry his own daughter, he did however marry his ex’s adopted daughter. Bad move but Farrow is a manipulative nut.