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Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: thkbeercan ()
Date: December 7, 2017 16:31

I remember reading somewhere that there was a large video screen above the Oakland stage in 1969 with a b&w closed circuit view of the Stones performance.

I have also seen a photo (I believe taken by Baron Wolman) taken from right in front of the stage showing a man with a video/TV camera on a tripod pointed at the stage.

Does anyone have any info on this?

Was the show just fed via closed circuit to the screen or was a video tape made of this show(s)?

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: timbernardis ()
Date: December 7, 2017 17:22

or was it broadcast anywhere?


plexi

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: loog droog ()
Date: December 7, 2017 19:29

I'm guessing it was recorded on 1/2" reel to reel or 3/4" U-matic at best. Nowhere near broadcast quality, but if a tape exists it would be mostly of historical interest.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: roundnround ()
Date: December 7, 2017 23:57

I was there and I do recall a black and white video screen above the stage...

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: SKILLS ()
Date: December 8, 2017 00:10

Remember that Bill lost the majority of his recordings in the warehouse fire.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: VideoJames ()
Date: December 11, 2017 03:51

Yes he did.. B/W 1/2 inch .. Bill G. had been video taping shows as early as 1967. Maybe even earlier. I have seen bunch of his shows from back then. Lighting could have been better.

There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: stoneslib ()
Date: December 11, 2017 04:07

Graham had the same CC in-arena broadcast screens going during his 1972 STP shows.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: December 11, 2017 11:02

There's always been rumors there were screens at some of the shows in 1969 and 1972, but to date there has never been any proof. On all available footage and pics the set up of the front of the stage is the same, with three columns of speakers hanging from the ceiling, two to the left and right, and one in the middle. Some 1972 shows were supposed to have been filmed, like San Francisco and Washington, but pics of the gig do not show screens anywhere, not any people with camera's taping.

Mathijs

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: oldschool ()
Date: December 11, 2017 21:26

Quote
VideoJames
Yes he did.. B/W 1/2 inch .. Bill G. had been video taping shows as early as 1967. Maybe even earlier. I have seen bunch of his shows from back then. Lighting could have been better.

There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

Thanks for the info VJ! your sharing of knowledge is always appreciated. Were the shows you have seen,or know about, part of Wolfgang's Vault stash or in private collectors hands?

1969 tour is my holy grail but I am not getting any younger so hope some of these see the light of day along with a complete audio SB or two before my end of time.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: dcba ()
Date: December 11, 2017 21:36

Quote
VideoJames

There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

eye popping smiley smiling bouncing smiley
if you've seen some of them shall we deduct they're safely stored in the band's vault? thumbs up

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: AntoineParis ()
Date: December 11, 2017 22:25

Quote
Mathijs
There's always been rumors there were screens at some of the shows in 1969 and 1972, but to date there has never been any proof. On all available footage and pics the set up of the front of the stage is the same, with three columns of speakers hanging from the ceiling, two to the left and right, and one in the middle. Some 1972 shows were supposed to have been filmed, like San Francisco and Washington, but pics of the gig do not show screens anywhere, not any people with camera's taping.

Mathijs


+1 fake news, no screen, never read it, never seen it

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: stoneslib ()
Date: December 12, 2017 01:27

Here's a crowd shot from LA Forum 1972 showing a live screen with Jagger close-up.


Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: Eleanor Rigby ()
Date: December 12, 2017 03:46

good spotting stoneslib !

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: Anitapal82 ()
Date: December 12, 2017 10:02

Going on all the shows bill graham filmed the odds are there must be Stones footage, but like most footage of bills I have seen, it is in black and white and poor quality . I guess not suitable for release .

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Date: December 12, 2017 10:09

That's great, Stoneslib! You learn something every day on IORR! thumbs up

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: automaticchanger ()
Date: December 13, 2017 22:35

Quote
VideoJames
There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

I don't know if you're including clips/incomplete footage in this number or whole shows, but off the top of my head:

1. Oakland, filmed by Bill Graham, presumed missing/lost/stolen/etc. Would've been the whole show.

2. Detroit, filmed by WABX Detroit Tubeworks, black and white. They aired clips of the show around December/January 70. The full master tape is 45 minutes and is owned by Reelin' In The Years Licensing House, so it'll probably never see the light of day again. If I could get to see any of these in full it would be this, Detroit being my favourite show of the tour. Here's Little Queenie, quality is pretty rough:

[www.4shared.com]

And here's a version I did using the audio from the common tape/bootleg:

[www.4shared.com]

3. L.A. Inglewood Forum, there's a few minutes of colour Super-8 around:

[www.youtube.com]

There's also some tantalizing clips of a secondary source, open-reel video tape with sync sound much like the Detroit stuff:

[www.youtube.com]

4. NYC, besides the Maysles there's some alt source pro-shot footage:

[www.youtube.com]

5. In an old thread it was alluded that the Maysles filmed the Baltimore show as well.

6. Altamont, besides the Maysles there's a black and white amateur source that I've seen clips of somewhere before.

7/8. The Lyceum and Saville shows were partially filmed, though I dunno if you count that as part of the tour:

[www.youtube.com]

[www.youtube.com]

[www.youtube.com]

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: thkbeercan ()
Date: December 14, 2017 16:55

thanks for the links

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Date: December 14, 2017 19:24

Quote
stoneslib
Here's a crowd shot from LA Forum 1972 showing a live screen with Jagger close-up.


Wow, those were the days. Beam me up Scotty.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: December 15, 2017 11:42

Quote
stoneslib
Here's a crowd shot from LA Forum 1972 showing a live screen with Jagger close-up.


Great find! Any more pics of a screen at other shows? Washington has always been rumored.

Mathijs

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: December 15, 2017 11:49

Quote
automaticchanger
Quote
VideoJames
There are at least 7 maybe 8 Rolling Stones shows video taped/filmed from the 69 tour that I know of or seen. There are probably more..

I don't know if you're including clips/incomplete footage in this number or whole shows, but off the top of my head:

1. Oakland, filmed by Bill Graham, presumed missing/lost/stolen/etc. Would've been the whole show.

2. Detroit, filmed by WABX Detroit Tubeworks, black and white. They aired clips of the show around December/January 70. The full master tape is 45 minutes and is owned by Reelin' In The Years Licensing House, so it'll probably never see the light of day again. If I could get to see any of these in full it would be this, Detroit being my favourite show of the tour. Here's Little Queenie, quality is pretty rough:

[www.4shared.com]

And here's a version I did using the audio from the common tape/bootleg:

[www.4shared.com]

3. L.A. Inglewood Forum, there's a few minutes of colour Super-8 around:

[www.youtube.com]

There's also some tantalizing clips of a secondary source, open-reel video tape with sync sound much like the Detroit stuff:

[www.youtube.com]

4. NYC, besides the Maysles there's some alt source pro-shot footage:

[www.youtube.com]

5. In an old thread it was alluded that the Maysles filmed the Baltimore show as well.

6. Altamont, besides the Maysles there's a black and white amateur source that I've seen clips of somewhere before.

7/8. The Lyceum and Saville shows were partially filmed, though I dunno if you count that as part of the tour:

[www.youtube.com]

[www.youtube.com]

[www.youtube.com]

But aside from MSG none of these films are professional. There all one handheld camera from the crowd, mostly for news reel purposes.

Concerning Detroit -to date only LQ is proven to be shown on the Detroit Tube Works. As with Oakland, and probably other shows, Graham did tape these in soundboard quality. Oakland was aired in 1972.

What I don't understand though is that of many 60's artists there's a slew of professionally filmed and recorded shows but of the Stones hardly anything. There's so much available from Hendrix for example, I really wonder why there isn't anything decent from the Stones. We still do not have a good sounding 1972 show!

Mathijs

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: john lomax ()
Date: December 15, 2017 14:54

Anybody notice that in some of the early 1969 shows, Keith and Bill's positions were reversed - i.e. Bill was next to Charlie and Keith was out on the side.....I wonder when they decide to change (to the configuration that they have had ever since, with Keith next to Charlie..

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: S.T.P ()
Date: December 15, 2017 17:26

It's funny how exausting it is to constantly wish for bits and pieces from the top of the iceberg of the classic years of live releases. They are milking the cow too slow. They should hand over all the consert material to proffesionals that see the potential in these treasures.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-12-15 17:31 by S.T.P.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: automaticchanger ()
Date: December 15, 2017 17:55

Quote
Mathijs
But aside from MSG none of these films are professional. There all one handheld camera from the crowd, mostly for news reel purposes.

Concerning Detroit -to date only LQ is proven to be shown on the Detroit Tube Works. As with Oakland, and probably other shows, Graham did tape these in soundboard quality. Oakland was aired in 1972.

What I don't understand though is that of many 60's artists there's a slew of professionally filmed and recorded shows but of the Stones hardly anything. There's so much available from Hendrix for example, I really wonder why there isn't anything decent from the Stones. We still do not have a good sounding 1972 show!

Mathijs

I know they're not professional, but I wasn't sure if VideoJames was talking about pro-shot stuff or not. Personally I'd consider the Detroit and L.A. Forum Sony open reel videos as 'mid-level', given the sync sound and relatively steady camerawork. Being right in the crowd adds a certain ambiance that the MSG stuff doesn't quite have too, imo. And yeah, Graham's soundboard tape aired on KSAN, but I meant the rumoured video.

LQ is the only one that's around right now, but even you were talking about the three songs circulating on video a while ago on older threads

Re: DETROIT 1969? :

Quote
Mathijs
Quote
still ill
Is this recently discovered footage?What or who was the original scource?Is there more?
Any ideas?
This is great stuff,the crowd scenes are tremendous,a real snapshot in time

This footage is available since at least the mid-80's (in better quality). The footage includes LQ, Sympathy and Stray Cat.

Mathijs

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: The Joker ()
Date: December 15, 2017 22:30

Quote
VideoJames


3. L.A. Inglewood Forum, there's a few minutes of colour Super-8 around:

[www.youtube.com]

I notice the meter runs from 1.13' to 1.19'

Could it mean they taped the whole show?

BTW, who could be the man with the white frock coat? An usher?

[youtu.be]

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: StonedRambler ()
Date: December 16, 2017 12:04

What I often wondered: There are parts of the 1969 MSG concerts in the Gimme Shelter Movie. And also other videos from that concerts appeared on YouTube. So I suppose the whole film must have been filmed (and recorded anyway, that's what we got on ya-yas). Why don't they realize this full concert as a Blueray?

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: john lomax ()
Date: December 16, 2017 12:08

Quote
The Joker
Quote
VideoJames


3. L.A. Inglewood Forum, there's a few minutes of colour Super-8 around:

[www.youtube.com]
T

I notice the meter runs from 1.13' to 1.19'

Could it mean they taped the whole show?

BTW, who could be the man with the white frock coat? An usher?

[youtu.be]

The guy in the white coat (the tux) is Ian Stewart. There is a great quote from Stu in Stanley Booth's book where Stu says:

"Mick asked what I'd wear onstage.....it seems I'm to wear a white tuxedo. It's going to cost them a bloody fortune to have me play with them..... and even more if I have to were a tux. Cash every night one thousand dollars, two thousand with the tux."



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-12-16 12:09 by john lomax.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: The Joker ()
Date: December 16, 2017 17:30

Quote
john lomax
Quote
The Joker
Quote
VideoJames


3. L.A. Inglewood Forum, there's a few minutes of colour Super-8 around:

[www.youtube.com]
T

I notice the meter runs from 1.13' to 1.19'

Could it mean they taped the whole show?

BTW, who could be the man with the white frock coat? An usher?

[youtu.be]

The guy in the white coat (the tux) is Ian Stewart. There is a great quote from Stu in Stanley Booth's book where Stu says:

"Mick asked what I'd wear onstage.....it seems I'm to wear a white tuxedo. It's going to cost them a bloody fortune to have me play with them..... and even more if I have to were a tux. Cash every night one thousand dollars, two thousand with the tux."

WThanks... That's a good one

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: VideoJames ()
Date: December 17, 2017 03:40

To clarify ..for me Pro-shot in 1969 means
1. More than 1 camera angle (there are exceptions /but rare)
2. Authorized by the band or venue to film or tape show.
3. shot on Film 16 MM/ 35 MM/
4. Shot on 3/4 inch video 1'' video or 2'' Video (there are exceptions)

Shows filmed that I know of or have seen
MSG 69 = 3 Pro shot shows filmed by the Maysles (16 MM Film)****
Altamont..= 1 Pro Shot(16 MM) by the Maysles
.(But also shot on b/w video non pro exist)
Oakland = 2 Pro shot shows by Bill Graham ( b/w video 1/2 inch)
L.A. Forum 1 show (b/w 1/2 video non pro whole show*)
Detroit 1 show pro shot ( exist on 2 inch B/W video..1 camera angle**).
West Palm Beach 1 pro Shot (16mm) filmed by the Maysles. ***

* I've seen the last 25 min of the show..I was told the first part of show exist but I have not seen a video yet..And no one I know has been able to find it as of yet???

** I call this pro shot as the promoter of the show/venue OK'd the
video shoot.

*** Albert Maysles told me years ago they shot footage in West Palm Beach, (How much ????? I do not know) You can see a very short piece of it in the Gimme Shelter movie at the start before "Love In Vain".. I believe.......I have to look again at the movie again to be 100% sure.
..
**** Years ago Albert also told me of a special version of the Gimme Shelter movie that they made(different edits/version & songs in the film) That film was stolen and still may be with the person that stole it..He ask me to locate it.. It exist with a separate mag track.. Which is why it
may never had surfaced....
.

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: timbernardis ()
Date: December 17, 2017 04:31

James - what is a mag track?


plexi

Re: Did Bill Graham video tape the 1969 Oakland shows?
Posted by: automaticchanger ()
Date: December 17, 2017 04:40

Thanks for the reply, that helps clarify things. I forgot the West Palm Beach footage, I remember you mentioning that in a thread a while back, along with that alt. Gimme Shelter edit (it had Midnight Rambler and a shot of Keith rolling a joint in a bathtub, right?).

That b/w Altamont footage was shot by Ira Schneider, who was a member of an early tape collective in New York called the Raindance Corporation. Apparently he walked around all day and shot around 7 hours of footage, but he's only ever shown a 20 minute edit.

How'd you come across the L.A. Forum footage? Was it when somebody was trying to sell it with some other stuff? Aside from the brief clips of Queenie and Satisfaction I've never seen anymore, unfortunately.

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