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Hairball

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daspyknows

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wickerman
Delta variant is mostly giving mild, cold-like symptoms, especially to vaccinated individuals. There is no concern about it if you have taken a vaccine already - just look at pure statistics. Death toll in the UK is extremely low, this is not a deadly virus anymore, not now when we have the vaccines widely available in Europe or the US. Hence, no reason to continue with all restrictions if vaccination rates are at 50%+ levels.

It is not deadly for those vaccinated. Right now only a few countries fit that bill. The US as a whole is in the middle but for every highly vaccinated location there is another with vaccination rates only slightly higher than a third world country. There will likely be another deadly wave before this is truly done then it will simmer for years.

As has been pointed out already in this thread, several of the cities on the tour itinerary fall in to the latter category of very low vaccination rates.

From NPR:

"There still are big portions of the country where the rates of vaccination are quite low. And, in fact, the Helix paper shows that this Delta variant
is increasing in frequency — the speed at which it's increasing in frequency is greatest in those areas where vaccination rates are lowest." - Dr. Jeremy Luban

The projections indicate that infections could start to rise again as soon as some time in July, especially if the vaccination campaign continues to stall.

Delta

Maybe some of those cities are being rescheduled to elsewhere... could explain a rescheduling hold up if they are working out how to refund certain cities and announce new ones.

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Hairball

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daspyknows

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wickerman
Delta variant is mostly giving mild, cold-like symptoms, especially to vaccinated individuals. There is no concern about it if you have taken a vaccine already - just look at pure statistics. Death toll in the UK is extremely low, this is not a deadly virus anymore, not now when we have the vaccines widely available in Europe or the US. Hence, no reason to continue with all restrictions if vaccination rates are at 50%+ levels.

It is not deadly for those vaccinated. Right now only a few countries fit that bill. The US as a whole is in the middle but for every highly vaccinated location there is another with vaccination rates only slightly higher than a third world country. There will likely be another deadly wave before this is truly done then it will simmer for years.

As has been pointed out already in this thread, several of the cities on the tour itinerary fall in to the latter category of very low vaccination rates.

From NPR:

"There still are big portions of the country where the rates of vaccination are quite low. And, in fact, the Helix paper shows that this Delta variant
is increasing in frequency — the speed at which it's increasing in frequency is greatest in those areas where vaccination rates are lowest." - Dr. Jeremy Luban

The projections indicate that infections could start to rise again as soon as some time in July, especially if the vaccination campaign continues to stall.

Delta

So.... then those anti-vaxers at this point will be anti-vaxers next year or will have contracted Covid by then and STILL not have antibody levels high enough to protect against a second infection. It will be a pandemic of the unvaccinated... No need to wait to get this tour started. Mick would not have talked about it already if Ronnie wasnt ready as someone else pointed out.

Sir Elton will be announcing a stadium tour tomorrow. I already have rescheduled tickets from summer 2020 for February 2022 for Chicago at United Center and will be at soldier field. Unclear whether it will be this year or next year. Seems like a lot of shows here since he will be here for 2 shows feb 2022.

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jimpietryga1

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Hairball

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daspyknows

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wickerman
Delta variant is mostly giving mild, cold-like symptoms, especially to vaccinated individuals. There is no concern about it if you have taken a vaccine already - just look at pure statistics. Death toll in the UK is extremely low, this is not a deadly virus anymore, not now when we have the vaccines widely available in Europe or the US. Hence, no reason to continue with all restrictions if vaccination rates are at 50%+ levels.

It is not deadly for those vaccinated. Right now only a few countries fit that bill. The US as a whole is in the middle but for every highly vaccinated location there is another with vaccination rates only slightly higher than a third world country. There will likely be another deadly wave before this is truly done then it will simmer for years.

As has been pointed out already in this thread, several of the cities on the tour itinerary fall in to the latter category of very low vaccination rates.

From NPR:

"There still are big portions of the country where the rates of vaccination are quite low. And, in fact, the Helix paper shows that this Delta variant
is increasing in frequency — the speed at which it's increasing in frequency is greatest in those areas where vaccination rates are lowest." - Dr. Jeremy Luban

The projections indicate that infections could start to rise again as soon as some time in July, especially if the vaccination campaign continues to stall.

Delta

So.... then those anti-vaxers at this point will be anti-vaxers next year or will have contracted Covid by then and STILL not have antibody levels high enough to protect against a second infection. It will be a pandemic of the unvaccinated... No need to wait to get this tour started. Mick would not have talked about it already if Ronnie wasnt ready as someone else pointed out.

Agree about Ronnie (hopefully), and as far as a "pandemic of the unvaccinated", I posted that yesterday after hearing a scientist on the radio say it, but he said it's already happening.
As for you saying "no need to wait to get the tour started", not sure if you're a scientist, or a physician, or have a crystal ball, or are just impatient, but evidently they have reasons to wait whatever those reasons are.
Could be visas, insurance, along with a number of other things, but they've held back on making an announcement even with stadiums booked until everything is ready to move forward...or maybe it won't happen at all.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-23 01:40 by Hairball.

Georgia Straight website in Vancouver says there's a major concert announcement tomorrow for BC Place. Steve Newton wrote the article and he's guessing it might be AC/DC although he has no inside information. Steve is the reporter who first broke the news that AC/DC was in Vancouver recording their last album.
Just in case it's a Stones announcement, I went on ticketmaster to repurchase tickets!

There's a shortage is so many things. New cars because of computer chips - with is pathetic. Ship containers. Wood. Buckets.

Maybe there's a shortage in union labor that builds the stages in the stadiums in the US because of the COVID enhanced Fed unemployment (a bump to the state unemployment payments), which ends the last day of June, 6-30-2021.

Or maybe because it's millions of dollars to rent the stadiums for the tour, the NFL teams have priority and scheduling is complete, that they're in negotiations. Or they already have had it finished and are just waiting on insurance approval.

Or maybe it's something else.

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DGA35
Georgia Straight website in Vancouver says there's a major concert announcement tomorrow for BC Place. Steve Newton wrote the article and he's guessing it might be AC/DC although he has no inside information. Steve is the reporter who first broke the news that AC/DC was in Vancouver recording their last album.
Just in case it's a Stones announcement, I went on ticketmaster to repurchase tickets!

It's going to be Elton John. He's announcing a bunch of shows on June 23.



That photo in social gives it away - Elton's logo on the field.

There is also a shortage of truckers.

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GasLightStreet
There's a shortage is so many things. New cars because of computer chips - with is pathetic. Ship containers. Wood. Buckets.

Maybe there's a shortage in union labor that builds the stages in the stadiums in the US because of the COVID enhanced Fed unemployment (a bump to the state unemployment payments), which ends the last day of June, 6-30-2021.

Or maybe because it's millions of dollars to rent the stadiums for the tour, the NFL teams have priority and scheduling is complete, that they're in negotiations. Or they already have had it finished and are just waiting on insurance approval.

Or maybe it's something else.

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Topi

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DGA35
Georgia Straight website in Vancouver says there's a major concert announcement tomorrow for BC Place. Steve Newton wrote the article and he's guessing it might be AC/DC although he has no inside information. Steve is the reporter who first broke the news that AC/DC was in Vancouver recording their last album.
Just in case it's a Stones announcement, I went on ticketmaster to repurchase tickets!

It's going to be Elton John. He's announcing a bunch of shows on June 23.



That photo in social gives it away - Elton's logo on the field.

Yes, they updated things later on this afternoon. Can't believe Elton is coming again! He already played 3 times here in Sept 2019 at Rogers Arena across the street. I saw the first two shows, identical right down to the between song talking. I'm sure it'll sell out or else come close, especially if this is the only show he's playing geographically in the Pacific North West.
The pic of BC Place with the logo is the configuration for the Whitecaps soccer games. You can see the upper bowl is curtained off so it holds about 26000 versus 54000 for full stadium.

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Topi
IanBillen: I still don't think it makes sense for them, from a pure financial standpoint, to just cancel the postponed 2020 tour now. There's a reason it has been postponed this long. And that reason is money. Far too much of it on the table for all the parties involved for just to say "screw it".

As far as Ronnie's health, consider this: if Ronnie wasn't healthy enough to go back on, why would Mick go on record (in the French interview) saying they're trying to reschedule the US tour for this fall already? Just a thought.

__________________________________________________________


Oh .. I was not aware Mick said this or of any French Interview. I figured there was a major hang up so they may have to / choose to let this tour go finally and plan for next year under mostly the same basic cities .. but new name for tour plus album ... So the same parties would be involved was my thought.

Could be a reschedule but new name with a few shows added or removed / re-arranged was my thinking.

I was not aware of Micks comments in the French interview. Even so .. things change fast at this age and truthfully .. as a touring act ..their health is fragile as a touring act. Charlie, Keith, Mick, and Ronnie have all been subject
to not making tours .. anything can happen at the turn of a dime at their ages (I hope nothing has though and I wish them health).

Ian

It's not likely they are going to change the name of the tour or the stage design at this point. The make up dates from 2020 (whenever they happen) are the 4th leg of the No Filter Tour which began in 2017. There are/were 6 legs of this tour originally planned and it was to run through 2022. Perhaps they will incorporate the 60th Anniversary of the band into the branding of the No Filter shows they play in 2022, or maybe they will just add some extra shows in London and New York to mark the occasion. We will all know soon enough.

I am hoping one of those legs will be South America, Buenos Aires in particular.


plexi

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timbernardis
I am hoping one of those legs will be South America, Buenos Aires in particular.

plexi

A Latin America tour was originally planned (as was Australia/New Zealand/Asia). I'm sure they would like to visit Buenos Aires, Brazil and Mexico City once more, but who knows if they will be able to make it back at this point.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-23 13:40 by TornAndFried.

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timbernardis
I am hoping one of those legs will be South America, Buenos Aires in particular.


plexi

very unlikely given the way the Covid crisis it (not) being dealt with in some south american countries

Also the South American economy may not be strong enough to sustain a Stones tour. More likely they'll stick with their go-to markets.

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IanBillen

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Topi
IanBillen: I still don't think it makes sense for them, from a pure financial standpoint, to just cancel the postponed 2020 tour now. There's a reason it has been postponed this long. And that reason is money. Far too much of it on the table for all the parties involved for just to say "screw it".

As far as Ronnie's health, consider this: if Ronnie wasn't healthy enough to go back on, why would Mick go on record (in the French interview) saying they're trying to reschedule the US tour for this fall already? Just a thought.

__________________________________________________________


Oh .. I was not aware Mick said this or of any French Interview. I figured there was a major hang up so they may have to / choose to let this tour go finally and plan for next year under mostly the same basic cities .. but new name for tour plus album ... So the same parties would be involved was my thought.

Could be a reschedule but new name with a few shows added or removed / re-arranged was my thinking.



Ian

Yes, what I'm saying is that the US tour is something they have already agreed to do, they're contractually bound to finish it. And as far as parties go, obviously the US promoters are totally different entities from the European/UK ones.

I don't see the point of just letting the postponed US tour go just as society is finally opening back up again for outdoor concerts in the US. Sure, logistics/visas and the like may still pose a problem for them to do the tour this year.

Again I fully admit I have no idea what kind of out clauses they may have in their contracts. But from a contractual/legal standpoint I fail to see how the Stones could just cancel with "party A" so they could plan and book another tour with "party B". Also, cancelling and rebooking "the same basic cities" makes zero sense. Cancelling some cities out of the original itinerary is an entirely another matter, of course.

But just cancelling the US tour now after all this time would just mean losing money. Not just the Stones, but also the promoters, the venues - as I said, all the parties involved. They won't want that to happen. This is precisely why things have been postponed for almost 18 months now - they are waiting it out, ready to perform as soon as it's deemed safe to do so again.

Oh, wait, I guess it's already been 18 months - the postponement was announced on March 17!

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Topi

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IanBillen

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Topi
IanBillen: I still don't think it makes sense for them, from a pure financial standpoint, to just cancel the postponed 2020 tour now. There's a reason it has been postponed this long. And that reason is money. Far too much of it on the table for all the parties involved for just to say "screw it".

As far as Ronnie's health, consider this: if Ronnie wasn't healthy enough to go back on, why would Mick go on record (in the French interview) saying they're trying to reschedule the US tour for this fall already? Just a thought.

__________________________________________________________


Oh .. I was not aware Mick said this or of any French Interview. I figured there was a major hang up so they may have to / choose to let this tour go finally and plan for next year under mostly the same basic cities .. but new name for tour plus album ... So the same parties would be involved was my thought.

Could be a reschedule but new name with a few shows added or removed / re-arranged was my thinking.



Ian

Yes, what I'm saying is that the US tour is something they have already agreed to do, they're contractually bound to finish it. And as far as parties go, obviously the US promoters are totally different entities from the European/UK ones.

I don't see the point of just letting the postponed US tour go just as society is finally opening back up again for outdoor concerts in the US. Sure, logistics/visas and the like may still pose a problem for them to do the tour this year.

Again I fully admit I have no idea what kind of out clauses they may have in their contracts. But from a contractual/legal standpoint I fail to see how the Stones could just cancel with "party A" so they could plan and book another tour with "party B". Also, cancelling and rebooking "the same basic cities" makes zero sense. Cancelling some cities out of the original itinerary is an entirely another matter, of course.

But just cancelling the US tour now after all this time would just mean losing money. Not just the Stones, but also the promoters, the venues - as I said, all the parties involved. They won't want that to happen. This is precisely why things have been postponed for almost 18 months now - they are waiting it out, ready to perform as soon as it's deemed safe to do so again.

Oh, wait, I guess it's already been 18 months - the postponement was announced on March 17!

_______________________________________________________




No no .. you are missing what I am saying. I don't think they would cancel with party A only to go with party B. Legaly that couldnt fly (unless there is some type of two year stipulation or something?). I meant same partys .. same cities for the most part but new tour name.. new album etc. in Spring of 2022.

Same groups involved but name change and a few cities change (but most kept as is.. just rescheduled). Perhaps different staging. That was my thought. This way nobody is out money really .. just a different name and stage.. and few show change. Might seem unrealistic but The No Filter 2020 reschedule is kinda dull and played out sounding IMO. If there is a new album, and being that is will be 60 years.. perhaps they would rebrand the tour was more my thought.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-23 13:04 by IanBillen.

OK, a name change. Got it. That depends on how much more they want to put into marketing that name change/rebranding. Question is, do they really need to do that with the majority of the tickets sold?

I wouldn't hold my breath on that new album right now, though.

Branding/marketing the 60th anniversary next year is a pretty safe bet. Remains to be seen what part of the No Filter concept they're going to keep, if any.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-23 13:20 by Topi.

Topi: "Question is, do they really need to do that with the majority of the tickets sold?"

Would you tell me where this information came from? I trust this takes into account all the tickets refunded since the initial postponement.

~"Love is Strong"~

Haven't the vast majority of ticket buyers obtained refunds by now? I'm sure there's no way to know, but I imagine very few people still hold tickets.

Happy to hold on to my tickets and live with the possibility of seeing another show.

I am genuinely getting very excited now. I know that there are differing views on this thread but I think that it will happen in the Fall. Cant wait for an annoucement. It feels like the cogs are beginning to turn. Whooooooooooooopp

Still have my tickets too. Didn't make much sense to get a refund for me. If they reschedule, I already have my tickets, if they cancel, well then no need to be on the phone with Ticketmaster, my credit card gets refunded with no work by me. Pretty easy to see how many people hung on to their tickets go to each venue on Ticketmaster and see how many tickets are available. The blue dots will tell the story. Not sure I understand the thought process of getting a refund for a postponed show unless you bought tix to multiple shows and/or bought expensive seats up close.

Just looked at Vancouver tickets to see tix available etc.
No tix available for the pits or the sections surrounding the stage etc.

Lots of tix available, but the better sections with none or few around the arena.
Pretty good example I think of how many kept their tix (plenty,) myself included.

Not as optimistic for my Lucky Dips, which I am holding for several shows incl Van.
Not sure why, I was spoiled in '19, lucky dips turning into Pit tickets left and right. (like 6 out of 8 shows)
Post pandemic may be different, just a gut feeling that they may be allocated to less preferred spots, hope not



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-23 18:45 by MisterDDDD.

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MisterDDDD
Just looked at Vancouver tickets to see tix available etc.
No tix available for the pits or the sections surrounding the stage etc.

Lots of tix available, but the better sections with none or few around the arena.
Pretty good example I think of how many kept their tix (plenty,) myself included.

Not as optimistic for my Lucky Dips, which I am holding for several shows incl Van.
Not sure why, I was spoiled in '19, lucky dips turning into Pit tickets left and right. (like 6 out of 8 shows)
Post pandemic may be different, just a gut feeling that they may be allocated to less preferred spots, hope not

Hey Mr.D4, I bought them again after I posted about the BC Place announcement which ended up being Elton John. I bought upper bowl actually one section closer to the stage so I ended up with better seats than originally. I was actually surprised at how many didn't get refunds. If there's 50000 seats total, I'd say maybe a little over 30k are sold.

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MisterDDDD
Just looked at Vancouver tickets to see tix available etc.
No tix available for the pits or the sections surrounding the stage etc.

Lots of tix available, but the better sections with none or few around the arena.
Pretty good example I think of how many kept their tix (plenty,) myself included.

Not as optimistic for my Lucky Dips, which I am holding for several shows incl Van.
Not sure why, I was spoiled in '19, lucky dips turning into Pit tickets left and right. (like 6 out of 8 shows)
Post pandemic may be different, just a gut feeling that they may be allocated to less preferred spots, hope not

Mr. D the betting man is back! Ok, I'll take the "other" side on this one.. I refunded my tickets but held my LDs on the thought that they'll say, "Thank you for all of you fans who stuck this out, all LDs will be Pit for this tour!"

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angee
Topi: "Question is, do they really need to do that with the majority of the tickets sold?"

Would you tell me where this information came from? I trust this takes into account all the tickets refunded since the initial postponement.

Most patrons kept their tickets. You'd be surprised how many people still, to this day, don't even know about the possibility of a refund...

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Rokyfan
Haven't the vast majority of ticket buyers obtained refunds by now? I'm sure there's no way to know, but I imagine very few people still hold tickets.

There is an easy way to know. Just go on Ticketmaster and see whst's available for each show.

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TumblinDice76
Still have my tickets too. Didn't make much sense to get a refund for me. If they reschedule, I already have my tickets, if they cancel, well then no need to be on the phone with Ticketmaster, my credit card gets refunded with no work by me. Pretty easy to see how many people hung on to their tickets go to each venue on Ticketmaster and see how many tickets are available. The blue dots will tell the story. Not sure I understand the thought process of getting a refund for a postponed show unless you bought tix to multiple shows and/or bought expensive seats up close.

Many of those blue dots may be resellers, and premium packages, you might want to filter those out to get a better picture of what normal tickets haven't been sold.

As far as Ticketmaster and the Stones go, a reseller trying to flip tickets for profit still represents a sold ticket for them. A "normal ticket" was sold, money exchanged hands, end of story. Whatever the resellers then do or don't do is their business. If they choose to list their tickets on Ticketmaster, Ticketmaster pockets a commission for each sale. But the ticket is already spoken for. The reseller sells them, uses them or "eats" them (if they made enough money for other tickets)



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2021-06-23 22:22 by Topi.