For information about how to use this forum please check out forum help and policies.
Quote
TheBluesHadaBabyQuote
spikenyc
3 friends of mine that attended the Peach Festival last weekend in Scranton PA have tested positive. They were all vaccinated and are experiencing mild to moderate symptoms.
They were no masks or covid protocols in place for the weekend.
Two questions:
What was the rate of full vaccination for Scranton and its surrounding county? (Pick but specify your measure: full population, age 12+, or age 18+) Get that to 70 or 75%, and infection falls way, way down.
Were the three fully vaccinated? If not, they were still highly vulnerable. Hopefully they were fully vaxxed. If so, yes, you still CAN catch covid, especially Delta which is almost twice as infectious. But none of the 3 should require hospitalization, much less die. Virtually no one is dying of covid in America anymore EXCEPT the unvaccinated. (One vaccinated person did die of it: a lung transplant recipient.) In short, if you're fully vaccinated, you're almost assured of not dying of covid. And "almost assured" is as good as we're ever going to get with such a vicious virus.
Quote
RokyfanQuote
GlimmerGirl24Quote
stickyfingers101
I also promise you there are plenty of insurance companies that would underwrite a Stones Tour if they went out tomorrow....guaranteed.
somebody underwrote Clapton and Bruce and Gn'R....there is money to be made and the insurance companies know it.
it's the Stones that are waiting...and that is their right. I have no problem w/ free-choice.
Besides, if we're gonna blame "the unvaccinated" for the lack of a Stones Tour, that's fine w/ me....as long as we give a big heaping slice of Blame Pie to the Wuhan Lab for starting this whole mess in the first place...or at least to the gnarly, unsanitary conditions of funky Chinese wet-markets, if you prefer that theory...
we'd have no "unvaccinated" if it wasn't for the Lab/Market/Whatever Theory You Like Better where all this crap began.....
Blame Pie! Because everybody likes blaming others.....and pie!
The issue isn't that insurance companies aren't trampling each other to insure tours, the issue is the promoters have changed the terms for the postponed 2020 tours. GnR is one of the bands that have agreed to a new contract which passes more of the financial risk onto the artist. Part of the new terms that Live Nation is insisting upon is:
"Force Majeure: If the artist’s performance is canceled due to an event of force majeure – including a pandemic similar to Covid-19 – the promoter will not pay the artist its fee. The artist is responsible for obtaining any cancellation insurance for its performance."
Live Nation has also cut guarantees by 20%. Additional new terms: if a venue cannot be used at full capacity because of venue/government orders, Live Nation can cancel the concert and the artist must return any money Live Nation has paid. In the past if a show was canceled for slow sales, the artist received 100% of the guarantee, now it's 25%. If the artist cancels a concert in breach of the contract, the artist owes Live Nation two times its fee.
[variety.com]
Over at AEG, they have also renegotiated and the changes include: “all deals in 2020 will be renegotiated regardless if they went on sale before the start of the crisis,” and that where a show was less than 90% sold out the guaranteed artist fee will be reduced “25% to 50% of original all-in guarantee based on sales before postponement.”
[www.musicradar.com]
Not only are bands paying the costs for insurance, they are now taking at least a 20% guarantee cut and in certain instances, the guarantee may drop to somewhere between zero and 25%. A band that experiences virus cancellations or slow ticket sales, could have their profit margin cut drastically.
While the Stones may have more negotiating power than other bands, AEG still may be passing on more of the financial risk than the Stones are willing to agree to, especially considering many of the concerts are in states with less than impressive vaccination rates.
In other words, he is correct . . . there is no inability to get insurance, that has nothing to do with the Stones not deciding what to do, as you stated was the current state of their thinking. Probably accurately since your connection to people with actual knowledge is well known. if and when they decide to resume touring, they will do so..
Quote
stickyfingers101Quote
TheBluesHadaBaby
For those who hide in a shack in the woods like a unibomber and never interact with another soul, fine, don't get vaxxed if you don't want to, nobody gives a f**k.
Everybody else, though, you're part of human society, like it or not. A global pandemic is killing millions, science has come up with a way to stop it, and if you refuse to help, then you are one of the people enabling the virus to continue infecting people, to keep mutating, and to continue killing people.
One's right to freely swing one's fists around ends where the next person's nose begins, is how I've always understood personal freedom. We all have responsibilities to help look out for each other's health and safety. But vaccination refuseniks are totally rejecting that paradigm.
If in August the U.S. had 70%, 75%+ of the adult population vaccinated, something physically very possible if people cooperated, then Covid Delta wouldn't stand a chance and we'd not be looking any possibilities of broad outbreaks this fall.
We'd also have a Rolling Stones North American tour starting late August or early September.
But those vax rates clearly aren't happening anytime soon, if ever, in America's Red States, due to obstinance and defiance that serve no real purpose and are causing only harm to the whole country, and beyond.
punching OTHER people in the face is illegal.
refusing to put medicine in YOUR OWN BODY is not.
unfortunate that you cannot accept that people have the right to choose what to put in their own body IRRESPECTIVE of how it affects you....
I agree that some of the consequences of FREE CHOICE are unpleasant...oh well.
I like having the right to choose what medicine goes in my body and what doesn't.
My Body, My Choice.
Besides...Corona is basically only killing the "defiant" Red State Unvaccinated now...you should be happy, since you clearly hate them.
[www.cnn.com]
Quote
daspyknows
a few hundred in the US and 1300 in Brazil as of a few months ago. That's doesn't seem like too many unless it is one of your kids.
[www.hopkinsmedicine.org]
[www.bbc.com]
Quote
AdamsQuote
spikenyc
I was going to post this in the Covid thread but probably has more relevance in this thread presently.
3 friends of mine that attended the Peach Festival last weekend in Scranton PA have tested positive.
They were all vaccinated and are experiencing mild to moderate symptoms.
They were no masks or covid protocols in place for the weekend.
We still need to be vigilant.
I have a feeling some of these upcoming tours and Fests might be postponed again.
Not holding my breath for a 2021 Stones tour.
That's why all events should be for vaccinated only at the moment. At least current knowledge is that there is a less chance of a spread between people who are fully vaccinated. Screw people who demonstrate for what they think is freedom.
Quote
timbernardisQuote
AdamsQuote
spikenyc
I was going to post this in the Covid thread but probably has more relevance in this thread presently.
3 friends of mine that attended the Peach Festival last weekend in Scranton PA have tested positive.
They were all vaccinated and are experiencing mild to moderate symptoms.
They were no masks or covid protocols in place for the weekend.
We still need to be vigilant.
I have a feeling some of these upcoming tours and Fests might be postponed again.
Not holding my breath for a 2021 Stones tour.
That's why all events should be for vaccinated only at the moment. At least current knowledge is that there is a less chance of a spread between people who are fully vaccinated. Screw people who demonstrate for what they think is freedom.
Stupid Trumpists.
plexi
Quote
DeanGoodman
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate covid anymore?
Quote
stickyfingers101Quote
daspyknowsQuote
Adams
In the autumn we might expect covid surges not touring.
I don't think it is somebody's business if they get vaccinated or not. If people don't get vaccinated they help the virus to mutate, they help the virus to spread, they also block hospitals from normal operations.
Someone who thinks otherwise is rather shortsighted to put it mildly.
Stated very well. I would add selfish to shortsighted too.
sure...I'd add that word too...not as an insult, though.
Maybe you disagree, but IMO, people 100% have the right to be "selfish" about what they put in their body....or what they don't..
it's not against the law to refuse the Vax...so, it doesn't matter what the consequences are OR if it is a "shortsighted" decision....it's a FREE choice made by a FREE individual in a FREE society....
Go Freedom!
Besides, if I don't choose what medicines to take (or not)....who should? The gov't?
No thank you.
I got the Vax...After conversations w/ my doctor, I did it for ME and MY family...b/c it was the best decision for ME and MY family....if that flattens the curve or keeps others safe in the process....all the better....but I don't take medicines because OTHER people want me to....
Sorry. No.
My Body, My Choice.
Quote
DeanGoodman
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate covid anymore?
Quote
timbernardisQuote
DeanGoodman
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate covid anymore?
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate set lists anymore?
plexi
Quote
kovachQuote
timbernardisQuote
DeanGoodman
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate covid anymore?
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate set lists anymore?
plexi
I'm in! I'm tired of arguing. I'd even buy those I've argued with a beer if I ran into them on the tour
Quote
spikenycQuote
TheBluesHadaBabyQuote
spikenyc
3 friends of mine that attended the Peach Festival last weekend in Scranton PA have tested positive. They were all vaccinated and are experiencing mild to moderate symptoms.
They were no masks or covid protocols in place for the weekend.
Two questions:
What was the rate of full vaccination for Scranton and its surrounding county? (Pick but specify your measure: full population, age 12+, or age 18+) Get that to 70 or 75%, and infection falls way, way down.
Were the three fully vaccinated? If not, they were still highly vulnerable. Hopefully they were fully vaxxed. If so, yes, you still CAN catch covid, especially Delta which is almost twice as infectious. But none of the 3 should require hospitalization, much less die. Virtually no one is dying of covid in America anymore EXCEPT the unvaccinated. (One vaccinated person did die of it: a lung transplant recipient.) In short, if you're fully vaccinated, you're almost assured of not dying of covid. And "almost assured" is as good as we're ever going to get with such a vicious virus.
I have no clue about vaccine rates for Scranton or the price of tea in China! ><
My friends have been fully vaccinated since March. Thanks
Quote
Sockers56Quote
DeanGoodman
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate covid anymore?
Amen to that, Dean.
Quote
bam
Let's hope the tour happens. And we can get back to arguing with people who are mistaken and don’t see that “Miss You” has been horribly overplayed.
Quote
NateQuote
kovachQuote
timbernardisQuote
DeanGoodman
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate covid anymore?
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate set lists anymore?
plexi
I'm in! I'm tired of arguing. I'd even buy those I've argued with a beer if I ran into them on the tour
Lots of people on here are now going to start arguments with you
Nate
Quote
kovachQuote
NateQuote
kovachQuote
timbernardisQuote
DeanGoodman
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate covid anymore?
When the Stones announce tour plans, can we all promise not to debate set lists anymore?
plexi
I'm in! I'm tired of arguing. I'd even buy those I've argued with a beer if I ran into them on the tour
Lots of people on here are now going to start arguments with you
Nate
Good one.
I'll be disquised as Keith Richards, good luck.
Quote
snoopy2
Received the Jason Isbell & 400 Unit tour announcement today, they got a gazillion dates but the one of interest is they are playing in Canada (Fredericton) Sept. 17th, which may bode well for "other" bands Canada dates
Quote
snoopy2
Received the Jason Isbell & 400 Unit tour announcement today, they got a gazillion dates but the one of interest is they are playing in Canada (Fredericton) Sept. 17th, which may bode well for "other" bands Canada dates