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skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
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NICOS
Last week we got our new corona rules.......
Infection went down from 20.005 to 15.202 per day.
Infected people in Hospitals went down 18,4 %
Infected people on IC's went down 8,6 %
And today they decide for a total lock down ?????? I'm lost
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treaclefingersQuote
skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
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NateQuote
treaclefingersQuote
skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
Of course it’s better to increase ICU capacity than shut down society.Why should people have their lives restricted in this manner because of a lack of investment in healthcare.If authorities don’t stop these lockdowns soon there will not be a healthcare system at all.Where do you think the money comes from to fund healthcare in the first place.
Nate
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bvQuote
NateQuote
treaclefingersQuote
skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
Of course it’s better to increase ICU capacity than shut down society.Why should people have their lives restricted in this manner because of a lack of investment in healthcare.If authorities don’t stop these lockdowns soon there will not be a healthcare system at all.Where do you think the money comes from to fund healthcare in the first place.
Nate
So how do you plan to quadruple ICU capacity during the next 4-8 weeks? There is a major staffing problem, not just in health, but also in general.
Norway is one of the countries with a major new wave now, they are reporting on entire surgery units closed down to handle covid-19 only, I don't think people with dreams about unlimited ICU capacity do understand how hospitals work.
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treaclefingersQuote
skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
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bvQuote
NateQuote
treaclefingersQuote
skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
Of course it’s better to increase ICU capacity than shut down society.Why should people have their lives restricted in this manner because of a lack of investment in healthcare.If authorities don’t stop these lockdowns soon there will not be a healthcare system at all.Where do you think the money comes from to fund healthcare in the first place.
Nate
So how do you plan to quadruple ICU capacity during the next 4-8 weeks? There is a major staffing problem, not just in health, but also in general.
Norway is one of the countries with a major new wave now, they are reporting on entire surgery units closed down to handle covid-19 only, I don't think people with dreams about unlimited ICU capacity do understand how hospitals work.
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skytrenchQuote
treaclefingersQuote
skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
It would be logical to have increased the available ICU capacity in response to the possible threat. What countries have actually done so? Lockdowns don't need to be so severe if the hospital capacity is not reached. The costs of more ICUs could be a good investment, instead of closing businesses and supporting them through public funds. Lockdowns keep the situation dragging on.
It's not either one or the other, black or white, but a workable compromise.
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mtaylor
Drink a lot - it kills the virus. Best medicine.
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stargroover
Spot on there Nate.And those people have every reason to think that way.
If lockdown comes it will be short,to give the impression that something is been done.The bottom line in the UK is the economy not folks health or wellbeing.The Government won’t want to fund more stay afloat schemes to businesses.Wealth not health.
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NateQuote
yorkshirestone
I could ask you the same question. ‘Everything points to it being the best news of the pandemic’ is a laughably childish viewpoint and totally unevidenced. Basic maths - higher transmissibility, more cases, more hospitalisations, more health system pressure ( in mid January, a time when the nhs is usually at maximum capacity anyway). But hey, let anyone with waning vaccine immunity, other health issues etc just get it - that’s a humane solution. Btw if you looked at the evidence (which you clearly haven’t) the proportion of critical care beds in the uk should factor in to your thinking, far less per 100k population than Germany, etc. Assume you’re happy to see friends, family and neighbours treated in tents in hospital car parks- most of us (thankfully) wouldn’t be
The evidence so far suggests omicron is a mild infection.There is no emergency the situation is nowhere near what it was when Covid got going in Europe and people were dying in hospital corridors in Italy due to lack of beds.I have known about 20 members of family and friends who have had Covid in the last month none of which even required a visit to the doctors let alone the emergency ward.
The fact is that Covid is a mild illness for the vast majority of infected individuals who at worst will be sat at home feeling a little rough for a few days.It is time to hand back freedoms to people that have been stolen and if that means that some people have to sacrifice a further year or two of life playing bingo in a care home then so be it.
Nate
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LeonidPQuote
NateQuote
yorkshirestone
I could ask you the same question. ‘Everything points to it being the best news of the pandemic’ is a laughably childish viewpoint and totally unevidenced. Basic maths - higher transmissibility, more cases, more hospitalisations, more health system pressure ( in mid January, a time when the nhs is usually at maximum capacity anyway). But hey, let anyone with waning vaccine immunity, other health issues etc just get it - that’s a humane solution. Btw if you looked at the evidence (which you clearly haven’t) the proportion of critical care beds in the uk should factor in to your thinking, far less per 100k population than Germany, etc. Assume you’re happy to see friends, family and neighbours treated in tents in hospital car parks- most of us (thankfully) wouldn’t be
The evidence so far suggests omicron is a mild infection.There is no emergency the situation is nowhere near what it was when Covid got going in Europe and people were dying in hospital corridors in Italy due to lack of beds.I have known about 20 members of family and friends who have had Covid in the last month none of which even required a visit to the doctors let alone the emergency ward.
The fact is that Covid is a mild illness for the vast majority of infected individuals who at worst will be sat at home feeling a little rough for a few days.It is time to hand back freedoms to people that have been stolen and if that means that some people have to sacrifice a further year or two of life playing bingo in a care home then so be it.
Nate
Omicron seems clearly to be a mild variant, just based on people I know ... Shutdowns are insane and masks are pointless (crazy to me to see some come into a pub or restaurant w/ their masks on, then take them off to drink / eat).
Luckily we had our office party this past Sat. night, all of my team attended except 1 (he has health issues, we all totally understand!) -- nothing would have stopped it, if they shut down, we would have just met at someone's house instead.
It seems obvious there are going to continue to be variants, like I've said before, you don't live forever, are people really going to let this control the rest of their lives? Crazy.
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Nate
Twice now I have seen once in Mexico City earlier this year and again in Paris just the other day the ridiculous sight of a couple attempting a kiss whilst both wearing masks.
Nate
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NateQuote
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skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
Of course it’s better to increase ICU capacity than shut down society.Why should people have their lives restricted in this manner because of a lack of investment in healthcare.If authorities don’t stop these lockdowns soon there will not be a healthcare system at all.Where do you think the money comes from to fund healthcare in the first place.
Nate
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daspyknowsQuote
NateQuote
treaclefingersQuote
skytrench
Most scary is what restrictions will be implemented and for how long. The leaders don't want to take risks with the hospital capacities in case of a surge, but how many of them have actually used the past year to invest in an increased ICU capacity for their people? Money well spent, if society's wheels can be kept turning.
so hang on...you're suggesting it's BETTER to simply increase ICU capacity instead of doing a lockdown?
Better to fill up the hospitals and keep the restaurants and bars open?
Wow, OK.
Of course it’s better to increase ICU capacity than shut down society.Why should people have their lives restricted in this manner because of a lack of investment in healthcare.If authorities don’t stop these lockdowns soon there will not be a healthcare system at all.Where do you think the money comes from to fund healthcare in the first place.
Nate
To handle omicron ICU capacity will need to increase by a fact or 3, 5, 10, 20? Who is going to staff the ICU's, how is going a hospital going to increase their number of beds by 5 times? You just are against any precautions like lockdowns or masks.
If authorities do nothing the healthcare system collapses. Temporary, short term lockdowns will not destroy the healthcare system. Obviously you do not understand math, public health or economics.