Quote
IanBillen

Quote
doitywoik

Quote
IanBillen

Universal will release the album when I say they shall. The Stones will record the rest of it as soon as I call them to get over here.

It's just that simple folks -

You da man, Ian!

_________________________________



Thanks Mr. Doitywoik! I will arrange that you and Hairball get free passes to some of the sessions!

Thanks for clarifying the "pissy Chuck" story above, and the fact that Keith was the peacemaker.
And not that anything's wrong with Chuck's playing on B&L, in fact it fits right in, but wondering how it might have sounded in it's original form?

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
Hairball

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
doitywoik

Quote
IanBillen

Universal will release the album when I say they shall. The Stones will record the rest of it as soon as I call them to get over here.

It's just that simple folks -

You da man, Ian!

_________________________________



Thanks Mr. Doitywoik! I will arrange that you and Hairball get free passes to some of the sessions!

Thanks for clarifying the "pissy Chuck" story above, and the fact that Keith was the peacemaker.
And not that anything's wrong with Chuck's playing on B&L, in fact it fits right in, but wondering how it might have sounded in it's original form?

______________________________________


I don't know. Musicians very very rarely seek out another to do the same parts if the original was up to their specs (because there is absolutely no point).

It's Matt Clifford .. I'm sure it sounded ok? My guess is they were going to try to use Chuck and if was ok they would have him on a few songs. Perhaps Chucks playing was more fitting. Like Chuck or hate Chuck .. he is a good keys player He plays well.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-03 08:00 by IanBillen.

So didn’t Chuck Leavell with his whining destroy the authenticity of blue and lonesome? They were hyping it as recorded live with no overdubs and some songs even done in one take yet this a-hole acts like a little child and they let him put overdubbed keyboards on the thing?
He’s an average keyboard player at best yet the Stonrs are catering to him,why?
If you ever wonder why the band will never be what they once were this is one of the reasons-old and soft doesn’t make good rock and roll,
The real Stones would,ve bounced his ass so fast for even opening his yap ..it boggles the mind what goes on with them sometimes these days.

...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

Quote
IanBillen
Thanks Mr. Doitywoik! I will arrange that you and Hairball get free passes to some of the sessions!

Yeah, and a CD with the good songs that didn't make the album because them blockheads couldn't agree ...

Quote
lem motlow
So didn’t Chuck Leavell with his whining destroy the authenticity of blue and lonesome? They were hyping it as recorded live with no overdubs and some songs even done in one take yet this a-hole acts like a little child and they let him put overdubbed keyboards on the thing?
He’s an average keyboard player at best yet the Stonrs are catering to him,why?
If you ever wonder why the band will never be what they once were this is one of the reasons-old and soft doesn’t make good rock and roll,
The real Stones would,ve bounced his ass so fast for even opening his yap ..it boggles the mind what goes on with them sometimes these days.

YOU NAILED IT!!!!

Quote
Rip This
...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

He's no auxiliary band member...he is the musical director--BIG difference which has been impossible to not notice or ignore.....Chuck L has a lot of sway over these guys .....they got lazy.....let someone else do all the things the Glimmer Twins used to do themselves.. the little things....like..oh I don't know...uh determine the setlist maybe..set tempos..pacing..beginning and end of songs..The twins abdicated to Chuck a long time ago. For better or worse is up to each fan...but for me...worse.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-04 02:00 by diverseharmonics.

Quote
Rip This
...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

_____________________________________


Chuck is not an 'auxiliary' musician Lol. He's not just some guy they know from playing on stage with them on tour. He's fairly good friends with each of The Stones. He has Mick Jaggers phone number and vice-versa yo .. He knows their families etc. As well.. he helps pick the set-list. He also lends some of his musical insight to their live shows. Chuck is 'in' as they say with them.. like it or not.


I'm not here to get on a soapbox or simply here to stand up for Chuck Leavell .. but we do need to get some things straight folks. Chuck is better than simply being 'average' (?) as someone else mentioned here (?). He's pretty versatile and he has a decent intuition for rootsy music. I'm not saying Matt Clifford is second to Chuck .. I'm not saying Ian Mglagan or Billy Preston is second to Chuck. I'm simply saying he's one of the best keyboard players in the world.. (top 50) and .....he plays with the Rolling Stones (<there's reason for that).



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-04 02:02 by IanBillen.

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
Rip This
...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

_____________________________________


Chuck is not an 'auxiliary' musician Lol. He's not just some guy they know from playing on stage with them on tour. He's fairly good friends with each of The Stones. He has Mick Jaggers phone number and vice-versa yo .. He knows their families etc. As well.. he helps pick the set-list. He also lends some of his musical insight to their live shows. Chuck is 'in' as they say with them.. like it or not.


Chuck is also better than simply being average as someone else mentioned here (?). He's pretty versatile and he has a decent intuition for rootsy music. I'm not saying Matt Clifford is second to Chuck .. I'm not saying Ian Mglagan or Billy Preston is second to Chuck. I'm simply saying he's one of the best keyboard players in the world.. (top 50) and .....he plays with the Rolling Stones.

using that logic---Karl Denson is a world-class player because he plays with the Stones?!....ummmm no.

Quote
diverseharmonics

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
Rip This
...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

_____________________________________


Chuck is not an 'auxiliary' musician Lol. He's not just some guy they know from playing on stage with them on tour. He's fairly good friends with each of The Stones. He has Mick Jaggers phone number and vice-versa yo .. He knows their families etc. As well.. he helps pick the set-list. He also lends some of his musical insight to their live shows. Chuck is 'in' as they say with them.. like it or not.


Chuck is also better than simply being average as someone else mentioned here (?). He's pretty versatile and he has a decent intuition for rootsy music. I'm not saying Matt Clifford is second to Chuck .. I'm not saying Ian Mglagan or Billy Preston is second to Chuck. I'm simply saying he's one of the best keyboard players in the world.. (top 50) and .....he plays with the Rolling Stones.

using that logic---Karl Denson is a world-class player because he plays with the Stones?!....ummmm no.

_______________________________________


So Chuck Leavell isn't a world class musician then...? Is that where we are .. Is that what it has come to? You might not care for Chuck .. and you may not like the fact that The Stones rely on him more than their other Keyboard players (I dislike that situation as well) .. BUT mate .. take it from me. Chuck Leavell is 'world class' - Lol (he has been for decades).


I like the fact that he doesn't sound technically perfect. He has a little slop to his play. Adds some Authenticity. I like that fact. Sure.. he can't boogie like Stu .. but Chuck Leavell is indeed a world classs keyboard player, my friend (IMO that's not even debatable).



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-04 02:14 by IanBillen.

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
diverseharmonics

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
Rip This
...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

_____________________________________


Chuck is not an 'auxiliary' musician Lol. He's not just some guy they know from playing on stage with them on tour. He's fairly good friends with each of The Stones. He has Mick Jaggers phone number and vice-versa yo .. He knows their families etc. As well.. he helps pick the set-list. He also lends some of his musical insight to their live shows. Chuck is 'in' as they say with them.. like it or not.


Chuck is also better than simply being average as someone else mentioned here (?). He's pretty versatile and he has a decent intuition for rootsy music. I'm not saying Matt Clifford is second to Chuck .. I'm not saying Ian Mglagan or Billy Preston is second to Chuck. I'm simply saying he's one of the best keyboard players in the world.. (top 50) and .....he plays with the Rolling Stones.

using that logic---Karl Denson is a world-class player because he plays with the Stones?!....ummmm no.

_______________________________________


So Chuck Leavell isn't a world class musician then...? Is that where we are .. Is that what it has come to? You might not care for Chuck .. and you may not like the fact that The Stones rely on him more than their other Keyboard players (I dislike that situation as well) .. BUT mate .. take it from me. Chuck Leavell is 'world class' - Lol (he has been for decades).


I like the fact that he doesn't sound technically perfect. He has a little slop to his play. Adds some Authenticity. I like that fact. Sure.. he can't boogie like Stu .. but Chuck Leavell is indeed a world classs keyboard player, my friend (IMO that's not even debatable).

yes it is debateable..world class?!...well..he's no slouch but...but I never said he wasn't good...what I mean is-he has too much power in the band...and over them as well...The Stones are in danger of becoming sidemen in their own group...sidemen in a band of sidemen.

Quote
diverseharmonics
he has too much power in the band...and over them as well...The Stones are in danger of becoming sidemen in their own group...sidemen in a band of sidemen.

Chuck Leavell and His Rolling Stones?

That's laughable.

He just does the things any good producer would do -- keeps the band grounded, keeps the music organized.

Above all else, he was recommended to the Stones by Ian Stewart.

Keeping him on is like a lasting tribute to Stu.

For the most part Chuck has added nothing worthwhile or memorable to the Stones. Yes he and Mick call the shots to what's played at live shows, and yes he counts off the songs "1,2,3,4",
But overall his playing is very bland on stage - there's nothing unique about it (unless you consider plink/plonk unique). And studio-wise he's basically an anonymous session man.
Not really his fault as he's somewhat restrained by the confines of the band and the tunes they play, but one wonders if he's part of the reason their albums have been supbar since he joined.

In contrast to the old days with the Allman Brothers after Duane died...Chuck had a voice within the band and was really something special.

The Allman Brothers Band - Jessica




_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
diverseharmonics

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
diverseharmonics

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
Rip This
...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

_____________________________________


Chuck is not an 'auxiliary' musician Lol. He's not just some guy they know from playing on stage with them on tour. He's fairly good friends with each of The Stones. He has Mick Jaggers phone number and vice-versa yo .. He knows their families etc. As well.. he helps pick the set-list. He also lends some of his musical insight to their live shows. Chuck is 'in' as they say with them.. like it or not.


Chuck is also better than simply being average as someone else mentioned here (?). He's pretty versatile and he has a decent intuition for rootsy music. I'm not saying Matt Clifford is second to Chuck .. I'm not saying Ian Mglagan or Billy Preston is second to Chuck. I'm simply saying he's one of the best keyboard players in the world.. (top 50) and .....he plays with the Rolling Stones.

using that logic---Karl Denson is a world-class player because he plays with the Stones?!....ummmm no.

_______________________________________


So Chuck Leavell isn't a world class musician then...? Is that where we are .. Is that what it has come to? You might not care for Chuck .. and you may not like the fact that The Stones rely on him more than their other Keyboard players (I dislike that situation as well) .. BUT mate .. take it from me. Chuck Leavell is 'world class' - Lol (he has been for decades).


I like the fact that he doesn't sound technically perfect. He has a little slop to his play. Adds some Authenticity. I like that fact. Sure.. he can't boogie like Stu .. but Chuck Leavell is indeed a world classs keyboard player, my friend (IMO that's not even debatable).

yes it is debateable..world class?!...well..he's no slouch but...but I never said he wasn't good...what I mean is-he has too much power in the band...and over them as well...The Stones are in danger of becoming sidemen in their own group...sidemen in a band of sidemen.

_____________________________________________________



Well Look I don't care for the situation entirely either. But YES ... Chuck Leavell is world class my friend. Look at his resume:

The Allman Brothers ... Eric Clapton .. The Black Crows .. John Mayer .. David Gilmore .. George Harrison ... The Rolling Stones ..(to name a handful). They aren't choosing him simply because he's decent me bruh? That's not to mention the Georgia Hall of Fame etc. (you know ... right along side of Ray Charles .. Otis Redding .. James Brown .. those type of folks) or any awards or anything besides that.

>>With respect to you but ........YES he's friggin 'world class' lol .. Being hired by the likes of those people makes you exactly that.



Edited 4 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-04 04:23 by IanBillen.

Quote
diverseharmonics
...The Stones are in danger of becoming sidemen in their own group...sidemen in a band of sidemen.

Mick becoming Chuck's sideman? Mick becoming anybody's sideman? No, I don't see that, not by a long chalk. Neither Keith. Maybe Ronnie and Charlie are sidemen of sorts - to Mick. Mick certainly would have liked to have Keith as his sideman too but it didn't quite work out, somehow ...

Nevertheless Chuck must be giving them something they didn't/don't find (or expect) in others, otherwise they wouldn't have him for 35(?) years now. I don't think it's about being the best keyboard player in the world (and, how to define that anyways?). Apparently he can "organize" them musically in rehearsals and on stage in a way that doesn't piss any of them off (which is possibly an art in itself). Whether he has much of a say when it comes to songwriting or choosing songs for the new album I don't know (possibly not really). I believe he got a writing co-credit for one song on my old Undercover LP, though (I remember an interview in which one of the Glimmers said that Chuck came up with a bridge in one of the songs), but to judge from the quality of the material on Undercover, they must have been quite desparate back then anyway ...

To my ears, Chuck works out quite OK when playing organ. On the piano, too much plink-plonk at times. He's very capable when it comes to butchering the intro of Brown Sugar ...

Quote
doitywoik

Quote
diverseharmonics
...The Stones are in danger of becoming sidemen in their own group...sidemen in a band of sidemen.

Mick becoming Chuck's sideman? Mick becoming anybody's sideman? No, I don't see that, not by a long chalk. Neither Keith. Maybe Ronnie and Charlie are sidemen of sorts - to Mick. Mick certainly would have liked to have Keith as his sideman too but it didn't quite work out, somehow ...

Nevertheless Chuck must be giving them something they didn't/don't find (or expect) in others, otherwise they wouldn't have him for 35(?) years now. I don't think it's about being the best keyboard player in the world (and, how to define that anyways?). Apparently he can "organize" them musically in rehearsals and on stage in a way that doesn't piss any of them off (which is possibly an art in itself). Whether he has much of a say when it comes to songwriting or choosing songs for the new album I don't know (possibly not really). I believe he got a writing co-credit for one song on my old Undercover LP, though (I remember an interview in which one of the Glimmers said that Chuck came up with a bridge in one of the songs), but to judge from the quality of the material on Undercover, they must have been quite desparate back then anyway ...

To my ears, Chuck works out quite OK when playing organ. On the piano, too much plink-plonk at times. He's very capable when it comes to butchering the intro of Brown Sugar ...

___________________________________________



You are spot on. It's not about him being into the live set.. it's about Chuck getting on with and adding some structure to the group in a live set.


I'm not saying Chuck is the very best or even top ten keyboard players in the world (probably top 50 ...based on his versatility and his live show adaptability and understanding). He is most def World class though.

'World Class' doesn't always mean top ten .. (although it could) .. World Class means working for or with the top named people in your field (internationally) and being regarded by some of those people as well as well recognized by the industry internationally.


Mr. DW Your assessment of Chuck Leavell and why The Stones have him and his role was spot on, Sa!



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-04 18:57 by IanBillen.

I recall at Desert Trip intently watching Keith from the pit when he began to play(or attempting to play) the intro to Little T&A, and much to my dismay there was Chuck in the back corner buffering and enhancing the riff on keyboards. Like the wizard of Oz behind the curtain (or Blondie under the stage?), Chuck was pulling strings and making it happen - but he wasn't hidden or hiding it, he actually was grinning from ear to ear as if he wrote the riff himself! Had Chuck not been there to help, the riff might have sounded like a messed up opening riff to Start Me Up (or a number of other trainwrecks), so in that sense Chuck is needed to keep things on the right track so to speak. But when I hear the raunchy opening riff from the studio version (or earlier live versions) vs. the sanitized version from Desert Trip, it's a bit sad. Chucks version made it sound like a lounge tune with a lullaby vibe, or like a carnival ride with balloons and cotton candy vibe - it just didn't have the guts or balls. Wish he would back off in cases like this, but again without him might have sounded like a cacophony of out of tune strings from Keith. For better or worse, that's what the Stones have become, and as fans that's what we're stuck with.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
Hairball
I recall at Desert Trip intently watching Keith from the pit when he began to play(or attempting to play) the intro to Little T&A, and much to my dismay there was Chuck in the back corner buffering and enhancing the riff on keyboards. Like the wizard of Oz behind the curtain (or Blondie under the stage?), Chuck was pulling strings and making it happen - but he wasn't hidden or hiding it, he actually was grinning from ear to ear as if he wrote the riff himself! Had Chuck not been there to help, the riff might have sounded like a messed up opening riff to Start Me Up (or a number of other trainwrecks), so in that sense Chuck is needed to keep things on the right track so to speak. But when I hear the raunchy opening riff from the studio version (or earlier live versions) vs. the sanitized version from Desert Trip, it's a bit sad. Chucks version made it sound like a lounge tune with a lullaby vibe, or like a carnival ride with balloons and cotton candy vibe - it just didn't have the guts or balls. Wish he would back off in cases like this, but again without him might have sounded like a cacophony of out of tune strings from Keith. For better or worse, that's what the Stones have become, and as fans that's what we're stuck with.

__________________________________________


This is the drawback. At times when chuck needs to chime in because of shakey starts .. It sounds Vegas-like ... It's also the reason many do not approve of Chuck. However their stage performance and show has changed so much since 1981 that he is needed.


You kno ..What ya gonna do? .. When I saw them on Zipcode I can honestly say this .. the guitars were huge .. and the sound was bare bones. I was blown away. It soundfed like I was listening to them play in a garage.. just basically the four of em but the sound was this Huuuge wall of guitar driven mix. I could hear everything but it wasn't too clean .. or glossy ... just clear. It was fantastico!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-07-05 08:56 by IanBillen.

God I feed dumb. I clicked on this thread for the first time in a few months to see if there was news about a new album.

Yeah Shotteeee…....its still The Billen & Ball Show ….. hhhhaaaaaaaaaaaa



ROCKMAN

Quote
Shott
God I feed dumb. I clicked on this thread for the first time in a few months to see if there was news about a new album.

News is: no news. It's in the works in some way or other, or so say several involved parties. Chuck Leavell's most recent estimate is it might be ready by Spring 2019 but I wouldn't bet my ass. Also, Ian still has to check the material and approve of it.

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
Rip This
...lem i'd take a pass/chill man....I can't imagine that either MJ or KR is all that invested in placating an auxiliary band member... ....that would indicate they didn't care about the product and I think they do.....more than they need to...probably....the record speaks for itself.

_____________________________________


Chuck is not an 'auxiliary' musician Lol. He's not just some guy they know from playing on stage with them on tour. He's fairly good friends with each of The Stones. He has Mick Jaggers phone number and vice-versa yo .. He knows their families etc. As well.. he helps pick the set-list. He also lends some of his musical insight to their live shows. Chuck is 'in' as they say with them.. like it or not.


I'm not here to get on a soapbox or simply here to stand up for Chuck Leavell .. but we do need to get some things straight folks. Chuck is better than simply being 'average' (?) as someone else mentioned here (?). He's pretty versatile and he has a decent intuition for rootsy music. I'm not saying Matt Clifford is second to Chuck .. I'm not saying Ian Mglagan or Billy Preston is second to Chuck. I'm simply saying he's one of the best keyboard players in the world.. (top 50) and .....he plays with the Rolling Stones (<there's reason for that).

whatever your argument, they may placate or listen to a reasonable request from a long time collaborator or band member, but CL is not core 4 and he wouldn't/couldn't get away with a hissy fit or demand the likes described. ( i doubt he'd even do that which accounts for his longevity )..KR and esp MJ ain't giving up that voice no matter how you want to slice it.

Quote
doitywoik

Quote
Shott
God I feed dumb. I clicked on this thread for the first time in a few months to see if there was news about a new album.

News is: no news. It's in the works in some way or other, or so say several involved parties. Chuck Leavell's most recent estimate is it might be ready by Spring 2019 but I wouldn't bet my ass. Also, Ian still has to check the material and approve of it.

______________________________________



Right-o .. Don't forget to remind me ... (may slip my mind ..)

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
doitywoik

Quote
Shott
God I feed dumb. I clicked on this thread for the first time in a few months to see if there was news about a new album.

News is: no news. It's in the works in some way or other, or so say several involved parties. Chuck Leavell's most recent estimate is it might be ready by Spring 2019 but I wouldn't bet my ass. Also, Ian still has to check the material and approve of it.

______________________________________



Right-o .. Don't forget to remind me ... (may slip my mind ..)

I'll get back to you when we've reached page 250.

Nice to see Mick's busy working out ideas for the new Stones album here, though I have a feeling Keith might veto it and Mick will have to release it as solo release.

Mick Jagger




Look forward to a dance remix.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
Hairball
Nice to see Mick's busy working out ideas for the new Stones album here, though I have a feeling Keith might veto it and Mick will have to release it as solo release.

Mick Jagger




Look forward to a dance remix.

___________________________________



Ah-Ha! ..and you were losing hope... Now we have proof they are even working on the material while on tour .. ... (not sure it sounds as promising as I would of liked it to? .. .....)

Didn't the people at Universal (or whoever) indicate that some of the material needed some more work?

Quote
doitywoik
Didn't the people at Universal (or whoever) indicate that some of the material needed some more work?

______________________________________


Yes .. and Chuck Leavell said recently that it def needed more work but one is also def in the the works.


Although I'm certainly kidding about Mick working on the material while on tour ..


However he always writes .. possibly may conjure up a song idea or two to try out when they get in the studio again.

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
doitywoik
Didn't the people at Universal (or whoever) indicate that some of the material needed some more work?

______________________________________


Yes .. and Chuck Leavell said recently that it def needed more work but one is also def in the the works.


Although I'm certainly kidding about Mick working on the material while on tour ..


However he always writes .. possibly may conjure up a song idea or two to try out when they get in the studio again.

I was actually referring to Mick's new demo, see the link posted by Hairball

Quote
Hairball
Nice to see Mick's busy working out ideas for the new Stones album here, though I have a feeling Keith might veto it and Mick will have to release it as solo release.

Mick Jagger

Quote
doitywoik

Quote
IanBillen

Quote
doitywoik
Didn't the people at Universal (or whoever) indicate that some of the material needed some more work?

______________________________________


Yes .. and Chuck Leavell said recently that it def needed more work but one is also def in the the works.


Although I'm certainly kidding about Mick working on the material while on tour ..


However he always writes .. possibly may conjure up a song idea or two to try out when they get in the studio again.

I was actually referring to Mick's new demo, see the link posted by Hairball

Quote
Hairball
Nice to see Mick's busy working out ideas for the new Stones album here, though I have a feeling Keith might veto it and Mick will have to release it as solo release.

Mick Jagger

This has quickly become one of my favorite Mick solo tunes.

Maybe a solo album filled with International traditional folk tune covers is in the future?

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......