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Stoneage
It is not difficult to understand why Keith was negative about any Jagger solo effort: He wanted the band to keep together. His number one priority was the band. Not some members solo efforts.
And to be fair, Keith was asked about Micks solo albums in the interview - he didn't just start spouting off about them, and he gave an honest answer. Not sure what else to expect from him - a lie?
The interviewer even egged Keith on a bit by stating he himself had never listened to Jagger’s solo albums. Keiths honest reply was “Nor have I. I’ll leave it at that.” Very simple, honest, and diplomatic.
On the other hand, I recall Mick being asked about some of Keith's solo material, and he dismissed it by saying "the drums are too loud" or something along those lines. Fair enough.
The fact is, they don't see eye to eye on many things, and it takes two to tango...clearly it's become dysfunctional, hence the reason they hit the wall and still haven't overcome it.
Well, if you managed to read the full interview you've linked to, there's a bit more than just a diplomatic "Oh, I never listened to them":
When asked about Jagger’s own solo material (the singer has released four solo albums), Richards said: “They had something to do with ego. He really had nothing to say.”
“What did he have, two albums? ‘She’s the Boss’ and ‘Primitive Cool’?” asked Richards. Jagger also released ‘Wandering Spirit’ in 1993 and ‘Goddess in the Doorway’ in 2001.
When the GQ journalist said he had never listened to Jagger’s solo albums, Richards replied: “Nor have I. I’ll leave it at that.”
The guitarist also said that he would never release an album for monetary gain and that creativity was the sole purpose behind his releases: “I never thought of making records as a way of being famous or making a statement. I just want to make good records with good musicians, to play with the best and learn.”
With a friend like that, you don't need enemies... Glorifying his own solo efforts by dismissing his partner's work - sorry, it just stinks.
I did read the entire interview, and he was honest with his ALL of his answers. Clearly you disagree with his opinion, but he can't please everyone with everything he says. I happen to admire and appreciate his honesty.
And who ever said they were friends? That friendship ended decades ago, and now they're nothing more than business partners keeping the business alive by touring the oldies and making millions in the process.
Ain't no use in crying about it.........
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HairballQuote
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Stoneage
It is not difficult to understand why Keith was negative about any Jagger solo effort: He wanted the band to keep together. His number one priority was the band. Not some members solo efforts.
And to be fair, Keith was asked about Micks solo albums in the interview - he didn't just start spouting off about them, and he gave an honest answer. Not sure what else to expect from him - a lie?
The interviewer even egged Keith on a bit by stating he himself had never listened to Jagger’s solo albums. Keiths honest reply was “Nor have I. I’ll leave it at that.” Very simple, honest, and diplomatic.
On the other hand, I recall Mick being asked about some of Keith's solo material, and he dismissed it by saying "the drums are too loud" or something along those lines. Fair enough.
The fact is, they don't see eye to eye on many things, and it takes two to tango...clearly it's become dysfunctional, hence the reason they hit the wall and still haven't overcome it.
Well, if you managed to read the full interview you've linked to, there's a bit more than just a diplomatic "Oh, I never listened to them":
When asked about Jagger’s own solo material (the singer has released four solo albums), Richards said: “They had something to do with ego. He really had nothing to say.”
“What did he have, two albums? ‘She’s the Boss’ and ‘Primitive Cool’?” asked Richards. Jagger also released ‘Wandering Spirit’ in 1993 and ‘Goddess in the Doorway’ in 2001.
When the GQ journalist said he had never listened to Jagger’s solo albums, Richards replied: “Nor have I. I’ll leave it at that.”
The guitarist also said that he would never release an album for monetary gain and that creativity was the sole purpose behind his releases: “I never thought of making records as a way of being famous or making a statement. I just want to make good records with good musicians, to play with the best and learn.”
With a friend like that, you don't need enemies... Glorifying his own solo efforts by dismissing his partner's work - sorry, it just stinks.
I did read the entire interview, and he was honest with ALL of his answers. Clearly you disagree with his opinion, but he can't please everyone with everything he says. I happen to admire and appreciate his honesty.
And who ever said they were friends? That friendship ended decades ago, and now they're nothing more than business partners keeping the business alive by touring the oldies and making millions in the process.
Ain't no use in crying about it.........
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Hairball
Critiquing Keith's behavior...as if he's in kindergarten with his report card saying things like:
"Mischievous", "speaks out of turn", "makes derogatory remarks about others work", "can sometimes be mean", "not a team player", ..........
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Rocky Dijon
I would say the onstage camaraderie, when it happens, is honest. They love the adoration and success their shared career has brought them. Stage actors can love being part of a successful show that runs for years. As soon as they're off stage, they go their separate ways. It's not really any different unless you're selling an image to the public as Keith does. We, as fans, pretend The Stones are still a band when they really haven't been a true band in nearly 40 years.
An illustration of how artful Keith is at manipulating the press: The X-Pensive Winos were an active backing band very briefly in the late 1980s and early 1990s, but Keith has always spoken of them in the press as if they're a real unit still out there waiting for him to have time to reunite. He plays a couple songs and manages to get media coverage for what? A reissue of a failed album that will barely sell. That is successfully using your fame.
The Stones are old men who grew old together and share fame together. That's why Chuck, Darryl, and Bernard will never be Stones. That's why Steve will never be a Stone. It's not about who you replaced and for how many decades. The Stones, as a real working band, are and have been a thing of the past. The men who used to work together every year touring and recording and creating new works, became men who have actually worked together for less than half of the past 37 years. Consider that in light of the fact that Bill Wyman wasn't even in the Stones for 30 years.
They've done a great job exploiting their brand and using it to market new works, but new works grew less common as well. All this noise about Mick or Keith not selling as solo artists misses the point that the Stones haven't sold well for decades either. Their last successful original album was nearly twenty years ago. Their last commercial success with hit singles was 33 years ago. Today they know well it has been over 40 years since the public really cared about them as artists.
Every act with longevity experiences a decline and gradual descent from the public consciousness. They did an amazing job of maximizing the celebration of their catalog and staying in the public eye as celebrities. The proof of that is how their concert sales have dwarfed their record sales for the past 33 years.
That isn't opinion, it's an honest assessment. All the noise about solo works or a new Stones album is just the chatter of fans like all of us. Their actual relevance has been over for a long time. We're just here for the long haul because we haven't noticed everyone else has left the party and gone home. When the music finally stops, we lose a major part of how we have chose to distract ourselves for decades. Waiting for something to come out of somewhere, but we'll find out it slipped away and we didn't even notice.
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Rockman
Yeah thats right retired....
Some people say i got a cute arse ....
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Rockman
WHAT!!!! ... have ya hit a brick wall ...
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Hairball
Looking back at some quotes about the supposed new album...
From Mick in 2016:
"We'll finish the album but I don't know when, because you want it to be really good and everything... I hope it's gonna be a very eclectic album.
I hope some of it's gonna be recognizable Stones and some of it's gonna be some Stones you never heard before, maybe... I was working on it quite recently.
We've got a long way to go, but I think it sounds really great and I'm looking forward to carrying on with that. I hope (next year)
And from Mick again in 2022:
"Keith and I recently had a writing session in which we had some good ideas. But until all these approaches have really become an album, we still have a lot of work ahead of us".
And then Keith in a recent interview - when asked about the supposed new album he starts mumbling away about God knows what:
"Well, as far as status goes, I can’t really report anything. But look, really all I want you guys to know is that it’s now …
what is it I want you guys to know? I mean, I just love working. If I can’t work with one lot, I’ll work with the other".
Still, as a fan it's good to still have a bit of hope for a new album even against seemingly impossible odds...maybe it will be ready by the 70th anniversary which is only a decade away.
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Taylor1
Mick has no interest in creating new music.0ne album of new material in 24 years and that album is in my opinion their worst.Even on Bridges Mick and Keith didn’t collaborate much on songs
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Taylor1
Mick has no interest in creating new music.0ne album of new material in 24 years and that album is in my opinion their worst.Even on Bridges Mick and Keith didn’t collaborate much on songs
I don’t think that Mick really has lost his interest in creating new music. He has said repeatedly that he is writing new stuff or jotting down ideas all the time and I see no reason not to believe him. The question is rather the state of completion, perhaps. I wouldn’t be surprised if a good deal of the stuff is in a state such that he could at least sing the songs to you at a camp fire. Under a Neil Young approach that would be enough to put them out on a record. Like, gather the boys, do a run-through of the songs, record that and release the first takes right away because of their spontaneity, or so. It doesn’t work that simple way under a Stones approach, and sometimes (often?) possibly for the better so.
What seems to be gone is the urge, need, willingness (or whatever) to seriously get to work with the rest of the group to work on the songs in the studio up to the point where something is ready for a potential release. And then, what do we really know about the actual inner dynamics of the group? Apparently Mick tried that in 2016 (?) (or whenever) and it didn’t work out even after several attempts (a/k/a the brick wall situation). If Mick had become totally unproctive, or unwilling to be productive, he hadn’t done “Strange Game”, which apparently he could come up with rather quickly and at quite short notice (at least, this is what it sounded like in the interviews/statements). If it doesn’t happen with the Stones, he has other outlets available and it’ll happen elsewhere.
What’s possibly gone is the urge (or whatever) to really produce and release everything he writes. Perhaps it is quite sufficient for Mick these days to write stuff just for his own enjoyment (he has said so in interviews anyway). There’s certainly no economic need for him to regularly supply the market with new product in order to be able to pay the rent.
Another question is how much encouragement there is from the rest of the group. The Mick-Keith situation aside, has Ronnie or Charlie ever called up Mick (or Keith) saying let’s get together and record a few songs, or do a new album? And seen from the (external) perspective of the Stones as an actual group/band, could Ronnie ever have called up Mick or Keith saying, I’ve got a few new songs and I would like to record them with you? He could have done so possibly if it were about a solo album but never for a Stones record.
And what do we know about the actual writing partnership? Our general understanding seems to be that back in the good old days the two of them got together to write together whereas nowadays everyone brings more or less finished songs to the studio (and Mick more so than Keith, in Mick’s case even demos where the others just have to fill in their parts). But have they really ever been writing together, apart perhaps from the super-early days? Doesn’t really seem so?
Returning to Mick’s creativity, he has said often enough that he doesn’t want to do a pure Stones-by-the-numbers album, whereas Keith is not fond of forcedly following (what is perceived of as) recent trends and trying to be modern-ish. (Ronnie possibly doesn’t care as long as he is paid for the gig.) But this cannot be a recent problem. Thinking of e.g. Miss You, which certainly had more to do with Mick’s attitude than Keith’s, did Keith at first oppose the idea of doing a disco-ish song? Or did he like the idea? Or did he just go along with it because the rest of the album was not like that?
Since it is hard for us to know what Mick’s ideas for the new album would have been it is impossible to judge whether Keith did well when opposing them or whether he blocked exciting fresh approaches. I can understand Mick’s interest in also doing somehing like Might As Well Get Juiced (although I personally don’t find it a great song/version and always skip it when listening to Bridges) but a whole album like that? Maybe OK as an artistic experiment but then rather in the vein of Lou Reed’s Metal Machine Music. Or did Keith oppose every tiny little thing, even if it would have helped a song?
We will possibly never know. Meanwhile we can address more pressing questions such as which members of the Stones have actually been portrayed by Cynthia Plaster Caster, or the like.
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DandelionPowderman
It's possible to be both creative and prolific, but choose not to release stuff the way the record industry is these days...
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NashvilleBlues
Nah. The newest Dylan album is very good. Don't need a trained ear to like it. It's my favorite Dylan album since 1997's Grammy winning Time Out of Mind. Unlike most bands/acts, he is better live now than any other time (6x) I've seen him in the last 25 years.
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NashvilleBlues
Nah. The newest Dylan album is very good. Don't need a trained ear to like it. It's my favorite Dylan album since 1997's Grammy winning Time Out of Mind. Unlike most bands/acts, he is better live now than any other time (6x) I've seen him in the last 25 years.
I agree with you there (with all points). But I sacrified Dylan for the sake of argument here...
- Doxa