Tell Me :
Talk
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War. If Jagger were to comment the general political situation in South America he should have done that in the seventies when the Chilean military coup was effected. Or the one in Argentina in 1976. He never did that. Apparently you don't know what you are talking about here.
You are ignoring the fact that the violence in this region escalated rapidly round this time. It affected so many more people than that of the Falkland's War that a comparison should be unnecessary.
Talking about Chile and Argentina, here's some words from the author's mouth about that:
«It combines a number of different references to what was going down in Argentina and Chile. I think it's really good but it wasn't particularly successful at the time because songs that deal overtly with politics never are that successful, for some reason».
- Mick Jagger, 1993
The world is bigger than just Great Britain, dear, and the Rolling Stones are aware of that.
You don't have to be, but when you go flinging clods of dirt around like that you just look oafish.
#1) that is a great point
#2) and, either way, was there a requirement at the time that if you wrote about a political issue, that it had to be the 'top' political issue of the time?
I think you are reasoning too much from an English viewpoint. I don't think people outside of England cared much about that war, apart from thinking it was a stupid and ugly thing to do. Of course, you could reason that Jagger is English too, but then again, he's also rather international, isn't he? Even though he wasn't with Bianca anymore at this time (I think), he still might feel some interest in the Latin world (as with Indian Girl, for instance). And anyway, he claims it was based on a book by Burroughs, in which Latin American cities play a large role. In any case, the lyrics in Undercover don't seem to have anything to do with the Falkland's war.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-01-06 19:52 by matxil.
Sorry about the language. You're right about that, With soul. Initially I was commenting on 24FPS' post who said that Jagger was "spot on on the current situation". He wasn't. The current situation back then was the Falklands war, nothing else. In fact he wrote a political song with no political content. Vague as ever. He even got a question about it then and couldn't point out which political situation he was talking about. Because there wasn't any. The lyrics, probably, refers to some book that he has read. Nothing else.
Dude, you made me pull out the DVD to see if I missed something. That was sad.
That's what I was referring to. The Falklands was some joke kerfuffle.
having listened closely to the song and paid attention to what was going on at the time, there is no question in my mind that the song is broadly about what was going on in south and central america (you can include nicaragua and el savador too which were both raging throughout most of the 80s)
Well, The Kinks and Pink Floyd did write songs about it...
...and Dylan already 1965 when he didn't want to work at Maggie's Farm...
2 1 2 0
I thought she laid the farmers off..
Both Jagger, Richards and Wood had houses in Cabo San Lucas, Mexico at the time. Richards even married there. Jagger was frequently travelling Latin America as well in those days. So his reference in 1982 certainly wasn't Stoke-on-Trent.
Mathijs
Ehhhhh. Nah. It is better than the other one though that was in that movie or on that 2008 live album that's so bad.
Undercover Of The Night is a fantastic studio song.
Undercover Of The Night is a horrible live song.
One Hit is not counted. That's one of the most watered down Stones releases ever.
It's not pre-recorded; it's sampling. That's all samples - of the individual tracks from the recording of the recording.
Amazing, innit, that a STEEL WHEELS by-the-numbers leftover gets such praise.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-01-08 00:19 by Redhotcarpet.
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Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Stoneage
()
Date: January 6, 2016 16:20
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
with sssoul
()
Date: January 6, 2016 16:49
Quote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Stoneage
()
Date: January 6, 2016 17:07
Quote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War. If Jagger were to comment the general political situation in South America he should have done that in the seventies when the Chilean military coup was effected. Or the one in Argentina in 1976. He never did that. Apparently you don't know what you are talking about here.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: January 6, 2016 17:17
Quote
StoneageQuote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War. If Jagger were to comment the general political situation in South America he should have done that in the seventies when the Chilean military coup was effected. Or the one in Argentina in 1976. He never did that. Apparently you don't know what you are talking about here.
You are ignoring the fact that the violence in this region escalated rapidly round this time. It affected so many more people than that of the Falkland's War that a comparison should be unnecessary.
Talking about Chile and Argentina, here's some words from the author's mouth about that:
«It combines a number of different references to what was going down in Argentina and Chile. I think it's really good but it wasn't particularly successful at the time because songs that deal overtly with politics never are that successful, for some reason».
- Mick Jagger, 1993
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
with sssoul
()
Date: January 6, 2016 17:25
Quote
StoneageQuote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War.
The world is bigger than just Great Britain, dear, and the Rolling Stones are aware of that.
You don't have to be, but when you go flinging clods of dirt around like that you just look oafish.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
caschimann
()
Date: January 6, 2016 17:41
At the "Madhouse", the Top-Discothek in Hamburg through the 80ies, we heard all the new stuff just arrived at the record companies and testet here if they will get reception on the dance floor.
When Undercover (and Too Much Blood) arrived at "Madhouse" DJ-desks 1 month before official release, they where dancefloor-packed-fillers right from the start.
When Undercover (and Too Much Blood) arrived at "Madhouse" DJ-desks 1 month before official release, they where dancefloor-packed-fillers right from the start.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
LeonidP
()
Date: January 6, 2016 19:37
Quote
with sssoulQuote
StoneageQuote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War.
The world is bigger than just Great Britain, dear....
#1) that is a great point
#2) and, either way, was there a requirement at the time that if you wrote about a political issue, that it had to be the 'top' political issue of the time?
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
matxil
()
Date: January 6, 2016 19:52
Quote
StoneageQuote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War. If Jagger were to comment the general political situation in South America he should have done that in the seventies when the Chilean military coup was effected. Or the one in Argentina in 1976. He never did that. Apparently you don't know what you are talking about here.
I think you are reasoning too much from an English viewpoint. I don't think people outside of England cared much about that war, apart from thinking it was a stupid and ugly thing to do. Of course, you could reason that Jagger is English too, but then again, he's also rather international, isn't he? Even though he wasn't with Bianca anymore at this time (I think), he still might feel some interest in the Latin world (as with Indian Girl, for instance). And anyway, he claims it was based on a book by Burroughs, in which Latin American cities play a large role. In any case, the lyrics in Undercover don't seem to have anything to do with the Falkland's war.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-01-06 19:52 by matxil.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Stoneage
()
Date: January 6, 2016 20:40
Quote
StoneageQuote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War. If Jagger were to comment the general political situation in South America he should have done that in the seventies when the Chilean military coup was effected. Or the one in Argentina in 1976. He never did that. Apparently you don't know what you are talking about here.
Sorry about the language. You're right about that, With soul. Initially I was commenting on 24FPS' post who said that Jagger was "spot on on the current situation". He wasn't. The current situation back then was the Falklands war, nothing else. In fact he wrote a political song with no political content. Vague as ever. He even got a question about it then and couldn't point out which political situation he was talking about. Because there wasn't any. The lyrics, probably, refers to some book that he has read. Nothing else.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: January 7, 2016 00:13
Quote
Wild Slivovitz
SAL version is beautifully sloppy! Great job by darryl Jones too!
Dude, you made me pull out the DVD to see if I missed something. That was sad.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: January 7, 2016 00:14
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
StoneageQuote
24FPS
They really had balls releasing this. It was SO different from anything before or since. It's just STONES music. And Mick knew it wouldn't be super popular, with it's political overtones (which were spot on to the current situation). It just roars out of the speakers and slashes and clicks. Too bad this monumental single got associated with perhaps the crappiest album of their career.
The "current situation" in 1983 was the Falklands War. Which Jagger didn't dare to touch. Of course....
That war was over when they released it. The violence in South America was more of an on-going thing.
That's what I was referring to. The Falklands was some joke kerfuffle.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: January 7, 2016 01:00
The Falklands war had a huge impact on other Southamerican regiimes. The war affected European inner relations and was a possible start of a wider conflict. Had Mick written a song about this he'd risk his career. Hence the bland Miami vice dance pop.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Stoneage
()
Date: January 7, 2016 01:22
Glad to know I'm not the only one who can put one and one together here, Redhotcarpet!
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Turner68
()
Date: January 7, 2016 02:42
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
StoneageQuote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War. If Jagger were to comment the general political situation in South America he should have done that in the seventies when the Chilean military coup was effected. Or the one in Argentina in 1976. He never did that. Apparently you don't know what you are talking about here.
You are ignoring the fact that the violence in this region escalated rapidly round this time. It affected so many more people than that of the Falkland's War that a comparison should be unnecessary.
Talking about Chile and Argentina, here's some words from the author's mouth about that:
«It combines a number of different references to what was going down in Argentina and Chile. I think it's really good but it wasn't particularly successful at the time because songs that deal overtly with politics never are that successful, for some reason».
- Mick Jagger, 1993
having listened closely to the song and paid attention to what was going on at the time, there is no question in my mind that the song is broadly about what was going on in south and central america (you can include nicaragua and el savador too which were both raging throughout most of the 80s)
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: January 7, 2016 08:46
'Bland Miami Pop' my ass. This wasn't no 'Heat Is On' by Glenn Frey.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: January 7, 2016 08:48
Quote
Redhotcarpet
The Falklands war had a huge impact on other Southamerican regiimes. The war affected European inner relations and was a possible start of a wider conflict. Had Mick written a song about this he'd risk his career. Hence the bland Miami vice dance pop.
Well, The Kinks and Pink Floyd did write songs about it...
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Come On
()
Date: January 7, 2016 09:15
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Redhotcarpet
The Falklands war had a huge impact on other Southamerican regiimes. The war affected European inner relations and was a possible start of a wider conflict. Had Mick written a song about this he'd risk his career. Hence the bland Miami vice dance pop.
Well, The Kinks and Pink Floyd did write songs about it...
...and Dylan already 1965 when he didn't want to work at Maggie's Farm...
2 1 2 0
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: January 7, 2016 09:51
Quote
Come OnQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Redhotcarpet
The Falklands war had a huge impact on other Southamerican regiimes. The war affected European inner relations and was a possible start of a wider conflict. Had Mick written a song about this he'd risk his career. Hence the bland Miami vice dance pop.
Well, The Kinks and Pink Floyd did write songs about it...
...and Dylan already 1965 when he didn't want to work at Maggie's Farm...
I thought she laid the farmers off..
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: January 7, 2016 10:17
Quote
StoneageQuote
with sssoulQuote
Stoneage
Sure, Dandy. But it was the closest thing to a current political issue then.
?! What was going on in South America at the time was plenty current for the people affected by it.
Mick's got broader horizons than some of us, and a good thing too.
Bollocks. The big political issue in Great Britain back in 1982-83 was, of course, the Falklands War. If Jagger were to comment the general political situation in South America he should have done that in the seventies when the Chilean military coup was effected. Or the one in Argentina in 1976. He never did that. Apparently you don't know what you are talking about here.
Both Jagger, Richards and Wood had houses in Cabo San Lucas, Mexico at the time. Richards even married there. Jagger was frequently travelling Latin America as well in those days. So his reference in 1982 certainly wasn't Stoke-on-Trent.
Mathijs
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Come On
()
Date: January 7, 2016 10:33
Nah, this is starting to resemble too much politic...if we would talk about just the music to this song, I think it's pretty boring ...Too much blood as the Glimmer would have put it...
2 1 2 0
2 1 2 0
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: January 7, 2016 22:54
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Stoneage
Of course this song was impossible to play live. Even though they tried....
And succeeded, imo. This is an excellent live version.
[www.youtube.com]
Ehhhhh. Nah. It is better than the other one though that was in that movie or on that 2008 live album that's so bad.
Undercover Of The Night is a fantastic studio song.
Undercover Of The Night is a horrible live song.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: January 7, 2016 22:56
Quote
matxil
The last time they did something really new and it still worked. (Unless you count One Hit.)
One Hit is not counted. That's one of the most watered down Stones releases ever.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: January 7, 2016 22:57
Quote
StoneageQuote
35love
I only like the song live. It sounds decidedly different to me live. Real, uncomputerized, raw, funk, jam, great for me while I'm cruising (exercise) outside.
Do not like recorded track.
Give it to me live!
If you're a fan of pre-recorded percussion, drum-loops and click-tracks this is the one for you. Basically, they play over a pre-recorded track.
It's not pre-recorded; it's sampling. That's all samples - of the individual tracks from the recording of the recording.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: January 7, 2016 23:00
Quote
Turner68Quote
HMSQuote
Stoneage
The political allusion in that song was so vague it was almost non-existent. Typically Sir Michael. "Highwire" on the other hand was more straightforward. A very much forgotten song though.
Unfortunately. Highwire belongs to their greatest songs ever. I remember very well the immense excitement I felt when I first listened to it. What a great, great song! The guitars, the drums, the vocals - what a treat!
I almost choked on my morning banana when I read this.
Amazing, innit, that a STEEL WHEELS by-the-numbers leftover gets such praise.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: January 7, 2016 23:06
I almost choked on my morning banana when I read this
..... that must be a massive strain on your back muscles so early in the day
ROCKMAN
..... that must be a massive strain on your back muscles so early in the day
ROCKMAN
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: January 7, 2016 23:25
I didn't dare saying that, Rockee 
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: January 7, 2016 23:35
.....it's a dirty job Dandeee but someone's gotta do it .....
ROCKMAN
ROCKMAN
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: January 8, 2016 00:18
And thank God Mick didnt go down that road. Undercover is the Stones. But, I dont care for the lyrics or the stupid video. Either you go political or you dont. Or you at least take politics and turn an issue into art. Gimme shelter is a great example. It's not about a war but the feeling you're own your own in some private hell, or possibly a war maybe a personal war with a friend, looking for shelter, be it heroin, a woman or a man, or a guitar. Shelter is not - like Undercover - trying to paint a vague picture of one of the many ongoing 70s/80s conflicts within a South American country. (conflicts that the outcome of the Falkland wars actually affected deeply)Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
Redhotcarpet
The Falklands war had a huge impact on other Southamerican regiimes. The war affected European inner relations and was a possible start of a wider conflict. Had Mick written a song about this he'd risk his career. Hence the bland Miami vice dance pop.
Well, The Kinks and Pink Floyd did write songs about it...
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-01-08 00:19 by Redhotcarpet.
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: January 8, 2016 00:20
Quote
Stoneage
Glad to know I'm not the only one who can put one and one together here, Redhotcarpet!
Re: Track Talk: Undercover Of The Night (New)
Posted by:
Title5Take1
()
Date: January 13, 2016 07:55
I read CITIES OF THE RED NIGHT and it is a very very surreal novel, and Mick definitely was influenced by the title and the book’s debauchery and violence, but the song's actual subject matter Mick took more from news stories than the novel. The disparus in the song are not in the book and Panama is the Latin American country that most features in the book. Argentina and Chile are not in the book at all. CITIES OF THE RED NIGHT was the first book of a trilogy, so I wonder if Mick read the next two volumes. (I didn’t. CITIES was interesting but not exactly my cup of tea.)
The documentary below is about the disparus Mick sings about:
Directed by Peter Sanders
The documentary below is about the disparus Mick sings about:
Directed by Peter Sanders
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