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Rocky Dijon

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stone4ever
I'm a changeable Martha Focker, i thought GGAG was ok to start with, i liked it, now its something else, its more than just another Jagger solo effort, its the real deal.
I see it getting 5 million hits on youtube, us keithettes have to be honest with ourselves or its just BS.
Mick did it this time, better late than never

If you are uncertain about GGAG just play it 6 times and play it LOUD ><

Twice was enough. First time was loud with crystal clear audio. Second time was through crappy laptop speakers which, oddly enough, sounds like that's how it was recorded.

This is IORR; if it's just BS, it's "Brown Sugar."

Whoa thats running too deep for me
Its just two sides of the same coin.
Watching KR Wicked As It Seems then watch Mick's new video, these guys think they are so opposite but they are almost one, like a couple of entangled photons that can't be separated, the only separation occurs because they can't see it themselves. This is spooky action at a distance.

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Hairball

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35love
When I am actually listening to the song (Hairball)
the questions the lyrics have provoked in you (me, perhaps the reviewer) by simply reading them from paper/computer screen
don't come up. I hear the words (magnificent selections and entrandres)
but I am not perplexed/ wondering Mick's political view,
I am grooving - I am. The base line (was about to look up who playing the bass?)

Do you see my point? Can you chill w/ the tune thru earbuds, with a bud or Bud lite,
and see if those questions come up, means the same.
'England Lost'
to me now if funny/ Mick is talking about a football game, and hearing Brits around him... maybe.

Not sure what you're saying 35love...ignore the actual lyrics while listening to the song? Or focus on the groove, and pay minimal attention to the lyrics and see the bright side of it all?
For me, half of the strength of a solid tune lies in the lyrics, and these leave something to be desired...maybe I don't have the same sense of humor as Mick (or you).
For the record, I never fully dissed the lyrics in the first place - my first impression yesterday was "Mick's vocals are good, lyrics aren't that great, a bit repetitive, and overall a bit derivative. Nice groove and atmosphere though". I then echoed what someone else who said about the simple rhymes he uses are subpar. Even though I've lost interest already in the two new tunes, they're not terrible and certainly could have been a lot worse.
Maybe if there was an instrumental version of these tunes, or maybe if Mick was just grunting unintelligible noises in the background...maybe they would be better?

*No, of course that is not what I meant, I am a word snob/ life long reader/
matters to me too! Right, I am the gal who doesn't like video don't distract me from the song.
What I meant/ my personal experience, having read the lyrics before hearing any of the song, I understood the lyrics 1 way. Then, after actually getting the song and hearing it a few times, the lyrics changed for me/ the meaning.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-07-29 02:19 by 35love.

There seemingly is something those respected reviewers with authority know but we lesser mortals here in IORR don't: that "Doom & Gloom" is "brilliant" and "Undercover of The Night" is a "classic"...

- Doxa

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wonderboy
From the Bonner review: 'the Stones’ own musical director, Matt Clifford.'
...

Uh, oh. Keith is reaching for his knife.

Nah, Chuck will beat him to it and figure Keith will take the rap and then get a suspended sentence with public service.

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Hairball
...
One things certain, there's quite a lot of remixes and versions of Getta Grip and England Lost to digest which is probably a good thing...

Really? Not for me, remixes are the worst thing that ever happened to b-sides. One out of every 30 or so are worth listening to.

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Rip This
...Gotta getta Grip has got a very nice groove...I like it!! kicks!

Ditto, I like it a lot!

But sorry, England Lost is crap. I'll take 1 out of 2, as this was unexpected.

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LeonidP

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Hairball
...
One things certain, there's quite a lot of remixes and versions of Getta Grip and England Lost to digest which is probably a good thing...

Really? Not for me, remixes are the worst thing that ever happened to b-sides. One out of every 30 or so are worth listening to.

I wrote that yesterday while maneuvering through all of the different versions hoping for something to elevate the official versions.
When the two official releases aren't that special (such as the case here), at least there are other versions to experiment with. Similar to a dub version of a reggae song which in many cases are better than the original song.
I did say "probably a good thing", but I was wrong. Sadly in this case, none of them elevate the official versions, so in that sense I would agree with you.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

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Doxa

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Rocky Dijon
I thought it rather sad that one critic seemed clueless regarding the reference to Marie Antoinette and the significance of comparing Brexit to another Revolution.

Haha... my favourite is the part:

Had a girl in Lisbon, a girl in Rome
Now I’ll have to stay at home

Ah, the real tragedy of leaving the EU: Mick Jagger potentially losing easy, visa-free access to sexually available women in mainland European cities.

Truly, poetry of our times.

I mean... that kind of reference - in the end - to sexual relationships, no matter wht the topic or context is, is so Jaggerian thing as it ever can be, and surely one done with that typical tongue-in-a-cheek style of his... Now this lady totally misses Jagger's grin there and takes the easy route to state the obvious. A cheap shot actually, which actually makes her to sound like some old moralist (the lesson: do not people forget what kind of womanizer this man really is). "No sex, we are English" indeed. She says she is an old Jagger fan - makes me wonder what she might thought about SOME GIRLS at the time...

- Doxa

*I completely missed the reference, and think I just bragged about reading a lot of books.

I don't think either song is MICK expressing his political views, or personal judgements or strong personal opinion of anything-
I think he is picking up all people all around him. Which is why he wanted it out now. Even the accent/voice in the middle of GGAG, starting a sentence with 'Anyway,' it sounds like the disjointed way everyone speaks nowadays!
I do think the part/story of GGAG of trying the newest latest self improvement diversion 'but I can't get you out of my mind' may be true...but who? ;-)

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HMS
Heavy Funk just like R.L.Burnside played back in the 90s... nice groove, some good guitar moments, Mick´s voice sounding pretty good... but these are not really songs, just groove... With stuff like that no wonder they "they hit the wall". After two times of listening you see it´s basically nothing... nearly nothing. To be honest both songs sound just the same to yours truly. To be even more honest, both songs are not far from being crap. How can fans be so easily satisfied... don´t let them get away with anything... Put it on the next re-release of Superheavy so hopefully most people will never ever hear these songs. Sorry for not being all smiles, but in fact there´s not much reason for being delighted. This stuff doesn´t even serve as a b-side.

How not original.

Both of these songs are better than the old hat or SuperBoring.

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LeonidP

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Hairball
...
One things certain, there's quite a lot of remixes and versions of Getta Grip and England Lost to digest which is probably a good thing...

Really? Not for me, remixes are the worst thing that ever happened to b-sides. One out of every 30 or so are worth listening to.

The Cult always had good remixes.

Rather ironic to see so many people worked up over a song called "Gotta Get a Grip."

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Rocky Dijon
Rather ironic to see so many people worked up over a song called "Gotta Get a Grip."

There's similarities to how some people couldn't get a grip when Lets Work was released.

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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

I read somewhere that these 2 songs was intended for the next Stones album but was taken off of the list fron songs that wouldn't fit in on a new Stones album and thank God for that. Theese songs are totally rubbish.

Okay Mick wants to get political and reflect the anxiety that is growing all over the world. Rather good lyrics but the music is utterly boring, have no energy, just a repeated "loop" around the lyrics.

To me it would have been better to sit down with Keith and say "Let's work".
I'm sure that would be a benefit for the Stones if they met and started to write together. Keith still got it as far as I am concerned. He is true to his roots while Jagger is a restless "Wandering spirit" who seems to have lost its guidelines in what music to create.

Been Stoned since 1964 and still am!

England lost... a persoon who was a great musician in the sixties and seventies.

<I read somewhere that these 2 songs was intended for the next Stones album but was taken off of the list fron songs that wouldn't fit in on a new Stones album and thank God for that>

That's not what people close to the Stones/Mick said here.

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Fan Since 1964


To me it would have been better to sit down with Keith and say "Let's work".

Into which Keith would politely say, "oh dear Mick, didn't you already release this song a long time ago? Besides, I don't think it is so good song the Stones should do a new version..."

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-07-29 12:05 by Doxa.

These songs have really grown on me. When I first heard them I wasn't impressed. But afte a few listens I think England Lost is awesome. And Gotta Get a Grip is growing on me too. I actually think these could have worked on a Stones album but I think the Stones wouldn't have done as good a job - i.e. These sorts of songs aren't their forte, they would have ended up sounding like "Suck on the Jugular" if the Stones had done them. This way, they sound cool, different and interesting.

Play 6 times before you listennnnn..... They are good



ROCKMAN

So on the one side, I'm happy someone in the Stones camp finally realizes how easy it is to put out music these days. On the other side, I'm not so happy if the output is a piece of shit.

And btw, someone here said these songs could've been from the "experimental" choices for the upcoming Stones album. There is nothing experimental about this, it's as generic as possible.

How does the lyrics of England Lost feel for the homesitters- those who didn't bother to vote, but preferred to remain in the EU?

Wasn´t there a picture from a Stones-session for the new album with some titles written on plexiglass, one of them "Get A Grip"?

I think these two songs are from Mick´s stack of 40+ demos. I´m glad the Stones rejected Get A Grip. I am not bashing these songs for being Mick´s songs, not at all, but this stuff is just not good. Mick always had that sense for a melody, a catchy bridge (even on stuff like Back To Zero), none of that can be found on these new songs. I don´t care if a song is written by Mick or written by Keith as long as it is a good song. But these new songs... make me think Substantial Damage and Infamy are quite decent efforts...

HMS: Wasn´t there a picture from a Stones-session for the new album with some titles written on plexiglass, one of them "Get A Grip"?

No.

Drive Me Too Hard and Get Out Of My Way.

.....what a draggggggggg it is getting old .........



ROCKMAN

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john lomax
These songs have really grown on me. When I first heard them I wasn't impressed. But afte a few listens I think England Lost is awesome. And Gotta Get a Grip is growing on me too. I actually think these could have worked on a Stones album but I think the Stones wouldn't have done as good a job - i.e. These sorts of songs aren't their forte, they would have ended up sounding like "Suck on the Jugular" if the Stones had done them. This way, they sound cool, different and interesting.

My exact thoughts. A typical Stones groove is great within its own limits, and I think what Jagger is aiming here - and also I think succeeds in doing - goes beyond that range. Theoretically the songs could have been done by the Stones - there is nothing so odd about their melodic lines and riffs - but the effect and the point of these tunes is based on marrying the topical lyrics with a specific groove. Going solo is very justified - they sound to me like you say "cool, different and interesting".

- Doxa

Interesting is that little remark by MIck that "It's always refreshing to get creative in a different fashion and I feel a slight throwback to a time when you could be a bit more free and easy by recording on the hoof and putting it out there immediately".

I think what he supposedly refers here is the 'innocent' times back in the sixties when they were releasing a new single every three or four months or so. Surely there was a lot pressure going on - their new single always needed to be a hit - but still they couldn't waste too much time on doing them (there is another Jagger interview from the 80's in that Jagger solo works thread in which he says for him the 64-66 era era "happy time" - no busts or too much drugs yet and all they did was touring, writing songs and making records with no worry about the future. Some Stones histories usually claim how busy and exhausted they were at the time, but probably that wasn't any problem for a workaholic like Jagger.) The result, especially when they got Jagger/Richard song team going on, was to reflect what's going on and release quickly those, with no second thoughts, on their next single.

I think there is something similarity in "Gotta Get A Grip"/"England Lost" to those 'pop era' singles - think their brief social - or whatever - commentaries starting with "Satisfaction" and continuing with things like "Get off of My Cloud", "19th Nervous Breakown", "Paint It Black", "Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby?" etc. All they did well, mostly number ones, and some of them are huge classics today, but at the time they weren't nothing but good pop singles no one would know would they have any lasting value in the long run. They were 'flavor of the month' type of things, recorded and released quickly, having their place in the sun for some months, and then to be aimed 'forgotten' to be followed by the next one. And the band itself wasn't sure if they will not be forgetten in two years time, but were pushing forward while they still were 'hot'...


So this kind of contingent, casual nature - not to be aimed to be some huge artistic statements or masterpieces to build for an eternity - Jagger's solo tunes have common with those 'pop era' singles. Luckily for him, his career doesn't any longer depend on their chart success (in any case, next month he will be, once again, the most successful frontman of his business facing an adoring audience). It could be that they are forgotten in some months time (and after that to be seen as a some sort curiosity in Jagger's CV for those interested in things like that), but what does it matter? They are 'flavor of the month' type of things by purpose - quickly done and released, stemming most likely just out of artistic motivation. Jagger thought he had 'something to say' - so he did it, and it looks like he will get a some kind of reaction. Do we like them next year, or in 20 years time from now on, doesn't really matter. Why everything should last forever? They are here and now. Let us - those who are moved by the stuff - enjoy while they are 'hot' and 'relevant'. Tomorrow we might have something else to excite our imagination.

It's only rock& roll, indeed.

- Doxa



Edited 6 time(s). Last edit at 2017-07-29 14:08 by Doxa.

Bought the vinyl yesterday.

I listened to the two songs around midnight six times. Then I thought that they were not so much songs, but more kinds of a personal sentiment (in one or two senses of the word) in a quite minimalistic musical form. But very effective in expressing that sentiment.

Just now I have listened to the songs a seventh time. Now I notice that I am taken in by the songs. They are growing interesting to me as music. The seeming monotony has opened up to me as having some to me formerly unknown form of variation in it. The Rolling Stones may have made better songs since then, maybe more than a few. But maybe these songs are the most novel species of, let me call it, Stones-related music since parts of the album UNDERCOVER.

I for one would have liked the direction of this musical form been made the basis of a new Rolling Stones studio album. As really new Rolling Stones music.

Edit: Clumsily written on my phone before I had read Doxa's preceding post.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-07-29 13:13 by Witness.

I still like both tunes. I agree that some of the rhyming is a bit silly, but some of it I like (meditation/medication is nice), and anyway, the main point is how it sounds. Of course neither is a timeless classic, but those days are gone since a long time. I think I am mainly pleased to hear that Mick Jagger sings in a convincing way, without the posing, and I very much like the production, the sound of the songs. As for the message, it's alright, but nothing overly poignant or profound.
I also like this way of working of his: just releasing two songs when they are ready. Maybe that's better than the outdated "making an album" approach.

I am surprised, actually, that nobody made the connection yet with Kate Tempest with "Europe is Lost". It seems like an obvious song to compare to. And her "Europe is Lost" certainly is very poignant, very much so, it moves me tremendously, and the lyrics are absolutely brilliant:

[www.youtube.com]







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-07-29 13:21 by matxil.

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Witness

I for one would have liked the direction of this musical form been made the basis of a new Rolling Stones studio album. As really new Rolling Stones music.

I agree.