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Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Date: March 2, 2017 09:40

I always thought that the DA guitar that Keith played in 69/70 was one and the same. But I saw a pic back stage of two DA's. Is that right?

Also there is a picture (I think) by Tarle of Jagger strumming, what looks like the 330, sitting by a piano. On the wall behind him are leaning the Stones guitars. An SG, a 335, the Flying V from Exile sessions, and maybe some more. Also one of the little tykes, maybe Marlon is sitting there. But there is a double cutaway guitar leaning there too. There is kind of a glare. and it is hard to tell. It is not an SG, and I dont think it is the DA , but I could be wrong. It almost looks more like a Rick, although that makes no sense.
If someone tells me how t drag pics in the posts w/o using any of the photo sites like bucket I;ll show the pics.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: RobberBride ()
Date: March 2, 2017 09:51

Here is the "normal" image of Jagger and young Jake Weber from "Exile":

[www.sfae.com]


Here (scroll down, on the right side) is the Jagger/Weber outtake from the December 2016 book "The Box":

[www.lagaleriedelinstant.com]


You´ll see the Armstrong easily enough smiling smiley

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: March 2, 2017 10:30



Mick Jagger & Keith Richards, studio, Villa Nellcote, Villefranche sur Mer, 1971 --- Dominique Tarlé,



ROCKMAN

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: March 2, 2017 10:36



Mick Jagger, studio, Villa Nellcote, Villefranche sur Mer, 1971 - --- Dominique Tarlé,


























. 2



ROCKMAN

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Date: March 2, 2017 11:11

Haha, you guys are incredible. Not just the actual pic, but outtakes, illustrating better...LOL. Get it @ IORR. Thank you Robber and Rock.
Once I see the DA w/o the glare it becomes obvious.

But - once again it is just the one Dan Armstrong. In the 70's backstage shot there are clearly two. And btw - they are both guitars. I remember that for a very short while Bill played a DA bass. I read that Bill hated all the Bass guitars that the rest of the band liked for him (the Fender, or the DA; maybe even the SG)

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: March 2, 2017 13:11

Ok, I have seen an Ampeg Dan Armstrong ? I have seen one with a single pickup which is a 1969 .Can anyone give me some info about if it is any good and how does it compare to Keith's



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-03-02 13:45 by TheGreek.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: Bungo ()
Date: March 2, 2017 23:05

Oh my GOD ! One Armstrong or two ..... Who gives a @#$%& ?
There's no Solar Significance to any of this mindless minutia. Get a job. Get a Life. Make something that contributes to humanity. I swear, One more pointless thread like this and I'm gonna blow my @#$%& brains out.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Date: March 2, 2017 23:26

Quote
Bungo
Oh my GOD ! One Armstrong or two ..... Who gives a @#$%& ?
There's no Solar Significance to any of this mindless minutia. Get a job. Get a Life. Make something that contributes to humanity. I swear, One more pointless thread like this and I'm gonna blow my @#$%& brains out.

People are interested in different things. It shouldn't be surprising that guitars is a popular subject in a Stones forum?

There are other threads (or boards). Lighten up, mate.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: LieB ()
Date: March 2, 2017 23:36

Quote
Bungo
Oh my GOD ! One Armstrong or two ..... Who gives a @#$%& ?
There's no Solar Significance to any of this mindless minutia. Get a job. Get a Life. Make something that contributes to humanity. I swear, One more pointless thread like this and I'm gonna blow my @#$%& brains out.

Jeez, why the negativity?
Even if it's not important how many Dan Armstrongs Keith had, it still makes for some interesting conversation. If it wasn't for this thread I wouldn't have seen some of the great unseen Tarlé photos that were linked here. I didn't know there was a new exhibition and a new book on top of that. There is a place for anything Stones related on this board.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: March 2, 2017 23:45

Bungo's never happy ...



ROCKMAN

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Date: March 3, 2017 01:58

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
Bungo
Oh my GOD ! One Armstrong or two ..... Who gives a @#$%& ?
There's no Solar Significance to any of this mindless minutia. Get a job. Get a Life. Make something that contributes to humanity. I swear, One more pointless thread like this and I'm gonna blow my @#$%& brains out.

People are interested in different things. It shouldn't be surprising that guitars is a popular subject in a Stones forum?

There are other threads (or boards). Lighten up, mate.

No, actually now I;m curious: show me a thread worthy of Solar Significance.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-03-08 21:49 by Palace Revolution 2000.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: wonderboy ()
Date: March 3, 2017 04:12

Good topic, even though I know nothing about guitars, and opens the door to a picture I'd never seen before.
Did Mick and Keith ever not look cool in a picture, and they've been snapped thousands of times.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: 2000 LYFH ()
Date: March 3, 2017 05:15

Quote
RobberBride
Here is the "normal" image of Jagger and young Jake Weber from "Exile":

[www.sfae.com]


Here (scroll down, on the right side) is the Jagger/Weber outtake from the December 2016 book "The Box":

[www.lagaleriedelinstant.com]


You´ll see the Armstrong easily enough smiling smiley

Thanks RobberBride

photo by Dominique Tarlé (basement of Nellcôte, 1971)




Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2017-08-07 00:32 by 2000 LYFH.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: March 3, 2017 14:26

That's a cool photo from Villa Nelcotte, the infamous basement music room where some of Exile was worked on and recorded .Look at the guitars sitting there next to what I asume would be a young Marlon Richards ,The viceroy brown Gibson 355, The Gibson SG , (which Taylor used for slide) The Ampeg Dan Armstrong,The white pickguard Gibson Korina Flying V (The one that Keith would play in 1969 slung low like he was a VC Guerilla spraying bullets at the G.I's) This photo has to be from the summer of 72 prior to the infamous breakin(if I should even call it that ) when the scum just walked in and helped themselves to a bunch of guitars when the vibes went bad .Look at the pensive look on Jagger's face as he is trying to work out a lick or a phrase either on the block neck Gibson 335 or a Gibson 330 (they don't look like P-90's from this angle of the photo but I am not sure).That is a very significant and most historic photograph .So I imagine this image is a Dominique Tarle photo?

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: rollmops ()
Date: March 3, 2017 14:36

Great pictures: If you have to lean your guitar against a wall don't do it the way the stones did at Nellcote. The back of the guitar shouldn't be facing the wall. That put pressure on the the neck and the strings.
Rock and roll,
Mops

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: mr_dja ()
Date: March 3, 2017 15:23

Quote
rollmops
Great pictures: If you have to lean your guitar against a wall don't do it the way the stones did at Nellcote. The back of the guitar shouldn't be facing the wall. That put pressure on the the neck and the strings.
Rock and roll,
Mops

Amen and Amen! thumbs up

Even on a "standard" guitar stand I'll sometimes (rarely) turn my guitar around. I much prefer the somewhat taller stands that "hang" a guitar (or sometimes, for secure locations only, the low one's that don't go higher than the body of the guitar) rather than the one's that rest the weight on the neck.

Back on topic: Thanks for sharing the pictures!

Peace,
Mr DJA

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: resotele ()
Date: March 3, 2017 16:27

Quote
TheGreek
Look at the pensive look on Jagger's face as he is trying to work out a lick or a phrase either on the block neck Gibson 335 or a Gibson 330 (they don't look like P-90's from this angle of the photo but I am not sure).That is a very significant and most historic photograph .So I imagine this image is a Dominique Tarle photo?

Isn't the guitar of pensive Mr Jagger an Epi Casino with P-90 ?

The Piano is a Wurlitzer.

Great pic, love this, and guitartalk !

resotele

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: 2000 LYFH ()
Date: March 3, 2017 16:37

Quote
TheGreek
That's a cool photo from Villa Nelcotte, the infamous basement music room where some of Exile was worked on and recorded .Look at the guitars sitting there next to what I asume would be a young Marlon Richards ,The viceroy brown Gibson 355, The Gibson SG , (which Taylor used for slide) The Ampeg Dan Armstrong,The white pickguard Gibson Korina Flying V (The one that Keith would play in 1969 slung low like he was a VC Guerilla spraying bullets at the G.I's) This photo has to be from the summer of 72 prior to the infamous breakin(if I should even call it that ) when the scum just walked in and helped themselves to a bunch of guitars when the vibes went bad .Look at the pensive look on Jagger's face as he is trying to work out a lick or a phrase either on the block neck Gibson 335 or a Gibson 330 (they don't look like P-90's from this angle of the photo but I am not sure).That is a very significant and most historic photograph .So I imagine this image is a Dominique Tarle photo?

That's Tommy Weber's son Jake and the picture (by Dominique Tarlé) is most likely from the summer of 1971. Keith rented it from April 1971 to March 1972, but I think by November 71, they had left and gone to LA to finish Exile. Don't know who was there from Nov 71 to the end of Keith's lease in March 72...

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: RobberBride ()
Date: March 3, 2017 17:13

Quote
2000 LYFH

That's Tommy Weber's son Jake and the picture (by Dominique Tarlé) is most likely from the summer of 1971. Keith rented it from April 1971 to March 1972, but I think by November 71, they had left and gone to LA to finish Exile. Don't know who was there from Nov 71 to the end of Keith's lease in March 72...

Yes yes and yes smiling smiley
Keith arrived on a BA flight on the 5th of April and everybody was out of Nellcote and bound for LA by the 29th of November.
In a letter typed up by assistant June Shelley and signed by Keith on Mars 14th 1974, he writes a recommandation for the housekeeper at Nellcote (Ms Elisabeth Hiemer) where he/somebody states her work period being April 1st 1971 - April 4th 1973.
The end date differs a bit in the folklore, but I´d say this document is pretty solid.
Ms Hiemer had worked at Nellcote for a decade by the time Keith started renting it.
I have always presumed one reason for Keith getting out of the madness of renting the place in 1973 was that the villa changed hands that year.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: March 3, 2017 18:50

Quote
resotele
Quote
TheGreek
Look at the pensive look on Jagger's face as he is trying to work out a lick or a phrase either on the block neck Gibson 335 or a Gibson 330 (they don't look like P-90's from this angle of the photo but I am not sure).That is a very significant and most historic photograph .So I imagine this image is a Dominique Tarle photo?

Isn't the guitar of pensive Mr Jagger an Epi Casino with P-90 ?

The Piano is a Wurlitzer.

Great pic, love this, and guitartalk !

resotele
Very good , thank you for the correction .

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: TheGreek ()
Date: March 3, 2017 18:52

Quote
2000 LYFH
Quote
TheGreek
That's a cool photo from Villa Nelcotte, the infamous basement music room where some of Exile was worked on and recorded .Look at the guitars sitting there next to what I asume would be a young Marlon Richards ,The viceroy brown Gibson 355, The Gibson SG , (which Taylor used for slide) The Ampeg Dan Armstrong,The white pickguard Gibson Korina Flying V (The one that Keith would play in 1969 slung low like he was a VC Guerilla spraying bullets at the G.I's) This photo has to be from the summer of 72 prior to the infamous breakin(if I should even call it that ) when the scum just walked in and helped themselves to a bunch of guitars when the vibes went bad .Look at the pensive look on Jagger's face as he is trying to work out a lick or a phrase either on the block neck Gibson 335 or a Gibson 330 (they don't look like P-90's from this angle of the photo but I am not sure).That is a very significant and most historic photograph .So I imagine this image is a Dominique Tarle photo?

That's Tommy Weber's son Jake and the picture (by Dominique Tarlé) is most likely from the summer of 1971. Keith rented it from April 1971 to March 1972, but I think by November 71, they had left and gone to LA to finish Exile. Don't know who was there from Nov 71 to the end of Keith's lease in March 72...
Thank you for the correction of the youngster sitting there and the date which I should have known better .

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: 2000 LYFH ()
Date: March 3, 2017 18:54

Quote
Bungo
Oh my GOD ! One Armstrong or two ..... Who gives a @#$%& ?
There's no Solar Significance to any of this mindless minutia. Get a job. Get a Life. Make something that contributes to humanity. I swear, One more pointless thread like this and I'm gonna blow my @#$%& brains out.

Your contribution to humanitysmoking smiley

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: Bungo ()
Date: March 4, 2017 00:01

Quote
2000 LYFH
Quote
Bungo
Oh my GOD ! One Armstrong or two ..... Who gives a @#$%& ?
There's no Solar Significance to any of this mindless minutia. Get a job. Get a Life. Make something that contributes to humanity. I swear, One more pointless thread like this and I'm gonna blow my @#$%& brains out.

Your contribution to humanitysmoking smiley

Grrrrrrrrrrr

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Date: March 4, 2017 07:14

Pretty amazing that all this legend surrounding the time at Nellcote really just was a few months in one summer. But I can identify.
Can you imagine being that housekeeper of 10 years at this old stately villa, and used to the ways of the village, and then this foreign tornado settles in with the Heroin, Anita and the rockn roll? "UhI will be taking my 15 minute break now..."

One thing I just now notice in that photo is a guitar leaning in the back, to the right of Jagger. I can't make it out. Looks like f-holes in there.
Where is Mathijs when you need him?

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: xke38 ()
Date: March 4, 2017 11:41

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
I always thought that the DA guitar that Keith played in 69/70 was one and the same. But I saw a pic back stage of two DA's. Is that right?

This one?


Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: 2000 LYFH ()
Date: March 4, 2017 16:30

Quote
RobberBride
Quote
2000 LYFH

That's Tommy Weber's son Jake and the picture (by Dominique Tarlé) is most likely from the summer of 1971. Keith rented it from April 1971 to March 1972, but I think by November 71, they had left and gone to LA to finish Exile. Don't know who was there from Nov 71 to the end of Keith's lease in March 72...

Yes yes and yes smiling smiley
Keith arrived on a BA flight on the 5th of April and everybody was out of Nellcote and bound for LA by the 29th of November.
In a letter typed up by assistant June Shelley and signed by Keith on Mars 14th 1974, he writes a recommandation for the housekeeper at Nellcote (Ms Elisabeth Hiemer) where he/somebody states her work period being April 1st 1971 - April 4th 1973.
The end date differs a bit in the folklore, but I´d say this document is pretty solid.
Ms Hiemer had worked at Nellcote for a decade by the time Keith started renting it.
I have always presumed one reason for Keith getting out of the madness of renting the place in 1973 was that the villa changed hands that year.

OK thanks again RobberBride. Found this article (translated from French to English) by Philippe Dupuy (July 29, 2015)

Nellcote: Elisabeth Hiemer tells:

At the end of winter 1971 Jo Bergman, the administrator of the Rolling Stones office in London, sounded the alarm. Red Alert: the group is in default. In spite of the hits accumulated over the past six years, the stones at the peak of their success and creativity, as well as the celebrity and the incessant touring, are as mowed as on the night of their first concert. The alleged guilty party was soon named: Allen Klein, their American manager, to whom the band had given the full powers without disquieting him from an already disastrous deal with his record company, which put him on the Straw. The shortfall would be £ 16 million. A colossal sum for the time.

The problem is that Klein has locked up his case. Lawyers are formal: no chance of getting any penny from that side. And no need to count, either, on the next album and the tour that will follow to bail out. The British tax authorities are paying 83 to 98% (!) Of the group's income. At this level of levies, they will have to play until the XXII century, just to pay off their debts!
A council of war is gathered at 46A Maddox Street, to develop a strategy. Mick Jagger, now a frequent visitor to the great world, introduces one of his new acquaintances, the Prince Rupert banker Ludwig Ferdinand zu Loewenstein-Wertheim-Freudenberg (known as Prince Rupert), heir to the royal family of Bavaria, who To draw from this bad step. His plan is in two words: fiscal exile. The Stones must flee England and settle abroad before the summer. The destination is quickly found: it will be the south of France.
On April 1, 1971, bassist Bill Wyman and his companion Astrid landed first at Nice airport. They settled in La Bastide St-Antoine in Grasse, followed by guitarist Mick Taylor, his wife Rose and their baby Chloe. Drummer Charlie Watts and his wife Shirley landed at the hotel in Cannes before buying a farm near Arles. Mick Jagger and his fiancée Bianca opt for Mougins. Recent ventures in London, Keith Richards and Anita Pallenberg are investing in Villa Nellcote, a magnificent historic residence overlooking the bay of Villefranche, which Jo Bergman had rented for three years thinking it would suit Mick and Bianca.

Elisabeth Hiemer, housekeeper sees the Richards couple and their two-year-old son, Marlon, one fine morning. For ten years that she reigned over Nellcote, this 41-year-old German, with a strong German accent, has known several tenants. But not so young, nor so disconnected! She did not take offense: "They were very kind and respectful," she recalls. I got along very well with the lady, we spoke German. The relative calm of the first few weeks when the couple lived after Élisabeth Hiemer, "A Family Life on a Normal Holiday," was quickly disturbed by an incessant parade of celebrated or anonymous guests. "I knew some of them," the governess remembers, "but not many. Eric Clapton, John Lennon and Yoko Ono, Gram Parsons and Paul Mc Cartney are among the visitors. Mick Jagger's wedding on May 12 in Saint-Tropez provoked a massive new arrival of guests. "Twenty at the table was a minimum," says Elisabeth, whose main task is now to ensure that the fridges are always full and that the children, more or less left to themselves, are lost Not in the park and do not drown in the bay.

From July, the fiesta, already permanent, becomes uncontrollable. After searching in vain for a recording studio in the area to start working on the new album, the band decided to record in the cellars of the villa. Renamed Café Keith, the house is no longer empty. "A smala of gypsies squatting a Renaissance castle in the humidity of a stuffy summer," summarizes the old child of rock, Philippe Maneuver.

The neighbors, frightened, witness an incessant coming and going of hippies, musicians, groupies, picnickers and dealers, who enter and leave the house, open to the four winds. Every night, the crazy sound of amps fuse through the vasistas of the cellar to the other side of the bay. Incidents multiply. The police took the opportunity to investigate trafficking and use of narcotics. It culminated in October 1973 with a one-year suspended prison sentence and ban on the territory for Keith Richards and Anita Pallenberg. But the lovebirds had already raised the bivouac for a long time, with the rest of the group. At the request of Anita Pallenberg, Elisabeth Hiemer followed the Rolling Stones in Los Angeles for the beginning of the 1972-1973 world tour, before finding Nellcote deserted, then resigning for a career in luxury hotels at Monaco

In her small, clean apartment in Roquebrune-Cap-Martin, where some pictures of the time are carefully arranged in a drawer, she still remembers this summer of madness with a smile: "It was a time of great freedom, I have a very good memory of it. It was much more amusing than anything I had ever known. "

[www.ipernity.com]

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: LieB ()
Date: March 4, 2017 19:03

Quote
resotele
Isn't the guitar of pensive Mr Jagger an Epi Casino with P-90 ?
That's definitely a Gibson ES-330. Possibly the one Keith played in Hyde Park '69, which may have been Brian's 330 that he used a lot around '67-68?

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: LieB ()
Date: March 4, 2017 19:05

Quote
Palace Revolution 2000
One thing I just now notice in that photo is a guitar leaning in the back, to the right of Jagger. I can't make it out. Looks like f-holes in there.
Where is Mathijs when you need him?

It looks like it has binding around the headstock (Les Paul Custom style, just like semi-hollow Gibson to the left). So I'm guessing it's a high-end Gibson ES model, perhaps a 345 or a 355.

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: riffcliche69 ()
Date: March 5, 2017 00:10

Chris Walters' backstage photos from Amsterdam October 9, 1970 show two Dan Armstrongs: one leaning on a wall with a single coil (probably RT,"Rock Treble") capo'd at the fourth fret (for JJF and ROB, the first two songs in every '70 set). Keith is tuning another DA, but it's difficult to tell whether it's the one with the higher output, "humbucker" style pickup (similar to the '69 tour guitar).

Re: Did Keith have TWO Dan Armstrong guitars in '70?
Posted by: Mathijs ()
Date: March 5, 2017 16:37

Keith had at least 4 DA's: the first one used on the 1969 tour had a grey prototype humbucker pickup, but he did use a single coil pickup for some 1969 shows as well. He added a second DA for the 1970 tour, which he used for open G tuning. Both guitars where used for the 1971 tour as well, although it is sketchy how he used them -it seems mostly for standard tuning, with the open G tuned one as a backup for the Gibson Les Paul Custom. The DA with prototype pickup can be seen at Nellcote, and according to some sourced he gave the second one away around this time. There are pics of several DA pickups lying around on the basement as well. The Da, or both, was stolen at the Nellcote robbery, and he ordered at least two more for the 1972 tour. He used them for some early shows (probably up to San Francisco), but he did not like the production models (which were different to the 1969 models with much slimmer neck profiles), and did not use them up to 2014 or so, when he played a Japanese made DA on some occasions.

Mathijs

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