Don’t they add a show in Canada when touring the USA for tax purposes?
Meaning the cancellation of a show in Canada is more significant than a single show in the USA being cancelled.

Nate

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Nate
Don’t they add a show in Canada when touring the USA for tax purposes?
Meaning the cancellation of a show in Canada is more significant than a single show in the USA being cancelled.

Nate

Interesting speculation. Sounds unlikely to me.
Perhaps someone with knowledge on the tax issue will weigh in.

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JN99

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Hairball
From WHO Chief scientist Dr. Soumya Swaminathan today via CNN:

"Everyone should recognize that this pandemic is not over… It's not that we can’t travel or do anything, but this is really not the time for us to encourage a lot of social mixing, to encourage mass events,
especially without precautions, wherever you live in the world because these variants, you know, they travel around the world even before you recognize there’s a new variant.I think this is the time still
to be very cautious and we should remember that a large part of the world still doesn't have enough vaccines even to protect their most vulnerable people, and we need to be getting vaccines out to them.”

CNN

Makes sense. We all want desperately for things to get back to normal or progress to whatever this new normal will be but the world just isn't there yet and the progress made is unequal and still very fragile. So while we may have hoped for a U.S. tour this fall, the reality is it's probably still too soon.

The Stones are clearly following the science carefully vs. hastily moving forward into unknown territory.
As bv stated in the coronavirus thread "Also, DELTA is probably the main concern of any tour plans, including the Stones. They do not make tour plans on wishful thinking".
So as much as some of us hope and wish for a rescheduled tour, until the World Health Organization and other scientists give the green light, probably best to be patient and hope for the best.
Based on the way things are going though, not to mention the insurance problems, visa issues, their age, and the dozens of other variables, the reality of it all doesn't really bode well for a fall tour this year.
Maybe we'll hear some more solid rumours soon, or maybe something soon from the Stones themselves one way or another...the clock is ticking...and ticking...and ticking...

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

I also think they realize pushing this tour back to 2022 kind of ruins their plans to play the U.K. in 2022 for the 60th Anniversary. I don't think playing more than 15 shows a year is something they want to do so touring both the U.S./Canada and then the U.K. later on (or before) is the most desirable option.

This 60th anniversary thing seems a tad overblown to me. They'll probably do something to mark the occasion but there isn't any indication that it's going to be a tour next summer. Other than perhaps Mick reading a poem that implies something about RAH being "ready for them". If we look at 2012, they didn't get it together until very late in the year and Keith later called the 2013 arena tour (of the US) and the Hyde Park shows the actual anniversary. He said something about 1962 being the year of "conception" with the actual "birth" of the band in 1963.

From NME, November 2020:

Stones 60th

The veteran band are set to celebrate 60 years together in 2022, having formed as The Rolling Stones in 1962.

Richards was asked in a new interview with GQ about whether the Stones had formulated any plans for their 60th anniversary yet, to which he replied: “Well, the plans are to still actually all be alive.”
“Apart from that, at our age, I don’t know. I haven’t heard of any plans, but I’m sure there are things being made,” the 76-year-old continued.

“First off, I’m going to get through this year and see how we handle next year. Because I think at the moment, there are more problems than a Rolling Stones celebration.
Although I’m very glad that we’re all here, but I’ll leave it at that if I can.”

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

The Stones aren't going much of anywhere in 2021. Maybe a little gig or two. Its way too late and way too uncertain to even consider it plausible. Save your bread for 2022 and even then I doubt much will come of it. One or two years means a lot when you are in your mid 70s to 80s. I think we might see some big extravaganza gig as a farewell and then that's it except for vault and rarity releases and more Super Dooper Deluxe red vinyl limited edition tourist fodder from that overpriced Target on Carnaby row.

jb



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-03 00:13 by jbwelda.

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Hairball
From NME, November 2020:

Stones 60th

The veteran band are set to celebrate 60 years together in 2022, having formed as The Rolling Stones in 1962.

Richards was asked in a new interview with GQ about whether the Stones had formulated any plans for their 60th anniversary yet, to which he replied: “Well, the plans are to still actually all be alive.”
“Apart from that, at our age, I don’t know. I haven’t heard of any plans, but I’m sure there are things being made,” the 76-year-old continued.

“First off, I’m going to get through this year and see how we handle next year. Because I think at the moment, there are more problems than a Rolling Stones celebration.
Although I’m very glad that we’re all here, but I’ll leave it at that if I can.”

I understand this quote by Keith better now, knowing about the Ronnie Wood situation

Local small music venues have been struggling to stay open for over a year here due to massive increases in insurance costs, concurrent with COVID closures. No breaks offered for them while shuttered during COVID, now trying to claw their way back they are facing increases of up to 400%. One prominent Toronto venue, the Horseshoe Tavern, may be leaving. I’m not sure whether other locales have this problem or not, but it does not bode well for the future of live music venues. I wonder if this will have any impact on future large tours, like the one we’re all crossing our fingers for… The El Mocambo has been ‘opening soon’ for years now, no idea if this could affect them too. I think it’s a bit of a personal passion for the current owner, who is very well off, but no idea how much more he is willing to sink into it.

[www.cbc.ca]

Live music venues struggle to stay afloat amid skyrocketing insurance rates as pandemic recedes

Iconic Horseshoe Tavern could leave province if it can't find liability insurance, owner warns

The city's live music venues are having so much trouble finding affordable insurance as the pandemic wanes that some are considering closing their doors.

And at least one — the iconic Horseshoe Tavern — could soon be leaving the province.

The situation is so dire that the city has taken on the role of go-between to help the insurance industry and the Canadian Live Music Association find some common ground that could lead to an affordable insurance plan tailored to live music venues.

Toronto city councillors will be updated on those talks when the economic and community development committee meets Wednesday.

"Pre-pandemic, insurance rates for my venue had increased about 400 per cent over 10 years," said Shaun Bowring, owner of The Garrison.

"The quotes received during the pandemic are 300 or 400 per cent more than pre-COVID."

And Jeff Cohen, the owner of the Horseshoe Tavern, long a fixture at Queen Street West and Spadina Avenue, said he can't get liability insurance at any price.

"If I have no liability insurance by the new year, I'll consider moving to another province," he said.

Part of the problem, according to Spencer Sutherland, a former venue owner and current member of the city's Toronto Music Advisory Committee, is that the city's 90 or so live music venues are often lumped in with nightclubs for the purposes of insurance — even though music venues operate under different licences and tend to be less risky.

"What we really want is simply for for an insurance company to provide an insurance program that is specific to those music venues — that doesn't lump it in with other high-risk entertainment-based businesses and just provide a solution that's more specific to the sector," Sutherland said.

"To differentiate the live music venues like the Horseshoe and the Phoenix and the Bovine and The Garrison, and to distinguish those from from large nightclubs or other major entertainment venues that have other risk factors."

Adding to to the owners' financial woes is the fact that for 16 months, insurance companies have insisted that venues continue to make their premium payments, even while they're shuttered, Sutherland said.

He said insurance companies have provided no reason for the sudden post-COVID rate hikes.

But Erin Benjamin, CEO of the Canadian Live Music Association, which is leading the talks with the insurance industry, said she's convinced the pandemic has made insurance companies especially risk-averse.

"The timing is just too much for me to really wrap my head around," she said.

"All of a sudden COVID strikes, and suddenly there's no one who will write [insurance policies] for the live music venues in the country, and not just venues, in some cases festivals as well."

Mike Tanner, Toronto's music development officer, said the city's role in the industry talks is strictly as a facilitator. He emphasized that the city is not interested in acting as an insurance provider, or a guarantor.

He said the ongoing discussions began last year and the city's role is to provide "information. advice, contacts, and context.

"Music venues animate our streets, they make Toronto more livable, and they're not least a springboard for young artists and their career trajectories. It's a fragile ecosystem.

"But that can be taken for granted."

Even so, Tanner said he's "optimistic and hopeful" that a new insurance scheme can be worked out that benefits the industry.

He said the live music industry in the city generates about $850 million annually and provides the equivalent of 10,500 full-time jobs.

The Insurance Bureau of Canada told CBC Toronto it's not directly involved in the talks, but "we do recognize this is a challenging time for businesses who are operating in an environment that no one would have predicted a year ago.

"The COVID-19 pandemic has compounded the existing challenges and heightened affordability and availability concerns.

"There is coverage available so our best advice is to shop around. Business owners should contact their insurance representative or broker to discuss their insurance needs and the products that are available in the market to address their requirements."

Per my source at LN, the tour is completely rerouted for the fall, all venues locked and loaded. They are not waiting on any type of Canada / border announcement, they are waiting for the band to give it the thumbs up.

I cannot confirm what venues may have been dropped or swapped out.

Obviously not super helpful in terms of planning specific dates / locations. I was more or less trying to confirm whether it was off the table, 50/50 etc. to help plan for Sept / Oct as we have a number of different shows we are seeing that have been re-scheduled.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-03 19:47 by livefromuk.

I think you are exactly right with an announcement toward the end of July . Most tickets are sold so eight weeks is not too late to start at the end of Sept like BTB in 97. A lot of the venues have roofs or are in the South. Wait on the US/Canadian border to open and that will signal the announcement.

How can they change venues if tickets have already been sold and are apparently still on sale on Ticketmaster .
Why not start the tour April 8th next year same venues ,apart from San Diego .They'll be finished by June 8th , 4 month break then play some London Autumn shows .

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welshphil
How can they change venues if tickets have already been sold and are apparently still on sale on Ticketmaster .
Why not start the tour April 8th next year same venues ,apart from San Diego .They'll be finished by June 8th , 4 month break then play some London Autumn shows .

I didn’t take the person’s post as the venues were changed or swapped. The person is just saying no information on individual dates, just the tour or the existence of the tour.

This lines up with what others have said or implied.

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livefromuk
Per my source at LN, the tour is completely rerouted for the fall, all venues locked and loaded. They are not waiting on any type of Canada / border announcement, they are waiting for the band to give it the thumbs up.

I cannot confirm what venues may have been dropped or swapped out.

Obviously not super helpful in terms of planning specific dates / locations. I was more or less trying to confirm whether it was off the table, 50/50 etc. to help plan for Sept / Oct as we have a number of different shows we are seeing that have been re-scheduled.

As an additional thought, could be any number of factors that the band is evaluating. I take the post to mean that Live Nation is not waiting on the Canada border announcement for dates so Vancouver was either included or it was not. TBD.

Makes sense to not have ~15 other dates hinge on 1, for better or worse.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-07-03 22:31 by Dougratajczak87.

In case anyone is interested, summary of the rumors floating around for date specifics:

- Late August for Minneapolis, possibly August 24th (can’t remember the specific source)

- Possibly Friday September 24th for Louisville (high school football game is normally played then at the stadium and it’s looked to moved to accommodate a concert at the venue according to a local)

- October 3rd for Pittsburgh per someone who works for the Steelers

- Cheese Shop Tom mentioned in a since deleted tweet that the Cotton Bowl in Dallas may be October 31 with Nashville and Austin around the same time frame.

This is an AEG Live tour. Live Nation’s competition.

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livefromuk
Per my source at LN, the tour is completely rerouted for the fall, all venues locked and loaded. They are not waiting on any type of Canada / border announcement, they are waiting for the band to give it the thumbs up.

I cannot confirm what venues may have been dropped or swapped out.

Obviously not super helpful in terms of planning specific dates / locations. I was more or less trying to confirm whether it was off the table, 50/50 etc. to help plan for Sept / Oct as we have a number of different shows we are seeing that have been re-scheduled.

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mpj200
This is an AEG Live tour. Live Nation’s competition.

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livefromuk
Per my source at LN, the tour is completely rerouted for the fall, all venues locked and loaded. They are not waiting on any type of Canada / border announcement, they are waiting for the band to give it the thumbs up.

I cannot confirm what venues may have been dropped or swapped out.

Obviously not super helpful in terms of planning specific dates / locations. I was more or less trying to confirm whether it was off the table, 50/50 etc. to help plan for Sept / Oct as we have a number of different shows we are seeing that have been re-scheduled.

You just got busted livefromuk

Live Nation = Ticketmaster = Rolling Stones tickets

If you get on livenation.com, when you hit the More Info button on a particular TBD Stones No Filter 2020 show, it redirects you to the ticketmaster.com page for that particular show...

Checking on the GnR dates originally scheduled for 2020, then moved to 2021 and reshuffled again for 7-31-21 start in Hershey, only 8 of 18 original stadium venues will be played, w Hershey and LA's Banc of California Stadium added in the mix... arena shows were added to cover many of the markets whose stadium shows were dropped.

Just tryin' to add some perspective to the dropping/adding gigs scenario not being unheard of...

I'm tryin' to be patient for some info, too, which means buying tix for some shows I would like to see in Aug/Sept/Oct/Nov 2021 are on hold until The Stones give me a path to follow, whether it's this Fall or next Spring...

AEG is the promoter not Live Nation. LN has merged with Ticketmaster that’s why

I know...

Bring on The Stones!

They are working on it…

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TKinOH


I know...

Bring on The Stones!

I never said LN was the promoter of the tour. The fact that AEG is the promoter has nothing to do with my post, source or info I provided. So no, I’m not “busted”. Thanks

I'm sure LN will know which other big bands are trying to fix tours, where and what dates - because they are talking to the same venues for their own tours. News from a source at LN should be pretty accurate.

I still feel it's a late Sept/early Oct start, December finish, with some Arenas at the end to make the finances work with fewer stadiums. Maybe 16-18 shows: after all they've had an enforced 2 year lay-off.

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Dougratajczak87
In case anyone is interested, summary of the rumors floating around for date specifics:

- Late August for Minneapolis, possibly August 24th (can’t remember the specific source)

- Possibly Friday September 24th for Louisville (high school football game is normally played then at the stadium and it’s looked to moved to accommodate a concert at the venue according to a local)

- October 3rd for Pittsburgh per someone who works for the Steelers

- Cheese Shop Tom mentioned in a since deleted tweet that the Cotton Bowl in Dallas may be October 31 with Nashville and Austin around the same time frame.

I gotta ask...who is Cheese Shop Tom?

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stickyfingers101

I gotta ask...who is Cheese Shop Tom?

"Fan of The Rolling Stones and all music ..." -- [Twitter.com] .

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Dougratajczak87
In case anyone is interested, summary of the rumors floating around for date specifics:

- Late August for Minneapolis, possibly August 24th (can’t remember the specific source)

- Possibly Friday September 24th for Louisville (high school football game is normally played then at the stadium and it’s looked to moved to accommodate a concert at the venue according to a local)

- October 3rd for Pittsburgh per someone who works for the Steelers

- Cheese Shop Tom mentioned in a since deleted tweet that the Cotton Bowl in Dallas may be October 31 with Nashville and Austin around the same time frame.

Living in Tennessee I can say that late October or early November could present a wide range of possible temperatures. I would like a Nashville show in the cold but I doubt Keith would.

The Unvaccinated Of The Americas will be the reason why The Rolling Stones do not tour NA this year.

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GasLightStreet
The Unvaccinated Of The Americas will be the reason why The Rolling Stones do not tour NA this year.

If this fall's tour doesn't happen, then yep, that'll be why.

That's been increasingly on my mind during this extended wait, as we've simultaneously watched vaccinations in a lot of states stall out. We have our states that are over 60% vaxxed among age 18+. And we've got states most of whose residents seem hell-bent on keeping their state at 50% or less. The 15 cities the Stones originally scheduled are scattered among both.

If the unvaxxed do scuttle the tour for this fall, I'm not sure the %'s in the South are going to be much improved by Spring 2022. UK and much of Europe should be ready by then, but the American South, I'm not so sure.

Here's my view. It's too late to do this for 2021, but if next spring the Stones choose to pull all the under-vaxxed states' concerts and move them to the much safer U.S. states, I'd not blame them.

And I say this as a native southerner and holder of great tix for Nashville and Atlanta. I'd just scramble for tickets up north instead of down here. (I say "here," Baltimore's closer to me anyway.) To hold this country below herd immunity... I just have no sympathy for those doing it. Obviously -- they're helping to very needlessly kill people. I have an intractable brother-in-law and two nephews among that "they," and I can report with 100% certainty, they're not budging on the matter. Most of America's vax refuseniks are that way.

If you lose great opportunities as a result, then you just lose great opportunities. The whole nation shouldn't have to suffer all of the same consequences that those states bring on themselves.

If we're stuck being Two Americas, as we seemingly are, I have zero objections to the Stones playing only in the one of the two Americas in which most of its citizens are behaving the more responsibly during a global pandemic.

****
I'm down in Virginia
with your Cousin Lou

I think they are waiting for a thumbs up for Ronnie. Recent pictures of him show him looking pretty haggard, after his recent cancer treatment. If his immune system is still compromised? No tour, or Mick Jagger is negotiating with Mick Taylor, as we speak. Were I MT, I'd be waiting for a dump truck, full of money,to appear in my driveway.

While I hope we see Ronnie come back 100%, I'd love to see and hear MT's take on songs he wasn't there for when recorded or released.

There was a Paris rehearsal where Keith zoomed off to be with his daughter who was having a baby. MT sat in for a day or two. What I wouldn't give to HEAR those rehearsals. MT sometimes could be seen, playing air guitar to SMU and JJF before he came out to play Satisfaction, for the encore. I'd LOVE to hear MT interpret those iconic riffs.

I'll get my second vaccination on Thursday. Hence they can play in my backyard