Quote
dcba

Quote
Hairball

Clearly Keith has more integrity as a solo artist, and his complaint about Mick milking the Stones catalogue is completely justified.

Yes but Jagger made 45000 people juping on their feet in Tokyo in 1988 while Keith "filled" 5000 persons venues (at best). And frankly the 92/93 gigs were kinda boring. The one time when people were genuinely moved by the music played was when the Winos played "Gimme shelter".

Quote
DandelionPowderman

<At that point, The Rolling Stones had never played in Japan>

That might have been the reason for those setlists in Japan.

Or did Mick play just as many Stones-tunes in Australia and New Zealand as well?

Quote
silverstones69

Hey guys,

Just to let you know from someone "downunder" that was actually at those shows, that the shows were fantastic & I can guarantee that the Australian Tour was a huge success for Mick.

Don't forget, us Aussies hadn't seen the Stones for 13 years & they weren't to show up again until around 1995, so to have Mick come over in 1986 [it was '86 I am fairly certain & not '88], and play for us, while the Stones had no chance in hell of getting a gig together at that time, was a great thrill for us all.

He played 2 shows each in Brisbane [which I saw], Adelaide & Perth & something like 7 shows each in Sydney [which I saw a few] & Melbourne, at the biggest arenas for each of those 5 cities. These were not stadium shows, but he could have easily filled a couple of stadiums each in Sydney & Melbourne.

"WILD COLONIAL BOY" was for us in Australia, no different to "BOB WILLS IS STILL THE KING" for all those Texanites in Austin. It went down great with the audience & it was Micks approach & originality that made the song a smash hit with us. I can truly relate to the Texas ABB show with how the audience felt while Mick sang their song to them.

As for-
a] "WORST STONES RELATED EVENT" - maybe for you, definately not for us Aussies who loved the shows & appreciated it very much for having Mick visit us at a very troubled time during the bands history.
b] "WAR BABY / LONG URINAL LINE" - didn't happen, period!
c] "FLUFFY 80's SHOW" - well it wasn't the Stones but the band played very very well & Mick was firing.

There is a great Video document of the Tour "Mick Jagger Deep Down Under" which is a full show + special videos shot in the Aust outback for PARTY DOLL & a MICK SOLO HARMONICA NUMBER - both Superb!!! & also some backstage stuff at his Australian secret warm up club gigs.

The set list above as I recall seems to be pretty spot on, with other shows I saw having a song or 2 dropped / added in for different nights.

If you didn't see one of these shows, don't judge it too harshly, maybe first check out the above video. If you still think it was a mistake for Mick, then rip into him, I am not here to criticise you.

What I do remember is how he put Australia in such a great vibe for the month or so he was here & for those of us who saw the shows, no one gave a bad review or was negative towards it. It was a brillaint show / concert event at that time during 1986.

Quote
RisingStone

Quote
DandelionPowderman



That might have been the reason for those setlists in Japan.

Or did Mick play just as many Stones-tunes in Australia and New Zealand as well?

Yes he did. Even more.
[www.setlist.fm]

And below is a quote from the old thread: Mick Jagger Solo Australia/Japan 1988 Set List.
[iorr.org]

Quote
silverstones69

Hey guys,

Just to let you know from someone "downunder" that was actually at those shows, that the shows were fantastic & I can guarantee that the Australian Tour was a huge success for Mick.

Don't forget, us Aussies hadn't seen the Stones for 13 years & they weren't to show up again until around 1995, so to have Mick come over in 1986 [it was '86 I am fairly certain & not '88], and play for us, while the Stones had no chance in hell of getting a gig together at that time, was a great thrill for us all.

He played 2 shows each in Brisbane [which I saw], Adelaide & Perth & something like 7 shows each in Sydney [which I saw a few] & Melbourne, at the biggest arenas for each of those 5 cities. These were not stadium shows, but he could have easily filled a couple of stadiums each in Sydney & Melbourne.

"WILD COLONIAL BOY" was for us in Australia, no different to "BOB WILLS IS STILL THE KING" for all those Texanites in Austin. It went down great with the audience & it was Micks approach & originality that made the song a smash hit with us. I can truly relate to the Texas ABB show with how the audience felt while Mick sang their song to them.

As for-
a] "WORST STONES RELATED EVENT" - maybe for you, definately not for us Aussies who loved the shows & appreciated it very much for having Mick visit us at a very troubled time during the bands history.
b] "WAR BABY / LONG URINAL LINE" - didn't happen, period!
c] "FLUFFY 80's SHOW" - well it wasn't the Stones but the band played very very well & Mick was firing.

There is a great Video document of the Tour "Mick Jagger Deep Down Under" which is a full show + special videos shot in the Aust outback for PARTY DOLL & a MICK SOLO HARMONICA NUMBER - both Superb!!! & also some backstage stuff at his Australian secret warm up club gigs.

The set list above as I recall seems to be pretty spot on, with other shows I saw having a song or 2 dropped / added in for different nights.

If you didn't see one of these shows, don't judge it too harshly, maybe first check out the above video. If you still think it was a mistake for Mick, then rip into him, I am not here to criticise you.

What I do remember is how he put Australia in such a great vibe for the month or so he was here & for those of us who saw the shows, no one gave a bad review or was negative towards it. It was a brillaint show / concert event at that time during 1986.

Quote
Taylor1
Mick didn’t write Ruby Tuesday,Brian and Keith did.Mick didn’t write IORR, Wood did. And Beast of Burden,Gimme Shelter, we’re mostly Keith.Jumping Jack Flash was co written by Wyman.The only songs on that list that he wrote by himself were Brown Sugar and You Can Always Get What You Want

Quote
dcba

Quote
Hairball

Clearly Keith has more integrity as a solo artist, and his complaint about Mick milking the Stones catalogue is completely justified.

Yes but Jagger made 45000 people juping on their feet in Tokyo in 1988 while Keith "filled" 5000 persons venues (at best).

Quote
slewan

Quote
dcba

Quote
Hairball

Clearly Keith has more integrity as a solo artist, and his complaint about Mick milking the Stones catalogue is completely justified.

Yes but Jagger made 45000 people juping on their feet in Tokyo in 1988 while Keith "filled" 5000 persons venues (at best).

but the big differnce is: Jagger didn't dare to take his solo tour to places that really matter, i.e. the USA, the UK and Europe.
It was relatively easy to sell out big venues down under and espically in the far east since Western artisted rarely toured there. Remember: The first time the Stones played Japan was in 1990…

Quote
Hairball

Quote
Taylor1
Mick didn’t write Ruby Tuesday,Brian and Keith did.Mick didn’t write IORR, Wood did. And Beast of Burden,Gimme Shelter, we’re mostly Keith.Jumping Jack Flash was co written by Wyman.The only songs on that list that he wrote by himself were Brown Sugar and You Can Always Get What You Want

Looks like more reasons that validate Keith's complaints, and it's completely understandeable why he was pissed off...or in his words severely pissed off .
Not only was Mick's setlist made up of mostly Stones songs, a majority of them were Stones songs he had no real hand in the writing of.

Again:

"I thought it was very sad that a high percentage of his show was Rolling Stones songs. If you're going to do something on your own, do stuff off the two albums you did.
Don't pretend you're a solo artist and have two chicks prancing around doing Tumbling Dice, do you know what I mean? That severely pisses me off". - Keith, '88

Quote
Hairball
The proper comparison is the '88 Osaka show where Mick's set was 16 Stones songs out of 22 (edit* over 2/3rds of the set), in which he only wrote two of them!

Quote
retired_dog

Quote
Hairball

Quote
Taylor1
Mick didn’t write Ruby Tuesday,Brian and Keith did.Mick didn’t write IORR, Wood did. And Beast of Burden,Gimme Shelter, we’re mostly Keith.Jumping Jack Flash was co written by Wyman.The only songs on that list that he wrote by himself were Brown Sugar and You Can Always Get What You Want

Looks like more reasons that validate Keith's complaints, and it's completely understandeable why he was pissed off...or in his words severely pissed off .
Not only was Mick's setlist made up of mostly Stones songs, a majority of them were Stones songs he had no real hand in the writing of.

Again:

"I thought it was very sad that a high percentage of his show was Rolling Stones songs. If you're going to do something on your own, do stuff off the two albums you did.
Don't pretend you're a solo artist and have two chicks prancing around doing Tumbling Dice, do you know what I mean? That severely pisses me off". - Keith, '88

This coming from an artist whose 18 track setlist at the Hollywood Palladium show includes 1/3 Stones and Stones related tunes... BTMMR, I Wanna Be Your Man, Time Is On My Side, Little T & A, Happy, Connection... 6 if I count right...

...and while we're at it - if you want to compare, at least do it right and use comparable years:

Setlist Keith Köln/Cologne 1992

Take It So Hard
Eileen
Wicked As It Seems
Gimme Shelter
Too Rude
Yap Yap
How I Wish
999
Big Enough
Demon
Time Is on My Side
Hate It When You Leave
I Could Have Stood You Up
Before They Make Me Run
Bodytalks
Will But You Won't
Happy
Whip It Up

Setlist Mick Webster Hall, New York 1993

Wired All Night
Out of Focus
Sweet Thing
Use Me
Don't Tear Me Up
Evening Gown
Angel in My Heart
Wandering Spirit
Put Me in the Trash
Think
Mother of a Man
Rip This Joint
Live With Me
Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby, Standing in the Shadow?

That's 5 Stones/Stones-related tunes for Keith against just 3 for Mick, folks!

Oh, and this "artistic integrity"! Depends on what criteria is used, really. I would not want to play the judge: Keith - whose solo output doesn't move all too far away from Stones material or Mick - who at least tried to escape the Stones' boundaries for a substantial part of his output, not counting Wandering Spirit, of course.

It's hardly a matter of personal taste. I for one admire Scott Walker for the artistic integrity of his later solo output, but have a hard time actually listening to it (with the exception of Farmer In The City, maybe).

Quote
dcba

Quote
GasLightStreet
[Keith] turned into a street pop lemonade stand artist with the ridiculous spray painting of his pants and shoes.

But you gotta admit he played wonderfully on this tour. His soloing on "sympathy" is far far better than what he delivered in 1969/70.

Quote
RisingStone

Quote
Hairball
The proper comparison is the '88 Osaka show where Mick's set was 16 Stones songs out of 22 (edit* over 2/3rds of the set), in which he only wrote two of them!

I guess you mean Tokyo show.

FYI the first three ‘88 Osaka shows (the tour’s openers) consisted of 25 songs (16 Stones songs and 9 solo numbers). The fourth and postponed show 23 songs (16 Stones songs, 6 solo numbers and Foxy Lady, Jimi Hendrix cover). Sorry for nitpicking.

I’m no expert as regards the songwriting partnership of Jagger/Richards in detail, who is the main lyricist or composer of which title etc, but are you sure Mick only wrote two of the 16 songs he played in Japan?

Quote
dcba

Quote
Hairball

Clearly Keith has more integrity as a solo artist, and his complaint about Mick milking the Stones catalogue is completely justified.

Yes but Jagger made 45000 people juping on their feet in Tokyo in 1988 while Keith "filled" 5000 persons venues (at best). And frankly the 92/93 gigs were kinda boring. The one time when people were genuinely moved by the music played was when the Winos played "Gimme shelter".

Quote
Hairball
The '93 Webster Hall show was only an hour long, and not comparable to a full concert
It was a one-off album release event for Wandering Spirit, and shouldn't be compared to any of Keith's proper shows.
In fact it's kind of weird that Mick would play any Stones tunes at all considering it was intended as a showcase for his solo material.

The proper comparison is the '88 Osaka show where Mick's set was 16 Stones songs out of 22 (edit* over 2/3rds of the set), in which he only wrote two of them! Vs. Keith's '92 show w/ only five of 18 tunes Stones related.
Of the Keith show, two are cover tunes, two are Stones tunes w/ Keith lead vocals (which he wrote solely on his own), and finally Gimme Shelter which was mostly written by Keith - maybe all of it written by Keith.

Quote
Hairball
As had been mentioned previously, Japan had never had a Stones show up to that point, so it's no wonder so many fans flocked to see Mick.
It was their first chance to see a Rolling Stone, and most probably thought it would be their only chance. Unfortunately it wasn't the Stones - it was Mick backed by a covers band.
Fortunately, and thankfully for Stones fans in Japan, the Stones did play there afterwards, so all's well that ends well.

Quote
Hairball
Lol...calm down retired dog....if there's any such thing as "Keith vs. Mick bullshit", we clearly know which side you're taking with your imaginary defense and rationale of everything Mick does, and your anti-Keith stance.
And I thought for sure you'd be going after GasLightStreet's detailed reply to you that he posted above instead of constantly stalking me around here - now that is weird!

Quote
RisingStone

Quote
Hairball
As had been mentioned previously, Japan had never had a Stones show up to that point, so it's no wonder so many fans flocked to see Mick.
It was their first chance to see a Rolling Stone, and most probably thought it would be their only chance. Unfortunately it wasn't the Stones - it was Mick backed by a covers band.
Fortunately, and thankfully for Stones fans in Japan, the Stones did play there afterwards, so all's well that ends well.

Even after the Stones payed repeated visits in Japan over the last thirty years, many who attended Mick’s solo show still retain fond memories and remember it favorably. Despite being thrown a shameful tag, ‘covers band’, from some quarters, there was something more than a mere substitute about these shows. The audience enjoyed every minute of it. No ‘exodus for toilet’ moment observed, either. When I find it unfeasible to convert naysayers, all I can say is, you had to be there...

Quote
retired_dog
What Gas Light and you did not get is that my comparison was tongue-in-cheek (at least a bit!), but cool to see you both waste your precious time to jump on it.

Quote
Hairball

I'm sure he made a big first impression considering no Rolling Stone had ever played there before then - I can actually envision the wild hysteria.

Quote
RisingStone

Quote
Hairball

I'm sure he made a big first impression considering no Rolling Stone had ever played there before then - I can actually envision the wild hysteria.

FYI actually Mick Taylor and Ron Wood toured Japan before Mick, respectively.

Quote
Hairball

Quote
retired_dog
What Gas Light and you did not get is that my comparison was tongue-in-cheek (at least a bit!), but cool to see you both waste your precious time to jump on it.

Well you spent almost an hour writing your lengthy/detailed comparison post, and had 8 different edits, so thought you might want a reply - even if just a brief one.
And it didn't look like it was tongue-in-cheek to me, even just a bit - it seemed to have a sense of anger and frustration as do many of your posts.
Maybe try to relax a bit, instead of getting all worked up over something as simple as the Rolling Stones...

Quote
Hairball
Lol...calm down retired dog....if there's any such thing as "Keith vs. Mick bullshit", we clearly know which side you're taking with your imaginary defense and rationale of everything Mick does, and your anti-Keith stance.
And I thought for sure you'd be going after GasLightStreet's detailed reply to you that he posted above instead of constantly stalking me around here - now that is weird!

Quote
retired_dog

Quote
Hairball
Lol...calm down retired dog....if there's any such thing as "Keith vs. Mick bullshit", we clearly know which side you're taking with your imaginary defense and rationale of everything Mick does, and your anti-Keith stance.
And I thought for sure you'd be going after GasLightStreet's detailed reply to you that he posted above instead of constantly stalking me around here - now that is weird!

Before I forget it (and to keep you busy for a while), I would like at least some sufficient proof for my alleged "anti-Keith stance" before I can believe you. Otherwise I would discard it as another creation of your "Keith vs. Mick" mindframe, but what could earn you at least a bronze "storyteller"-medal instead. Gold rings on ya! lol