Dutch Stones accountant Jan Favié will be questioned under oath by a Dutch Parliamentary comité researching misuse of Holland as a tax haven for the Stones.
This will take place in June. Jan representents Promotone and also U2.

I heard it on the news yesterday.........bit odd as the Stones are located with Promotone B.V. in the Netherlads for decades now

__________________________

The Netherlands is actually a huge fiscal paradise. Not just for the Stones, also for U2 and a bunch of other huge companies.

(In Dutch:

[hoeveelkrijgjij.nl]

[www.oxfamnovib.nl]

)

It's legally Okay, but ethically no longer defendable. That's why the inquest will be held. Jagger will be on tiptoes, because if there is one thing he likes it is keeping his business affaires under the radar.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-09 14:31 by paulspendel.

let's hope he doesn't end up like Roberto Calvi, the banker of the Vatican...

Yep, it's unethical. Normal workers pay their taxes but big corporations always finds a way of not paying them.

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dcba
let's hope he doesn't end up like Roberto Calvi, the banker of the Vatican...

What's the matter with the boy ...

Are you really comparing the Mick to Roberto Calvi? I beg your pardon, but if that was meant to be a joke, it went tits up, and I can't even say that comparison was extremely far-fetched, because it doesn't even fit a trifle, and something like that doesn't belong here, for it is simply all stupid and absolutely tasteless.

O si tacuisses ...

dead.flowers

I wonder if that will herald the end of touring - if they can't make lots of money through Rupert's established way of setting everything up in the Netherlands for each tour, with tax legally minimised, Mick might not think it worth their while to do it .....

It's just an investigation held by members of parliament who want to investigate tax evasion
through the Netherlands. It is possible the outcome of this investigation will lead to
new tax laws in The Netherlands, but that will take so long that it's more likely
the kids of the Stones will see the effects of that than our beloved band itself.

Just as long as the guitar plays, let it steal your heart away

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dead.flowers
absolutely tasteless.

Didn't know that "good taste" was part of the Stones vibe. Seems a bit contradictory with the guys huh? And yes it was a joke.

If you're offended we can stick to "has Mick Taylor more fretboard superpowers than Ronnie Wood?" type of discussion.
Zero offending jokes there...

Quote
marcovandereijk
It's just an investigation held by members of parliament who want to investigate tax evasion
through the Netherlands. It is possible the outcome of this investigation will lead to
new tax laws in The Netherlands, but that will take so long that it's more likely
the kids of the Stones will see the effects of that than our beloved band itself.

Thanks for highlighting us, marco. That's just as much as what I thought it might be. End ofg story. No reason to get exited.

dead.flowers

Quote
dead.flowers

Quote
dcba
let's hope he doesn't end up like Roberto Calvi, the banker of the Vatican...

What's the matter with the boy ...

Are you really comparing the Mick to Roberto Calvi?

To me it was quite obvious he was 'comparing' that "Dutch Stones accountant" (see the title of this thread) to Calvi - but I could be wrong...

And yes it was a joke.

Well alright, no offence, nothing, but that was so far-fetched a comparison that my brains are still curling about it. I personally wouldn't even wish my worst enemies - if I had any - to end up in such a way.

Fair enough, though, dcba.

dead.flowers

OK, OK, the post looked at least to be referring to MJ since it came directly under the Jagger in tiptoes post. And the poster of the joke didn't contradict he meant MJ.

However, in case it referred to the Dutch accountant, it could be understood as a joke then.

Anyhow, whoever the accountant may be, and if he follows this thread: I wish you long life and prosperity, sir.

dead.flowers

Not quite. It's partially fiscal laws indeed, but mainly based on fiscal rulings. These can be dismissed overnight.

Well, that did not go all too well.
Mr. Favié tried to convince the committee that The Stones and U2 (he represents both bands
through Promogroup BV and U2 Limited) chose domicile in Amsterdam for the "expertise
and added value" he can offer the bands when it comes to management of copyrights and
business administration.
According to mr Favië it's a mere coincidence that royalties from all over the world
come in through these Dutch companies and are paid to the stockholders (the members
of the bands) and that the Dutch tax rates for these transactions are relatively low.

A member of parliament in this committee called this implausible and incredible.

Mr. Favie did not deny that in the past the Stones fled the UK, because in the early
70s the tax rates for artists were close to 100 % (we know that, hence Exile on Main St)
but he also emphasized that the Stones pay taxes alright. They pay VAT on ticketsales
and each member of the band pays income tax in his home country.

Just as long as the guitar plays, let it steal your heart away

Never mind most of you don't understand Dutch. Mr Favie doesn't seem happy with all the attention.

[nos.nl]

Rolling Stones, U2 Management Deny Tax Evasion Via Dutch Shell Companies
By Janene Pieters on June 12, 2017 - 15:10

Rock bands The Rolling Stones and U2 don't have offices in the Netherlands for tax-evasion purposes, but because of the "specific experience and expertise" the country has to offer, their management said to an investigative committee on Monday, NU.nl reports.

Jan Favié is talking to an investigating committee, consisting of six Dutch parliamentarians, on Monday as part of the investigation into the Panama Papers. Favié is the director of Promogroup B.V. and U2 Limited, the companies that respectively manage the rights of The Rolling Stones and U2.

Favié vehemently denied that the two world famous rock bands settled in the Netherlands to pay as little tax as possible. "There are two certainties in life: death and taxes. Both can't be avoided", he said, adding that both Promogroup and U2 limited paid profit tax in the Netherlands.

He also denied the suggestion that he is in charge of a shell company - a company with little economic activity. "The problem is that there is no good definition for shell companies. They are target companies that are managed by a trust office. We're not that. I also had to explain that to the ladies in our office, they also didn't understand", he said.

Favié seemed to be working on the committee members' nerves a few hours into the the questioning. When Favié tried to again explain his work in Amsterdam two hours in, CDA committee member Chris van Dam could not hold himself in. "You are deliberately sailing around the questions", he snapped, according to NU.nl.

GroenLinks committee member Tom van der Lee also explained that Favié's companies make use of a so-called double nothing deduction - which means not paying tax on an amount up to two times by using fiscal laws and regulations, according to the newspaper. "A classic example of evasion", Van deer Lee said.

[nltimes.nl]

To me this is an excruciating experience for (us) the Dutch people. For many years our society and its inhabitants where labeled as 'liberal', 'open minded', tolerant. The fact is that these terms are only slightly appropriate: far more we are opportunistic people, make prophet when you can, allow foreigners as long as we can make a prophet, use them. And so we created a tax heaven where Starbucks, U2 and the Rolling Stones are thriving from. Among many other companies. It's about time these institutions paid their fare share. Mick Jagger and band, kids, the whole lot have a right to be frightened because promopub.bv will have to pay up. And damn right they should. Above all, we,the Ducht people should be ashamed to have made this possible: for decades!!!!
We zouden de ogen uit onze kop moeten schamen!!

But, if there was no law broken, why investigate??
Change the law!

Interestingly Jan Favie posted a "position paper" to parliament.
The paper states that one of the two members of the company board is a woman and that this woman is the rolling stones manager.
The paper also states that the promopub company is not an empty shell but that it exerts direct control over the rolling stones archive in the uk where , according again to jan favie, there is currently a extensive digitisation of the archive material underway.

The paper is here promopub

Why are they questioning the Stones and U2? Many big money making companies do the same, all around the globe.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-12 23:25 by TheflyingDutchman.

There will be a new sticky fingers with unreleased songs!

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TheflyingDutchman
Why are they questioning the Stones and U2? Many big money making companies do the same, all around the globe.

The stones were mentioned as an example on the public network NPO.
Politicians reacted to that.

The Stones are not guilty of tax evasion. Tax avoidance, which is legal and any smart person would take full advantage of any and all laws, would apply to the Stones organization. And why not? They got burned in the 70s plus the debacle with Mr. Klein. I'd take full advantage as well. Perhaps the NL are being pressured by Brussels or just more money hungry politicians are stirring up the pot.

Tax evasion? No. Tax avoidance? Yep.

It's not a "criminal investigation" as part of a court case.
It is only a political investigation to evaluate the Dutch laws.
So the question of "guilty or not guilty" is not at stake here.

Just as long as the guitar plays, let it steal your heart away

Part of the tax avoidance is that in the Netherlands tax is not paid over royalties earned outside of the Netherlands. So, the Stones and U2 do not pay any tax over 98+ % of their royalties.

Mathijs

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StonedAsia
The Stones are not guilty of tax evasion. Tax avoidance, which is legal and any smart person would take full advantage of any and all laws, would apply to the Stones organization. And why not?

Tax evasion? No. Tax avoidance? Yep.

Basically you say "it's not moral but it's legal". That's the defense system of most crooks these days : "yeah what I did is shocking but it's perfectly legal...".
That's a very thin defense line in my book.

And logically you, I, gotta wonder : where is the money? Where is the Stones' money? On some offshore account "somewhere" in the Bermudas? In some opaque financial blackhole, next to Assad's or some arm dealer's "savings"?

Keef the old "pirate" should ask himself about the kind of arrangement with common decency and morality that was necessary to make him a very rich man from 1989 on.

I find all this rather nauseating. And more than the musical decline of recent years this is what drove me away from the band.

Honoré de Balzac once wrote : "behind every great fortune there is a great crime".
He would have loved the Stones...



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-13 14:29 by dcba.

Leona helmsley once said that paying taxes is for the little people.