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Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: May 31, 2017 01:23

Quote
gotdablouse
Gilmour's soulful and delivate playing, even during the last tour.

If Gilmour could write a decent tune on his own without help from Roger in the past, and his current wife in the present, then it would be much more enjoyable. I love him as a guitar player/vocalist as a member of the Roger era Pink Floyd and a few of his solo tunes (I enjoyed his On an Island album and tour - better then the most recent one imo), but as a songwriter he leaves a lot to be desired. His live shows come across as either a tribute band (classic Pink Floyd tunes), or a band who is learning to write for the very first time (almost everything he's written without the help of Roger Waters).

Bottom line is one is less without the other, and depending one what one gives more weight to (Roger the "creative genius of Pink Floyd" or David the "voice and guitar of Pink Floyd" which is how they bill themselves), will be the reason someone pick's one over the other.

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2017-05-31 01:25 by Hairball.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: dmay ()
Date: May 31, 2017 05:36

Have not waded through the thread. Never a fan of Pink Floyd or Roger Waters. But, he reminds me, from the few comments I read, of the 60s, when performers/artists thought they could move people and change the world through the songs they wrote and performed. IMHO, we could use today some of that 60s idealism, want for a better world, involvement. If someone can bring it/us out through music, photography, paintings, graphics/posters, writings, engagement, more power to them.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: crholmstrom ()
Date: May 31, 2017 09:44

thumbs up
Quote
dmay
Have not waded through the thread. Never a fan of Pink Floyd or Roger Waters. But, he reminds me, from the few comments I read, of the 60s, when performers/artists thought they could move people and change the world through the songs they wrote and performed. IMHO, we could use today some of that 60s idealism, want for a better world, involvement. If someone can bring it/us out through music, photography, paintings, graphics/posters, writings, engagement, more power to them.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: marcovandereijk ()
Date: May 31, 2017 11:40

It's been said before on this forum: a Roger Waters show should not be considered a rock
concert. It's a show. An entertaining show, for those who love spectacular effects and
visuals, and perfectly performed music, with no room for musicians to improvise and add
some of their own ideas.
Impressive, overwhelming, spectacular. Those are the thrills you'll find at his shows.
His lip sync parts are all part of his aim to give a perfect show.

If you're aiming to see a Rock 'n Roll show with spontaneous music, there's plenty
of other bands to enjoy. It's just something completely different.

Just as long as the guitar plays, let it steal your heart away

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: gotdablouse ()
Date: May 31, 2017 14:03

Yes, well if he can't sing his parts anymore he should get someone on stage who can, it's not like he can't afford it...there's no excuse for lip syncing, be it a "concert" or a "show".

Having said that the new album is now "out" and well I quite like it on first listen...but I also liked Kaos in 1987 so that's probably not saying much ;-) Still the songs are good for the most part and it's hard not to fall for the production, that's definitely a producer's album, as if Goodrich had listened to all the classics (DSOTM/Animals/TW/TFC) and cleverly applied a patchwork to the new songs. ATD was a lot "tamer" in that respect. Didn't think Waters had an album like that in him but here it is.

As a side note it's interesting that Goodrich pulled out all these old tricks for Rog' when he gave Macca such a "hard time" by depriving him of his band so that he could be "himself". Now of course if he'd done with Rog it might not have been very marketable ;-)

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: RollingFreak ()
Date: May 31, 2017 18:23

Yeah, I totally agree. Listen, I'm a massive Waters fan, and I'm fine with a bit of lip syncing from him here and there, but if its gonna become a majority of the show that changes my mind. I get that its a "show", but it is still a concert, and for those prices I'm going to see him live, not stand on a stage and mime even if the visuals are excellent. I could see Cirque De Solele for that if I wanted. There needs to be a nice balance, and if he can't hack it at his age anymore then stop touring. Although obviously I see the other side of it that if I don't like it I should shut up and not bother it while other's enjoy it.

I'm looking forward to this album. Never been a big fan of his previous efforts. Pros And Cons has its moments although I really only like half. Radio KAOS I have heard awhile ago but remember none of it. Amused To Death people rave about but heard again recently and think its just OK. A little too long and self indulgent and would have been better cutting down. Liked the songs he did live though. This new one is getting great reviews and hope to hear it soon. Would love to enjoy a Roger Waters album a lot for once lol!

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: May 31, 2017 20:59

Ironically the biggest critic of the new album is Roger Waters himself. Claiming he had to "bit his tongue" and "sit on his hands" at various points of recording while Nigel Godrich took over. Several songs had some of the lyrics chopped out (the originals can be heard at various small performances the last couple years) with Roger saying the lyrics should have remained. He's also now second guessing the overall production itself, saying he'd like to remix it some day - and it's not even officially released yet!. And then there's a few serious diehard audiophile Floyd fans who are ripping it part (one of which I am not), claiming the vocals are too buried, something about too much compression, blah, blah,blah, etc. At the same time Roger says he's proud of it, and gives kudos to Godrich saying something along the lines of "I wrote all the songs, but Nigel made the record". I've heard the entire thing quite a few times now and love it from start to finish just the way it is as it harkens back to the classic Floyd albums, and had it been solely up to Roger, it might have turned out as a spoken word album with ambient/acoustic music in the background or something along those lines.


As for the new shows, there was minor snafu the other night with one of the main props - giant temporary hanging screens that run directly down the center from stage to back behind the soundboard. Evidently they were not going up and down in proper fashion or whatever it was. During yesterdays show rehearsal and stage set up, problems remained and it was decided that the screens during the entire portion of the show (three songs I think) were not going to be used at all with Roger sending out a tweet saying something like "we don't want to endanger the fans". One can only think of Spinal Tap, but the show went on without any other hitches. Whether those screens will be back remains to be seen. But with all the time and effort they put in to them, I have a feeling they will as they are a major part of the show. Spinal Tap lives! winking smiley

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-05-31 21:06 by Hairball.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: DEmerson ()
Date: May 31, 2017 21:23

I was at the Louisville show Sun. Hairball, and yes - one of the screens that runs down the length of the floor for part of the 2nd 'act' did not go up along with the rest. For a bit I wondered if it was there for a reason (for an upcoming part of the show), but then it became fairly obvious it was a snafu. Not that big of deal - especially for the 2nd show of the tour. I'm sure (I hope!) it's something they iron out, and it will be disappointing for those going to the next show (St. Louis? and beyond?) if they don't use the entire set up - because it's really stunning!
The screens used are similar to what U2 did with their last tour (not this current Joshua Tree), and are used to amazing effect.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: May 31, 2017 22:12

I was watching some of the Lousivile show via periscope and noticed something was slightly amiss with the screens after watching some of the previous opening show in Kansas City which went smoothly. St. Louis was last night without using the screens at all, and the next show will be tomorrow in Tulsa where we'll find out if the screens remain - hope so and see no reason why not! Either way, the show must go on!

If I hadn't already said it here, seems this type of show is best suited for a giant stadium or outdoor space ala Desert Trip, where the mega-gigantic screen behind the stage served the purpose for all of those effects - it was truly mesmerizing. As for now, it seems a bit condensed like trying to fit a huge rectangle into a round hole - no doubt it's impressive though and can't wait to experience it all myself! There's been hints that the tour will eventually come back for another round in stadiums just as The Wall tour did. Being that he's 73 years old, it's great to see him out there anywhere ruffling feathers and sharing alot of the great timeless work he created throughout the years - with some new stuff to boot!

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: mr_dja ()
Date: May 31, 2017 22:13

Quote
dmay
Have not waded through the thread. Never a fan of Pink Floyd or Roger Waters. But, he reminds me, from the few comments I read, of the 60s, when performers/artists thought they could move people and change the world through the songs they wrote and performed. IMHO, we could use today some of that 60s idealism, want for a better world, involvement. If someone can bring it/us out through music, photography, paintings, graphics/posters, writings, engagement, more power to them.

No need to stay stuck in the 60's... From what I understand (mind you, not from listening to the music but by reading the press releases, interview quotes, etc.), your desire for 60's idealism in 2010+ top 40 pop artists is being delivered regularly by people like Katy Perry, Arianna Grande, Justin Bieber, Lady Gaga, Madonna, Beyoncé, Nikki Manaj. The list goes on and on. Unfortunately, most of those artists, in my opinion, have spent too much time getting the public to focus on their underwear and have thus lost the ability to be taken seriously when they discuss serious issues in either their music (art) or interviews (commentary).

Just take Katy Perry's response last week: "I think the greatest thing that we can do now is just unite as people, as fanbases, all of it, you know? Whatever we say behind people’s backs – because the internet can be a little bit ruthless as far as fanbases go – but I think that the greatest thing we can do is just unite and love on each other. And no barriers, no borders – we all need to just coexist." I understand that she was directly discussing how groups of fans sometimes don't get along with each other more so than the world at large but, what is the world other than just a bunch of "fanbases"? She's espousing unity and loving one another. No barriers, no borders, all just coexisting. How utopian! Maybe her new album will be full of empowerment songs which will lead directly to world peace and shark costumes for all!

The messages are there and they're being sold delivered all day and night. Perhaps they're just not being sent to a generation who saw the original acts some 50-60 years ago.

Peace,
Mr DJA

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: custom55 ()
Date: June 1, 2017 05:08

From what I've seen on youtube, the show is visually stunning. I cannot wait to see Roger in Brooklyn in Sept.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: kovach ()
Date: June 1, 2017 06:05

Quote
dmay

Just take Katy Perry's response last week: " I think that the greatest thing we can do is just unite and love on each other. And no barriers, no borders – we all need to just coexist." I understand that she was directly discussing how groups of fans sometimes don't get along with each other more so than the world at large but, what is the world other than just a bunch of "fanbases"? She's espousing unity and loving one another. No barriers, no borders, all just coexisting. How utopian!

Yes as she goes to her gated home. That only works if everyone agrees, if anyone doesn't the whole thing falls apart. And never does everyone agree!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-01 17:55 by kovach.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Date: June 1, 2017 09:51

Quote
mr_dja
Quote
dmay
Have not waded through the thread. Never a fan of Pink Floyd or Roger Waters. But, he reminds me, from the few comments I read, of the 60s, when performers/artists thought they could move people and change the world through the songs they wrote and performed. IMHO, we could use today some of that 60s idealism, want for a better world, involvement. If someone can bring it/us out through music, photography, paintings, graphics/posters, writings, engagement, more power to them.

No need to stay stuck in the 60's... From what I understand (mind you, not from listening to the music but by reading the press releases, interview quotes, etc.), your desire for 60's idealism in 2010+ top 40 pop artists is being delivered regularly by people like Katy Perry, Arianna Grande, Justin Bieber, Lady Gaga, Madonna, Beyoncé, Nikki Manaj. The list goes on and on. Unfortunately, most of those artists, in my opinion, have spent too much time getting the public to focus on their underwear and have thus lost the ability to be taken seriously when they discuss serious issues in either their music (art) or interviews (commentary).

Just take Katy Perry's response last week: "I think the greatest thing that we can do now is just unite as people, as fanbases, all of it, you know? Whatever we say behind people’s backs – because the internet can be a little bit ruthless as far as fanbases go – but I think that the greatest thing we can do is just unite and love on each other. And no barriers, no borders – we all need to just coexist." I understand that she was directly discussing how groups of fans sometimes don't get along with each other more so than the world at large but, what is the world other than just a bunch of "fanbases"? She's espousing unity and loving one another. No barriers, no borders, all just coexisting. How utopian! Maybe her new album will be full of empowerment songs which will lead directly to world peace and shark costumes for all!

The messages are there and they're being sold delivered all day and night. Perhaps they're just not being sent to a generation who saw the original acts some 50-60 years ago.

Peace,
Mr DJA

Hey, Mr DJA, I found a nice vinyl copy of «You're Getting Even While I'm Getting Odd», if you're still looking for that one. Email me if you're interested, and I'll send it to you.

Sorry for being OT, y'all.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: kovach ()
Date: June 1, 2017 21:37

Heard some of the props malfunctioned during rehearsal at the St. Louis show therefore weren't used, like the Battersea Power Station, that along he sides only the chimney's appeared suspended in midair.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: dmay ()
Date: June 1, 2017 23:12

Found this on a Dylan site. Don't know if it was posted earlier.

[www.billboard.com]

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: June 2, 2017 00:10

Quote
dmay
Found this on a Dylan site. Don't know if it was posted earlier.

[www.billboard.com]

Q:And war is a consistent theme on these albums.

A:I haven't got time to do an album of Frank Sinatra covers.

Q"Some people do three of them.

A: Bob Dylan, for instance, which is weird. You go, "@#$%& me Bob, what is wrong with you? Why would you do that?"
I guess it's because he can't bear the thought of not being on the road and he couldn't think of anything else to do.
I can't believe he really has an affinity for all that schlock. But maybe he does.



Read this earlier - what a jackass remark from Roger Waters- of course Dylan likes Sinatra!!!
Roger Waters hasn't released an album of originals in 25 years, and when he does tour it's mostly living in the past.
Dylan on the other hand has been a "Never Ending Tour" since 1986, and he probably has zillions of unheard originals written and/recorded.
He could put out an album of originals every month if he chose to, and I wish he would release at least one, but can't fault a man for doing what he pleases whenever he pleases.

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: dmay ()
Date: June 2, 2017 00:33

Re Hairball's comment that Dylan likes Sinatra (I love classic Sinatra) and American music standards, I recall a comment regarding the release of "Tell Tale Signs" by Dylan that his outtakes on these albums were better than most performers official releases. I can't disagree. So, if Bob Dylan wants to cover Sinatra and American standard pop songs, more power to him. I wish the Stones were as willing to chance things.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: June 2, 2017 00:44

I like Sinatra, but am not too fond of anyone doing covers of him, be it Dylan or whoever else it may be.
As for Dylan's Tell Tale signs, one of my favorite box sets - I sunk my teeth right in to it for months after it was released.
Regarding Roger Waters, that seemed an odd statement as he's said many times that Dylan is one his favorite - if not absolute favorite - songwriters. He even had a Dylan track playing at all of the pre-shows last tour along with John Lennon, Sam Cooke, Curtis Mayfield, and other greats. Perhaps he's just missing some originals (like many of us), and put his foot in his mouth in a big way. Foolish thing for him to say though, and not excusable. angry smiley lol...smiling smiley

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-02 00:46 by Hairball.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: The Sicilian ()
Date: June 2, 2017 04:58

Buffalo NY show announced today for Saturday September 9th.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: DGA35 ()
Date: June 2, 2017 05:23

A second Vancouver show has been announced for Oct 29, the night after the first show. I'm a bit surprised since the first show has tickets still available and they went on sale quite a while ago.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: crholmstrom ()
Date: June 2, 2017 13:57

Quote
DGA35
A second Vancouver show has been announced for Oct 29, the night after the first show. I'm a bit surprised since the first show has tickets still available and they went on sale quite a while ago.

Last time I checked, there were plenty of tickets left for Tacoma in 3 weeks. I must admit the show is on the spendy side. Highest price tickets I bought for the summer concert season.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: carouslambra ()
Date: June 2, 2017 16:42

Just finished listening to the new album....It makes Final Cut seem like a party album !!! Not sure these tracks will come across well live....suggest you take a good pillow with you !!

Don't get me wrong I love Waters and saw him at the O2 the night Gilmour played Comfortably Numb but will give any future UK gigs a miss.

Hopefully the album is a'grower'

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: June 2, 2017 17:56

Maybe not everyone's cup of tea, but the positive reviews are pouring in, and haven't read a bad one yet!

Roger Waters Flays Modern Dystopia

Pink Floyd founder returns when the world needs him most

Is This The Life We Really Want? is worth the long wait

Roger Waters’ new LP ‘Is This the Life We Really Want'


_______________________________________________________________________

As for the show last night in Tulsa, I heard that those giant screens after intermission (for three songs) were still a no show. Maybe they will be axed permanently after all? In one sense that might be good, but on the other they seemed to have a "wow" factor that elevated the show in a big way. But after all, it's all about a live musical experience...well most of it's live anyways. eye popping smileywinking smiley

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: The Sicilian ()
Date: June 3, 2017 07:07

Quote
crholmstrom
Quote
DGA35
A second Vancouver show has been announced for Oct 29, the night after the first show. I'm a bit surprised since the first show has tickets still available and they went on sale quite a while ago.

Last time I checked, there were plenty of tickets left for Tacoma in 3 weeks. I must admit the show is on the spendy side. Highest price tickets I bought for the summer concert season.

How much were they?

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: June 3, 2017 07:46

Links for tickets at all shows via his official site:

Roger Waters

I believe L.A. has the most expensive tickets with a max at $250 face value (+fee) and as low as $55 with severaal price levels in between.
A bargain when compared to Stones prices imo which for the Vegas shows were priced as high as $750 + fees regular tickets...eye popping smiley...(or was it even higher at $850?) with the lowest being $150 for nosebleeds.

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: crholmstrom ()
Date: June 3, 2017 09:55

Quote
The Sicilian
Quote
crholmstrom
Quote
DGA35
A second Vancouver show has been announced for Oct 29, the night after the first show. I'm a bit surprised since the first show has tickets still available and they went on sale quite a while ago.

Last time I checked, there were plenty of tickets left for Tacoma in 3 weeks. I must admit the show is on the spendy side. Highest price tickets I bought for the summer concert season.

How much were they?

I didn't get the most expensive ones but I paid about $350 for a pair.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: coffeepotman ()
Date: June 3, 2017 15:37

I love the new album, have listened to it several times already, I would really like him to do a showcase of the new album, and throw in a couple of PF songs as an encore. I know it will never happen. Also love the PF set he did at Desert Trip, just fantastic!

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: RollingFreak ()
Date: June 4, 2017 19:08

Well I finally heard the album. I'll have to wait and write a more in depth review next time I'm sitting and listening to it. Heard it in the car this morning on the way to work. Wasn't a big fan. I do think the first song is pretty great. Then again, I've never been a big fan of his solo albums. I always think they're missing the right musicianship to back up the usually dense lyrics. This album, in fairness, is his best amalgamation of that IMO. I get why its getting pretty good reviews. I thought the first half was fine (nothing great though) then the second half kind of took a nosedive for an album I was already just fine with. Maybe it'll grow. By no means do I not appreciate the effort, but with all the glowing reviews I thought it would finally be a Waters solo album I really liked and in the end I find it as forgettable as the rest but a good effort.

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: Hairball ()
Date: June 4, 2017 20:19

A friend who is a friend of guitar player Dave Kilminster was told that the giant screens spectacle for part of the show is being "repaired', and will resurface for San Jose and the rest of the tour.
Good news imo, as it was a crucial and significant part of the presentation that started the second half of the show, and took the show beyond the "ordinary" - at least by Roger's standards.
Even without them though, the overall show was extraordinary according to those who have seen it with and without.

.
_____________________________________________________________
Nothing to do, nowhere to go...you're talkin' to people that you don't know....

Re: OT: Roger Waters 2017
Posted by: RollingFreak ()
Date: June 4, 2017 22:07

Now with my second listen:

The good part about the album for me is its less story driven and necessary than some of his other albums. Pros And Cons, while good, always suffered from that IMO (it was like the Wall without any of the good music that made that album great for the most part) and to a lesser extent Radio KAOS. The not so good part is its still kinda the same I've always thought about Roger solo: he can still write good thought provoking lyrics but can't write a tune or a melody to save his life. Whereas Dave has the exact opposite problem where he can still rip a guitar, but has no song to add it to as his lyrics suck so much.

But enough of a comparison. I still maintain the first song with the first song intro is the best. Simple, but effective, builds to a climax. Very Pigs On The Wing/Mother-ish and it works. Problem is, thats kinda the ONLY song Roger can write. He writes it 5 more times on this record and it either gets old or just isn't as good as that one. The Last Refugee is similar, although worse cause it seems less melodic to me and more lyrically dense. Its also the first song that uses Bowie's Five Years drum pattern which is then used at least 2 more times on the record.

Rest of the record never really picks up IMO. Picture That is ok. Very clearly a Welcome To The Machine meets One Of These Days tracks but neither is too effective, at least to me. Thats a nice and annoying part of the album. Its got those callbacks, complete with the god damn intro that is basically right out of Dark Side (and closes the album as well) but to me they are also too on the nose or lacking in anything to really add to them than to just be nostalgic. Again, its not as harsh of a criticism as I make it sound, but I feel the album just fails to reach that next level. Broken Bones is probably my second favorite, but again not very different from Deja Vu.

Middle portion kinda loses me. Is This The Life We Really Want basically just drags to me, never becoming a full song, same with The Most Beautiful Girl. Bird In A Gale and Smell The Roses are just sort of a menacing thing but nothing that stands out (with the former having shades of Dogs thrown in). Then there's the last 3 songs which are basically a 9 minute finale to the record, again kind of never going anywhere. Which is fine, it doesn't necessarily have to, but then it never quite stops being a combo between Mother and Final Cut type song IMO. Any acoustic song he does is always reminiscent of Mother/Pigs On The Wing, and this album had a lot of shades of The Final Cut. Which I liked, although what I didn't like was those Final Cut songs usually reached a climax and thats what these songs lacked. A great guitar solo like the title track on that album, or a crescendo like The Gunner's Dream. The whole ending reminds me of Two Suns In The Sunset, but again kind of a not as good version of that. Fine, but never more than a passing OK sound to me despite it genuinely trying to be it sounds like. Its supposedly 3 different songs but if you were hearing that without looking at something that tells you when the songs switch you'd never know it. I would hope with the separation each would get bigger or be a little different.

I don't mean it to sound like a total takedown. In the end, as someone thats never fully gotten into his solo stuff but wanted to I didn't expect much else. The glowing reviews gave me small hope but people always loved Amused To Death too which I also thought was just ok but usually plodding and dense most of the time. I do think he did a good job trying to craft an album that was cohesive, it just all sounds a bit too much the same for me. I also think it was a good job bringing back those clear Floyd elements. Its a nice touch and roots the album in something, I just wish the songs or melodies were better to accompany it. Overall its a fine effort, when he didn't have to deliver anything at all, but I'd probably give it a 3 or 4 out of 10 with only 2 real memorable songs to me. In the end, to me, he can only write Mother, Pigs On The Wing, Apparently They Were Travelling Abroad so many times before it just gets endlessly repetitive and there's too many of those songs here.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017-06-04 22:18 by RollingFreak.

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