King (ring) Brady is the GOAT

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three16
King (ring) Brady is the GOAT

Maybe,but definitely the LOAT.

The luckiest of all time by far.

Extraordinary luck combined with extraordinary talent and extraordinary work and preparation = 5 championships.

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GasLightStreet

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keefriff99

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Winning Ugly VXII

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Natlanta
awesome game.

Pats/Belichick/Brady are the NFL best of all time, close-ish dynasty-wise to the NBA Celtics/Auerbach/Russell/etc era.

Please. They haven't won a championship in 11 years without the help of horrendous play calls by the opposing coaching staffs. That's Seattle and Atlanta to be specific.

Atlanta had the game won at the 23 yard line with 3:58 left in the game (28-20). They should have run the ball twice more and kicked a 41 yard (or shorter) field goal which should have given them an 11 point lead with around 3 minutes left in the game.

The Patriots are sure not looking / playing like the best team of all time.

They have never won a Super Bowl by more than FOUR points without going into overtime (which means that they were 1 point away from losing the game in regulation).

Their last 2 championships have been facilitated by glaring strategical errors by their opponents. Their first one by a short lived , nonsensical rule which has since been abolished. The greatest teams of all time do not need help to win.

Do you think the Seahawks would rather have:

a. One blowout Super Bowl win against the Peyton Manning-led Broncos, or
b. 5 hard-fought nailbiter Super Bowl wins?

Ironic that a guy with the name "Winning Ugly" is complaining that the Patriots, in fact, win ugly. It's a hard @#$%&' game...you have to claw out victories any way you can.

HA HA! What he points out yet complains about and then says the greatest teams don't need help is... great coaches and great teams figure out how to win when the opportunity arises. NE lost to NY because NY had their opportune moments.

5 Super Bowls. The Seahawks blew out a team that didn't show up.

New England beat a team that showed up - and then CHOKED. Denver choked from the flip of the coin. And then Seattle lost because they have a stupid coach. NE went to 7 Super Bowls and won 5 Super Bowls because they have a good coach. Sure, they never won with over 4 points or whatever - but they won 5 Super Bowls - a new record. No other team has more than 4 Super Bowls with the same QB. That's pretty amazing.

All that matters is who has the most points.

Winning a championship is one thing winning close is another and being gifted extra opportunities is yet another.

Yes, mistakes are made every game but,not to the point where it becomes the equivalent of playing black jack (21) and taking a hit on 19.

If you have the opportunity to go ahead by 11 points with 3 minutes left to play in the SUPER BOWL,you don't risk passing the ball,dropping back 12 yards. You run the ball right between the tackles,tell the guy not to fumble at all costs. Football strategy 101.

Also,if you take a 25 point lead with 18 minutes left in the game,you might want to consider running the ball more than 5 times during the remainder of the game. Again,football strategy 101.

Yes. The Patriots should have beaten the Giants the first time. One of the 2 ..... maybe 3 times that they were actually the best team in football.

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Winning Ugly VXII

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three16
King (ring) Brady is the GOAT

Maybe,but definitely the LOAT.

The luckiest of all time by far.

Extraordinary luck combined with extraordinary talent and extraordinary work and preparation = 5 championships.

Yes lucky. They never flinched which was pretty impressive. Quite the parade yesterday, Belichick was very animated at City Hall plaza, nice to see that side of him.

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Natlanta
...and as far as the Saints/Falcons thing... Atlantans don't really care, we're pretty nonchalant about sports... sometimes it's fun to tweak Saints fans but it's too easy

When Atlanta fans come to New Orleans they are treated with respect.

Atlanta knows nothing about respect when it's the other way around.

Anyone who wants to sit here and downplay Tom Brady and suggest that Drew Brees is a better qb knows squat about football. The debate is over folks Brady is the best ever. I have the pleasure of seeing him play weekly living in Massachusetts. The dink and dunk comment is ridiculous. The deep out throw is not a dink and dunk it travels thirty yards on a line and is thrown with pinpoint accuracy Brady had many of these throws in the Super Bowl. When Brady has a legit deep threat he can throw long with the best of them. Remember when he had a guy named Moss?? He adapts to whatever is put around him, could care less about stats except the one that really matters of who won the game. He takes care of the ball better than anyone. Yeah he threw a bad pick in the SB but that was one of 5 in 15 games played this year. This is not even a debate any longer. Also Atlanta did not choke, they made some bad decisions which allowed a perfect storm to allow the Pats to come back. poor play calling and playing like it was 0-0 with a 25 point lead was their downfall.

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slew
Anyone who wants to sit here and downplay Tom Brady and suggest that Drew Brees is a better qb knows squat about football. The debate is over folks Brady is the best ever. I have the pleasure of seeing him play weekly living in Massachusetts. The dink and dunk comment is ridiculous. The deep out throw is not a dink and dunk it travels thirty yards on a line and is thrown with pinpoint accuracy Brady had many of these throws in the Super Bowl. When Brady has a legit deep threat he can throw long with the best of them. Remember when he had a guy named Moss?? He adapts to whatever is put around him, could care less about stats except the one that really matters of who won the game. He takes care of the ball better than anyone. Yeah he threw a bad pick in the SB but that was one of 5 in 15 games played this year. This is not even a debate any longer. Also Atlanta did not choke, they made some bad decisions which allowed a perfect storm to allow the Pats to come back. poor play calling and playing like it was 0-0 with a 25 point lead was their downfall.

1. No one claimed Brees is better than Brady, but it's simply a fact that he has slightly more touchdowns and passing yard than Brady. That doesn't make him better by any stretch, but the stats are self-evident.

2. 'Dink and dunk' isn't an insult. It's actually a hard style of play to master. And I've repeatedly pointed out that the one time Brady had an elite wide receiver (Moss), he broke the single-season touchdown record. That says something about what Brady is capable of had he been given elite wide receivers his entire career.

Peyton manning will always be the greatest. Went to and won super bowls with different teams, different systems, different coaches, different GMs, some of that switched while he was on the teams. Peyton misses a season and the colts get a top draft pick. Brady misses a season and they go 11-5 with matt cassell and miss the playoffs due to tiebreakers. Brady suspended, no problem. They go 3-1 using 2 different QBs, one a rookie. Brady has had the same coach the entire time and the record the team has wothout brady, I believe they are 17-7 without brady since he became the starter says a lot

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keefriffhard4life
Peyton manning will always be the greatest. Went to and won super bowls with different teams, different systems, different coaches, different GMs, some of that switched while he was on the teams. Peyton misses a season and the colts get a top draft pick. Brady misses a season and they go 11-5 with matt cassell and miss the playoffs due to tiebreakers. Brady suspended, no problem. They go 3-1 using 2 different QBs, one a rookie. Brady has had the same coach the entire time and the record the team has without brady, I believe they are 17-7 without brady since he became the starter says a lot

Oh man, here we go again. I always liked Peyton but to compare him to Brady and Montanna. C'mon man. He is definitely top 10 of all time but all those one and dones are just awful. He may go down as one of the best regular season qbs but just not in the same level as Brady and Montanna.

By the way when Peyton was out that Colts team stunk. And they tanked it towards the end to get the pick. The whole Matt Cassel thing is blown out of proportion, that team went undefeated the season before. Could have put a 3rd stringer in there and he would have done well; the Cassel led team didn't make the playoffs as well. As for the 3 games they won this season, we'll Cardinals were frauds and Miami in Foxboro stinks, Texans were awful, and Bills stunk yet beat the Pats 27-0.

But whatever, it's all subjective. To say who is the greatest qb will never end; unless Brady gets his 5th ring. Oh wait. He just did, OK if he gets his 6th then maybe we can take the blinders off and say he's probably the greatest.

I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

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Mr. Jimi

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keefriffhard4life
Peyton manning will always be the greatest. Went to and won super bowls with different teams, different systems, different coaches, different GMs, some of that switched while he was on the teams. Peyton misses a season and the colts get a top draft pick. Brady misses a season and they go 11-5 with matt cassell and miss the playoffs due to tiebreakers. Brady suspended, no problem. They go 3-1 using 2 different QBs, one a rookie. Brady has had the same coach the entire time and the record the team has without brady, I believe they are 17-7 without brady since he became the starter says a lot

Oh man, here we go again. I always liked Peyton but to compare him to Brady and Montanna. C'mon man. He is definitely top 10 of all time but all those one and dones are just awful. He may go down as one of the best regular season qbs but just not in the same level as Brady and Montanna.

By the way when Peyton was out that Colts team stunk. And they tanked it towards the end to get the pick. The whole Matt Cassel thing is blown out of proportion, that team went undefeated the season before. Could have put a 3rd stringer in there and he would have done well; the Cassel led team didn't make the playoffs as well. As for the 3 games they won this season, we'll Cardinals were frauds and Miami in Foxboro stinks, Texans were awful, and Bills stunk yet beat the Pats 27-0.

But whatever, it's all subjective. To say who is the greatest qb will never end; unless Brady gets his 5th ring. Oh wait. He just did, OK if he gets his 6th then maybe we can take the blinders off and say he's probably the greatest.

the game is a team sport. the 2 years peyton won the SB weren't even his best years in the playoffs. telling me he went out after his first playoff game means noting because 3 of those times he wasn't on the field when the team lost and another 2 times he posted the best stats he had in the playoffs. you just said it though the colts team without manning stunk and the patriots without brady had the best record ever to not make the playoffs.


the patriots didn't make the playoffs at 11-5. that never happens.

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

This video is AMAZING...

[www.youtube.com]



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-16 05:50 by keefriff99.

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keefriff99

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

This video is AMAZING...

[www.youtube.com]

Duuuude... that is AMAZING. Thank you for linking.

That hurt to watch... I am sore. Ouch.
Not only did LT CRUSH the other team... he defined adding insult to injury!
Barking at his prey as they lay shattered... so they would remember... in their nightmares

LTerrifying



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-16 06:05 by HankM.

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

exactly and while not as rough manning played 5-6 seasons of his career when QBs still weren't untouchable while brady only played 3 years like that

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keefriffhard4life

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

exactly and while not as rough manning played 5-6 seasons of his career when QBs still weren't untouchable while brady only played 3 years like that

Yup, there came a time when the NFL realized (for good or bad) that stars put people in the seats and the guy with the ball is the star... and if the star keeps getting crumpled like good ole Broadway Joe did (back when it took a real man to play the game) then it hurt ticket sales... so the NFL decided to protect the QBs (for good or bad)... so comparing todays pretty boy QBs to the QBs greats of yesteryear is like comparing an apple iphones to a IBM pc.

Brady is good and all that... but to say he is the best of all time?
That would be disrespecting the names of other greats like Bobby Layne... and that is bad luck.

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HankM

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keefriffhard4life

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

exactly and while not as rough manning played 5-6 seasons of his career when QBs still weren't untouchable while brady only played 3 years like that

Yup, there came a time when the NFL realized (for good or bad) that stars put people in the seats and the guy with the ball is the star... and if the star keeps getting crumpled like good ole Broadway Joe did (back when it took a real man to play the game) then it hurt ticket sales... so the NFL decided to protect the QBs (for good or bad)... so comparing todays pretty boy QBs to the QBs greats of yesteryear is like comparing an apple iphones to a IBM pc.

Brady is good and all that... but to say he is the best of all time?
That would be disrespecting the names of other greats like Bobby Layne... and that is bad luck.

to me this change of protecting the QB came around 2003 or 2004. it was a transition of about 2 years before it finally became the normal. if we say 2004 then manning played 6 years under the older way with 2 years in transition so 8 years of his career. compare that to brady who only had to play 4 seasons like that before they started protecting the QBs.peyton is the only person I can think of to sorta play 1/2 a career the old way and 1/2 the newer way. favre played most of his the older way. the rest of the current QBs are too young to have played a majority of a career the older way

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keefriffhard4life

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HankM

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keefriffhard4life

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

exactly and while not as rough manning played 5-6 seasons of his career when QBs still weren't untouchable while brady only played 3 years like that

Yup, there came a time when the NFL realized (for good or bad) that stars put people in the seats and the guy with the ball is the star... and if the star keeps getting crumpled like good ole Broadway Joe did (back when it took a real man to play the game) then it hurt ticket sales... so the NFL decided to protect the QBs (for good or bad)... so comparing todays pretty boy QBs to the QBs greats of yesteryear is like comparing an apple iphones to a IBM pc.

Brady is good and all that... but to say he is the best of all time?
That would be disrespecting the names of other greats like Bobby Layne... and that is bad luck.

to me this change of protecting the QB came around 2003 or 2004. it was a transition of about 2 years before it finally became the normal. if we say 2004 then manning played 6 years under the older way with 2 years in transition so 8 years of his career. compare that to brady who only had to play 4 seasons like that before they started protecting the QBs.peyton is the only person I can think of to sorta play 1/2 a career the old way and 1/2 the newer way. favre played most of his the older way. the rest of the current QBs are too young to have played a majority of a career the older way

I agree. I am not sure when exactly it happened but if someone was motivated to research it could be tracked exactly by when new rules were passed and when the refs actually started calling "being too mean to the QB - 15 YARDS - FIRST DOWN!!" more rigidly.

You mentioned the great Brett Favre, he is one of my favorites. I dont debate much of anything as far as rankings go... after a long life it all becomes kind of a tie at the top and then "the rest".

I put Favre up at the top with some other greats. I think Favre is the last QB I really enjoyed watching play. He was a true football man that properly played the game like a kid. And he wasn't even "my QB"... but I wish he could have been. Just like LT was not on "my team"... but I wish he was too.

Favre was one of the last old school guys for sure. peyton sorta was but not really. maybe big ben can be considered a hybrid old school guy even though his entire career came after they started protecting the QBs more

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keefriff99

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

This video is AMAZING...

[www.youtube.com]

All clean hits, LT certainly knew how to tackle. Awesome that Belichick has ties to the NYG from a historical standpoint.

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HankM

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keefriff99

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

This video is AMAZING...

[www.youtube.com]

Duuuude... that is AMAZING. Thank you for linking.

That hurt to watch... I am sore. Ouch.
Not only did LT CRUSH the other team... he defined adding insult to injury!
Barking at his prey as they lay shattered... so they would remember... in their nightmares

LTerrifying

Seriously...what a monstrous presence on the gridiron...must have been terrifying to see him charging at you. He played like a man possessed. Absolutely remarkable to watch such energy and ferocity.

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HankM

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keefriffhard4life

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

exactly and while not as rough manning played 5-6 seasons of his career when QBs still weren't untouchable while brady only played 3 years like that

Yup, there came a time when the NFL realized (for good or bad) that stars put people in the seats and the guy with the ball is the star... and if the star keeps getting crumpled like good ole Broadway Joe did (back when it took a real man to play the game) then it hurt ticket sales... so the NFL decided to protect the QBs (for good or bad)... so comparing todays pretty boy QBs to the QBs greats of yesteryear is like comparing an apple iphones to a IBM pc.

Brady is good and all that... but to say he is the best of all time?
That would be disrespecting the names of other greats like Bobby Layne... and that is bad luck.

I think multiple things caused the softening...obviously there are the health and concussion issues that are still plaguing the league, and it's also a matter of the quarterback being the linchpin of NFL popularity. If guys like Brady, Manning or Rodgers are constantly injured or forced into early retirement, it affects the league's bottom line.

I'm torn because I enjoy watching old-school vicious hits, but I also appreciate the desire to modernize the league and protect player health.

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keefriff99

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HankM

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keefriff99

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HankM

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Maindefender
I like recognizing the greatest of a generation or decade instead of all time. So many great QB's over the years. TB is still going strong, another SB next year??

Who's to say how Brady would hold up against the Giants defenses of the 80's lead by no other than Belichick and those linebackers.

LT (that is Lawrence Fkn Taylor for those too young to understand that some things actually did happen before 10 years ago) would have knocked the stuffing out of Brady scared him so much he would have run home crying to his mama and never left her house (let alone step on a football field) again.

This video is AMAZING...

[www.youtube.com]

Duuuude... that is AMAZING. Thank you for linking.

That hurt to watch... I am sore. Ouch.
Not only did LT CRUSH the other team... he defined adding insult to injury!
Barking at his prey as they lay shattered... so they would remember... in their nightmares

LTerrifying

Seriously...what a monstrous presence on the gridiron...must have been terrifying to see him charging at you. He played like a man possessed. Absolutely remarkable to watch such energy and ferocity.

Yeah but seriously would he pass a drug test if playing now instead of playing in the wild and crazy 80's??

I'm can't stand Brady or the Patriots....
But on SuperBowl Sunday Feb 5th, 2017 he became the greatest QB of all time!! you cannot argue differently - It pains me to no end to say that but he is.
Montana - Manning are now in his rearview...


Oh and the SeaHawks will be back in the big game next year!!! woop woop !!

LTerrifying

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Maindefender

Yeah but seriously would he pass a drug test if playing now instead of playing in the wild and crazy 80's??

Sure he would... all that talk of people doing drugs back then was exaggerated...

But yeah.... whats-his-name-pats-QB is good...
but there are many better QBs I would pick as my QB... if I could pick any QB in history.

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umakmehrd
I'm can't stand Brady or the Patriots....
But on SuperBowl Sunday Feb 5th, 2017 he became the greatest QB of all time!! you cannot argue differently - It pains me to no end to say that but he is.
Montana - Manning are now in his rearview...


Oh and the SeaHawks will be back in the big game next year!!! woop woop !!

& with most of their draft picks....

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HankM
LTerrifying

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Maindefender

Yeah but seriously would he pass a drug test if playing now instead of playing in the wild and crazy 80's??

Sure he would... all that talk of people doing drugs back then was exaggerated...

Lol right....

Tom Brady is without question the greatest qb of all time. This is not even worth arguing. The man has won five SB’s and been in seven in 16 years of starting.

And for the people who claim Brady is “lucky” to have won five championships I would argue the exact opposite. Brady should have won at least two more, but lost two SB’s to the Giants on two of the luckiest catches in the history of the NFL...And while we are on the subject, I would argue the Patriots lost another SB during an AFC Championship vs the Colts when the entire team had the flu and lost a huge halftime lead.

If the Patriots had any luck at all they would have eight rings instead of five...Love the Patriots or hate them,they are the best the NFL has ever seen.

P.S. Did I mention they are odds on favorites to win next years Super Bowl?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2017-02-17 01:50 by James Kirk.

Maybe to "headline only" readers he is the best of all time...
But I actually watched the whole Super Bowl game this year and the way he and his team played in the first half is not how I would expect the "best of all time" to play. If Atlanta had not fallen apart and handed the game to them it would have been a massacre.

Comebacks like that make for good TV ratings and drama... but it does not speak much for "greatest of all time"


I remember another embarrassing game... a MNF game played not too long ago at Arrowhead Stadium where he was knocked out of the game and even the NE faithful were questioning him and wondering if he was done as they started rooting for their next pretty boy QB to step in. He certainly didn't look like the best of all time that night.


One could question whether 80% of todays players could even compete with players of 15+ years ago. There are some greats today (Gronk, JJ Watt, Antonio Brown and some others) that certainly could... but a lot of these guys seem more like ballerinas prancing around on Sunday than NFL players.

Something seems off about this league. The 2016/2017 NFL season was the worst NFL year I have seen in a long time. I dont think there were any really good teams... and the team who won the final game... is not saying much. The competition is just not there.


I hope things pick up and it gets better... or it will wither.