Hi everybody fellow vinyl Collectors,
the forthcoming book on the US discography (albums, vinyl only) is on its way, but
as it often happens the higher you go the wider is your horizon becomes...I am here to ask for somebody's help with runoutetchings in albums that ABKCO contracted to Capitol Records (LONODN Records was just a distributor, at this point).
As far as I am aware, this is what I've been able to set:


Matrix information on Capitol Records pressings may include the lacquer, or more specifically, the lathe that was used to cut the lacquer. The lathes that were used by Capitol Records (indicated in the run-out space, after the matrix number) were:

Scully lathes (tube lathes)
A/B stereo Capitol Mastering, Hollywood, CA 1967 / 1974
D Capitol Mastering, Hollywood, CA
F/G mono Capitol Mastering, Hollywood, CA 1967 / early 1969
H/J Capitol Mastering, Hollywood, CA 1969 / 1983
P/T Capitol Mastering, N.Y.C., NY 1967 / 1971
W/X stereo Capitol mastering, N.Y.C., NY 1967 / 1974

Neumann lathes (solid state lathes)
F stereo Tower Mastering, Hollywood, CA 1969 / 1982
G stereo Capitol Mastering, Hollywood, CA. 1975 / 1988
N stereo Capitol Mastering, N.Y.C., NY
P stereo Capitol Mastering, N.Y.C., NY 1980 / 1983
R stereo Capitol Mastering, N.Y.C., NY 1972 / 1974

Everything seems to be correct, but it does not fit the case of the Rolling Stones'albums pressed by Capitol as - for instance - this would mean that they kept on pressing mono albums far after the official 12.12.67 deadline.
On top of that, I still have to archive some -C albums that look like they were pressed by Capitol, but I've not been able to confirm they actually were.
Anybody here willing to help, please?
Thanks in advance, Luca



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-08-04 11:48 by 1963luca0.

This is all rather arcane and filled with a lot of technical jargon that is beyond most of us. Perhaps another IORR forum would be best, perhaps that one that has a lot about the various editions of (mostly boot) recordings, can't remember its name.


plexi

Yes, Tim, it's technical: we're talking about the DNA of US vinyl albums.
Still, I believe that Tell Me is a good place to meet well informed Collectors.
The book I'm going to issue it's about the many info you read in the runouts and that are the sole leading to distinguish one copy from another
How many times you've read about mauve, dark blue, blue, azure labels with or without glossy finishing? And red versus burgundy labels? What about those who use Sterling versus Bell Sound to tell an original from a reprint? Well, that's all wrong!
London Records had no own pressing plants and used to contract small plants to get their few albums pressed, along with those they got from the UK. With the advent of Klein, things changed radically: ABKCO contracted no less than 16 different plants, through the years, including the most of the majors and all those owned by Viewlex Inc.
Atlantic Records had the same policy of ABKCO. Do you want to tell an original from a re-issue? Well, you have to understand what's written on labels, covers and runout vinyl: the DNA, in other words.
The book, nearly 600 pages and 1.000 pictures is about this and is an absolute first. I know it is not going to be a best seller on Amazon, but I also know it's the first serious attempt to crack these records, and above all, to pass knowledge to fellow Collectors.
Back to Capitol: they've had a great role in the mid-60's. Unfortunately, the info I got do not go back to 1964: they begin with 1967. This is somehow 'unperfect' and I'm just trying to fix it.
Thanks for caring, Luca



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-08-06 15:19 by 1963luca0.

Have you asked on Hoffman?


"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"

No, Deltics, I haven't. I use that forum, but it is not Stones oriented, being a US forum. The best info I've found on Capitol are from a Pink Floyd site and this is the reason why they go back to 1967 and not to 1964.On top of that, that forum is often vehicle of wrong info, like in case oc Columbia matrix suffixes.
The net is great, but is not a reliable place, sometimes.
Also love the great Both Sides forum, with the excellent Tim Neely posting...

Hey 1963

R u a "completist"?


plexi

If you're asking me if I buy any record from any Country in the world, I can tell that YES, I've been a completist. I started with bootlegs ('Rock Out Cock Out'), then came singles and last arrived albums. And tapes. Initially, I went into the CD madness only to abandon them very soon, in the 00's. Also stopped buying bootleg CDs very soon. When my collection reached its top, I had about 11.000 records.
Today, I only collect vinyl records from UK, US, Canada (albums only) and Eu and the core of my collection includes circa 4.000 records. When coming at these Countries I am a completist.
This means that I tend to buy a record just because of a minor/major difference in label design, matrix numbers and/or any other kind of detail.
Tha matter is that the story behind each pressing fascinates me and helps me to archive that record properly. I'm not satisfied with classic classifications like open vs boxed DECCA labels or flip-back vs non flip-back cover and - above all - I can't stand third generation cow-boy stories about records.
Do you remenber the stupid topic of 'large' zipper to tell an original UK 'Sticky Fingers'? Are you sure that mono pressings were stopped in 1967, in US?
That's my way of being a record Collector: an archivist. Last but not least, I believe we'd share our knowledge and that's the reason why I publish books, since 1996.
That said, you're right: my books are technical but I can't see a better way to archive records of the greatest group on Earth.
Bye, Luca



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2018-08-07 10:37 by 1963luca0.

Luca...love that you're so devoted.

I fancy myself a bit of a completist but certainly not anywhere near your level.

collecting should be a pleasure... of you’td happy with your collection, then everything is ok: it’s a very personal journey

I also find this an interesting subject. Our New Zealand Decca releases I purchased in the late 60’s were pressed here I believe. I collected singles and mono albums not realising they may have later value

We had a NZ only album called ‘Unstoppable Stones’ which I ended up with four copies of.

Records from NZ are high in value. First of all, because your EPs are almost unique.
Moreover, you have some unique issues, like 'Unstoppable Stones'. The album's first cover is wonderful! I have had the nice re-issue, but the original I belive it'd be in TOP100 of any Collector. The only problem with NZ albums is that you hardly find them in EXC/MINT conditions, like was my fold-open 'Sticky Fingers': another must-have.When I started reducing my collection to the bone, I got nice money for NZ records, indeed.
Yes, they were locally pressed.
Bye, Luca

maybe you can find info on discogs.com?

Life's just a cocktail party on the street

Done, but not satisfied yet

Quote
1963luca0
No, Deltics, I haven't. I use that forum, but it is not Stones oriented, being a US forum. The best info I've found on Capitol are from a Pink Floyd site and this is the reason why they go back to 1967 and not to 1964.On top of that, that forum is often vehicle of wrong info, like in case oc Columbia matrix suffixes.
The net is great, but is not a reliable place, sometimes.
Also love the great Both Sides forum, with the excellent Tim Neely posting...

It looks ass though this thread has run out of steam
SO
Despite your reservations it might be worth trying the Hoffman site. Sure reliability is an issue, but then IORR is far from perfect on that score!
Also the Hoffman site has so many more subscribers..that is a problem in itself, for example I do check sometimes Stones related topics but often find the number of pages a bit overwhelming!

1963 luca

have u ever been contacted by organizations or people such as the R and R Hall of Fame in Cleveland or the Stones Archives themselves. Perhaps for some kind of consultation.


plexi

Hi everybody.
No I’ve never been in touch with official channels leading to insiders. To be Italian means to stay far from the core of the Stones activities and, above all, I’m not sure someone would show some interest for what I do. In any case, heaven would be talking to ABKCO, actually...
Thanks you all for your interest, I hope to get the book ready in few weeks. At the moment, I’m re-working the draft to reduce the pages to 500 (the max. Amazon accepts).See you soon...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-08-14 19:22 by 1963luca0.