Tell Me :
Talk
Macca would be advised to say nothing on the matter.
Rich and pampered multi millionaire people from the (unreal) world of show biz generally have little insight into something as complex as Europe. They see things in black and white terms.
Mick and Keith have wisely kept their opinions (if they have any) on politics to themselves since the 60's.
I agree that Mick, Keith and Paul are very wise men when it comes to expressing opinions, or rather not doing so. However as for Ringo, hmmmm. He upset a lot of people a few years ago when he made very disparaging comments about his home city, although he did later apologise. Macca at least visits regularly as his brother Mike still lives there.
Wise business move. Alienating half your fans by taking sides isn't.
I wish more would take that approach Especially in concert. I want to hear music, not a campaign speech.
Although they like to point to our slave-mentality history, the UK, and Europe in general, have never experienced the kind of mass migration that is central to the American foundation. And it took centuries, and a war and movements and uprisings, for the U.S. to become the pluralistic society we are now. Xenophobes and injustice will always exist in any society, and as a nation the U.S. is continually tripping over its sins(see.. Alton Sterling) and we are a perpetual work in progress.
The UK has no real concept of true multiculturalism or multicultural assimilation. Brexit tells me that they still haven't quite figured out how to handle it. There seems to be a strong streak of mistrust toward their neighbors and those who are 'other'. I'm simplifying and generalizing because obviously it's not true of all Brits..or most. It's just my perception as an American from afar.
But I remember reading those interviews with the Stones and other Brits and Mick especially spoke so disparagingly of the French, Germans or the Italians. It was funny to me because it seemed so benignly nationalistic. But it seems to have roots in a very British elitism. Remember when Eric Clapton got flak for his comments about immigrants in the 70s?
And in the same breath they would be chastising Americans for its racism toward Black Americans etc..
It's a lack of self-awareness.
Can any of our European friends here tell me if my perceptions are misguided? I genuinely want to know because the post-Brexit fallout - increase in hate-crimes etc..... is troubling and astounding to me.
Apologies for the multiple edits ... Yikes - I'm typing on an iPad.
Edited 9 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-07 06:53 by stupidguy2.
"There seems to be a strong streak of mistrust toward their neighbors and those who are 'other'" - that would surely also apply to US/Mexico relations and the ongoing border/wetback problem which is related to economic inequalities between the USA and Mexico?
Very interesting. I appreciate the update.
When/If you ever see a relatively unbiased and somewhat easy to understand story about this whole situation I would appreciate a link to the story. I have tried to keep up but it seems complicated.
I would especially be interested in stories about the part where The Leave campaign had no strategy as they didn't expect to win and the Remain campaign didn't have one as they didn't expect to leave.
Thank you, please keep us posted,
FTA
No Brexit until 2019?
The UK could remain in the EU "until late 2019" after ministers warned senior figures in the City of London that the Brexit and International trade departments will not be ready to enact Article 50 in January, The Sunday Times reported yesterday.
Sources also cited upcoming French and German elections as a cause for delay, saying: "You can't negotiate when you don't know who you're negotiating with
Thank you jambay. The whole thing is a complete mess. The pound has slipped from $1.50 to $1.31 and from 1.30EUR to 1.16 EUR. Interest rates have been cut to 0.25%. The winning leave side have lots of different opinions of what Brexit should look like. Lots of the votes came from Xenophobes and racists and hate crime against foreign residents and ethnic minorities have risen sharply since the Brexit vote.
I am no fan of the EU and imho, it a is a fat, wasteful, non-transparent undemocratic and arrogant and it sorely needs reform but at least we knew what we were getting and had influence in it.
Uncertain and difficult times lie ahead for the UK, at least in the short to medium time. Long term, I hope we will be OK.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
stonesrule
()
Date: July 6, 2016 20:38
The US and the UK are two very different countries.
TODAY, the vast population of America has SO many poor and homeless, both native born and immigrants. The middle class seems to have dwindled while our Congressmen are mostly millionaires. One way or another.
It will take true leadership in the next years to change the current problems.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-07 06:05 by stonesrule.
TODAY, the vast population of America has SO many poor and homeless, both native born and immigrants. The middle class seems to have dwindled while our Congressmen are mostly millionaires. One way or another.
It will take true leadership in the next years to change the current problems.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-07 06:05 by stonesrule.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
Stoneage
()
Date: July 6, 2016 20:39
You can't compare apples and pears, Koen. North America was largely unpopulated and those who came first didn't exactly have a set table to welcome them. The welfare state didn't exist.
And North America was a British and French colony to begin with. They picked their immigrants from Western countries. Which was a key to their success.
And North America was a British and French colony to begin with. They picked their immigrants from Western countries. Which was a key to their success.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
jlowe
()
Date: July 6, 2016 23:13
Quote
hopkinsQuote
marianna
Ringo Starr? But what does Paul McCartney think about it?
[www.washingtonpost.com]
Macca would be advised to say nothing on the matter.
Rich and pampered multi millionaire people from the (unreal) world of show biz generally have little insight into something as complex as Europe. They see things in black and white terms.
Mick and Keith have wisely kept their opinions (if they have any) on politics to themselves since the 60's.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
grzegorz67
()
Date: July 7, 2016 00:46
Quote
jloweQuote
hopkinsQuote
marianna
Ringo Starr? But what does Paul McCartney think about it?
[www.washingtonpost.com]
Macca would be advised to say nothing on the matter.
Rich and pampered multi millionaire people from the (unreal) world of show biz generally have little insight into something as complex as Europe. They see things in black and white terms.
Mick and Keith have wisely kept their opinions (if they have any) on politics to themselves since the 60's.
I agree that Mick, Keith and Paul are very wise men when it comes to expressing opinions, or rather not doing so. However as for Ringo, hmmmm. He upset a lot of people a few years ago when he made very disparaging comments about his home city, although he did later apologise. Macca at least visits regularly as his brother Mike still lives there.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
stonesrule
()
Date: July 7, 2016 01:28
RE my ABOVE POST I am talking about NOW.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
kovach
()
Date: July 7, 2016 05:39
Quote
jloweQuote
hopkinsQuote
marianna
Ringo Starr? But what does Paul McCartney think about it?
[www.washingtonpost.com]
Mick and Keith have wisely kept their opinions (if they have any) on politics to themselves since the 60's.
Wise business move. Alienating half your fans by taking sides isn't.
I wish more would take that approach Especially in concert. I want to hear music, not a campaign speech.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
stupidguy2
()
Date: July 7, 2016 06:10
Quote
Koen
The US became one of the richest countries in the world due to mass immigration. I don't see what everyone is afraid of.
Although they like to point to our slave-mentality history, the UK, and Europe in general, have never experienced the kind of mass migration that is central to the American foundation. And it took centuries, and a war and movements and uprisings, for the U.S. to become the pluralistic society we are now. Xenophobes and injustice will always exist in any society, and as a nation the U.S. is continually tripping over its sins(see.. Alton Sterling) and we are a perpetual work in progress.
The UK has no real concept of true multiculturalism or multicultural assimilation. Brexit tells me that they still haven't quite figured out how to handle it. There seems to be a strong streak of mistrust toward their neighbors and those who are 'other'. I'm simplifying and generalizing because obviously it's not true of all Brits..or most. It's just my perception as an American from afar.
But I remember reading those interviews with the Stones and other Brits and Mick especially spoke so disparagingly of the French, Germans or the Italians. It was funny to me because it seemed so benignly nationalistic. But it seems to have roots in a very British elitism. Remember when Eric Clapton got flak for his comments about immigrants in the 70s?
And in the same breath they would be chastising Americans for its racism toward Black Americans etc..
It's a lack of self-awareness.
Can any of our European friends here tell me if my perceptions are misguided? I genuinely want to know because the post-Brexit fallout - increase in hate-crimes etc..... is troubling and astounding to me.
Apologies for the multiple edits ... Yikes - I'm typing on an iPad.
Edited 9 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-07 06:53 by stupidguy2.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
Aquamarine
()
Date: July 7, 2016 10:48
I agree with you on most things, stupidguy2, but I have to disagree slightly on two points here. Firstly, I find the UK to be much more truly multicultural than the US. I'm a joint citizen of both countries, and I can remember, for example, interracial relationships being commonly seen in British popular culture long before they became accepted as a fact of life in the US--even now, you rarely see an interracial couple in US commercials. In other words, the UK is multicultural within its own borders, and also most younger people feel assimilated with Europe. But they're not the ones who voted in the referendum. (I think there is a real difference in generational attitudes since the 1970s.)
The other point has to do with mass migration--Europe has experienced a lot of migration but over a much longer period of time, and I think that what compounds the current situation is simply that European countries are all a fraction of the size of the US, which has been able to absorb vast numbers of immigrants. But Europe just can't handle the current wave of refugees, all at once.
The other point has to do with mass migration--Europe has experienced a lot of migration but over a much longer period of time, and I think that what compounds the current situation is simply that European countries are all a fraction of the size of the US, which has been able to absorb vast numbers of immigrants. But Europe just can't handle the current wave of refugees, all at once.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
Father Ted
()
Date: July 7, 2016 12:28
Quote
stupidguy2Quote
Koen
The US became one of the richest countries in the world due to mass immigration. I don't see what everyone is afraid of.
Although they like to point to our slave-mentality history, the UK, and Europe in general, have never experienced the kind of mass migration that is central to the American foundation. And it took centuries, and a war and movements and uprisings, for the U.S. to become the pluralistic society we are now. Xenophobes and injustice will always exist in any society, and as a nation the U.S. is continually tripping over its sins(see.. Alton Sterling) and we are a perpetual work in progress.
The UK has no real concept of true multiculturalism or multicultural assimilation. Brexit tells me that they still haven't quite figured out how to handle it. There seems to be a strong streak of mistrust toward their neighbors and those who are 'other'. I'm simplifying and generalizing because obviously it's not true of all Brits..or most. It's just my perception as an American from afar.
But I remember reading those interviews with the Stones and other Brits and Mick especially spoke so disparagingly of the French, Germans or the Italians. It was funny to me because it seemed so benignly nationalistic. But it seems to have roots in a very British elitism. Remember when Eric Clapton got flak for his comments about immigrants in the 70s?
And in the same breath they would be chastising Americans for its racism toward Black Americans etc..
It's a lack of self-awareness.
Can any of our European friends here tell me if my perceptions are misguided? I genuinely want to know because the post-Brexit fallout - increase in hate-crimes etc..... is troubling and astounding to me.
Apologies for the multiple edits ... Yikes - I'm typing on an iPad.
"There seems to be a strong streak of mistrust toward their neighbors and those who are 'other'" - that would surely also apply to US/Mexico relations and the ongoing border/wetback problem which is related to economic inequalities between the USA and Mexico?
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: August 15, 2016 00:22
Quote
Stones50
one thing has nothing to do with the other.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: August 15, 2016 00:22
Quote
Stoneage
You can't compare apples and pears, Koen. North America was largely unpopulated and those who came first didn't exactly have a set table to welcome them. The welfare state didn't exist.
And North America was a British and French colony to begin with. They picked their immigrants from Western countries. Which was a key to their success.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: August 15, 2016 00:27
IF the borders close noone drowns. The refugees already stay in lebanon and other countries in the region.Quote
mtaylorQuote
Stones50
one thing has nothing to do with the other.
Indeed it has. England pointing fingers at EU complaining about immigration.
England's answer is to close their own borders and leave border countries deal with the immensely increasing problems.
The question is then - should the rest of EU do the same and let people die in the ocean!!
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
grzegorz67
()
Date: August 16, 2016 01:48
Well the latest news here in the UK is that the Brexit Negotiating team assembled by Theresa May can't even agree an opening negotiating position and cracks are appearing. It is abudantly clear that both The Leave campaign had no strategy as they didn't expect to win and the Remain campaign didn't have one as they didn't expect to leave. meanwhile, although Stock Msrkets all around the World have soared after sn initial hit, the pound continues to fall. Businesses are delaying investment and recruitment decisions amid complete uncertainty.
If you're a tourist, it's a good time to come here.
If you're a tourist, it's a good time to come here.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
JJHMick
()
Date: August 16, 2016 14:26
If the Frankfurt and the London Stock Exchange are allowed to merge than being in or out of the EU must mean no difference?!
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
jambay
()
Date: August 16, 2016 14:45
Quote
grzegorz67
Well the latest news here in the UK is that the Brexit Negotiating team assembled by Theresa May can't even agree an opening negotiating position and cracks are appearing. It is abundantly clear that both The Leave campaign had no strategy as they didn't expect to win and the Remain campaign didn't have one as they didn't expect to leave. meanwhile, although Stock Markets all around the World have soared after an initial hit, the pound continues to fall. Businesses are delaying investment and recruitment decisions amid complete uncertainty.
If you're a tourist, it's a good time to come here.
Very interesting. I appreciate the update.
When/If you ever see a relatively unbiased and somewhat easy to understand story about this whole situation I would appreciate a link to the story. I have tried to keep up but it seems complicated.
I would especially be interested in stories about the part where The Leave campaign had no strategy as they didn't expect to win and the Remain campaign didn't have one as they didn't expect to leave.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
jambay
()
Date: August 17, 2016 22:55
Thank you, please keep us posted,
FTA
No Brexit until 2019?
The UK could remain in the EU "until late 2019" after ministers warned senior figures in the City of London that the Brexit and International trade departments will not be ready to enact Article 50 in January, The Sunday Times reported yesterday.
Sources also cited upcoming French and German elections as a cause for delay, saying: "You can't negotiate when you don't know who you're negotiating with
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
grzegorz67
()
Date: August 18, 2016 16:07
Quote
jambay
Thank you, please keep us posted,
FTA
No Brexit until 2019?
The UK could remain in the EU "until late 2019" after ministers warned senior figures in the City of London that the Brexit and International trade departments will not be ready to enact Article 50 in January, The Sunday Times reported yesterday.
Sources also cited upcoming French and German elections as a cause for delay, saying: "You can't negotiate when you don't know who you're negotiating with
Thank you jambay. The whole thing is a complete mess. The pound has slipped from $1.50 to $1.31 and from 1.30EUR to 1.16 EUR. Interest rates have been cut to 0.25%. The winning leave side have lots of different opinions of what Brexit should look like. Lots of the votes came from Xenophobes and racists and hate crime against foreign residents and ethnic minorities have risen sharply since the Brexit vote.
I am no fan of the EU and imho, it a is a fat, wasteful, non-transparent undemocratic and arrogant and it sorely needs reform but at least we knew what we were getting and had influence in it.
Uncertain and difficult times lie ahead for the UK, at least in the short to medium time. Long term, I hope we will be OK.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
jlowe
()
Date: August 18, 2016 16:28
The UK newspapers, both the more serious ones and the comics will over egg the 'turf wars'. Anything to make a drama out of it.
The actual(and very complex) negotiations will be done behind closed doors.
It will be too dry for most people. Their main concern will be how the exchange rates are doing and how it effects the holiday spend.
The real losers, as always will be the underclass who probably voted to leave.
Deprived areas have to some extent done well out of EEC funds/grants. A right wing Government, looking to cut spending and taxes are less likely to support such projects.
The farmers, many of whom were Exiteers will continue to get their subsidies....but still complain.And drive their Range Rovers.
Mother Teresa (May) and Angela will be the ones making the decisions, not the boys.
The actual(and very complex) negotiations will be done behind closed doors.
It will be too dry for most people. Their main concern will be how the exchange rates are doing and how it effects the holiday spend.
The real losers, as always will be the underclass who probably voted to leave.
Deprived areas have to some extent done well out of EEC funds/grants. A right wing Government, looking to cut spending and taxes are less likely to support such projects.
The farmers, many of whom were Exiteers will continue to get their subsidies....but still complain.And drive their Range Rovers.
Mother Teresa (May) and Angela will be the ones making the decisions, not the boys.
Re: OT British Election
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: August 19, 2016 01:40
Angela already helped GB out of EU.
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