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That's something that afflicts both IORR & GHS. [Though early vinyl pressings of both sounded a lot sharper than any subsequent versions]
That said, I'm not sure that the clear "Hi Fi"sound of B&B suits the Rolling Stones especially well.
The murky , inaccessible mixes can be part of the charm with some albums.
Exile being perhaps the best example.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-06 09:19 by Spud.
Er... I don't follow you there? To me, ER is up there with Black And Blue, Beggars Banquet and Let It Bleed as the best-sounding Stones album. Tattoo You is up there, too.
The sound of SG, ER and TY is different, though. But worst? No way
Try Out Of Our Heads (UK), It's Only Rock'n'Roll or A Bigger Bang.
Me too, but does it have a cohesive sound (compare the crisp-sounding Bitch to Brown Sugar, for instance).
It's a lovely collection of recordings from 1968-1971, but to me, it is very eclectic-sounding (a bit like TY).
But that doesn't matter. It remains in my top 3 of favourite Stones-albums anyway.
Here I was merely talking about how it was engineered, though
Apart from the drums, DW doesn't really sound that bad, imo. And on the Charlie (and Ronnie) drum-tracks even the drums sound fine
And the worst?
Steel Wheels IS the worst of course. Not sure about the best.
Steel Wheels on vinyl suffers from the fact that it was a bit too long to cut it with much dynamic range on single album.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-06 15:02 by Spud.
Miller didn't do the engineering, though, he produced.
Glyn Johns was still on board for Black And Blue (even though he didn't want to, at first) + Keith Harwood and a couple of other guys (as well as some assistant engineers)
Talk about your favorite band.
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Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Pecman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 06:06
What do you think the best Sounding and Worst sounding Stones studio album is?
I would say "Black And Blue" is the best.
I would say "Emotional Rescue is the worst. (Besides Dirty Work).
To this day..."Black and Blue" no matter how loud you crank it or low volume
device you listen to it...always sounds full, no distorted and the perfect
balance of lows, highs, trebile and bass.
My second worst has to be Goats Head Soup.
Pecman
I would say "Black And Blue" is the best.
I would say "Emotional Rescue is the worst. (Besides Dirty Work).
To this day..."Black and Blue" no matter how loud you crank it or low volume
device you listen to it...always sounds full, no distorted and the perfect
balance of lows, highs, trebile and bass.
My second worst has to be Goats Head Soup.
Pecman
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
TeaAtThree
()
Date: June 6, 2017 08:59
Black and Blue wins around here a lot for its sound.
I very much like the sound of ER, to me the worst are the muddied mixes of It's Only Rock n Roll. Every version of that I've ever owned, even the vinyl, sound like your listening through a thick layer of gauze.
Then, as much as I love the album, I hate the sound of Some Girls. It always sounds tinny to these ears.
T@3
I very much like the sound of ER, to me the worst are the muddied mixes of It's Only Rock n Roll. Every version of that I've ever owned, even the vinyl, sound like your listening through a thick layer of gauze.
Then, as much as I love the album, I hate the sound of Some Girls. It always sounds tinny to these ears.
T@3
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Spud
()
Date: June 6, 2017 09:16
Quote
TeaAtThree
Black and Blue wins around here a lot for its sound.
I very much like the sound of ER, to me the worst are the muddied mixes of It's Only Rock n Roll. Every version of that I've ever owned, even the vinyl, sound like your listening through a thick layer of gauze.
Then, as much as I love the album, I hate the sound of Some Girls. It always sounds tinny to these ears.
T@3
That's something that afflicts both IORR & GHS. [Though early vinyl pressings of both sounded a lot sharper than any subsequent versions]
That said, I'm not sure that the clear "Hi Fi"sound of B&B suits the Rolling Stones especially well.
The murky , inaccessible mixes can be part of the charm with some albums.
Exile being perhaps the best example.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-06 09:19 by Spud.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Silver Dagger
()
Date: June 6, 2017 10:06
Black And Blue - best hands down winner.
Worst would be Some Girls or Goats Head Soup. Too cluttered and not enough separation.
Worst would be Some Girls or Goats Head Soup. Too cluttered and not enough separation.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 10:15
Quote
Pecman
What do you think the best Sounding and Worst sounding Stones studio album is?
I would say "Black And Blue" is the best.
I would say "Emotional Rescue is the worst. (Besides Dirty Work).
To this day..."Black and Blue" no matter how loud you crank it or low volume
device you listen to it...always sounds full, no distorted and the perfect
balance of lows, highs, trebile and bass.
My second worst has to be Goats Head Soup.
Pecman
Er... I don't follow you there? To me, ER is up there with Black And Blue, Beggars Banquet and Let It Bleed as the best-sounding Stones album. Tattoo You is up there, too.
The sound of SG, ER and TY is different, though. But worst? No way
Try Out Of Our Heads (UK), It's Only Rock'n'Roll or A Bigger Bang.Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 10:18
..........I lurv the sound of Sticky ...
ROCKMAN
ROCKMAN
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 10:27
Quote
Rockman
..........I lurv the sound of Sticky ...
Me too, but does it have a cohesive sound (compare the crisp-sounding Bitch to Brown Sugar, for instance).
It's a lovely collection of recordings from 1968-1971, but to me, it is very eclectic-sounding (a bit like TY).
But that doesn't matter. It remains in my top 3 of favourite Stones-albums anyway.
Here I was merely talking about how it was engineered, though
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Maindefender
()
Date: June 6, 2017 10:29
Is there going to be a separate DW thread? 
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 10:38
Quote
Maindefender
Is there going to be a separate DW thread?
Apart from the drums, DW doesn't really sound that bad, imo. And on the Charlie (and Ronnie) drum-tracks even the drums sound fine
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Monsoon Ragoon
()
Date: June 6, 2017 10:43
Steel Wheels
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 11:00
Quote
Monsoon Ragoon
Steel Wheels
And the worst?
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Monsoon Ragoon
()
Date: June 6, 2017 11:56
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Monsoon Ragoon
Steel Wheels
And the worst?
Steel Wheels IS the worst of course. Not sure about the best.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Toru A
()
Date: June 6, 2017 12:07
Nowadays, my favorite engineer is Tony Cousins from Metropolis Mastering.
His KPI is excellent.
I guess he was involved in No Security.
His KPI is excellent.
I guess he was involved in No Security.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Blueranger
()
Date: June 6, 2017 12:52
From a pure TECHNICAL perspective, it would be Black And Blue.
However, for me it's also a question of what fits the music.
For example, the debut album sounds like it was recorded inside a cardboard box, but I wouldn't want it any other way.
However, for me it's also a question of what fits the music.
For example, the debut album sounds like it was recorded inside a cardboard box, but I wouldn't want it any other way.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 12:55
Quote
Blueranger
From a pure TECHNICAL perspective, it would be Black And Blue.
However, for me it's also a question of what fits the music.
For example, the debut album sounds like it was recorded inside a cardboard box, but I wouldn't want it any other way.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
jumpingjackflash5
()
Date: June 6, 2017 13:18
Black and Blue sounds great. Yes Some Girls has strange mix.
If you have CD, you can try to upsample to 24/88.2 with Resampler
[github.com]
On many DACs it sounds better.
If you have CD, you can try to upsample to 24/88.2 with Resampler
[github.com]
On many DACs it sounds better.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Spud
()
Date: June 6, 2017 14:58
Quote
Monsoon RagoonQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Monsoon Ragoon
Steel Wheels
And the worst?
Steel Wheels IS the worst of course. Not sure about the best.
Steel Wheels on vinyl suffers from the fact that it was a bit too long to cut it with much dynamic range on single album.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-06 15:02 by Spud.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
wonderboy
()
Date: June 6, 2017 15:07
Black and Blue for best. I wonder why. Jimmy Miller was gone and the Glimmers were a mess.
I like the sound of Let it Bleed. Sounds very rich, like you are sitting in the studio. I like when you can hear the physical sounds, like guitarist striking the strings.
On IORR the drum don't sound good. SG, as noted, sounds a bit tinny, or thin.
I like the sound of Let it Bleed. Sounds very rich, like you are sitting in the studio. I like when you can hear the physical sounds, like guitarist striking the strings.
On IORR the drum don't sound good. SG, as noted, sounds a bit tinny, or thin.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 15:17
Quote
wonderboy
Black and Blue for best. I wonder why. Jimmy Miller was gone and the Glimmers were a mess.
I like the sound of Let it Bleed. Sounds very rich, like you are sitting in the studio. I like when you can hear the physical sounds, like guitarist striking the strings.
On IORR the drum don't sound good. SG, as noted, sounds a bit tinny, or thin.
Miller didn't do the engineering, though, he produced.
Glyn Johns was still on board for Black And Blue (even though he didn't want to, at first) + Keith Harwood and a couple of other guys (as well as some assistant engineers)
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: June 6, 2017 16:52
I really do not like the sound of Voodoo Lounge. It sounds contrived. I think Let it Bleed sounds terrific, and Tattoo You as well.
Mathijs
Mathijs
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
RobertJohnson
()
Date: June 6, 2017 17:00
Best sounding: ABB (full, rich guitar sound)
Worst: Aftermath (thin guitars, very disappointing after the fully sounding performance on e.g. Out Of Our Heads)
Worst: Aftermath (thin guitars, very disappointing after the fully sounding performance on e.g. Out Of Our Heads)
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Thommie
()
Date: June 6, 2017 17:17
Best: Tattoo You
Worst: Between the Buttons?
Worst: Between the Buttons?
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
buttons67
()
Date: June 6, 2017 20:30
from a technical view, black and blue despite having few great songs is the best sounding stones album, also good is tattoo you.
some girls is poorly made from an engineering view and spoils the album to some extent.
emotional rescue is poorly made too.
some girls is poorly made from an engineering view and spoils the album to some extent.
emotional rescue is poorly made too.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
stonehearted
()
Date: June 6, 2017 21:03
Best: Let It Bleed -- because it has atmosphere, the music has room to breathe, so that there can be a theatrical moment where Mick just "laughs in the face of the danger" as the middle of Midnight Rambler slows down.
Worst: A Bigger Bang -- because all the life, all the melody, all the musicality is crushed beyond belief by all the over-compression, so that it's just a monotonous, plodding noise throughout. They should have called this album Dirtier Work.
Worst: A Bigger Bang -- because all the life, all the melody, all the musicality is crushed beyond belief by all the over-compression, so that it's just a monotonous, plodding noise throughout. They should have called this album Dirtier Work.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Maindefender
()
Date: June 6, 2017 21:31
I think because I listened to Some Girls so much with headphones on it sounded perfect for the times. With all the radio play it got it seemed to prove great songs are great songs no matter what. EOMS another great headphone album....
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
donvis
()
Date: June 6, 2017 22:55
Blue & Lonesome sounds as bad as A Bigger Bang as far as I'm concerned!!!
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
StonedRambler
()
Date: June 6, 2017 23:36
I think the best one is Sticky Fingers because it uses Tape Saturation in a fashion that makes it even more rock'n'roll and dirtier. It also has a roomy sound in comparison to LIB which makes it more lively and more like you are there with the musicians.
Black and blue might be the technically best, but it sounds a bit too flat and clean to me.
Worst? For me Undercover 'cause I always found it terrible sterile and synthetic sounding.
There are actually some quite good songs on it (e.g. All the way down, wanna hold you, she was hot) but I could never force myself to listen to the whole album in one run.
But I think all their 80s albums sound very bad. But some people might like that 80s-sound.
A question to you all: I only own the remasters from GHS and IORR and think they are sounding quite good, not as good as Sticky or LIB but they come right after Exile in my personal ranking.
But many of you say those Albums are sounding muffled or thin. Have they fixed that in the Remasters a bit or why can't I hear that? (For Sticky and Exile the remasters actually sound worse IMHO)
Black and blue might be the technically best, but it sounds a bit too flat and clean to me.
Worst? For me Undercover 'cause I always found it terrible sterile and synthetic sounding.
There are actually some quite good songs on it (e.g. All the way down, wanna hold you, she was hot) but I could never force myself to listen to the whole album in one run.
But I think all their 80s albums sound very bad. But some people might like that 80s-sound.
A question to you all: I only own the remasters from GHS and IORR and think they are sounding quite good, not as good as Sticky or LIB but they come right after Exile in my personal ranking.
But many of you say those Albums are sounding muffled or thin. Have they fixed that in the Remasters a bit or why can't I hear that? (For Sticky and Exile the remasters actually sound worse IMHO)
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: June 6, 2017 23:55
<But many of you say those Albums are sounding muffled or thin>
IORR lacks what you like with SF, imo. It sounds like it's badly recorded, too. It's a bit dead. The drum sound is horrible to my ears.
My only gripe with SF (now I'm very picky) is that the recordings from all the different studios sound, well, different. But all the recordings sound great (in different ways).
There are huge differences within how the Stones's 80s-albums sound, imo. We can't really put ER and SW back to back for comparison. To me, ER sounds like a perfected SG (when it comes to sound and mix). U and DW both sound more punchy and better recorded than SW, imo.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-06 23:56 by DandelionPowderman.
IORR lacks what you like with SF, imo. It sounds like it's badly recorded, too. It's a bit dead. The drum sound is horrible to my ears.
My only gripe with SF (now I'm very picky) is that the recordings from all the different studios sound, well, different. But all the recordings sound great (in different ways).
There are huge differences within how the Stones's 80s-albums sound, imo. We can't really put ER and SW back to back for comparison. To me, ER sounds like a perfected SG (when it comes to sound and mix). U and DW both sound more punchy and better recorded than SW, imo.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-06 23:56 by DandelionPowderman.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
StonedRambler
()
Date: June 7, 2017 00:45
Thanks Dandy, actually I thought the drum sound is quite fat on some songs (on Dance Little Sister its almost like a Bonham drum sound, well almost.. Just the vocals sound thin and phasey sometimes.
I think IORR went with the trend of seperating the instruments more EQ-wise, as technology was moving forward and more and more channels could get recorded and eqed separately. But that might have led to a thin sound for some people. I suspect the 2009 remaster I have is blown up a lot, therefore everything seems fatter at cost of the dynamics.
As for Sticky, that's something I always liked because it brings more different color to the album. And I think it's pretty unnoticeable when listening in order because the arrangements and playing of the songs are even more different than the recordings.
And I actually think DW is the best sounding 80s album because it has the most aggressive and powerful character.
I think IORR went with the trend of seperating the instruments more EQ-wise, as technology was moving forward and more and more channels could get recorded and eqed separately. But that might have led to a thin sound for some people. I suspect the 2009 remaster I have is blown up a lot, therefore everything seems fatter at cost of the dynamics.
As for Sticky, that's something I always liked because it brings more different color to the album. And I think it's pretty unnoticeable when listening in order because the arrangements and playing of the songs are even more different than the recordings.
And I actually think DW is the best sounding 80s album because it has the most aggressive and powerful character.
Re: Best Engineered / Worst Engineered Stones Album - Dirty Work Excluded
Posted by:
Palace Revolution 2000
()
Date: June 7, 2017 01:09
Agree with "Black & Blue".
There are a few that are not-so-good, but most of them are kind of endearingly bad. I think calling SG badly engineered sounds like you don't want to get parts of the album. I thought the whole 78 album and tour was kind of an inside joke.
GHS is to me the one album where I do believe the hype about too many drugs. And IORR sounds like they are trying to go to Munich to live that all down, but still didn't quite know how. And the album sounds like it was mixed and mastered under a blanket with a flashlight.
Steel Wheels is so glaringly digital that it also becomes funny. That leaves Voodoo - IMO the big loser. I dislike almost everything Don Was is involved in. It tries to do everything; to cover it all.
There are a few that are not-so-good, but most of them are kind of endearingly bad. I think calling SG badly engineered sounds like you don't want to get parts of the album. I thought the whole 78 album and tour was kind of an inside joke.
GHS is to me the one album where I do believe the hype about too many drugs. And IORR sounds like they are trying to go to Munich to live that all down, but still didn't quite know how. And the album sounds like it was mixed and mastered under a blanket with a flashlight.
Steel Wheels is so glaringly digital that it also becomes funny. That leaves Voodoo - IMO the big loser. I dislike almost everything Don Was is involved in. It tries to do everything; to cover it all.
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