This is more about Stash...

Prince Stash Klossowski De Rola - 1960's Peacock Style Icon
by
dandyinaspic.blogspot.com

Bjornulf



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2020-01-21 16:46 by bv.

Went with RobberBride yesterday. The film was not as bad as expected. Sam Cutler and Stash are rather interesting characters, to put it mildly.

Interesting that the director of A Degree of Murder said that Keith saved the sessions, and that Brian was out of it. I didn't know that.

The conspiracy theories were coming in from all sides, eventually

The music was disturbing. Garcia might had been better off using some totally different kind of music all the way through (and lower!), like he did in the beginning. There was a cover of I Ain't Signifying in there, though.

Had a nice talk with Swedish Stones legend Ove Tingvall after he did a Q&A after the screening. He shared stories about his time with the band in 1965-67 + the 2007-incident in Stockholm.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-01-25 09:03 by DandelionPowderman.

Don't we think that after 50 years of speculation, conspiracy theories and second hand tales, its by now impossible to separate fact from fiction ?

I sometimes wonder whether, in our escalating multi media age, future historians will ever be able to come to comfortable conclusions about anything.

There's so much distracting "chaff" today when trying to get to any truth .

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DandelionPowderman

Interesting that the director of A Degree of Murder said that Keith saved the sessions, and that Brian was out of it. I didn't know that.

Volker Schlondorff interview - Taken from recent official Mord Und Totschlag DVD.

Click on the image to open the Youtube link

[jambands.com]

This looks interesting.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-25 09:03 by Javadave.

More here. See page 11.

[iorr.org]

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Cristiano Radtke
Rolling Stone: Life and Death of Brian Jones

After hearing the ersatz 'Stonesish' music, is there any doubt this is another cheap ass, exploitation film? Stock footage and all?

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24FPS

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Cristiano Radtke
Rolling Stone: Life and Death of Brian Jones

After hearing the ersatz 'Stonesish' music, is there any doubt this is another cheap ass, exploitation film? Stock footage and all?

It wasn't that bad, actually. However, that music was annoying.

They managed to sneak in a cover of I Ain't Signifying, though

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DandelionPowderman

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24FPS

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Cristiano Radtke
Rolling Stone: Life and Death of Brian Jones

After hearing the ersatz 'Stonesish' music, is there any doubt this is another cheap ass, exploitation film? Stock footage and all?

It wasn't that bad, actually. However, that music was annoying.

They managed to sneak in a cover of I Ain't Signifying, though

I just won't watch 'documentaries' of talking heads I don't care about, whose opinions aren't any more valid than all of us on here. I don't give two cents what anyone from The Old Grey Whistle Test thinks, no matter how low key their delivery. How was it factually? They usually get some real stinkers in there. And no Brian wasn't the face of the Rolling Stones. Mick has always been the focus. Watch any older footage and you barely see the rest of the band. Brian was great, but his importance, after the first couple years of the group, is way over inflated.

I'm curious about Sam Cutler's contributions. Stash may be entertaining, but that depends on one's tolerance for a dilettante tambourine player with delusions of grandeur.

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Rocky Dijon
I'm curious about Sam Cutler's contributions. Stash may be entertaining, but that depends on one's tolerance for a dilettante tambourine player with delusions of grandeur.

Stash was awesome. Quite a character. Double that, and you have Sam Cutler. Hilarious guy!

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24FPS

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DandelionPowderman

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24FPS

Quote
Cristiano Radtke
Rolling Stone: Life and Death of Brian Jones

After hearing the ersatz 'Stonesish' music, is there any doubt this is another cheap ass, exploitation film? Stock footage and all?

It wasn't that bad, actually. However, that music was annoying.

They managed to sneak in a cover of I Ain't Signifying, though

I just won't watch 'documentaries' of talking heads I don't care about, whose opinions aren't any more valid than all of us on here. I don't give two cents what anyone from The Old Grey Whistle Test thinks, no matter how low key their delivery. How was it factually? They usually get some real stinkers in there. And no Brian wasn't the face of the Rolling Stones. Mick has always been the focus. Watch any older footage and you barely see the rest of the band. Brian was great, but his importance, after the first couple years of the group, is way over inflated.

The opinions of Stash and Sam Cutler are not more valid than mine? Thanks, but I wasn't even born when Brian died

50+ years since Brian died. The detailed truth faded long ago.

Good or bad. Their memories are for sure influenced by ravages of time, what and how things are asked, their many re-tellings, what they have read, heard etc etc. Some of the talking heads knew or met Brian briefly, in Sam's case I wonder if he ever even met him. Volkers 'memories' have gotten more extreme with each passing decade.

Recalling the same thing over and over through time also adds a solidity and permanence to things that were fleeting and gone before they had even been taken in. Then there's the thing of perception etc.

The general bigger story is well known and very over trodden, any new details are dubious and open to all of the above and more influencing them.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2020-02-27 16:31 by His Majesty.

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DandelionPowderman
Went with RobberBride yesterday. The film was not as bad as expected. Sam Cutler and Stash are rather interesting characters, to put it mildly.

Interesting that the director of A Degree of Murder said that Keith saved the sessions, and that Brian was out of it. I didn't know that.

The conspiracy theories were coming in from all sides, eventually

The music was disturbing. Garcia might had been better off using some totally different kind of music all the way through (and lower!), like he did in the beginning. There was a cover of I Ain't Signifying in there, though.

Had a nice talk with Swedish Stones legend Ove Tingvall after he did a Q&A after the screening. He shared stories about his time with the band in 1965-67 + the 2007-incident in Stockholm.

I think you mean Gothenburg 2007. and I was with Ove backstage and I have a different view of what we saw. However the media picked up on the story, but it was all BS as far as I´m concerned.

Vilhelm
Nordic Stones Vikings

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mickijaggeroo

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DandelionPowderman
Went with RobberBride yesterday. The film was not as bad as expected. Sam Cutler and Stash are rather interesting characters, to put it mildly.

Interesting that the director of A Degree of Murder said that Keith saved the sessions, and that Brian was out of it. I didn't know that.

The conspiracy theories were coming in from all sides, eventually

The music was disturbing. Garcia might had been better off using some totally different kind of music all the way through (and lower!), like he did in the beginning. There was a cover of I Ain't Signifying in there, though.

Had a nice talk with Swedish Stones legend Ove Tingvall after he did a Q&A after the screening. He shared stories about his time with the band in 1965-67 + the 2007-incident in Stockholm.

I think you mean Gothenburg 2007. and I was with Ove backstage and I have a different view of what we saw. However the media picked up on the story, but it was all BS as far as I´m concerned.

Absolutely. Gothenburg it is.

Release date: June 12, 2020
[www.jpc.de]

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His Majesty
50+ years since Brian died. The detailed truth faded long ago.

Good or bad. Their memories are for sure influenced by ravages of time, what and how things are asked, their many re-tellings, what they have read, heard etc etc. Some of the talking heads knew or met Brian briefly, in Sam's case I wonder if he ever even met him. Volkers 'memories' have gotten more extreme with each passing decade.

Recalling the same thing over and over through time also adds a solidity and permanence to things that were fleeting and gone before they had even been taken in. Then there's the thing of perception etc.

The general bigger story is well known and very over trodden, any new details are dubious and open to all of the above and more influencing them.

Agree. Anyone who really knew Brian is either not around, or has told their tale many times over. There s no way anyone of any importance at all could somehow have been overlooked for 51 years. The only real impact IMO would come if someone like F Thorogood, one of the people that was there on last night, emerged with a clear, objective POV. But, impossible.

I know of two builders still alive who can tell the correct story, one located near Chichester and the other one in London, two brothers. The problem is the majority of the Cotchford builders were related to each other. They will never talk. They know me and I know them. We stare at each other and there is legally no way.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-03-29 14:52 by paulspendel.

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Palace Revolution 2000

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His Majesty
50+ years since Brian died. The detailed truth faded long ago.

Good or bad. Their memories are for sure influenced by ravages of time, what and how things are asked, their many re-tellings, what they have read, heard etc etc. Some of the talking heads knew or met Brian briefly, in Sam's case I wonder if he ever even met him. Volkers 'memories' have gotten more extreme with each passing decade.

Recalling the same thing over and over through time also adds a solidity and permanence to things that were fleeting and gone before they had even been taken in. Then there's the thing of perception etc.

The general bigger story is well known and very over trodden, any new details are dubious and open to all of the above and more influencing them.

Agree. Anyone who really knew Brian is either not around, or has told their tale many times over. There s no way anyone of any importance at all could somehow have been overlooked for 51 years. The only real impact IMO would come if someone like F Thorogood, one of the people that was there on last night, emerged with a clear, objective POV. But, impossible.

Overlooked? It depends. I can't speak of people who were around when Brian spent his time around the (fatal) swimming pool, but there are (anyway "is") (a) person(s) who knew him very well from his youngster days and further on when he became a blues/rock celebrity. I don't mean any of his bandmates or anyone who choose for publicity. Nothing of that info from that person is in around in publicly written form.
Why? Because there have been threats from different angles at different times.
Nothing misterious, just simple facts ... Brian's death was dirty business and no coincidence. Having said that, Brian had a nose for getting himself in trouble.

Brian's death irks people, perhaps Brian himself does. Using the same logic, why write another word about The Stones or Mick or Keith? It's all been said. Why bother making new music? They've accomplished everything they could. Anything left is just an addendum. Why bother playing a Stones record ever again? We've heard them all so many times. There is nothing new to hear.

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Rocky Dijon
... Using the same logic, why write another word about The Stones or Mick or Keith? It's all been said ...

My guess is, RD, that this is meant cynically, or? My guess is also, that you know that "it's not all been said"

I was being sarcastic to an extent. I understand others feeling there are no more Brian conspiracies to consider or stories to tell, but to not discuss Brian is to pretend he didn't matter. Brian's death is a bit like JFK. It either went down as the official story says or it's on a larger scale and you'd be foolish to get too close to questioning the truth. I would rather discuss Brian's role in the band and his contribution to recordings and place in their development. I'm cynical about people like Stash though I understand he's a colorful character and entertaining.

Let's pretend one of these half cocked conspiracies is true. Then what? The builder did it. Keylock did it. Everybody there that night did it. And? Will it bring Brian back? Will it change the trajectory of the band at this late date? Aren't the main suspects dead? You find out Oswald was trying to escape to a safe house in Dallas after he shot JFK. There's a story. Brian Jones accidently drowned after a row with a builder. Would that matter now? What would it change?

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paulspendel
I know of two builders still alive who can tell the correct story, one located near Chichester and the other one in London, two brothers. The problem is the majority of the Cotchford builders were related to each other. They will never talk. They know me and I know them. We stare at each other and there is legally no way.

I feel like you're leaving us hanging LOL.
I want that last sentence to keep going.

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Rocky Dijon
I was being sarcastic to an extent. I understand others feeling there are no more Brian conspiracies to consider or stories to tell, but to not discuss Brian is to pretend he didn't matter. Brian's death is a bit like JFK. It either went down as the official story says or it's on a larger scale and you'd be foolish to get too close to questioning the truth. I would rather discuss Brian's role in the band and his contribution to recordings and place in their development. I'm cynical about people like Stash though I understand he's a colorful character and entertaining.

I totally agree. As a senior (well retired, but not as a Stones fan) I really wouldn't know what more to say about Brian's importance/contribution to the band he started. There have been so many discussions already, some great, some worthless. For an oldy like me Brian was one of the gang for 4/5 years, the last one as a sad man. It was the foundation of a life long "addiction", but one that was/is totally harmless. Instead it added a richness to my life way beyond what I could ever have expected.
As a life long optimist I look forward to the Stones' 60st Anniversary. While five economic recessions and several pandemics, not to mention the band in "WW 3" couldn't stop them, why would "Mr Corona"? And the spirit of Brian will be around all the time too.

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Rocky Dijon
Brian's death irks people, perhaps Brian himself does. Using the same logic, why write another word about The Stones or Mick or Keith? It's all been said. Why bother making new music? They've accomplished everything they could. Anything left is just an addendum. Why bother playing a Stones record ever again? We've heard them all so many times. There is nothing new to hear.

I agree. I only sometimes listen to the Stones when I'm drunk or in a sentimental mood.

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Palace Revolution 2000

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paulspendel
I know of two builders still alive who can tell the correct story, one located near Chichester and the other one in London, two brothers. The problem is the majority of the Cotchford builders were related to each other. They will never talk. They know me and I know them. We stare at each other and there is legally no way.

I feel like you're leaving us hanging LOL.
I want that last sentence to keep going.

Why is there legally no way? These guys have to be in their 70s or even 80s by now.

It's not my intention to leave you hanging. It's just the situation as it is.Legally spoken there wasn't even a case in 1969. so all this endless talks about re-opening is not one. There is nothing to re-open because there never was an official case in 1969. Besides, people knowning what happened doesn't stand up in any UK court. You need first hand witnesses. The Sussex Police had Tom Keylock in their interview room in 1994. They failed to put him under caution. That shut the door for good. Joan Fitzsimons wanted to testify in 1994. They ignored her. There is no way the authorities will go down this route again because they will trip over their own faults. A contact I had within Sussex Police kindly told me how they spoke of me: i was called a @#$%&.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2020-03-31 11:49 by paulspendel.

They have their own website to sell the DVD:
[mvdshop.com]