The reason for vaccinating children is hard to see if this is true:

"The bottom line was that, in contrast to the other variants, vaccinated people, even if they didn't get sick, got infected and shed virus at similar levels as unvaccinated people who got infected," Dr. Walter Orenstein, who heads the Emory Vaccine Center and who viewed the documents, told CNN.

[edition.cnn.com]

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skytrench
The reason for vaccinating children is hard to see if this is true:

"The bottom line was that, in contrast to the other variants, vaccinated people, even if they didn't get sick, got infected and shed virus at similar levels as unvaccinated people who got infected," Dr. Walter Orenstein, who heads the Emory Vaccine Center and who viewed the documents, told CNN.

[edition.cnn.com]

And if vaccinated people get infected anyway, they have as much virus in their bodies as unvaccinated people. That means they're as likely to infect someone else as unvaccinated people who get infected.

So no reason to segregate the unvaccinated at concerts for example.

CDC document warns Delta variant appears to spread as easily as chickenpox and cause more severe infection

"I think people need to understand that we're not crying wolf here. This is serious" - CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky

Coronavirus

The Delta coronavirus variant surging across the United States appears to cause more severe illness and spread as easily as chickenpox, according to an internal document from the US Centers for Disease Control and Prevention. The document -- a slide presentation -- outlines unpublished data that shows fully vaccinated people might spread the Delta variant at the same rate as unvaccinated people. CDC Director Dr. Rochelle Walensky confirmed the authenticity of the document, which was first reported by The Washington Post. "I think people need to understand that we're not crying wolf here. This is serious," she told CNN. "It's one of the most transmissible viruses we know about. Measles, chickenpox, this -- they're all up there."

The CDC is scheduled to publish data Friday that will back Walensky's controversial decision to change guidance for fully vaccinated people. She said Tuesday the CDC was recommending that even fully vaccinated people wear masks indoors in places where transmission of the virus is sustained or high. And she said everyone in schools -- students, staff and visitors -- should wear masks at all times. "The measures we need to get this under control -- they're extreme. The measures you need are extreme," Walensky told CNN. She said the data in the report did not surprise her. "It was the synthesis of the data all in one place that was sobering," she said. The CDC presentation says the Delta variant is about as transmissible as chickenpox, with each infected person, on average, infecting eight or nine others. The original lineage was about as transmissible as the common cold, with each infected person passing the virus to about two other people on average. That infectivity is known as R0. "When you think about diseases that have an R0 of eight or nine -- there aren't that many," Walensky told CNN. And if vaccinated people get infected anyway, they have as much virus in their bodies as unvaccinated people. That means they're as likely to infect someone else as unvaccinated people who get infected. "The bottom line was that, in contrast to the other variants, vaccinated people, even if they didn't get sick, got infected and shed virus at similar levels as unvaccinated people who got infected," Dr. Walter Orenstein, who heads the Emory Vaccine Center and who viewed the documents, told CNN. But vaccinated people are safer, the document indicates. "Vaccines prevent more than 90% of severe disease, but may be less effective at preventing infection or transmission," it reads. "Therefore, more breakthrough and more community spread despite vaccination." It says vaccines reduce the risk of severe disease or death 10-fold and reduce the risk of infection three-fold.

The presentation also cites three reports that indicate the Delta variant -- originally known as B.1.617.2 -- might cause more severe disease. The CDC, the document advises, should "acknowledge the war has changed." It recommends vaccine mandates and universal mask requirements. The virus is once against surging across the US -- especially in areas where fewer people are vaccinated. The US averaged more than 66,900 new daily cases over the last week -- an average that's generally risen since the country hit a 2021 low of 11,299 daily cases on June 22, according to Johns Hopkins University data. "The number of cases we have now is higher than any number we had on any given day last summer," Walensky told CNN. As of Wednesday, cases have risen in all but one state in the past seven days compared with the week before, according to Johns Hopkins. "The one thing I will say is I've been heartened in the past couple of days to see more people taking action in response to the fact that it's bad -- more organizations, businesses, states, localities taking the action that's needed to get us out of this," Walensky said. The CDC document walks through new "communication challenges" as a result of breakthrough infections, along with the need to retool public health messaging to highlight vaccination as the best defense against the Delta variant. The agency should "improve (the) public's understanding of breakthrough infections" and "improve communications around individual risk among vaccinated," it says.

Earlier Thursday, President Joe Biden announced a number of new steps his administration will take to try to get more Americans vaccinated, including requiring that all federal employees must attest to being vaccinated against Covid-19 or face strict protocols. "This is an American tragedy. People are dying -- and will die -- who don't have to die. If you're out there unvaccinated, you don't have to die," Biden said during remarks at the White House. "Read the news. You'll see stories of unvaccinated patients in hospitals, as they're lying in bed dying from Covid-19, they're asking, 'Doc, can I get the vaccine?' The doctors have to say, 'Sorry, it's too late.' "

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

I used to live on Guam also in the Marianas chain and I would love to go to Saipan. Having herbs legal there is all the more reason. Fantastic diving and its an (as yet) unspoiled paradise.

jb

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terraplane

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skytrench
The reason for vaccinating children is hard to see if this is true:

"The bottom line was that, in contrast to the other variants, vaccinated people, even if they didn't get sick, got infected and shed virus at similar levels as unvaccinated people who got infected," Dr. Walter Orenstein, who heads the Emory Vaccine Center and who viewed the documents, told CNN.

[edition.cnn.com]

And if vaccinated people get infected anyway, they have as much virus in their bodies as unvaccinated people. That means they're as likely to infect someone else as unvaccinated people who get infected.

So no reason to segregate the unvaccinated at concerts for example.

I would take it the other way. More reason to require vaccinations for admission.

921 deaths out of a population of over 24 million. Send in the troops.


Australia to deploy troops to enforce Sydney lockdown


[news.yahoo.com]

From the CDC:

New @CDCMMWR finds Delta variant causes vaccine breakthrough infections. Jurisdictions might consider expanded prevention strategies, including masking in indoor public areas, particularly for large public gatherings that include travelers from many areas. [www.cdc.gov]

[twitter.com]

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bleedingman
921 deaths out of a population of over 24 million. Send in the troops.


Australia to deploy troops to enforce Sydney lockdown


[news.yahoo.com]

Well...if the population is compared to say the US, that's like the US getting 13000 new deaths. But wait, it's concentrated to Sydney, so now your talking more like 100000 deaths in the US.

Everything is relative.

Plus...are you suggesting they should wait longer until what, there are way more deaths, so as to justify it?

Saving Grace featuring Robert Plant and Suzi Dian pull out of the headlining slot of Underneath the Stars Festival “due to medical reasons”. Birmingham show also postponed.

[twitter.com]

[twitter.com]

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treaclefingers

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bleedingman
921 deaths out of a population of over 24 million. Send in the troops.


Australia to deploy troops to enforce Sydney lockdown


[news.yahoo.com]

Well...if the population is compared to say the US, that's like the US getting 13000 new deaths. But wait, it's concentrated to Sydney, so now your talking more like 100000 deaths in the US.



Everything is relative.

Plus...are you suggesting they should wait longer until what, there are way more deaths, so as to justify it?

From the article: "Since the pandemic began, Australia has recorded, 33,473 cases of Covid-19, including 921 deaths." So it's not just Sydney. It's the entire population since it began. Not new deaths.

No surprise here.
Broadway theaters to require COVID-19 shots and masks when shows reopen

"All of New York's 41 Broadway theaters are mandating documentation of full vaccination before allowing indoor entry to patrons, performers, backstage crew and theater staff for all shows, the Broadway League said in a statement. Masks are required for audience members."

[www.yahoo.com]

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bleedingman

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treaclefingers

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bleedingman
921 deaths out of a population of over 24 million. Send in the troops.


Australia to deploy troops to enforce Sydney lockdown


[news.yahoo.com]

Well...if the population is compared to say the US, that's like the US getting 13000 new deaths. But wait, it's concentrated to Sydney, so now your talking more like 100000 deaths in the US.



Everything is relative.

Plus...are you suggesting they should wait longer until what, there are way more deaths, so as to justify it?

From the article: "Since the pandemic began, Australia has recorded, 33,473 cases of Covid-19, including 921 deaths." So it's not just Sydney. It's the entire population since it began. Not new deaths.

OK thanks, didn't read the article I was just going by your post summary. I STILL think it's a good idea to get ahead of it the way they are. 600,000 dead is just irresponsible.

Don't wish to cause any controversy, but could it be that anti-vaxxers and anti-maskers already had COVID? It would explain a few things:

[www.ctvnews.ca]


COVID-19 linked to 'significant' drop in intelligence: research
Jackie Dunham
CTVNews.ca Writer
@JaclynLDunham Contact

Published Tuesday, July 27, 2021 1:09PM EDT
SHARE:
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TORONTO -- Individuals who recovered from COVID-19, including those who no longer had symptoms, exhibited significant “cognitive deficits,” according to a large study out of the U.K.

The research, conducted by academics from Imperial College London, Kings College and the Universities of Cambridge, Southampton and Chicago, aimed to find out how COVID-19 affected mental health and cognition.

For the study, researchers analyzed data from 81,337 participants of the Great British Intelligence Test from January to December 2020. Of those participants, nearly 13,000 reported they had contracted the novel coronavirus.

For the rest of the participants, the researchers said they employed a linear model to predict general cognitive performance, or premorbid intelligence, based on age (to the third order), sex, handedness, ethnicity, first language, country of residence, occupational status, and earnings.

“Predicted and observed general performance correlated substantially, providing a proxy measure of premorbid intelligence of comparable performance to common explicit tests such as the National Adult Reading Test,” the study stated.

What’s more, the academics also found that their intelligence estimates for individuals pre-illness indicated that those who contracted COVID-19 were actually likely to have had a “somewhat higher as opposed to lower cognitive ability” before they were sick.

After controlling for those factors, they found that those who had COVID-19 underperformed when compared to those who never contracted the disease.

The cognitive deficits were particularly pronounced for test tasks that involved reasoning, problem solving, spatial planning and target detection, while those who had COVID-19 fared better when they were asked to complete simpler tasks, such as working memory span and emotional processing.

“These results accord with reports of long-COVID, where ‘brain fog’, trouble concentrating and difficulty finding the correct words are common,” the authors noted. “Recovery from COVID-19 infection may be associated with particularly pronounced problems in aspects of higher cognitive or ‘executive’ function.”

The authors said their results appear to show that COVID-19 infection is associated with cognitive deficits that can persist into the recovery phase, such as in cases of long COVID in which symptoms can last for weeks or months after the initial illness.

The level of underperformance was also dependent on the severity of illness in the group who had COVID-19 during the pandemic. The study said those who had been placed on a ventilator during the pandemic exhibited the greatest cognitive deficits, so much so that it equated to a seven-point drop in IQ in a classic intelligence test.

The drop in intelligence among those who had been ventilated was also larger than the deficits observed in patients who had previously suffered a stroke or who reported learning disabilities, according to the paper.

The authors cautioned against drawing firm conclusions about the neurobiological or psychological basis for the intelligence deficits without brain imaging data; however, they said the results should serve as a clarion call for further research on the subject.

The study, “Cognitive deficits in people who have recovered from COVID-19,” was published in the journal The Lancet last week.

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daspyknows

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terraplane

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skytrench
The reason for vaccinating children is hard to see if this is true:

"The bottom line was that, in contrast to the other variants, vaccinated people, even if they didn't get sick, got infected and shed virus at similar levels as unvaccinated people who got infected," Dr. Walter Orenstein, who heads the Emory Vaccine Center and who viewed the documents, told CNN.

[edition.cnn.com]

And if vaccinated people get infected anyway, they have as much virus in their bodies as unvaccinated people. That means they're as likely to infect someone else as unvaccinated people who get infected.

So no reason to segregate the unvaccinated at concerts for example.

I would take it the other way. More reason to require vaccinations for admission.

You should just stay home with the fear of getting another bad flu. Let's not take a chance here. Your life depends on it. At least 0.01% of it does. You can come here to follow the shows, while the rest of us (including the Stones) live our lives.

Say it ain't so Joe............

Biden says US will 'in all probability' see more guidelines and restrictions amid rising Covid cases

President Joe Biden said Friday the US will, "in all probability," see more guidelines and restrictions
amid rising coronavirus cases and the spread of the highly contagious Delta variant.

> Coronavirus

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Please do not post conspiracy theories and false news on IORR. If something sounds strange, then check what the site is all about. Someone posted links to a site by Joseph Mercola here. It takes just one minute of online research to find out what this person is all about:

Joseph Michael Mercola (born July 8, 1954) is an American alternative medicine proponent, osteopathic physician, and Internet business person. He markets dietary supplements and medical devices, some of which are controversial. On his website, Mercola and colleagues advocate a number of unproven alternative health notions including homeopathy and opposition to vaccination. These positions have faced persistent criticism.

During the COVID-19 pandemic, Mercola spread misinformation about the virus and pseudoscientific anti-vaccine misinformation on social media platforms, and The New York Times noted that researchers have identified him as the "chief spreader of coronavirus misinformation online". He has been warned numerous times by the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) for selling unapproved health products, including supposed Covid-19 treatments.

[en.wikipedia.org]

Bjornulf



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-31 08:46 by bv.

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terraplane

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skytrench
The reason for vaccinating children is hard to see if this is true:

"The bottom line was that, in contrast to the other variants, vaccinated people, even if they didn't get sick, got infected and shed virus at similar levels as unvaccinated people who got infected," Dr. Walter Orenstein, who heads the Emory Vaccine Center and who viewed the documents, told CNN.

[edition.cnn.com]

And if vaccinated people get infected anyway, they have as much virus in their bodies as unvaccinated people. That means they're as likely to infect someone else as unvaccinated people who get infected.

So no reason to segregate the unvaccinated at concerts for example.

Wrong.

CDC study shows 74% of people infected with covid outbreak in Massachusetts were fully vaccinated.
Is it really necessary to take the vaccine at this stage considering everything. I mean if it's not preventing covid or the spread what's the point
[www.cnbc.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-31 10:24 by Rocktiludrop.

The non profit that runs 3 renovated old theater venues in Seattle has rescinded a proof of vaccination requirement to attend shows but have reinstituted a mask requirement for all. Seems strange & not so smart.

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Rocktiludrop
CDC study shows 74% of people infected with covid outbreak in Massachusetts were fully vaccinated.
Is it really necessary to take the vaccine at this stage considering everything. I mean if it's not preventing covid or the spread what's the point
[www.cnbc.com]

It's an option for those who risk getting severe covid. Elderly, obese, people with lung conditions, etc. In vaccinated communities there are much fewer covid patients on ventilators, saving lives and resources. You know that Rocktiludrop!

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Rocktiludrop
CDC study shows 74% of people infected with covid outbreak in Massachusetts were fully vaccinated.
Is it really necessary to take the vaccine at this stage considering everything. I mean if it's not preventing covid or the spread what's the point
[www.cnbc.com]

From a sample of 469
Of which 4 people were hospitalised
Personally I think that’s great maths for vaccination
Think you’ve drawn the wrong conclusion there but feel free not to have it yourself.

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skytrench

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Rocktiludrop
CDC study shows 74% of people infected with covid outbreak in Massachusetts were fully vaccinated.
Is it really necessary to take the vaccine at this stage considering everything. I mean if it's not preventing covid or the spread what's the point
[www.cnbc.com]

It's an option for those who risk getting severe covid. Elderly, obese, people with lung conditions, etc. In vaccinated communities there are much fewer covid patients on ventilators, saving lives and resources. You know that Rocktiludrop!

So why are they pushing for children to have the vaccine ??

I speak as i find, that's what i know, i don't have personal experience of people sick or dead from covid ( other than very bad flu ) but i have a lot of first hand experience of side effects from vaccines. That's all i need to know in the real world, not the world from my TV, tablet, laptop. mobile phone,
Instincts and observations tell me the truth.
People do not know the long term effects from experimental vaccines, but even so i would take the vaccine if i believed it would prevent me from being sick with covid or prevent me spreading covid, but am i the only person not seeing those results, from where I'm observing the vaccine is disappointing, i hoped for better results, in some places I'm seeing increased spread of covid since the vaccines.
It would appear everyone is eventually going to get covid or has had covid, that's the way these things go, herd immunity, which is why lockdowns just prolonged the inevitable, the more people get it the weaker it becomes, it's not rocket science, at this point in time vaccines are probably futile to my mind, yes vaccines will be hailed as the saviour but I'm thinking nature has taken it's course, will continue to take its course, I've had covid, my body has probably built it's own natural antibodies, is it such an extreme reckless decision for me to refuse the vaccine, I will eventually have to take it to travel, but is that fair.

Anyone else switch-off whenever Covid-19 is mentioned? Meeting the British public daily, as part of my job-role, the one thing I draw from the mentioning of the virus, is just how thoroughly bored of it everyone is. Myself? I'm double-jabbed and now no-longer care. As long as their are no further lockdowns, Covid-19, will now have no further impact on my life. I won't let it.

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Rocktiludrop
So why are they pushing for children to have the vaccine ??

I speak as i find, that's what i know, i don't have personal experience of people sick or dead from covid ( other than very bad flu ) but i have a lot of first hand experience of side effects from vaccines. That's all i need to know in the real world, not the world from my TV, tablet, laptop. mobile phone,
Instincts and observations tell me the truth.
People do not know the long term effects from experimental vaccines, but even so i would take the vaccine if i believed it would prevent me from being sick with covid or prevent me spreading covid, but am i the only person not seeing those results, from where I'm observing the vaccine is disappointing, i hoped for better results, in some places I'm seeing increased spread of covid since the vaccines.
It would appear everyone is eventually going to get covid or has had covid, that's the way these things go, herd immunity, which is why lockdowns just prolonged the inevitable, the more people get it the weaker it becomes, it's not rocket science, at this point in time vaccines are probably futile to my mind, yes vaccines will be hailed as the saviour but I'm thinking nature has taken it's course, will continue to take its course, I've had covid, my body has probably built it's own natural antibodies, is it such an extreme reckless decision for me to refuse the vaccine, I will eventually have to take it to travel, but is that fair.

The rulers of the lands have seen their economies battered and are using a shotgun approach wanting everyone to be vaccinated without much concern for the longterm effects of the new vaccines. The lockdowns have prolonged the inevitable herd immunity, but allowed hospitals to cope with the amount of patients at a given time. I don't believe you are reckless to refuse, since you already have antibodies and once covid is at a low level due to global immunity, vaccination mandates for travel will hopefully be superfluous.

One can hope that a treatment will emerge from all this that also aids in the treatment of common virus infections like flu and common colds. Continual vaccination seems like a slippery slope for mankind. Just like antibiotics should be used sparingly.

Wow this place really seems to be waking up other than the usual fanatics, reading some of these common sence posts is heart warming, there is hope.
Here's to all of you that see through the media, big pharma, wikkie, fact checkers etc



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-31 16:47 by Rocktiludrop.

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Rocktiludrop
Wow this place really seems to be waking up other than the usual fanatics, reading some of these common sence posts is heart warming, there is hope.

LOL

It's like those dolls with strings. Pull the string and they start yelling "Fake News!" LOL

Here, you guys need this site.
[www.calhope.org]

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Rocktiludrop
Wow this place really seems to be waking up other than the usual fanatics, reading some of these common sence posts is heart warming, there is hope.
Here's to all of you that see through the media, big pharma, wikkie, fact checkers etc

Did you take the vaccine?

Nate

As I posted upthread, granted there is an unforeseeable risk to come out of this newly developed vaccine, I still support it in view of the mess the world is in right now, weighing the good against the bad in the balance.

It is true the double vaccinated can get the virus — a fact that a most ardent pro-vaxxer knows by now. But it helps greatly reduce the risks of symptomatic disease and hospitalization. And I keep wearing a mask where there is a group of people, especially indoors, to prevent infection not only for myself but also for other people.

In Britain, after the lifting of the restrictions on July 19, gigs and festivals are starting happening. Already there are reports of CV-positive turning out among the attendees on their return and back home, and last-minute cancellations of gigs or festive appearances of some acts who were found positive. See what the situations will be like in the next few weeks...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-31 19:22 by RisingStone.

It's weird to me listening to Steve Colberts recent jesty monologues. He has his fully vaccinated audience present and it should be obvious there's a possibility for breakthrough cases. They're packed tightly and act so exuberant (jesty too with the cheers and the boos) But he's lamenting the rise in cases and placing the blame straight at unnvaccinated people. If you asked me what he does isn't funny enough to warrant driving the wedge further between people.