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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-11 19:07 by UrbanSteel.

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UrbanSteel
Probably as all Jay Williams cds, a cd-r.

In that case... I am sorry for tioms.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-11 19:06 by UrbanSteel.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-13 10:32 by tioms.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-11 11:25 by UrbanSteel.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-13 10:33 by tioms.

Additional comment to my former reply.

When I had my previous website many years ago, I posted many CDs on that site.
Also I have had posted the Naugthy Songs CD and I (and several other collectors) were convinced that this was a real collectors-item.
However in the passed few years it turned out that this CD was not a real Virgin promo but a fake CD.
At that time I couldn't use my website anymore !
It seems now that the note on the CD (25 copies made) has made many victims. Me and a lot of other collectors has spend a lot of money on that !
I am sorry that I couldn't warn you for this before.

Andre

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rollingandre
Additional comment to my former reply.

When I had my previous website many years ago, I posted many CDs on that site.
Also I have had posted the Naugthy Songs CD and I (and several other collectors) were convinced that this was a real collectors-item.
However in the passed few years it turned out that this CD was not a real Virgin promo but a fake CD.
At that time I couldn't use my website anymore !
It seems now that the note on the CD (25 copies made) has made many victims. Me and a lot of other collectors has spend a lot of money on that !
I am sorry that I couldn't warn you for this before.

Andre

Hate to tell you, Andre, but the info from your old web site is still alive not only on that russian site (mentioned on page 1 of this thread) but also here
[rollingstonesvaults.blogspot.pt]

tioms, that answer - risk of collection - is a brilliant one for a dealer but not appropriate for a respectful seller. Sorry, you was fooled.

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-11 11:25 by UrbanSteel.

...very useful thread..!!! Warning ! collectors !!!!

There is an e-bay seller based in the UK (Derbyshire) who is currently selling 'promo' CD singles of Just Your Fool and Hate To See You Go. Is there any way of telling whether these are genuine or fake?

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-13 10:33 by tioms.

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martinw
There is an e-bay seller based in the UK (Derbyshire) who is currently selling 'promo' CD singles of Just Your Fool and Hate To See You Go. Is there any way of telling whether these are genuine or fake?

In 99% cases so called promo CD or promo CD-R on ebay are fakes. Just ask the seller to provide matrix # and ifpi codes for that CD (he claims CD but it is clearly a CD-R). Like those I posted on page 1 of this thread.

If there are no codes and no numbers - that is not a CD pressed on industrial equipment but custom made CD-R. And custom made CD-R could be easily faked nowadays by a high school kid or a student with minimal knowledge of Photoshop and access to a printer and I-net.

If you do not have connections in music business and do not have trustful source - just stay away from the promos from ebay.

Moreover, I do not understand why one would burn a CD-R for companies these days (waste of time and money). It is easier to make a zip file (a track + info list in pdf) and send it to radio station or journal via dropbox or email.

Another thing about CD-R's - they won't live long. Just read wiki and you'll see that the probability the CD-R will not play in a few years due to decomposition/degradation of the dye is rather high.
[en.wikipedia.org]
This is pure waste of money for collector's. Although this is a kind of protection for record companies. The radio station do not need to return CD-R back as long as they would become faulty in a few years due to natural causes.

Anyway, the last 2 promos whose identities could be confirmed are official silvers:
The Rolling Stones
2009 Remasters Promo
Year: 2009
Record Label: Polydor
Catalogue #: RS2009 001
Matrix #: RS2009001 02
SID Mould Code: IFPI 0442
SID Mastering Code: IFPI L136



The Rolling Stones
The Singles 1971-2006 Sampler
Year: 2011
Record Label: Polydor
Catalogue #: RSBOX1
Matrix #: RSBOX1 01
SID Mould Code: IFPI AEW35
SID Mastering Code: Sony DADC LY34


PS. Apparently, there was another one - Japanese only promo for Ladies and Gentlemen but I have no info on that one.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-01 11:53 by ironbelly.

Thanks very much for the info ironbelly - very useful. So record companies no longer send out CD-Rs at all? In other words, if it's a CD-R it's a fake?

I rarely buy promos from e-bay - I usually buy direct from dealers - it's just that this particular seller seems to have an endless supply - always a suspicious sign...

However, what about 'watermarked' CD-Rs? I have a watermarked promo called the "Dance Mix Sampler", with 11 dance mixes from the singles box set. It is obviously a CDR but it was sent out from the Peer Music Group to a known DJ. I bought it from a well-known dealer at a record fair in London. So is this likely to be a fake because it is a CD-R?

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martinw
Thanks very much for the info ironbelly - very useful. So record companies no longer send out CD-Rs at all? In other words, if it's a CD-R it's a fake?

I rarely buy promos from e-bay - I usually buy direct from dealers - it's just that this particular seller seems to have an endless supply - always a suspicious sign...

However, what about 'watermarked' CD-Rs? I have a watermarked promo called the "Dance Mix Sampler", with 11 dance mixes from the singles box set. It is obviously a CDR but it was sent out from the Peer Music Group to a known DJ. I bought it from a well-known dealer at a record fair in London. So is this likely to be a fake because it is a CD-R?

I do not have connections in music business and can not be 100% sure that the record companies stop with CD-R's. Actually, rollingandre claims there were official promo CD-R's for certain tracks from Blue and Lonesome. He also provided elsewhere the nicknames of those ebay sellers who sell the fakes - Luckylarryspromoshack, Promorecordsltd, Eazeism and Equinox4774 all located in the UK.

I am just saying that at the moment the production of CD-R's for promo purposes is outdated. And CD-R's with custom booklet or info sheet are very easy to fake. That is it.

If you know a dealer and if you trust him - it is up to you. You can buy or you can skip.

PS. We should ask urbansteel to provide the list of known fake CD-R's that were made by Jay Williams. Pleeeeese .

To martinw,

Yes, besides the regular official 16 track promo CD for the singles box, there was indeed an official promo CDr acetate release with 11 tracks called Dance Mixes Sampler, (only a few were done ).
Anybody seen my baby (Armands rolling steelo mix)
Harlem shuffle (NY mix)
Mixed emotions (Chris Kimsey's 12" )
One hit to the body (London mix)
Out of control (In hand with Fluke mix)
Rain fall down (Asley Beedle heavy mix)
Rock and a hard place (dance mix)
Saint of me (deep dish club mix)
Terrifying (12" mix)
Winning ugly VI (London mix)
You got me rocking (perfecto mix)

However, it is difficult to say if you have the original acetate or a fake CDr.
Anyway, the songs provided on this CDr is a nice track-listing.

To rollingandre

Yes, this is the one I have, with the same tracks but in a different order to your list. On the (paper) sleeve it states "This CD has been watermarked to prevent unauthorized copying [...] the inaudible watermark enables us to trace this audio back to you". I've just copied it onto my PC with no problem, but I've no idea how to tell whether it has a watermark or not.

The CD itself is printed, no paper stuck-on label. The plastic sleeve has a sticker with the release date and contact details of the rep at Peer Music Group. The paper sleeve is numbered, with the name of the recipient (a DJ).

I would have been suspicious if I had seen a seemingly limitless supply coming up on e-bay every week, as per the recent Just Your Fool and Hate To See You Go "promos", but I've not seen any for sale anywhere, certainly not on e-bay (not yet anyway!) I didn't pay a lot for it - less than £20 if I remember correctly. I suppose one way to check would be if there are a number of copies with the same number and recipient's name. But as you say, with these CD "acetates" you can never be 100% sure if they are fake or not...

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Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-13 10:34 by tioms.

Tioms I'm sorry about your wrong deal. Unfortunately some people care more about fast money than humanity. I believe they won't be happy in the end. I'm talking spiritual here so I don't want to go any deeper. People are allowed to make their own choices. Enjoy your collection and The Stones. Cheers.