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bye bye johnny

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Hairball
- Keith has pretty much gone AWOL since his meeting with Mick back in December (or was it January?) as far as a new Stones album

February. Keith was reported to be in the studio in some interviews promoting the upcoming No Filter dates.

Thanks for the clarification bye bye johnny - the timeline of this supposed new album has become a quagmire. Imagine what the historians are going to have to go through!
Three dynamite riffs. 40 demos. Hit the wall. B&L. Start from scratch. Getta Grip. England Lost. Stalled out. Mick in studio (with Matt Clifford). Ronnie dabbles on bass alone.
Keith in studio alone playing piano. Keith back in studio (claims Mick will be there in half hour). Charlie still has no idea, etc., etc.

I think it was Rocky who put together a more detailed and definitely more accurate timeline somewhere in this thread - will be interesting to see the final timeline if and when the album ever gets finished.

It would also be nice if the Stones would release a new single for the upcoming tour! They released One More Shot and Doom and Gloom for the GRRRR album/tour, so why not one now?

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
Hairball

Quote
bye bye johnny

Quote
Hairball
- Keith has pretty much gone AWOL since his meeting with Mick back in December (or was it January?) as far as a new Stones album

February. Keith was reported to be in the studio in some interviews promoting the upcoming No Filter dates.

Thanks for the clarification bye bye johnny - the timeline of this supposed new album has become a quagmire. Imagine what the historians are going to have to go through!
Three dynamite riffs. 40 demos. Hit the wall. B&L. Start from scratch. Getta Grip. England Lost. Stalled out. Mick in studio (with Matt Clifford). Ronnie dabbles on bass alone.
Keith in studio alone playing piano. Keith back in studio (claims Mick will be there in half hour). Charlie still has no idea, etc., etc.

I think it was Rocky who put together a more detailed and definitely more accurate timeline somewhere in this thread - will be interesting to see the final timeline if and when the album ever gets finished.

It would also be nice if the Stones would release a new single for the upcoming tour! They released One More Shot and Doom and Gloom for the GRRRR album/tour, so why not one now?

___________________________________


I am tellin ya! It is like a friggin mystery. Clues and tidbits lead to nothing concrete and there seems to be something going on underneath it all but at the same time nothing at all?


We found out from Charlie they were in the studio more than were knew though. Even had a big session ..<before>.. Blue & Lonesome December 2015 sessions .. We knew absolutely nothing about that .. Not even a rumor.. no nothing at all about it until he candidly came out in saying that over two years later (in a recent interview with Ronnie).


They could of been in the studio more than we know of so far .. even in Rockys Timeline (which was very insightful none-the-less).

Quote
They could of been in the studio more than we know of so far .. even in Rockys Timeline (which was very insightful none-the-less).

According to Don Was, they were on the studio about 6 weeks since December 2015, and that's including the B&L sessions, it should be 7 weeks now with the last one with Mick and Keith, but they were on the studio only 3 or 4 days, not more than that.

Don Was says it probably won’t be ready this year.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-04-04 03:01 by georgelicks.

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Hairball
[Imagine what the historians are going to have to go through!

Easy job: almost 3 years (and counting) of nothing much happening.
The tough part: sum up all the twists and turns in this thread ...

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Hairball
Three dynamite riffs. 40 demos.

Big question: will their identity ever been revealed? - Actually, that's a serious remark. I'd really like to know what's the deal with those 40 songs, and I'd like to be convinced by evidence that those 3 riffs are really dynamite.

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Hairball
It would also be nice if the Stones would release a new single for the upcoming tour! They released One More Shot and Doom and Gloom for the GRRRR album/tour, so why not one now?

I remember something posted (by georgelicks?) about 1,5-2 years ago that reportedly there is a great "soul ballad" among the new tunes (not sure if it was a ballad but I remember it had soul in it). If that's the only proper song so far, I'm not sure if it would be wise to put it out before the rest of the album is done. That way, it might never get finished and all we got is a new single with a Mick song and a (dynamite?) Keith riff on the flip side instead of a full album.

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georgelicks
According to Don Was, they were on the studio about 6 weeks since December 2015, and that's including the B&L sessions

This almost sounds like the better part of these 6 (or 7) studio weeks still happened back in 2015, and ever since both of them only listened to the stuff in a studio a few times but nothing much went on otherwise.

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georgelicks

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They could of been in the studio more than we know of so far .. even in Rockys Timeline (which was very insightful none-the-less).

According to Don Was, they were on the studio about 6 weeks since December 2015, and that's including the B&L sessions, it should be 7 weeks now with the last one with Mick and Keith, but they were on the studio only 3 or 4 days, not more than that.

Don Was says it probably won’t be ready this year.

______________________________


Roger that. When and where did Don Was say it probably won't be ready this year? Just wonderin?

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doitywoik

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Hairball
[Imagine what the historians are going to have to go through!

Easy job: almost 3 years (and counting) of nothing much happening.
The tough part: sum up all the twists and turns in this thread ...

The answer shall be eventually be revealed - it was originally going to be on page 200 of this thread, but now I'm leaning towards page 250.

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doitywoik

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Hairball
Three dynamite riffs. 40 demos.

Big question: will their identity ever been revealed? - Actually, that's a serious remark. I'd really like to know what's the deal with those 40 songs, and I'd like to be convinced by evidence that those 3 riffs are really dynamite.

Two of Mick's demos may been revealed under the guise of Getta Grip and England Lost (if you recall Keith rejected them), while Keith's three riffs remain a mystery.
Hopefully he has them recorded on tape, otherwise back to the drawing board!

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doitywoik

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Hairball
It would also be nice if the Stones would release a new single for the upcoming tour! They released One More Shot and Doom and Gloom for the GRRRR album/tour, so why not one now?

I remember something posted (by georgelicks?) about 1,5-2 years ago that reportedly there is a great "soul ballad" among the new tunes (not sure if it was a ballad but I remember it had soul in it). If that's the only proper song so far, I'm not sure if it would be wise to put it out before the rest of the album is done. That way, it might never get finished and all we got is a new single with a Mick song and a (dynamite?) Keith riff on the flip side instead of a full album.

Valid point, and I suppose it would be a gamble to release anything due to the reasons you describe. And while it might be a great "soul" tune as georgelicks hinted at some time back, they might be better off releasing something that has a classic Stonesy rocking vibe to it if they were to release anything at all. There's also the chance it really stinks - not sure that would be a good selling point for any future release.

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doitywoik

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georgelicks
According to Don Was, they were on the studio about 6 weeks since December 2015, and that's including the B&L sessions

This almost sounds like the better part of these 6 (or 7) studio weeks still happened back in 2015, and ever since both of them only listened to the stuff in a studio a few times but nothing much went on otherwise.

Ah yes, 2015 was a great year (spoken in the voice of a jaded disillusioned old man still waiting for a new Stones album in 2018).
Crosseyed Heart was released and the future was bright for something original and brand new from the Stones. But then things quickly ran amok (hitting the wall, etc) eventually turning in to the quagmire it's become today.
Like a Twilight Zone episode....or a conundrum with no answer, or as IanBillen put it: "there seems to be something going on underneath it all but at the same time nothing at all"?

The Twilight Zone




"You've just crossed over...into the new album thread..."

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-04-04 04:36 by Hairball.

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Roger that. When and where did Don Was say it probably won't be ready this year? Just wonderin?

On a radio interview a couple of weeks ago, ABC radio I think.

It's also the same time frame for Keith's latest solo album, 4 years between the first session in 2011 and the album released in 2015.

Also Universal is looking forward to 2019 now.

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georgelicks

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Roger that. When and where did Don Was say it probably won't be ready this year? Just wonderin?

On a radio interview a couple of weeks ago, ABC radio I think.

It's also the same time frame for Keith's latest solo album, 4 years between the first session in 2011 and the album released in 2015.

Also Universal is looking forward to 2019 now.

___________________________________



Gotcha I actually remember now. He said something along the lines of 'you probably wont see it this year'... I remember now.



I still think it will come later this year .. but you know .. thats just me ha

Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

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keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

Because, since the beginning, they think (Mick and Keith) they are the songwriters and nobody else.
I think somewhere that for them Ronnie is always the last one, a 1/2 stones.
Darryl Jones is nothing he is the "Polish plumber". European people will know what it means! Currently,
Ronnie is the best songwriter they could get.
It's like you would prefer to throw away a old raincoat rather to give it to an homeless.

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ouroux58

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keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

Because, since the beginning, they think (Mick and Keith) they are the songwriters and nobody else.
I think somewhere that for them Ronnie is always the last one, a 1/2 stones.
Darryl Jones is nothing he is the "Polish plumber". European people will know what it means! Currently,
Ronnie is the best songwriter they could get.
It's like you would prefer to throw away a old raincoat rather to give it to an homeless.

Its an ego thing i guess, but its a missed opportunity not to bring Ronnie into the fold, Ronnie on the strength of his last album should have earn't the respect of the glimmers, i think a trio of writers would work great, they could bounce off each other. Ronnie probably knows he is on his game right now, must be frustrating to be the one still wearing L plates at 70 years of age.

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keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

__________________________________


There is no writers block situation that I know of. They hit a wall on one friggin song in 2015 .. According to Don Was the song writing done between them since has been 'something to behold'.

The writers block theory was created on these message boards .. nothing more.

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IanBillen

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keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

__________________________________


There is no writers block situation that I know of. They hit a wall on one friggin song in 2015 .. According to Don Was the song writing done between them since has been 'something to behold'.

The writers block theory was created on these message boards .. nothing more.

13 years without a Stones album is a block in a way.
Don is always going to say the material coming is great, he has to to keep his job, he's not going to say its crap is he.

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keithsman

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IanBillen

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keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

__________________________________


There is no writers block situation that I know of. They hit a wall on one friggin song in 2015 .. According to Don Was the song writing done between them since has been 'something to behold'.

The writers block theory was created on these message boards .. nothing more.

13 years without a Stones album is a block in a way.
Don is always going to say the material coming is great, he has to to keep his job, he's not going to say its crap is he.

_______________________________


As far as original material goes ... Not putting out an album isn't due to writers block .. it was laziness, neglect, and unwillingness.

Keith has done things on his own .. Mick has done things .. As a group they did not (except for two original songs).

...new album should be ready...

Least they could do is release a single to go with the tour.

I don't take any notice of what don was mumbles he talks in riddles.
As for universal another clueless bunch.

Charlie said he can remember doing 3/4 sessions on the new album,
Yet he can't remember any songs lol, other than the album is not any good.

It's like Charlie and Ronnie have been told not to say much about it.
I've said before a new tour plus a new album go well together,it's good
Business.

Quote
keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

Mick and Keith are seemingly unable and/or unwilling to work together anymore as far as writing and recording original material. Individually they can each write/record original music on their own, but when it comes to collaborating together as in the good old days, there is certainly some sort of block preventing them from doing so. Two original songs in 13+ years is the obvious proof, and when you have Keith rejecting certain Mick tunes while they are together (see Getta Grip), it's clear they have a different vision of what the Jagger/Richards songwriting team means these days.

As for Keith working with Ronnie it would probably have to be seperate from Mick and the Stones. So imagine the Richards/Wood Project - this could be the best thing since the invention of sliced bread. Seeing as Ronnie has upped his game in the guitar department in recent years (carrying most of the load during live shows, etc), he could actually play the guitar parts in the studio that Keith comes up with yet is physically unable to play anymore, while Keith can stick with some simple rhythm playing. Keith may be able to hear these classic killer riffs in his head, yet is unable to play them, so he could hum them to Ronnie who would then replicate them on guitar. There might be another intricate CYHMK opening riff swimming around in Keith's head - he just needs someone to see it come to life. Add the fact that Ronnie is a decent songwriter/singer on his own terms, teaming up with Keith could be the answer - the Richards/Wood project. Meanwhile, Mick can continue to write with Matt Clifford and Dave Stewart......while the Stones continue to stay in limbo. Thought for sure after the No Filter tour (pt.1) they would have had some pep in their step and a newfound willingness to collaborate and get back to the new album, but so far it doesn't seem that way. Maybe after No Filter pt.2?

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-04-04 20:36 by Hairball.

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Hairball

Quote
keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

Mick and Keith are seemingly unable and/or unwilling to work together anymore as far as writing and recording original material. Individually they can each write/record original music on their own, but when it comes to collaborating together as in the good old days, there is certainly some sort of block preventing them from doing so. Two original songs in 13+ years is the obvious proof, and when you have Keith rejecting certain Mick tunes while they are together (see Getta Grip), it's clear they have a different vision of what the Jagger/Richards songwriting team means these days.

As for Keith working with Ronnie it would probably have to be seperate from Mick and the Stones. So imagine the Richards/Wood Project - this could be the best thing since the invention of sliced bread. Seeing as Ronnie has upped his game in the guitar department in recent years (carrying most of the load during live shows, etc), he could actually play the guitar parts in the studio that Keith comes up with yet is physically unable to play anymore, while Keith can stick with some simple rhythm playing. Keith may be able to hear these classic killer riffs in his head, yet is unable to play them, so he could hum them to Ronnie who would then replicate them on guitar. There might be another intricate CYHMK opening riff swimming around in Keith's head - he just needs someone to see it come to life. Add the fact that Ronnie is a decent songwriter/singer on his own terms, teaming up with Keith could be the answer - the Richards/Wood project. Meanwhile, Mick can continue to write with Matt Clifford and Dave Stewart......while the Stones continue to stay in limbo. Thought for sure after the No Filter tour (pt.1) they would have had some pep in their step and a newfound willingness to collaborate and get back to the new album, but so far it doesn't seem that way. Maybe after No Filter pt.2?

I really don't think Keith's physical limitations affect him in the Studio. I trust his chord thoughts transfer well to his guitar playing. As he stated he has strong songs ready to go.....also listen to his collaboration with Bettye Lavette. They worked out two wonderful arrangements, stuff that I would welcome on a new Stones album although not rip snortin' rockers. Damn shame hopefully we'll be rewarded at some point.

Perhaps true Maindefender, but I was really referring to lead guitar and some of the kick ass riffage he used to come up with, not just chord progressions/thythm playing which he could still play as I stated above. That said, I did enjoy Keith's tasty riffage on Crosseyed Heart (some of which was recorded a decade ago or more?) as well as the more recent tidbits he added to the Bettye Lavette cover tunes, but it's a fact that his skills have become somewhat limited whether live or in the studio compared to the old days - especially live when he only gets one stab at it. On the other hand, Ronnie has stepped up (playing all the leads on B&L excpet for when Clapton steps in)and a collaboration between he and Keith would be a welcome addition to the gamut of the Stones' related releases. If Mick can get Charlie and Ronnie to play on his recent solo tunes, seems only fair they should do the same with Keith - they could call it the Keith Richards Trio.




_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-04-05 05:19 by Hairball.

Quote
Hairball

Quote
keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

Mick and Keith are seemingly unable and/or unwilling to work together anymore as far as writing and recording original material. Individually they can each write/record original music on their own, but when it comes to collaborating together as in the good old days, there is certainly some sort of block preventing them from doing so. Two original songs in 13+ years is the obvious proof, and when you have Keith rejecting certain Mick tunes while they are together (see Getta Grip), it's clear they have a different vision of what the Jagger/Richards songwriting team means these days.

As for Keith working with Ronnie it would probably have to be seperate from Mick and the Stones. So imagine the Richards/Wood Project - this could be the best thing since the invention of sliced bread. Seeing as Ronnie has upped his game in the guitar department in recent years (carrying most of the load during live shows, etc), he could actually play the guitar parts in the studio that Keith comes up with yet is physically unable to play anymore, while Keith can stick with some simple rhythm playing. Keith may be able to hear these classic killer riffs in his head, yet is unable to play them, so he could hum them to Ronnie who would then replicate them on guitar. There might be another intricate CYHMK opening riff swimming around in Keith's head - he just needs someone to see it come to life. Add the fact that Ronnie is a decent songwriter/singer on his own terms, teaming up with Keith could be the answer - the Richards/Wood project. Meanwhile, Mick can continue to write with Matt Clifford and Dave Stewart......while the Stones continue to stay in limbo. Thought for sure after the No Filter tour (pt.1) they would have had some pep in their step and a newfound willingness to collaborate and get back to the new album, but so far it doesn't seem that way. Maybe after No Filter pt.2?

_______________________________________



They just wrote together a few times for this album. To Keiths defense he said he was interested in 'sitting down and working on songs together rather than playing with Micks Demos in a room with him .. that's my ball there .. '


We know they wrote together for this album. We have no idea if any of Micks songs are being used. So lets see how this album goes .. but lets not say they are <still> unwilling to work together. They were <unwilling / neglectful / lazy> for a while but they are atleast in motion 'together' on an album again.

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
Hairball

Quote
keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

Mick and Keith are seemingly unable and/or unwilling to work together anymore as far as writing and recording original material. Individually they can each write/record original music on their own, but when it comes to collaborating together as in the good old days, there is certainly some sort of block preventing them from doing so. Two original songs in 13+ years is the obvious proof, and when you have Keith rejecting certain Mick tunes while they are together (see Getta Grip), it's clear they have a different vision of what the Jagger/Richards songwriting team means these days.

As for Keith working with Ronnie it would probably have to be seperate from Mick and the Stones. So imagine the Richards/Wood Project - this could be the best thing since the invention of sliced bread. Seeing as Ronnie has upped his game in the guitar department in recent years (carrying most of the load during live shows, etc), he could actually play the guitar parts in the studio that Keith comes up with yet is physically unable to play anymore, while Keith can stick with some simple rhythm playing. Keith may be able to hear these classic killer riffs in his head, yet is unable to play them, so he could hum them to Ronnie who would then replicate them on guitar. There might be another intricate CYHMK opening riff swimming around in Keith's head - he just needs someone to see it come to life. Add the fact that Ronnie is a decent songwriter/singer on his own terms, teaming up with Keith could be the answer - the Richards/Wood project. Meanwhile, Mick can continue to write with Matt Clifford and Dave Stewart......while the Stones continue to stay in limbo. Thought for sure after the No Filter tour (pt.1) they would have had some pep in their step and a newfound willingness to collaborate and get back to the new album, but so far it doesn't seem that way. Maybe after No Filter pt.2?

_______________________________________

They just wrote together a few times for this album. To Keiths defense he said he was interested in 'sitting down and working on songs together rather than playing with Micks Demos in a room with him .. that's my ball there .. '

We know they wrote together for this album. We have no idea if any of Micks songs are being used. So lets see how this album goes .. but lets not say they are unwilling to work together. They were for a while but they are atleast in motion 'together' on an album again.

I did say "seemingly unable and/or unwilling to work together anymore" meaning something is preventing them from completing the task at hand. While on the surface it might seem as if they are "willing" to work together, spending a couple of hours together in a studio is not what I would call a very productive team like the good old days. And when all they have to show for the "hard" work they've done together is many backing tracks, half done stuff, too much uneven stuff and average songs - well that tells me they are incapable of doing what they used to do. And f you recall, that's why the Blue and Lonesome covers album came into the picture - because they couldn't get anything properly together. Anyhow, maybe after the upcoming mini-tour they can put their differences aside and put their shoulders to the wheel (deja vu as I said the same prior to the last mini tour). We're now stretching into 14 years which might be a good title for the new album when it's released in 2019 - "14 and Counting"...

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
Hairball

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
Hairball

Quote
keithsman
Considering the apparent writers block situation, i wonder why Ronnie isn't used by Mick or Keith to help out.
Neither Keith or Mick seem willing to work with Ronnie on writing , i thought how strange, Keith writes with Steve Jordan , Mick writes with Dave Stewart, why not Ronnie.
I'm talking about the last 13 years not before that, i know Ronnie contributes on various tracks from the past, but now more than ever Ronnie is needed.

Its just that Ronnie's last solo album was great, and so was Keith's , these two should get in the studio and work together imho.

Or would that cause WW3, i just don't see what they got to lose, Mick and Keith are not working together in the studio anyway, otherwise we would have an album by now.

Mick and Keith are seemingly unable and/or unwilling to work together anymore as far as writing and recording original material. Individually they can each write/record original music on their own, but when it comes to collaborating together as in the good old days, there is certainly some sort of block preventing them from doing so. Two original songs in 13+ years is the obvious proof, and when you have Keith rejecting certain Mick tunes while they are together (see Getta Grip), it's clear they have a different vision of what the Jagger/Richards songwriting team means these days.

As for Keith working with Ronnie it would probably have to be seperate from Mick and the Stones. So imagine the Richards/Wood Project - this could be the best thing since the invention of sliced bread. Seeing as Ronnie has upped his game in the guitar department in recent years (carrying most of the load during live shows, etc), he could actually play the guitar parts in the studio that Keith comes up with yet is physically unable to play anymore, while Keith can stick with some simple rhythm playing. Keith may be able to hear these classic killer riffs in his head, yet is unable to play them, so he could hum them to Ronnie who would then replicate them on guitar. There might be another intricate CYHMK opening riff swimming around in Keith's head - he just needs someone to see it come to life. Add the fact that Ronnie is a decent songwriter/singer on his own terms, teaming up with Keith could be the answer - the Richards/Wood project. Meanwhile, Mick can continue to write with Matt Clifford and Dave Stewart......while the Stones continue to stay in limbo. Thought for sure after the No Filter tour (pt.1) they would have had some pep in their step and a newfound willingness to collaborate and get back to the new album, but so far it doesn't seem that way. Maybe after No Filter pt.2?

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They just wrote together a few times for this album. To Keiths defense he said he was interested in 'sitting down and working on songs together rather than playing with Micks Demos in a room with him .. that's my ball there .. '

We know they wrote together for this album. We have no idea if any of Micks songs are being used. So lets see how this album goes .. but lets not say they are unwilling to work together. They were for a while but they are atleast in motion 'together' on an album again.

I did say "seemingly unable and/or unwilling to work together anymore" meaning something is preventing them from completing the task at hand. While on the surface it might seem as if they are "willing" to work together, spending a couple of hours together in a studio is not what I would call a very productive team like the good old days. And when all they have to show for the "hard" work they've done together is many backing tracks, half done stuff, too much uneven stuff and average songs - well that tells me they are incapable of doing what they used to do. And f you recall, that's why the Blue and Lonesome covers album came into the picture - because they couldn't get anything properly together. Anyhow, maybe after the upcoming mini-tour they can put their differences aside and put their shoulders to the wheel (deja vu as I said the same prior to the last mini tour). We're now stretching into 14 years which might be a good title for the new album when it's released in 2019 - "14 and Counting"...

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Guy wait a second .. you may be fabricating a bit here (with all due respect). A couple hours? Lol. Guy That is what you are saying occurred but they said they were together writing one on one much more than a couple hours.


They could of spent a month putting together songs for all we know? Keith said he and Mick spent a whole week together in a room at one point ...not this year but last year alone .. As well they met again this year one-on-one ... I seriously doubt they would fly to meet each other for a couple hours. Im sure they spent enough time together. It doesnt take them six weeks to record the basis for 12-15 songs (in which Don Was said they were in the studio). Six weeks recording or writing songs is a long time. That isn't just jerking around. A simple band could at least record the basis for a couple albums in that amount of time. Im sure at least a third of that was spent on the writing process.


The couple hours thing isn't fair because we at least know they spent plenty more than that according to Keith and Don Was. A 'couple hours' .. come on now.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2018-04-05 05:33 by IanBillen.

Yes Ian I realize all of that and it was a bit of an exaggeration. So to clear it up, from georgelicks:

"According to Don Was, they were on the studio about 6 weeks since December 2015, and that's including the B&L sessions,
it should be 7 weeks now with the last one with Mick and Keith, but they were on the studio only 3 or 4 days, not more than that".

So a couple of hours, a week or two, or even six or seven weeks - when you put it in the context of nearly 14 years it amounts to nearly nothing. And when all they have from that entire 13+ year period is One More Shot/Doom and Gloom along with many backing tracks, half done stuff, too much uneven stuff and average songs, it makes you wonder whether they're even capable of working together anymore, or if their hearts are even in it to begin with - maybe a combo of both.

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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2018-04-05 06:06 by Hairball.

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Hairball
The answer shall be eventually be revealed - it was originally going to be on page 200 of this thread, but now I'm leaning towards page 250.

My bid is 251

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Hairball
And while it might be a great "soul" tune as georgelicks hinted at some time back, they might be better off releasing something that has a classic Stonesy rocking vibe to it if they were to release anything at all. There's also the chance it really stinks - not sure that would be a good selling point for any future release.

You’re right of course. Another question, and I’m wondering about this ever since I read it, is what “soul” actually means in that context. Not sure if “soul” still means what it used to mean. Like, back in the 70, when I was still young and promising , “Rhythm and Blues” stood for quite different music that it stands for today (back then, today’s R’n’B would have been considered schmaltzy crooning, or fake yodeling, maybe).

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Hairball
Like a Twilight Zone episode....or a conundrum with no answer, or as IanBillen put it: "there seems to be something going on underneath it all but at the same time nothing at all"?

"You've just crossed over...into the new album thread..."

><

Big Bob Z, ever the prophet, accurately summed up the current situation already more that 50 years ago:

“Something is happening here
“But you don’t know what it is,
“Do you, Mister Jones?”

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IanBillen
They hit a wall on one friggin song in 2015 .. According to Don Was the song writing done between them since has been 'something to behold'.

The writers block theory was created on these message boards .. nothing more.

Just one song? I rather understood it was about the whole approach to the album-to-be (which Keith thought might change after the B&L experience).
Don Was - what else should he say? If their song writing is 'something to behold', how come the Universal execs think there’s “too much uneven stuff and average songs”? And what is to behold - that they still can do Stones by numbers?
On the other hand, imagine Mick and Keith reporting to a bunch of 20-year-old Universal jerks, only to be told their song writing isn’t quite up to par - how humiliating is that?
Writer’s block - I think keithsman had a point saying that “13 years without a Stones album is a block in a way”. Not sure if “writer’s block” is the right term, also not sure about “laziness”, rather seems like there’s no real inner creative urge for quite a while.

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terry
Charlie said he can remember doing 3/4 sessions on the new album,
Yet he can't remember any songs lol, other than the album is not any good.

I think that's Chawlie's mumbling that caused some confusion here, he didn't say "I don't like the songs" but "I don't write the songs", me thinks. But it's quite relieving to see that also the native speakers here can't always catch what the guys say.

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terry
It's like Charlie and Ronnie have been told not to say much about it.

Wouldn't be surprising, no? I guess whatever they might say would be considered unfitting. Well, not so sure about Charlie. Seems like they didn’t make him wise, so he couldn’t spill no beans anyways.

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terry
I've said before a new tour plus a new album go well together,it's good
Business.

For sure, and many among us hope for it, I dare say. However, it hasn’t happened in 20 years (and counting).

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Hairball
So imagine the Richards/Wood Project - this could be the best thing since the invention of sliced bread.

Indeed. Actually, we had this situation already, the result was Dirty Work. Despite the general criticism, in my book DW is a good album (and, funnily, got rave reviews back then over here). There’s a general consensus that DW lacked Mick’s input, and I’m ready to admit that DW would have benefitted from more involvement from Mick’s side. Since they appear to be on (more or less) good personal terms at present, Mick might get more involved now, and we might get a really good album.

I know the question of Ronnie’s having no part in the song writing has been discussed many times, and I am among the ones who think that the occasional Ronnie song wouldn’t hurt. Ronnie said that in the course of the Paris sessions, Mick asked him if he had a tune to offer (I’d still like to know what became of that). But that does not seem to have happened this time round (yet)?).

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doitywoik
Big Bob Z, ever the prophet, accurately summed up the current situation already more that 50 years ago:

“Something is happening here
“But you don’t know what it is,
“Do you, Mister Jones?”

Indeed...also seems like it could have been written for Charlie "where is the new album?" Watts:

“Something is happening here
“But you don’t know what it is,
“Do you, Mister Watts?”



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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

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Hairball
Indeed...also seems like it could have been written for Charlie "where is the new album?" Watts:

“Something is happening here
“But you don’t know what it is,
“Do you, Mister Watts?”

It's a shame that this option had escaped me!

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shortfatfanny
...new album should be ready...

"It MY album, on this laptop! MINE! Not yours, MINE! You want it? Only from my cold, dead hands!"

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Hairball
Yes Ian I realize all of that and it was a bit of an exaggeration. So to clear it up, from georgelicks:

"According to Don Was, they were on the studio about 6 weeks since December 2015, and that's including the B&L sessions,
it should be 7 weeks now with the last one with Mick and Keith, but they were on the studio only 3 or 4 days, not more than that".

So a couple of hours, a week or two, or even six or seven weeks - when you put it in the context of nearly 14 years it amounts to nearly nothing. And when all they have from that entire 13+ year period is One More Shot/Doom and Gloom along with many backing tracks, half done stuff, too much uneven stuff and average songs, it makes you wonder whether they're even capable of working together anymore, or if their hearts are even in it to begin with - maybe a combo of both.

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I ..very ..very ..very much agree that their hearts were not into it for a good ten years or more. I know it was a tough ten years for them but at the same time ...They never showed any signs of seriously getting together in the studio.


I know you were exaggerating but still I think they spent more than a few days or a week together writing as you may of or still think.


Guys like them can write several songs in two or three weeks. Sure ..many wouldn't make the cut and many would simply be ideas ..but they can and have been known to write one to three songs a day at times (such as The A Bigger Bang Sessions).

I think / HOPE Mick & Keith are consciously looking / trying to make this an especially strong album with the substance versus simply doing it by the numbers as has been for the last four or five RS albums.

It seems instead of mass amounts of material and then cherry picking the best ones then recording them this time they are working on stuff and trying to get the best possible results / versions of select songs. At least that is sort of what was indicated per Charlie, Don Was, and Ronnie if you read between the lines.

Well, for what it's worth, I think the last few albums, from Voodoo through to Bigger, have been good. They could've all had the potential to have been great albums, but too many songs and a lack of judicial editing may have been the cause of this.

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IanBillen
It seems instead of mass amounts of material and then cherry picking the best ones then recording them this time they are working on stuff and trying to get the best possible results / versions of select songs. At least that is sort of what was indicated per Charlie, Don Was, and Ronnie if you read between the lines.

Read between the lines lol...

Here's the way I read it:

Charlie doesn't even know the status of the new album, Don Was will always say it's great no matter what, and Ronnie has no input with the writing, so whatever any of them say should be taken with a grain of salt.
It would be nice to hear some real news directly from the two that really matter and the two who we've been talking about - Mick and Keith. Mick has been silent while Keith has been as vague as ever.

All we really know is there are many backing tracks, half done stuff, too much uneven stuff and average songs....
Sounds like there's mass amounts they're attempting to narrow down, so it doesn't sound like "they're trying to get the best possible results / versions of select songs".

We also know that Don Was has stated the new album probably won't be finished until 2019 which isn't that far away in Stones years...14 and counting...

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Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......