Quote
They may have a deal now that is a 'do whatever you want' deal for all it seems.

That's the current deal with Universal, the original deal was for 5 years and NEVER asked for original or new stuff.

Albums released under the old deal (2008-2012)
- Shine a Light
- Exile re-issue
- Some Girls re-issue
- GRRR

Combined sales for these albums were close to 4,5 million copies worldwide and we can add all their back catalog sales from 1971-2005, about a million copies, so with 5-6 million copies sold worldwide from 2008-2013, Universal has made their money back.


Since 2013, they can do whatever they want, re-issues, new albums, digital only stuff, it's all up to the Stones.
Universal only ask for a MAJOR release every 12-18 months, so we had the Sticky Fingers re-issue on 2015 (which sold close to 500k worldwide) and Blue & Lonesome on 2016.

Black Ice peaked at number one in 29 countries, including Australia, Canada, the United Kingdom and the United States. It was the second best-selling record of 2008 and had shipped more than 8 million copies worldwide.

What about À Bigger Bang ?

Quote
RipThisBone

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
KRiffhard

Quote
RipThisBone

Quote
powerage78
Almost no new material since 2005 but yes off course no worries.

Off course no worries. We got a great BLUES cover album coming!

Better no new material than lousy albums like Rock and Roll Train and Rock or Burst (the first album that is missing in my AC/DC collection) like AC/DC produced and going on tour without Malcolm, Phil Rudd and Brian Johnson but with Axl Rose .

Better some great blues covers than usless album like Black Ice or Rock or Bust.

BLACK ICE is outstanding and almost as good as STIFF UPPER LIP! Alas, I can not speak of ROCK OR BUST because I never got around to getting it.

HAHAHA! These albums made such a low impression I don't even remember the titles. STIFF UPPER LIP has one good track, the title song and BALLBREAKER is lousy too except Hard As A Rock. So that's maybe 4 good tracks in 20+ years. Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz........................

HATE TO SEE YOU GO:

video: [youtu.be]

***
I'm just a Bad Boy Boogie

Quote
Rockman
...a solo album after Blue and Lonesome?
Do you think it's possible?


NO!!! ... there'll be a Stones album of new material ...

I wouldn't mind a new Keith solo album ...
Mick on the other hand, no thanks - Superheavy-Alfie type stuff doesn't move me.
I can't imagine any of the 'songs that wouldn’t be perfect for the Stones' being enjoyable on any level.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
powerage78
Black Ice peaked at number one in 29 countries, including Australia, Canada, the United Kingdom and the United States. It was the second best-selling record of 2008 and had shipped more than 8 million copies worldwide.

What about À Bigger Bang ?

Black Ice was a surprise monster seller, no one saw that coming, I mean the album did sell close to 800k in the US during the first week and about 6.2 million copies worldwide during 2008. Crazy.

Does the current Universal deal have an 'end' date?

Quote
georgelicks

Quote
powerage78
Black Ice peaked at number one in 29 countries, including Australia, Canada, the United Kingdom and the United States. It was the second best-selling record of 2008 and had shipped more than 8 million copies worldwide.

What about À Bigger Bang ?

Black Ice was a surprise monster seller, no one saw that coming, I mean the album did sell close to 800k in the US during the first week and about 6.2 million copies worldwide during 2008. Crazy.

...that's still a boring/usless album.

powerage78:
Black Ice peaked at number one in 29 countries, including Australia, Canada, the United Kingdom and the United States. It was the second best-selling record of 2008 and had shipped more than 8 million copies worldwide.

Don't know what it's got to do with this tread but congratulations non the less.

What about A Bigger Bang?

Well, that's a pretty good Stones album, Black In Black was the last AC/DC album that was better than any Stones album including ABB.

Shall we discus Fly On The Wall, Dirty Work and Blow Up Your Video on an AC/DC site?

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
retired_dog
What I don't quite understand is why they're intending a new album of original material at all when it shines through now that they're not exactly kissed by their muses. I mean, they are not bound by any recording contracts to do a new album, a freedom they rightfully earned throughout their career.

Their contract with UMe calls for 3 new albums. What is not known is the specifics of what 3 new albums is: studio, live... because they've released 3 live albums so far with UMe (SHINE A LIGHT, SWEET SUMMER SUN, STICKY FINGERS LIVE).

[www.nytimes.com]

It was three releases with new material (not three new studio albums) over a five year period. By 2013 they had reissued EXILE and SOME GIRLS with newly recorded material and compiled GRRR with new material included.

Obviously the agreement has been extended because the label relationship is considered supportive at this stage in their careers. The band is no longer the crown in a label's roster. The archive releases are continuing. Don Was will continue to be involved in the higher profile archival releases just as every archival release is mixed or remixed by Bob Clearmountain. There will be a new Stones album in 2017 or later one way or the other. There will be another Jagger solo release in 2018 or later one way or the other.

For a very long time, Mick and Keith have been critical of the direction one another chooses for the band. For the past 15 years or so, the rest of the band is also less than enthusiastic about new material though this is rarely voiced outside of closed doors, it has been conveyed with Ronnie stating many times over the years there is no need for new material and Mick mentioning he thought everyone (the band, Don Was, and Universal) would be more enthused over his new material in 2012 and somewhat surprised the one they went for was "Doom and Gloom." These guys have ego and still want to create work that will be received well by the public. This is a tough time for them and plays into inactivity and sniping. If Keith hadn't felt like his muse deserted him at the time, LIFE would not have had the vitriol. He found that muse again with Steve Jordan, but it is hardly a question of confidence restored. Both he and Mick are plagued with doubt over whether their work will be met well. Neither wants to risk failure. There are regular posters here at IORR who know this for fact should you not accept my "take" on the situation. One way or the other, there will be more "new" Stones and Jagger material whether brand new songs or newly released recordings that have languished in the vaults. More material was worked on between 2009 and 2011 than has surfaced. Mick has also done more recording with Dave Stewart that has not surfaced. Keith's work with Steve Jordan earlier this year was an attempt to get the spark going that was not necessarily there with the Stones (from Keith's perspective) and then bring that back to the band. Finding someone in sympathy with your work is not easy at their ages. That is why Matt Clifford and Steve Jordan are vital to both of them. CROSSEYED HEART could be seen as a small miracle for a legendary artist who thought he had lost his way. The craft of songwriting is easier for Mick, but both of them lack confidence and do not always support one another's endeavors. Keith doesn't want to stay relevant and Mick wants energy not songs that are "too slow." It's a creative disconnect that simple compromise can no longer heal not with others doubting them and not being the yes men they were in the past.

Quote
Rocky Dijon

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
retired_dog
What I don't quite understand is why they're intending a new album of original material at all when it shines through now that they're not exactly kissed by their muses. I mean, they are not bound by any recording contracts to do a new album, a freedom they rightfully earned throughout their career.

Their contract with UMe calls for 3 new albums. What is not known is the specifics of what 3 new albums is: studio, live... because they've released 3 live albums so far with UMe (SHINE A LIGHT, SWEET SUMMER SUN, STICKY FINGERS LIVE).

[www.nytimes.com]

It was three releases with new material (not three new studio albums) over a five year period. By 2013 they had reissued EXILE and SOME GIRLS with newly recorded material and compiled GRRR with new material included.

Obviously the agreement has been extended because the label relationship is considered supportive at this stage in their careers. The band is no longer the crown in a label's roster. The archive releases are continuing. Don Was will continue to be involved in the higher profile archival releases just as every archival release is mixed or remixed by Bob Clearmountain. There will be a new Stones album in 2017 or later one way or the other. There will be another Jagger solo release in 2018 or later one way or the other.

For a very long time, Mick and Keith have been critical of the direction one another chooses for the band. For the past 15 years or so, the rest of the band is also less than enthusiastic about new material though this is rarely voiced outside of closed doors, it has been conveyed with Ronnie stating many times over the years there is no need for new material and Mick mentioning he thought everyone (the band, Don Was, and Universal) would be more enthused over his new material in 2012 and somewhat surprised the one they went for was "Doom and Gloom." These guys have ego and still want to create work that will be received well by the public. This is a tough time for them and plays into inactivity and sniping. If Keith hadn't felt like his muse deserted him at the time, LIFE would not have had the vitriol. He found that muse again with Steve Jordan, but it is hardly a question of confidence restored. Both he and Mick are plagued with doubt over whether their work will be met well. Neither wants to risk failure. There are regular posters here at IORR who know this for fact should you not accept my "take" on the situation. One way or the other, there will be more "new" Stones and Jagger material whether brand new songs or newly released recordings that have languished in the vaults. More material was worked on between 2009 and 2011 than has surfaced. Mick has also done more recording with Dave Stewart that has not surfaced. Keith's work with Steve Jordan earlier this year was an attempt to get the spark going that was not necessarily there with the Stones (from Keith's perspective) and then bring that back to the band. Finding someone in sympathy with your work is not easy at their ages. That is why Matt Clifford and Steve Jordan are vital to both of them. CROSSEYED HEART could be seen as a small miracle for a legendary artist who thought he had lost his way. The craft of songwriting is easier for Mick, but both of them lack confidence and do not always support one another's endeavors. Keith doesn't want to stay relevant and Mick wants energy not songs that are "too slow." It's a creative disconnect that simple compromise can no longer heal not with others doubting them and not being the yes men they were in the past.

wow...and yet despite this we get the covers album and a new album next year. a small miracle.

too bad they don't have the confidence in their songwriting that they do in their live performance. never new that about ronnie either.

mick should just make a solo album if he wants to stay "relevant", whatever the heck that means. Good luck Mick......

The Ronnie quotes can be found on timeisonourside.com. Start with 2000 and move forward as they talk about when they're heading back out on tour. For years I wrote it off as sour grapes on Ronnie's part that he was no longer contributing to the songwriting. There was a definite change from STEEL WHEELS to BABYLON where it was always "I have plenty of songs, but they want to get their Glimmer Twins thing back so I'll just give them room." Prior to LICKS all the way to the present Ronnie stresses there is no need for new material. Quite a change in what he communicates. Mick has also talked about new songs not going down well in concert and whether or not the band thinks they're any good. Look at how little Ronnie has been involved in the studio after VOODOO LOUNGE. Sure some of it is down to the former need to get through rehab to be insured for the tour, but the band feeling went away. BRIDGES can be seen as a sponge job for the band since Mick and Keith worked the tracks up with other musicians in 1996 and even during the band sessions. Since then, Mick worked in the same fashion Ray Davies did in the waning years of The Kinks. "I'll bring you my highly polished demo and Keith, Charlie, and Ronnie can overdub their bits." This isn't just about Mick, though. Keith is largely in the same boat, but he can't sit down with Matt Clifford or Dave Stewart and deliver product the way Mick can. Keith needs Steve Jordan or George Recile to sit down and work with him patiently until the jams become songs. Mick and the rest of the Stones aren't about to do that any longer. BRIDGES, LICKS, BANG, on through the most recent sessions are about compressed recording time with everything ready to go. Some have suggested STEEL WHEELS was the same, but that's hard to judge as more than hearsay. The time spent on WANDERING SPIRIT and VOODOO LOUNGE really developing songs with a band (even a solo band) just isn't going to happen again. GODDESS IN THE DOORWAY attempted to replicate the BRIDGES model but the results were not encouraging for Mick so since then he's been far more conservative. The reception of his demos (even the original blues numbers) has not been tremendous. Look at timeinsourside.com with a new light on what is being said. And yes, I wouldn't post this if others didn't share the view. Sure, it is just their "take" on reality, too, but they are closer to the core than I ever would be. If anyone here who is connected wishes to dispute this, I will not argue , but I suspect this is the consensus even if the picture it paints isn't a popular one.

Rocky tells it like it is. But Mick and Keith are both hoping/trying to come up with a vibe for an album that works for them, and the rest of the group.

Rocky does indeed speak much sense.

The most pertinent point I thnk is that in days of yore they would often wait for days for Keith to come up with that Killer hook... and then spend weeks playing with scores of overdubs and alternative passes to result in the required magic.

They don't have the inclination to do that anymore.

ABB was a good example .
They came up with the bones of a few decent songs, played them decently well...and then put out the resulting decent album.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-11-14 15:07 by Spud.

Back to Blue and Lonesome: Can we assume that Keith has been involved with any mixing?

Man, these are cool songs on Blue and Lonesome. Just listened to Magic Sam's All Of Your Love, so good......><

Not sure we can assume he's had a lot to do with the mixing...but for this old school Blues album I'm not sure his tastes or inclinations would differ much from Mick's.

With this stuff...they're on the same page.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-11-14 16:19 by Spud.

Yes, great for Magic Sam, dead so young.

***
I'm just a Bad Boy Boogie

Quote
georgelicks

Quote
They may have a deal now that is a 'do whatever you want' deal for all it seems.

That's the current deal with Universal, the original deal was for 5 years and NEVER asked for original or new stuff.

The NYTimes article I found said the original deal did ask for 3 new albums. One might guess that means studio albums but instead they got what you listed, SHINE A LIGHT, the newly recorded studio tracks for EXILE and SOME GIRLS, with each one having its own separate album which, technically, may fall under 'new album'.

The two new tracks for the hits comp probably didn't fall under that deal because it had expired anyway according to what others have said.

Quote
powerage78
Yes, great for Magic Sam, dead so young.

With his higher pitch it would lend itself to Keith doing the vocals.......which I realize isn't happening

As Rocky has highlighted, what strikes me about the possible lack of confidence with new stuff may be related to the set list hardly going past 1981 these past few years of touring?

I find it ridiculous that they did VOODOO, BRIDGES and BANG and, with the odd exception for You Got Me Rocking and Out Of Control, they've been ignored since 2012! Those albums all sold quite well as I recall, at least the first two. They had the confidence to release them when they did so what the hell is wrong with them!!!!!!!!! They thought You Got Me Rocking was good enough to be a single and played on the tours - and that song stinks compared to other songs they could've played!

So now those albums are not worthy? Of course not playing anything from the 1986 disaster makes sense but they toured the last 3 albums! BRIDGES was the peak of the Virgin contract! They were all up about BANG when it came out except when it came to the tour and how, after averaging 4 songs on the 2005 tour (they played It Won't Take Long for 2 shows in a row but did revolve some other tunes, like Back Of My Hand and This Place Is Empty around) and for the 2006 European tour they did do 5 songs for a tiny bit but then it went down to 3 and by the second American leg in 2006 they were down to averaging 2 songs and averaging 1 on the 2007 Euro tour! They gave up on the album!

It's still somewhat odd that they never played Plundered or No Spare Parts on any of the recent tours since those were SINGLES! But the two off the hits album got played a little bit.

Obviously they had enough confidence in those two songs for a little while.

It's just very strange that they've recorded albums past 1981 and they've ignored them. Perhaps they're admitting that they're not any good but the reality possibly is the crowds either don't know them, don't own them or don't like them so, as Mick likes to say, why bother.

Because they did them? That seems logical. But the Stones have never been about logic, really.

Quote
Spud
Rocky does indeed speak much sense.

The most pertinent point I thnk is that in days of yore they would often wait for days for Keith to come up with that Killer hook... and then spend weeks playing with scores of overdubs and alternative passes to result in the required magic.

They don't have the inclination to do that anymore.

ABB was a good example .
They came up with the bones of a few decent songs, played them decently well...and then put out the resulting decent album.

that's exactly the problem and that's why the hardcores can hear the holes in those latter day stones albums.a casual fan would think "well that's a good song" but we can hear a patch job with the spirit of the band that breathed life into the old songs completely drained from the process.

in a sense the latter day records are almost the same results we would get if the band played on each others solo albums.
and the problem is twofold,not only do they have trouble coming up with great songs they would then,as rocky said,have to sit in the studio for hours and days hammering them into something classic.

the good news is they may have found a loophole,instead of staying there and working the long hours they do some work,set it aside and get back together and pick it up again.
my guess is that's what happened to the new record-when they went back they noticed that what they had done just wasn't very good.with a record like bigger bang or voodoo lounge they did them and put them out so fast that it was too late.before they knew it they had put out several c grade albums in a row and they just thankfully stopped recording alltogether.
it's been over 10 years now so there's no hurry,if they keep taking their time to get it right we may just get one more great one -just the fact that they knew it was crap and stopped is a good sign.

They can take all the time they want if it's going to make for a better record, but the pertinent question now is if they have the time and patience?
Can't imagine them all anxiously wanting to get back in the studio any time soon - especially after their recent hefty payday (Desert Trip, Vegas, private shows).
Except for 'young' Ronnie, they're all over 70 and are probably enjoying the fruits of their labor and spending time with family, children, horses, etc.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Quote
GasLightStreet
It's just very strange that they've recorded albums past 1981 and they've ignored them. Perhaps they're admitting that they're not any good but the reality possibly is the crowds either don't know them, don't own them or don't like them so, as Mick likes to say, why bother.

Because they did them? That seems logical. But the Stones have never been about logic, really.

To the bolded, that's THE issue, even in a small 1500 "seater" it's hard to get people interested in new stuff when you've got a cartload of mega hits/classics that people want to hear. I was reminded of that again at Sting's show at the Bataclan on Saturday. During most of the new songs, especially the "non rock" ones that are easier to get into, 99% of the crowd went more or less "blank". Pull out Roxanne or So Lonely and they're ecstatic...what can a poor boy do, especially when you're playing to 20,000+ people !

--------------
IORR Links : Essential Studio Outtakes CDs : Audio - History of Rarest Outtakes : Audio

Dunno, but if they set out the aim to record just 2 good songs a year after Babylon in 1997, by 2017 we could have had 3 or even 4 new albums in the meantime instead of just one. I can't be that hard and time-consuming to write and record 2 songs year by year. I wouldn't even mind a cover here and there, there's loads of songs out there that would suit the Stones. Of course, if you let years pass by doing nothing and have to come up with 10 to 12 quality songs in a couple of months it is a different story.

.



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2016-11-15 06:21 by hopkins.

Quote
Hairball
They can take all the time they want if it's going to make for a better record, but the pertinent question now is if they have the time and patience?
Can't imagine them all anxiously wanting to get back in the studio any time soon - especially after their recent hefty payday (Desert Trip, Vegas, private shows).
Except for 'young' Ronnie, they're all over 70 and are probably enjoying the fruits of their labor and spending time with family, children, horses, etc.

Except that most of the other performers at the Desert (all of similar age) will be as busy as ever in 2017.

Quote
jlowe

Quote
Hairball
They can take all the time they want if it's going to make for a better record, but the pertinent question now is if they have the time and patience?
Can't imagine them all anxiously wanting to get back in the studio any time soon - especially after their recent hefty payday (Desert Trip, Vegas, private shows).
Except for 'young' Ronnie, they're all over 70 and are probably enjoying the fruits of their labor and spending time with family, children, horses, etc.

Except that most of the other performers at the Desert (all of similar age) will be as busy as ever in 2017.

Except that most of them are singular acts (Macca, Dylan, Waters, Young) who don't move (or rock)like..Jagger and the Stones. And they'll still likely do more in '17...

Quote
jlowe

Quote
Hairball
They can take all the time they want if it's going to make for a better record, but the pertinent question now is if they have the time and patience?
Can't imagine them all anxiously wanting to get back in the studio any time soon - especially after their recent hefty payday (Desert Trip, Vegas, private shows).
Except for 'young' Ronnie, they're all over 70 and are probably enjoying the fruits of their labor and spending time with family, children, horses, etc.

Except that most of the other performers at the Desert (all of similar age) will be as busy as ever in 2017.

True.

And at the slow rate the Stones put out new albums, we'll probably be waiting for the 10th anniversary of Desert Trip in 2026 for this album of originals.
Meanwhile, Dylan's still on his Neverending tour. Neil Young already has a new album about to be released, and will probably have a tour lined up soon (as well as surprise appearances > Standing Rock Protest).
The Who have a bunch of shows lined up for the UK in the Spring. Roger Waters will be touring the US on a massive tour which will more than likely turn into a World tour, and there's the possibility of a new album .
And Paul McCartney...not sure what he's up to, but I'm sure he'll be busy.

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

Stones on the cover of Rolling Stone
[www.rollingstone.com]





Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-11-16 17:55 by GS1978.

Quote
GS1978
Stones on the cover of Rolling Stone
[www.rollingstone.com]

Very, very good article!! Thanks for the link.

Quote
Wild Slivovitz

Quote
GS1978
Stones on the cover of Rolling Stone
[www.rollingstone.com]

Very, very good article!! Thanks for the link.

. Love these guys.......