Quote
TravelinMan

I never heard Billy Preston complain about credits, probably because he had a semi-successful solo career.

Well...the release of LYL was postponed as Preston demanded more money. They reached an agreement, but they decided to change direction and continue without him.

Mathijs

Quote
Mathijs

Quote
TravelinMan

I never heard Billy Preston complain about credits, probably because he had a semi-successful solo career.

Well...the release of LYL was postponed as Preston demanded more money. They reached an agreement, but they decided to change direction and continue without him.

Mathijs

A blessing in disguise if I ever saw one!

Quote
DandelionPowderman

Quote
TravelinMan

Quote
DandelionPowderman

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Quote
Taylor1
He probably deserved a writers credit for the music since without his playing the song would have wound up like the piano demo.Look at the writer credits Andrew Watts got on Hackney Dismonds.I doubt he contributed more than Taylor did to some of the songs he played on.

I think that Jagger and Richards (and most Stones fans) have a different view on songwriting credits, and who deserves it. The Rolling Stones are no prog rock band where every individual member gets credited, no matter who wrote the main theme or score. It's the prog rock alike Stones music where Taylor was complaining about.. TWFNO , Moonlight Mile, and maybe even 100 Years ago. As long as Richards and Jagger share the stage, stadiums will sell out called "the Rolling Stones" . That's the Crux behind the story. No brilliant session player helping them, writing or arranging songs does matter. There were quite a few though. They will get no penny for songwriting. There's no guilty person involved either. Jagger has the last word. Keith backing him up as his ancient trademark guitarist and co-songwriter.The rest is history. Or even the future.

Well, Watt did get songwriting credits on HD. He must be a tough bloke

Compare the financials of 1973 Mick Jagger to 2023 Mick Jagger and there is your answer.

It's not like he has handed out credits willingly since 1989, either, so ...

GHS was a big seller, btw, so no doubt he could have afforded it back then as well

I just don't think that Jagger really needs people to write with. If you look at his solo out put he wrote more than 75% himself, and gave credit where credit is due with Dave Stewart, Jimmy Rip etc.

To write Stones tracks he needs Richards, but he doesn't need Richards or anybody else to write oddities like Hundred Years.

Mathijs

I do remember an interview with Bill Wyman back in the (early?) eighties where he said "not to bring in any musical ideas anymore" because they were rejected most of the time, and he found it quite frustrating. Bill was a bit cleverer than Mick Taylor (who felt the same issues) and waited a bit longer to leave the Stones.
He left as a millionaire. I also do think that Richards "wanted to protect his songs" -quote Jagger- so likely Taylor had a lot of disagreements with Richards in the Studio. It can be that Richards refused to play guitar on 100 years ago just because he didn't like the song. His bass lines are great though, as is the entire song imo. (Just to stay on topic).



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024-10-14 20:03 by TheflyingDutchman.

The posted live versions are interesting - being the second track on the LP it makes sense they should play it, they performed the song fantastically - but perhaps the overall energy of the song was unsuitable for what they were doing at the time.

Just a guess.

100 Years Ago shall remain 'one of those songs' that will always be better on record than live, much like She's So Cold, She Was Hot, Neighbours, Crazy Mama, Rocks Off, Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo, Sway, CYHMK, Love Is Strong, Tops - they've never truly nailed those; they ignored their essence; too many details they screw up live. And perhaps some they will hopefully never play live, like Laugh, I Nearly Died, No Use In Crying, Down In The Hole, Dear Doctor...

Could be a very interesting playlist.

Which in one way is strange considering they've done fantastic performances of Monkey Man, Shattered, Worried About You, Memory Motel, Let It Bleed, Sweet Virginia, various others - somehow they've managed to play those, for the most part (Shattered has been the most abused but I think the 1994-95 performances of it are the best) and expand on the intricacies of the song, like Let It Bleed, which is very fat, lumbering and chuggy on the record, but very snarly bluesy live in 1981-82 and country bluesified in 1994-95.

I haven't listened to the live version(s) in 15 years and what IMHO strikes me is the same issue that Mick had with Rocks Off for a while, I suspect he wasn't 100% content with the singing on this gem. I do believe he would've executed it perfectly between 89 up until today but back in the 70's where the tempo was much higher and cigarettes and the bolivian delicacy still was on the menu it might not have been to his satisfaction. A shame as it is a great song

I don't think there is anything wrong with the Mannheim rendition of Hundred Years.

But if you look at the Mannheim setlist and see what they changed for the next show Cologne they took out the midtempo songs Hundred Years and Sweet Virginia. This way the set is more balanced with a high energy part from Brown Sugar to Star Star, followed by the ballads Angie and YCAGWYW. Further up the tour they refined the setlist even more by moving DWMrD/Heartbreaker from after YCAGWYW to before Angie.

Mathijs

Did KR play bass live?

Quote
TravelinMan
Did KR play bass live?

Unthinkable re 100 years ago.

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Quote
TravelinMan
Did KR play bass live?

Unthinkable re 100 years ago.

I haven't listened to the live versions in years. Can we hear a rhythm guitar?

Quote
Mathijs

Quote
TravelinMan

I never heard Billy Preston complain about credits, probably because he had a semi-successful solo career.

Well...the release of LYL was postponed as Preston demanded more money. They reached an agreement, but they decided to change direction and continue without him.

Mathijs

Mick and Keith did overdubbing and mixing in April - June, LYL came out in mid-September. If there was a delay it must've been for 30 seconds.

Quote
TravelinMan

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Quote
TravelinMan
Did KR play bass live?

Unthinkable re 100 years ago.

I haven't listened to the live versions in years. Can we hear a rhythm guitar?

I cannot. My guess is that Keith is playing along with Preston more or less, and buried in the mix. Very unlikely Keith left the stage for this song, unless someone on iorr saw it with his/her own eyes.

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Quote
TravelinMan

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Quote
TravelinMan
Did KR play bass live?

Unthinkable re 100 years ago.

I haven't listened to the live versions in years. Can we hear a rhythm guitar?

I cannot. My guess is that Keith is playing along with Preston more or less, and buried in the mix. Very unlikely Keith left the stage for this song, unless someone on iorr saw it with his/her own eyes.

You can hear Keith's part better on the Rotterdam Rehearsals, it's quite a nice part.

Mathijs

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
Mathijs

Quote
TravelinMan

I never heard Billy Preston complain about credits, probably because he had a semi-successful solo career.

Well...the release of LYL was postponed as Preston demanded more money. They reached an agreement, but they decided to change direction and continue without him.

Mathijs

Mick and Keith did overdubbing and mixing in April - June, LYL came out in mid-September. If there was a delay it must've been for 30 seconds.

Recorded in June 1976, released in September 1977. That's ages.

Mathijs

Quote
Mathijs

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Quote
TravelinMan

Quote
TheflyingDutchman

Quote
TravelinMan
Did KR play bass live?

Unthinkable re 100 years ago.

I haven't listened to the live versions in years. Can we hear a rhythm guitar?

I cannot. My guess is that Keith is playing along with Preston more or less, and buried in the mix. Very unlikely Keith left the stage for this song, unless someone on iorr saw it with his/her own eyes.

You can hear Keith's part better on the Rotterdam Rehearsals, it's quite a nice part.



Mathijs

Thank you; I didn't even know these recordings existed. I searched and put them below. Keith is more or less playing what I expected him to play. The song starts at 10:10.







Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2024-10-16 13:18 by TheflyingDutchman.

Quote
GasLightStreet

Quote
Mathijs

Quote
TravelinMan

I never heard Billy Preston complain about credits, probably because he had a semi-successful solo career.

Well...the release of LYL was postponed as Preston demanded more money. They reached an agreement, but they decided to change direction and continue without him.

Mathijs

Mick and Keith did overdubbing and mixing in April - June, LYL came out in mid-September. If there was a delay it must've been for 30 seconds.

Here's the quote. It's from Ian McLagan's book All The Rage, page 266 where Ian describes his negotiations with Jagger for the 1978 tour:

"Jane handed me the papers, and after looking at them briefly I said I'd sign it after my lawyer had looked it over. Mick wasn't pleased, as he had apparently assumed I'd sign it without reading it. I was insulted, and he was angry, and like a petulant child, he pouted and said: "Oh you're not going to be like Billy, and hold us to ransom, are you?" This was the second time I'd been compared to Billy Preston, but neither had anything to do with music. Freddie Sessler explained later that the Stones had finished the 1975 tour before Billy Preston had signed a contract, so when the live album, Love You Live, came out with him on every track, he was in a position to bargain and eventually got a percentage of it."

In the press at the time, it was also mentioned that LYL was delayed due to this.

Mathijs

That's odd. Preston played the March 1977 Toronto Mocambo shows. Keith was restricted in where he could be. They overdubbed etc in Philly and NYC APril-June.

They spent months working on a double live album!

Quote
GasLightStreet
That's odd. Preston played the March 1977 Toronto Mocambo shows. Keith was restricted in where he could be. They overdubbed etc in Philly and NYC APril-June.

They spent months working on a double live album!

They started overdubbing a year after the recording dates, that's really long. You would think you want to release a live album of a tour maximum a couple of months after a tour, not 1,5 years later. When they released it Never Mind the Bollocks was released 3 weeks later, showing how obsolete the 1976 tour was.

Mathijs

Quote
Mathijs

Quote
GasLightStreet
That's odd. Preston played the March 1977 Toronto Mocambo shows. Keith was restricted in where he could be. They overdubbed etc in Philly and NYC APril-June.

They spent months working on a double live album!

They started overdubbing a year after the recording dates, that's really long. You would think you want to release a live album of a tour maximum a couple of months after a tour, not 1,5 years later. When they released it Never Mind the Bollocks was released 3 weeks later, showing how obsolete the 1976 tour was.

Mathijs

I looked at STILL LIFE, FLASHPOINT and NO SECURITY - all worked on during, on a break or right after and released within 3 months of the end or, in STILL LIFE's case, into the second tour.

However, they weren't exactly being hounded like they were in 1975-77. Seems that Keith's situation had more to do with working on the live recordings than Billy Preston wanting a little more money. 1976 Keith listened to the live recordings about two months after the tour ended and roughly one month after Knebworth.

They had plenty of material for a double. Whatever talks with Preston couldn't've taken MONTHS to figure out, especially since he was with them in Toronto.

Well, I just want to go back to the subject of the thread.
100 years ago is one of my favorite Stones tunes. It's a real great song. When I try to cover a song and it doesn't work, it might be because the song itself is not too good. Of course it's not necessarily like that. Sometimes it took me a long time to do justice to a song. This happened to me, when I tryed to cover Lady Jane. All I have is my voice and my accoustic. After many attempts I found my version. The main challenge was to strip the arrangement down to my accoustic. The melody of Jaggers singing is being repeated by Brian Jones. The instrumental part is different. Brian Jones plays the part, that Mick Jagger sings before. Both take place over different chords in the progression. So I had to learn to play the melody over different chotd progressions. And the intro is played by two guitars. So I had to work on playing both at the same time. The same with the solo / instrumental part.
100 years ago is a song I love to play and it is a part of my repertoire since a long time. A wonderfull tune to play and sing. The sound of the keybord intro sounds pretty good with an accoustic and the second part also is offerimg an easy way to catch it.
Did anybody else of you guys cover it? Or Lady Jane?



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2024-10-19 16:18 by micha063.

Had a go at it awhile back. Fun song to play. It's so well written...
[youtu.be]

The groove of 100 Years Old is absolutely fantastic yet it's not really anything any different than She's A Rainbow or Shine A Light - that sort of dumpy thump that Charlie was excellent at.

The vibrancy of the instrumentation, as well as the entire album, including Through The Lonely Nights and Criss Cross, is something that hadn't been done before and would never happen again. They figured out some magical formula. It's part of what makes GHS such a fantastic album, regardless of having Silver Train instead of... hell, just listen to Tops and, although it's mixed to sound like the rest of TATTOO YOU, it's obvious it's a GHS tune. Not so easily said with Waiting On A Friend although Nicky Hopkins is the biggest factor giving way to GHS.

Quote
GasLightStreet
The groove of 100 Years Old is absolutely fantastic yet it's not really anything any different than She's A Rainbow or Shine A Light - that sort of dumpy thump that Charlie was excellent at.

The vibrancy of the instrumentation, as well as the entire album, including Through The Lonely Nights and Criss Cross, is something that hadn't been done before and would never happen again. They figured out some magical formula. It's part of what makes GHS such a fantastic album, regardless of having Silver Train instead of... hell, just listen to Tops and, although it's mixed to sound like the rest of TATTOO YOU, it's obvious it's a GHS tune. Not so easily said with Waiting On A Friend although Nicky Hopkins is the biggest factor giving way to GHS.

Great post. My pops didn't have Goats on CD so I didn't hear it until I was older. When I did, I was surprised by its uniqueness.

Waiting on a Friend has a stereo chorus or something applied to the electric guitar which really changes it from the 1972 outtake version, which has more of a Goats vibe IMO.

Quote
poor immigrant
Had a go at it awhile back. Fun song to play. It's so well written...

Unbelievable what you can do with a few chords. Jagger's vocal lines are brilliant. And he knows what player to ask and what for.

How many Stones songs start off with a keyboard (of some sort)?

The only others I can think of at the moment are Coming Down Again (maybe?), Worried About You, Melody, Memory Motel, Fool To Cry, Faraway Eyes and Out Of Tears.

Listen to Hang Fire - it starts out of the gate on the album but the reality is they'd started it live in the studio with the bridge and then went to the verse and so it was edited.

I doubt 100 Years Ago or Worried About You had similar beginnings.

Quote
GasLightStreet
How many Stones songs start off with a keyboard (of some sort)?

The only others I can think of at the moment are Coming Down Again (maybe?), Worried About You, Melody, Memory Motel, Fool To Cry, Faraway Eyes and Out Of Tears.

Listen to Hang Fire - it starts out of the gate on the album but the reality is they'd started it live in the studio with the bridge and then went to the verse and so it was edited.

I doubt 100 Years Ago or Worried About You had similar beginnings.

Heartbreaker.

We Love you ..... well after thee chains



ROCKMAN

Loving Cup
Let's Spend The Night

Shine a Light
Ruby Tuesday

She's A Rainbow