Quote
Rockman



WOW man reusing swabs !!!!!
..... what a low act ....

That is disgusting.

Another story from CNN on vaccine hesitancy in the US, with the President hoping to unite the divided country:

Biden addresses Covid-19 vaccine hesitancy by underscoring that it's not "a Democrat or Republican issue"
From CNN's Maegan Vazquez

President Biden underscored on Tuesday that the coronavirus vaccine has been an apolitical endeavor led by science, crediting the Trump administration for approval of two Covid-19 vaccines in use in the US and thanking Republicans in Congress for their efforts. As the nation embarks on a new phase of its vaccination program, the administration has said it anticipates having to address more reluctant populations who have yet to get vaccinated. “I want to be clear. I’ve been saying this a long time, but I really believe this is not a Democrat or Republican issue. Science behind the vaccines has been under development for decades. Two of our vaccines were authorized under prior administrations, Republican administrations,” Biden said during remarks at the White House. “My administration, a Democratic administration, is doing the work to get hundreds of millions of shots in arms. While we may not always agree on everything, this is one thing people across the political spectrum can agree on.”

Biden thanked prominent conservatives like Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell and the “large group of Republican members of Congress who have medical training, who have advanced getting vaccinated.” He also thanked the 105 million Americans “of every background who are fully protected from one of the deadliest pandemics in our history.” “You know, there’s a lot of disinformation out there, but there’s one fact I want every American to know: people who are not fully vaccinated can still die every day from Covid-19,” Biden said. “This is your choice: it’s life and death, and I hope everyone knows within themselves and makes the choice that’s going to help them and their loved ones be safe,” he continued.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
NICOS

Quote
treaclefingers

Quote
MisterDDDD
As early as this week, Pfizer may get FDA approval for 12-16 year olds.
Have a 15 yo that will be as close to the front of the line as I can get her.

FDA to authorize Pfizer vaccine for children ages 12-15 as early as this week

"In the Pandemic, more children could soon be in line to get a COVID-19 vaccine. The FDA could soon approve use of Pfizer's two dose vaccine in kids over the age of 12.

Right now Pfizer is the only shot approved for people 16 and older.

Doctors say those shots for children will likely be administered in locations where they'll be easily accessable such as Pediatric offices.
[www.wdio.com]

Good news. In Canada Pfizer's also made an application for that age range. Their prediction 5-11 year olds by end of summer.

5-11 year old?...... are they getting sick too of covid?.................. and what about 0-4 years old?

Pfizer's also made an application for that age range.... Pfizer's will be filthy rich if this pandemic will be over.

Normally I won't react on this thread.....but I couldn't resist this one....

well...not normally but this week an infant under 1 and a 2 year old both died of COVID. Possibly the new variants UK or Brazil.

This just in: in the hamlet of Clements, in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada in California, some yokels in a bar just got busted for selling, get this, fake immunization cards. How's this make you feel about the "safety" of those crowds of supposedly immunized people? And what kind of whack job pays money to get a fake card showing something they could have gotten for free, not to mention get themselves protected at the same time. Thats right, the stupid people are winning again.


jb

That's The United Mistakes of Amnesia for ya.

Quote
jbwelda
This just in: in the hamlet of Clements, in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada in California, some yokels in a bar just got busted for selling, get this, fake immunization cards. How's this make you feel about the "safety" of those crowds of supposedly immunized people? And what kind of whack job pays money to get a fake card showing something they could have gotten for free, not to mention get themselves protected at the same time. Thats right, the stupid people are winning again.


jb

This is happening everywhere. I fear we are going to need Covid vaccines AND negative Covid tests to attend events in some places and in other places it is an assumed risk to attend events. I would definitely plan my show attendance around the places requiring the vaccines and tests .

Quote
jbwelda
This just in: in the hamlet of Clements, in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada in California, some yokels in a bar just got busted for selling, get this, fake immunization cards. How's this make you feel about the "safety" of those crowds of supposedly immunized people? And what kind of whack job pays money to get a fake card showing something they could have gotten for free, not to mention get themselves protected at the same time. Thats right, the stupid people are winning again.


jb

People are weird and then mix in there rhetoric and common sense is thrown out with the trash . Tow the line or else .

Quote
jbwelda
This just in: in the hamlet of Clements, in the foothills of the Sierra Nevada in California, some yokels in a bar just got busted for selling, get this, fake immunization cards. How's this make you feel about the "safety" of those crowds of supposedly immunized people? And what kind of whack job pays money to get a fake card showing something they could have gotten for free, not to mention get themselves protected at the same time. Thats right, the stupid people are winning again.


jb

Meh.
Thats why vaccine passports will become a thing.
These yahoos just helping it along.

As for how it makes me feel re safety of crowds.. again .. meh.
Got my shots. Hoping we all reach herd immunity. But a minuscule number of fans getting in with fake cards doesn't concern me at all really.

Now having had both shots, I genuinely feel more liberated. I, personally, would have no qualms with attending mass events alongside others that are also as fortunate as me. If there’s a scheme whereby those not vaccinated can enter by showing proof of recent testing, that’d be okay, also.

You do realize what a pain in the ass getting a covid test in a short time frame before an event will be, right? Especially if a lot of people "need" them all of a sudden. Just one more hoop to jump over because of fools.

And about the "vax passports": who is to say those won't be counterfeited, and again, what a pain in the ass to get and have, all because some dickbreath idiots want to make some side money preying on imbeciles.

I am vaxxed so I guess I don't care, what I will say is when I see people without masks standing around in a group, I take off my mask and start coughing, in their general direction.

So tired of idiots and having to lower my game to the lowest common denominator because of their idiocy.

jb

Quote
jbwelda
You do realize what a pain in the ass getting a covid test in a short time frame before an event will be, right? Especially if a lot of people "need" them all of a sudden. Just one more hoop to jump over because of fools.

And about the "vax passports": who is to say those won't be counterfeited, and again, what a pain in the ass to get and have, all because some dickbreath idiots want to make some side money preying on imbeciles.

I am vaxxed so I guess I don't care, what I will say is when I see people without masks standing around in a group, I take off my mask and start coughing, in their general direction.

So tired of idiots and having to lower my game to the lowest common denominator because of their idiocy.

jb

It's all going to be a huge pain and for the life of me I have to think it's going to be one major pain in the fanny to return to normalcy due to the idiots not being vaccinated . There will be a cost born out of the idiocy from the idiots that will be passed on to all of us . Which in turn will take the natural fun out of it for me . Then how safe is safe ? I do not intend to get rid of my mask in the near future for quite some time . I have 2 dinners planned out for contractors from out of town and I am not looking forward to putting myself in that situation , but it's the cost of doing business and best foot forward .

Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

Bjornulf

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

this sounds sensible and easy enough to do for the sake of safety .

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

Fair enough, but that will really depend on how the gov't-system works in different countries.

In the US, the Feds have already essentially said they are not going to mandate Vax Passports....which means it will be left up to the states, which is a mixed-bag.

Some states have already banned VPs, some are implementing them.

I foresee this going to the SCOTUS. There's simply too many "civil rights" and "privacy" and "discrimination" elements involved.....and Americans love to sue, IMO...

As for concerts, if VPs are left up to the states...bands and fans will have to choose their tour-schedules depending on how they feel about VPs and various state policies therein...seems fair to me.

Personally, I have no interest in supporting "No VP, No Entry"...I'll simply adjust my behavior accordingly.

If the SCOTUS says they are legal, I'll accept that as the law. That's why we have a SCOTUS.

and yes, I have my vax...no, I am not an anti-vaxxer...no, I am not a denier, no I am not a MAGA-Trumper or whatever else one might need/want to call me "stupid" or some other unnecessary insult.

I simply disagree with the policy as I see it as discriminatory and unnecessary b/c "if it isn't safe-enough w/o VPs, it isn't safe-enough"....IMO.

and...the sooner they are introduced, the more rapid the global inequities they foster will emerge and grow (most people in the 3rd world won't have a Vax until 2023 or beyond...so, what are they supposed to do while we get on w/ our lives and make money and enjoy the recovery and go to the Stones? Be excluded & get poorer, that's what)

interesting read:

[www.bu.edu]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-05-05 21:57 by stickyfingers101.

"Seychelles brings back curbs despite vaccination success"

Schools have been closed and sports activities cancelled for two weeks

The Seychelles, which has fully vaccinated over 60% of its population against Covid-19, is bringing back restrictions amid a rise in cases.

The archipelago of nearly 100,000 people recorded close to 500 new cases in the three days to 1 May and has about 1,000 active cases.

A third of the active cases involved people who had had two vaccine doses, the country's news agency said.
[news.yahoo.com]

From the Washington Post:

He faked a coronavirus certificate to fly to Argentina, officials say. He was infected all along.

Covid19

Teo Armus
May 5, 2021 at 4:55 a.m. PDT

Just hours before he was set to board a flight home to Argentina on Saturday, Santiago Solans Portillo received some news that appeared to throw a wrench in his travel plans: His coronavirus test had come back positive, authorities say. But when the 29-year-old arrived at the airport in Miami, he made no such disclosure to the American Airlines agents checking him in, instead presenting a medical certificate that said he was fit to fly. It was only the following day, when he landed in Buenos Aires and health officials took his temperature, finding he had a fever of 101.3 degrees, that he made his confession: He probably had covid-19 — and should not have boarded the plane. “Due to this irresponsible, selfish behavior, 200 people are at risk despite having done the right thing while traveling,” Florencia Carignano, Argentina’s top immigration official, told reporters this week.

As with many other countries, Argentina requires international travelers coming from the United States to present proof of having recovered from covid-19 recently or a negative test to board a flight. Borders have largely been closed to almost anyone besides citizens and permanent residents. New cases in Argentina have skyrocketed in recent weeks, surpassing a total of 3 million and reaching an all-time high of new daily cases late last month as hospitals scramble to accommodate the influx of covid-19 patients. But as in much of Latin America, vaccine rollout efforts have stalled — in part because of a shortage of supplies largely stockpiled by the United States and other wealthier countries. About 7 million people, or 16 percent of the total population, had received at least one shot as of May 3, according to data tracked by The Washington Post.

Anxious and tired of waiting, some of the richest Argentines have instead looked north, flying to Miami to get shots. Officials said that Portillo, who owns a commercial pressure-washing business, was one of them. It is unclear whether Portillo ever did get vaccinated. But Argentine authorities say that he received a medical certificate at some point on Saturday from a clinic in Hollywood, Fla., stating that he was in good health and able to travel internationally. But in an interview with an Argentine radio station this week, Juan Manuel Dragani, a lawyer in Buenos Aires who represents that clinic, insisted that the certificate was not counterfeit or fraudulent and had been issued to the patient in accordance with all U.S. guidelines. “There’s a direct responsibility for the accused,” Dragani said, noting that Portillo’s only contact with the clinic had been through a telehealth appointment. Still, at 5:15 p.m. on Saturday, Portillo received a PCR test that showed he was positive for the coronavirus, authorities said. By midnight, he had boarded American Airlines Flight AA921, and on Sunday morning, the plane — carrying 258 other passengers and 12 crew members — landed in Argentina. After acknowledging his alleged ruse, authorities said, he was arrested and transported to a Buenos Aires sanitary hotel — one of several facilities that the city had run for travelers arriving from abroad who were ordered to quarantine.

In a brief phone interview Tuesday with Clarín, the country’s largest newspaper, Portillo said he was running a fever and was receiving medical treatment while in custody there. He claimed that the publication’s previous reporting on his case was “all a lie” and refused to offer more details without consulting his lawyer. (As of that morning, however, court officials noted that he had yet to retain an attorney; The Post was unable to reach Portillo.) Carignano, the immigration official, said that Portillo could face 3 to 15 years in prison under an Argentine law that bars people from knowingly exposing others to infectious diseases. She noted that his “complex judicial situation” would be compounded if any of his fellow passengers develop symptoms in the coming days. Buenos Aires city health officials have tracked down at least 14 people who were sitting near Portillo on the plane, ordering them to quarantine for at least seven days, although it is unclear whether any have tested positive for the virus. A judge has seized Portillo’s cellphone to examine when he received the medical certificate, and at what time a different clinic in Miami notified him that he had tested positive for the virus. Carignano has also said that her agency would sanction and fine American Airlines for allowing a sick person to board the flight, in violation of the country’s coronavirus rules. The airline did not immediately respond to a request for comment from The Post.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
TheGreek

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

this sounds sensible and easy enough to do for the sake of safety .

Too bad the US is unable to allow anything like that.

A lawyer's dream come true:

"OSHA’s New Guidance on Recordability of COVID-19 Vaccine Reactions"

"If I require my employees to take the COVID-19 vaccine as a condition of their employment, are adverse reactions to the vaccine recordable?

If you require your employees to be vaccinated as a condition of employment (i.e., for work-related reasons), then any adverse reaction to the COVID-19 vaccine is work-related. The adverse reaction is recordable if it is a new case under 29 CFR 1904.6 and meets one or more of the general recording criteria in 29 CFR 1904.7."

[www.natlawreview.com]

Quote
Big Al
Now having had both shots, I genuinely feel more liberated. I, personally, would have no qualms with attending mass events alongside others that are also as fortunate as me. If there’s a scheme whereby those not vaccinated can enter by showing proof of recent testing, that’d be okay, also.

Then again: I ask myself: when do I attend mass-gatherings? I don’t go to football matches and, truthfully, wasn’t exactly attending many concerts prior to the initial lockdown. I enjoyed seeing the Stones at Twickenham in 2017, but viewed it as a one-off. I genuinely can’t be bothered anymore. It’s too crowded and costs far too much. I think I like the idea of such events taking place once again, but I’ll sit it all out!

When it’s over, will it look like this?

get vaccinated folks....the bullshit out there regarding fears and concerns of the vaccine are false...get it done...protect yourself and your loved ones..stop being selfish and stupid.

Latest projection by IHME-UW shows daily #COVID19 deaths in U.S. falling to less than 75 by end of July. In January, 3,350 people were dying every day.


[covid19.healthdata.org]

Quote
daspyknows

Quote
TheGreek

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

this sounds sensible and easy enough to do for the sake of safety .

Too bad the US is unable to allow anything like that.

Agreed daspy

Quote
Rip This
get vaccinated folks....the bullshit out there regarding fears and concerns of the vaccine are false...get it done...protect yourself and your loved ones..stop being selfish and stupid.

I find it interesting how many people think that calling people "selfish" and "stupid" (etc. etc.) is a good way to bring them around to your position.

It's been my experience that insults rarely work to do anything but get people to dig their heels in against you....irrespective of any validity to your point.

people should get the vax, IMO...calling them "stupid" works against that goal, IMO.

but, if you want to keep trying....good luck.

if you get offline and start going "live" w/ your strategy, don't be surprised if you get a punch in the face rather than an "OK, you convinced me...thank you for showing me how dumb I am!!"

Quote
daspyknows

Quote
TheGreek

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

this sounds sensible and easy enough to do for the sake of safety .

Too bad the US is unable to allow anything like that.

Question: Would your opinion change depending on which party was in control of the Federal Gov't?

What if the Fed Gov't decided Vax-Passports were illegal across the entire US? Or made "illegal" something else you are in favor of?

Still agree w/ this system? Or do you only like it if they make decisions you agree with?

our Federalist system has flaws...it's still better than "One Size Fits All" across 330 million people.

the ONLY way VPs can/should become "mandatory" across the US is if the SCOTUS rules as-such....which is why we have a SCOTUS.

Quote
stickyfingers101

Quote
daspyknows

Quote
TheGreek

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

this sounds sensible and easy enough to do for the sake of safety .

Too bad the US is unable to allow anything like that.

Question: Would your opinion change depending on which party was in control of the Federal Gov't?

What if the Fed Gov't decided Vax-Passports were illegal across the entire US? Or made "illegal" something else you are in favor of?

Still agree w/ this system? Or do you only like it if they make decisions you agree with?

our Federalist system has flaws...it's still better than "One Size Fits All" across 330 million people.

the ONLY way VPs can/should become "mandatory" across the US is if the SCOTUS rules as-such....which is why we have a SCOTUS.

When it comes to the party in office I don't care a hill of beans when it comes down to safety . That is a societal issue not defined by ideology . It is a Greek Tragedy of epic proportions that we as a nation are divided by ideology that flies in the face of common sense and rational thinking . What else can we expect when everything has become a holy political war ? I do understand the fine line/tightrope that Government and Business is operating on . Should we thrown caution to the wind and re open sooner than later ? Because there will most likely not be another Federal Stimulus bailout where everyone gets a check in the mail . Everything is tied together and peoples lives and livlyhoods depend on it along with the Feds and the States trying to replenish the tax coffers as so much has been spent . As far as Vax Passports , when there is a will there will be a way for the scammers to perpetrate fraud for monetary gain . So then how much does this help or provide safety ? Maybe we should all be microchiped ? How is that for radical ?

Quote
daspyknows

Quote
TheGreek

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

this sounds sensible and easy enough to do for the sake of safety .

Too bad the US is unable to allow anything like that.

There are pros and cons to freedom and liberty.

One of the negatives about the whole situation is how it became so much of a political issue, when it is actually a health (and common sense) issue.

I lean conservative, but have had both shots, wear a mask in stores or crowds, etc. to protect myself and others - whatever ones politics may be, as human lives are more important. Also, I look forward to concerts and sports events again.

The idea of fake cards repulses me.

BTW, I teach at a public school and we have been in person since last August with very few cases. Our students and staff have been pretty good (much better than I expected) about masking up and using common sense.

Quote
Elmo Lewis
One of the negatives about the whole situation is how it became so much of a political issue, when it is actually a health (and common sense) issue.

I lean conservative, but have had both shots, wear a mask in stores or crowds, etc. to protect myself and others - whatever ones politics may be, as human lives are more important. Also, I look forward to concerts and sports events again.

The idea of fake cards repulses me.

BTW, I teach at a public school and we have been in person since last August with very few cases. Our students and staff have been pretty good (much better than I expected) about masking up and using common sense.

I totally agree with your last paragraph. Similar experience here, but most kids here never wear masks. Now almost none do, now that the mandate has been lifted for weeks. But, Covid exposure here at school has been almost non-existent.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-05-06 17:27 by NashvilleBlues.

Quote
TheGreek

Quote
stickyfingers101

Quote
daspyknows

Quote
TheGreek

Quote
bv
Today Norway authorities announced the plan for the "Corona Pass", to be ready next month. The pass will give access to privileges like larger venues, concerts, travel and more. It will be secure, controlled by QR code and an app, online. It will give you privileges if one of the following thee conditions are in place:

- Vaccination ok
- Antibodies following covid-19
- Negative covid-19 test within 24 hours

Without the covid-19vaccine, you would have to test yourself every time you want to go to a concert, travel or do other activities involving a crowd of more than 50-200 people. Luckily most people here intend to get vaccinated during the next few months.

this sounds sensible and easy enough to do for the sake of safety .

Too bad the US is unable to allow anything like that.

Question: Would your opinion change depending on which party was in control of the Federal Gov't?

What if the Fed Gov't decided Vax-Passports were illegal across the entire US? Or made "illegal" something else you are in favor of?

Still agree w/ this system? Or do you only like it if they make decisions you agree with?

our Federalist system has flaws...it's still better than "One Size Fits All" across 330 million people.

the ONLY way VPs can/should become "mandatory" across the US is if the SCOTUS rules as-such....which is why we have a SCOTUS.

When it comes to the party in office I don't care a hill of beans when it comes down to safety . That is a societal issue not defined by ideology . It is a Greek Tragedy of epic proportions that we as a nation are divided by ideology that flies in the face of common sense and rational thinking . What else can we expect when everything has become a holy political war ? I do understand the fine line/tightrope that Government and Business is operating on . Should we thrown caution to the wind and re open sooner than later ? Because there will most likely not be another Federal Stimulus bailout where everyone gets a check in the mail . Everything is tied together and peoples lives and livlyhoods depend on it along with the Feds and the States trying to replenish the tax coffers as so much has been spent . As far as Vax Passports , when there is a will there will be a way for the scammers to perpetrate fraud for monetary gain . So then how much does this help or provide safety ? Maybe we should all be microchiped ? How is that for radical ?

Well, it may not be defined by ideology, but the simple truth when it comes to humanity is: what one considers "necessary for public safety" is subjective.

Thankfully, I live in a democracy for now....and, a discussion/debate about balancing "public safety" and "individual liberties" is what democracy is all about, IMO.

if that has to go all the way to the SCOTUS...that's what democracy is all about....God Bless It....

the problem is, democracy is not structured well to handle certain types of emergencies that demand rapid action and/or actions that might violate what people consider their "rights"

....Dictatorships work much better.

that's the trade-off....rapid-dictated-decisions....or slower-democratic ones.

I prefer Democracy and am willing to accept the negative externalities of that process/delay

otherwise, as I said in a different post: We can just let Vladi Putin decide everything for the world.

Good old Vladi.