I have read lots of conflicting stories about the development of this song. Some stories suggest it was developed with Ry Cooder and evolved from a country song, some suggest Mick Taylor had a big influence in brining the rock element while others that it was pretty much finished as a rock song by the time Taylor joined.

Does anyone know the time line of the songs development (and the forms it had) between it's composition to it's final release?

Thanks!

Good 'ol Wiki states that the rock version was done before Mick Taylor joined. Taylor states he "added" to it but that it was basically done before that.

[en.wikipedia.org]

From Time Is On Our Side

Mick and I were sitting on the porch of this ranch house and I started to play, basically fooling around with an old Hank Williams idea, you know.

- Keith Richards, 2003

Keith and I were on this holiday in Brazil once and we sang it all the way through the holiday.

- Mick Jagger, 2003

I wrote Honky Tonk Women as a straight Hank Williams-Jimmie Rodgers sort of number. Later, when we were fooling around with it trying to make it sound funkier, we hit on the sound we had on the single. We all thought, Wow, this has got to be a hit single. And it was, and it did fantastically well. It's the sort of song that transcends all tastes.

- Keith Richards, 1969

The guitar is in open tuning on that. I learned that particular tuning (G) off Ry Cooder.

- Keith Richards, 1979

I definitely added something to Honky Tonk Women, but it was more or less complete by the time I arrived and did my overdubs. They had already laid down the backing track, but it was very rough and incomplete. I added some guitars to it, but I didn't play the riffs that start it - that's Keith playing. I played the country kind of influence on the rock licks between the verses.

- Mick Taylor, 1979


"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"

Please refer to "Country Honk" for the original idea.

Ry claims he wrote the music.

Jas Obrecht Archives snippet:

"...Keith has said that you made the song “Honky Tonk Women” what it became.

Taylor: Well, I definitely added something to it, but it was more or less complete by the time I arrived and did my overdubs.

Was it your idea to electrify it?

Taylor: No, they’d already laid the backing track down, but it was very rough and it wasn’t complete. I added some guitars to it. But I didn’t play the riff that starts “Honky Tonk Women” – that’s Keith playing. I played the sort of country-influenced rock licks between the verses...."
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LeonidP
Good 'ol Wiki states that the rock version was done before Mick Taylor joined. Taylor states he "added" to it but that it was basically done before that.

[en.wikipedia.org]

Y'know what they say about they Internet, don't you? It's always true.

Mick Taylor Interview
[jasobrecht.com]


Keith has said that you made the song “Honky Tonk Women” what it became.

Well, I definitely added something to it, but it was more or less complete by the time I arrived and did my overdubs.



Was it your idea to electrify it?

No, they’d already laid the backing track down, but it was very rough and it wasn’t complete. I added some guitars to it. But I didn’t play the riff that starts “Honky Tonk Women” – that’s Keith playing. I played the sort of country-influenced rock licks between the verses.



Back when it was called “Country Honk,” on Let It Bleed, did you come in and play the bottleneck part?

Yeah. It wasn’t on a regular guitar, though. It was on a cheap little Selmer Hawaiian guitar, which I played on my lap.

Honky Tonk Women should be in a time capsule for the ages .Future generations will want to study and examine Rock and Roll and the Stones and all you have to do to explain the Rolling Stones is to play this song , the lyrics, Keith's open G chord that starts the song , Mick Taylors fills, and finaly Keith's masterpiece solo .

honky tonk woman was played at hyde park in 1969 which was mick taylors first gig, not sure how long he had been in the stones at that point 0r how much input he had towards forming the song.

i like honky tonk woman but feel its overrated, there is better.

the A chapter, without a bass, the guitar start, and the income of the drums at the beginning, all very special.. love it. have covered it in a very slow version. ( dinner music).

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buttons67
honky tonk woman was played at hyde park in 1969 which was mick taylors first gig, not sure how long he had been in the stones at that point 0r how much input he had towards forming the song.

i like honky tonk woman but feel its overrated, there is better.

Over rated? Absolutely not. That sparse arrangement; the frugal horns, that the Bass doesn't arrive until the chorus; the drum pattern that seems to just be there for the cowbell; the compressed overall sound. It is a brilliant recording and song. No one could have done it like they did. Maybe 'Country Honk" but not HTW.

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BeforeTheyMakeMeRun

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LeonidP
Good 'ol Wiki states that the rock version was done before Mick Taylor joined. Taylor states he "added" to it but that it was basically done before that.

[en.wikipedia.org]

Y'know what they say about they Internet, don't you? It's always true.

Okay, feel free to point out any inaccuracies in the link. All looks good to me.

Not to mention, do you have a better source of info?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-17 15:52 by LeonidP.

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Palace Revolution 2000

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buttons67
honky tonk woman was played at hyde park in 1969 which was mick taylors first gig, not sure how long he had been in the stones at that point 0r how much input he had towards forming the song.

i like honky tonk woman but feel its overrated, there is better.

Over rated? Absolutely not. That sparse arrangement; the frugal horns, that the Bass doesn't arrive until the chorus; the drum pattern that seems to just be there for the cowbell; the compressed overall sound. It is a brilliant recording and song. No one could have done it like they did. Maybe 'Country Honk" but not HTW.

All true, and a killer riff and great vocals & lyrics to boot!

What I find enduringly intriguing, is the possibility of Brian Jones' involvement. Sources have suggested that Brian was present at early sessions for the soon-to-be single, and that he was a participant in the very-early takes. There are rumours that he even went as far as to tell his father of his 'excitment' at the Stones' 'new direction'

There is a (sort of) embryonic version of the HTW riff from the Satanic Sessions.

No one is mentioning the lyrics. I think the opening line is Springsteen-seque and the best ever. In 10 words you are transported...

Great point about the opening line. It opens up a world.

I always liked the line from the "Pusher" song "You know I smoked a lot of grass.."sung in that tone.
Of course the open line from 'Gimme Shelter" too

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Palace Revolution 2000

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buttons67
honky tonk woman was played at hyde park in 1969 which was mick taylors first gig, not sure how long he had been in the stones at that point 0r how much input he had towards forming the song.

i like honky tonk woman but feel its overrated, there is better.

It is a brilliant recording and song.

If only the word brilliant wasn't so overused that it doesn't mean anything anymore.

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stanlove

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Palace Revolution 2000

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buttons67
honky tonk woman was played at hyde park in 1969 which was mick taylors first gig, not sure how long he had been in the stones at that point 0r how much input he had towards forming the song.

i like honky tonk woman but feel its overrated, there is better.

It is a brilliant recording and song.

If only the word brilliant wasn't so overused that it doesn't mean anything anymore.

I don't overuse the word. And the earlier parts of the post show exactly what I mean by brilliant in this context.

I read somewhere that it was Jimmy Millers idea to strip the intro right back to Keith's rhythm guitar. When he heard how it was sitting in next to the piano part he realised how unique it was and decided it should be more prominent.

Can't remember where I read this though, but it certainly makes sense!

"We've never played an intro to Honky Tonk Women live the way it is on the record.
That's Jimmy playing the cowbell and either he comes in wrong or I come in wrong -
but Keith comes in right, which makes the whole thing right. It's one of those things
that musicologists could sit around analyzing for years. It's actually a mistake, but ... it works."
- Charlie Watts, 2003, quoted on [www.timeisonourside.com]

'Gram Parson' influence possibly...

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LeonidP

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BeforeTheyMakeMeRun

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LeonidP
Good 'ol Wiki states that the rock version was done before Mick Taylor joined. Taylor states he "added" to it but that it was basically done before that.

[en.wikipedia.org]

Y'know what they say about they Internet, don't you? It's always true.

Okay, feel free to point out any inaccuracies in the link. All looks good to me.

Not to mention, do you have a better source of info?

No, I'm sure it's right, this just was a PSA to be cautious of what you read on Wikipedia.

If you could put just one Stones song in a time capsule, this would be the one.
If you found someone who had never heard of the Stones, this would be the song to play them.

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BeforeTheyMakeMeRun

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LeonidP

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BeforeTheyMakeMeRun

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LeonidP
Good 'ol Wiki states that the rock version was done before Mick Taylor joined. Taylor states he "added" to it but that it was basically done before that.

[en.wikipedia.org]

Y'know what they say about they Internet, don't you? It's always true.

Okay, feel free to point out any inaccuracies in the link. All looks good to me.

Not to mention, do you have a better source of info?

No, I'm sure it's right, this just was a PSA to be cautious of what you read on Wikipedia.

Same as any other site, really. In actuality, wiki is a lot more accurate in many cases, i've found, because anyone with an approved account can go in and make corrections ... and remove inaccuracies etc.

So Taylor plays the swarm of guitars that come in before the chorus?, I always liked these, listening to an alternate take without them I always think "hang on somethign is missing"!

It is interesting that he says the song was pretty much down but also pretty rough at the same time. I think that sums up the Stones!

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Elmo Lewis
Please refer to "Country Honk" for the original idea.

Ry claims he wrote the music.

I'm not sure Ry Cooder ever explicitly made such a claim.