Looking at the songlist, I just cannot remember any of the songs Low Down, Gunface and Might as well get juiced. Time to dust of the CD, I guess.

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DandelionPowderman

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RobertJohnson
Great beginning with Keith's and Ronnie's guitar onslaught on Flip the Switch. Great heavy noise on Low Down. Too Tight is the last classic Stones rocker in my opinion. Weaker the rest of the album, particularly the arrangements of some (i.e. two) songs, especially the loop thing that ruins actually a good song. The ballads are average, and sorry, but too much Keith, Thief in the Night and How Can I Stop begin promising but end in a boring mess. They are too long. In general like Voodoo Lounge diversified and varied and a good album in the end.

Just out of curiousity, where do you hear Ronnie on Flip The Switch? I know he (and Waddy) is credited, but I haven't really found his (or Waddy's) part. All I hear is several Keith-guitars.

I don't hear Ronnie on that track, and same for live versions of it.

Keith took over on that one.

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DandelionPowderman

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RobertJohnson
Great beginning with Keith's and Ronnie's guitar onslaught on Flip the Switch. Great heavy noise on Low Down. Too Tight is the last classic Stones rocker in my opinion. Weaker the rest of the album, particularly the arrangements of some (i.e. two) songs, especially the loop thing that ruins actually a good song. The ballads are average, and sorry, but too much Keith, Thief in the Night and How Can I Stop begin promising but end in a boring mess. They are too long. In general like Voodoo Lounge diversified and varied and a good album in the end.

Just out of curiousity, where do you hear Ronnie on Flip The Switch? I know he (and Waddy) is credited, but I haven't really found his (or Waddy's) part. All I hear is several Keith-guitars.

Live, yes, Ronnie is mixed in the background usually on this track (unfortunately). But in the studio: In my opinion Ronnie plays in the left channel (i P h o n e headset).

Left channel is classic Keith. But there might be more guitars buried under there. However, the most audible guitar in the left channel is Keith, no doubt

EDIT: The other guitar in the left channel is Keith as well. I'm listening now. The high pitched guitar in the left channel during the intro could be anyone, though, it's barely audible.

EDIT II: I listened closely now, and, no, I can't find other guitars in there that can be Ronnie or Waddy.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2015-10-20 17:38 by DandelionPowderman.

Please stop the insanity

Okay, Keith alone ... "Let me play the lion too. I will roar, that I will do any man's heart good to hear me ..."

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Stones50
Please stop the insanity

Sure you're in the right thread?

I seem in some recent interview where they asked Keith what he's listening to and he said Bridges to Babylon.... Surprised me.

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Thenoshows
I seem in some recent interview where they asked Keith what he's listening to and he said Bridges to Babylon.... Surprised me.

He was very proud of How Can I Stop and called it "groundbreaking" when it came out. He still likes it, I guess.

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matxil

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DandelionPowderman

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RobbedBlind

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DandelionPowderman
There are very good songs on both Dirty Work and Bridges To Babylon, hence none of them are the «very poor» records that some posters suggest.

Both albums have 4-5 very good songs on them, and that amount of very good Stones tunes make them interesting, imo.

Sometimes I wonder why people bother to listen to the Stones, if they can't stomach Harlem Shuffle, One Hit, Out Of Control or How Can I Stop.

But to each his own.

i think when most people say they are very poor, what they mean implicitly is "very poor for the stones".

i think both dirty work and bridges to babylon are very poor for the stones. i also think they're better than say 95% of what's out there. i think most of the people who criticize such albums feel the same way.

I wish that were true. Instead, people are claiming it is worse than anything ever released, unfortunately

Well, in the case of Dirty Work (and it has that in common with Their Satanic Majesties Request), I think most people would agree that there are some good songs on it (One Hit, Harlem Shuffle, Sleep Tonight). The problem is that the other half is absolutely the most embarrassing bs they ever did. And even so, as Robbed Blind says, yes, it might even be better than most of the 80's rubbish (or 60's psychedelic rubbish) that was around at the same time, but from the Stones you would expect something better.

Anyway, Bridges to Babylon was a lot better, there is nothing downright embarrassing on it, although it lacks a bit in consistency. I would say it's their best post-Undercover album.

Eh, sure, DIRTY WORK has some good songs on it - but sometimes - and DIRTY WORK is one of those times - production can kill the song. The majority of the album dooms the others, hence, there is no greater good. That is why DIRTY WORK fails as an album. BTB has some really great tracks on it and some really shitawful tracks on it. BTB is a better album than DW. Even TSMR is a better album than DW and that's astounding.

Side One
Anybody Seen My Baby
Flip The Switch
Lowdown
Already Over Me
Out Of Control

Side Two
Saint Of Me
Gunface
Might As Well Get Juiced
Thief In The Night
How Can I stop

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Witness
Your views on "Always Suffering", GasLightStreet, is only one of some more points, where I would not trust you with setting up a canon of Rolling Stones music, even if you are wellinformed and very often have interesting views.

At first hearing at the time, also to me "Always Suffering" was a disappointment and appeared rather predictable. However, against all that and despite the incidences of a reborn innovativeness about the album that I adore, soon "Always Suffering" grew to be the album's dearest gem to me.

Well then, by all means, be gleeful with listening to sub-par and poor Stones songs while the canon of Stones tunes I've set up are beyond trust worthy...

A much improved track editing which results in a much improved LP...

Flip The Switch
Anybody Seen My Baby?
Low Down
You Don't Have To Mean It
Out Of Control
Saint Of Me
Too Tight
Thief In The Night
How Can I Stop

Eliminating Always Suffering & Already Over Me of course leads to a much better album. But there are still the godawful Thief In The Night, Out Of Control and Saint Of Me...

My personal version of B2B which pleases me very much goes like this:

Flip The Switch
Anybody Seen My Baby
Lowdown
Gunface
You Dont Have To Mean It
Might As Well Get Juiced
Too Tight
How Can I Stop

That still makes no great album like Dirty Work and Undercover are but at least a good one with some true highlights. I included rather boring How Can I Stop because every Stones-album should contain a not-so-good/average/subpar song to let the true gems shine even brighter.

Apart from how the following three songs emerge individually, I immensely like the sequence of "Saint of Me", "Might As Well Get Juiced" and "Always Suffering". That sequence adds to the impact each of the songs makes, and to me as such is the very best part of the album.

I love B2B. It's from an era where I had given up on topnotch material from them. But especially when they took it on tour, and rocked those songs every night.
Only one to disappoint live was "Anybody Seen my Baby"; it suffered the same fate as "Rocks off" where IMO they should have changed the key for live rendition.
The only song on B2B I am not wild about is "Gunface".
Flip the Switch, Lowdown, Too Tight - all string rockers.
Control became a warhorse; one of the best late era songs; same goes for 'Saint of Me" - the live renditions showed that Jagger didn't need to mess with the loop and all at all.I think he did it just for his own experience. But it is superfluous. Still a good tune.
And I like the two that often are maligned: Always Suffering and Juiced.

I loved it when it came out. I retrospect I must say that it didn't aged so well. The production was very top notch at the end of the 90's, but almost 20 years later it sounds somehow dated. Ironically more dated than some their 70s or even 60s recordings.

BTB is an album I don't listen to much anymore.

I never understood why so many people seem to love Out Of Control & Saint Of Me. Mick´s affected vocals are so very annoying. Saint Of Me is so goddamn stupid. It makes me sad that the album is so watered down by Always Suffering, Already Over Me, Saint Of Me, Out Of Control & Thief In The Night.

I like Might As Well Get Juiced a lot. Love the guitars/drums on Gunface & Lowdown.

I love BRIDGES TO BABYLON except for the Biz Markie sample and the version of "Juiced" they opted to release. Only other change I would make would be to add "Any Way You Look At It."

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Rocky Dijon
I love BRIDGES TO BABYLON except for the Biz Markie sample and the version of "Juiced" they opted to release. Only other change I would make would be to add "Any Way You Look At It."

I like Juiced but that Biz Markie bit needed to go....

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GasLightStreet
A much improved track editing which results in a much improved LP...

Flip The Switch
Anybody Seen My Baby?
Low Down
You Don't Have To Mean It
Out Of Control
Saint Of Me
Too Tight
Thief In The Night
How Can I Stop

Yes, much beter tracklist, although I would take out "Too Tight" and I would add "Anyway You Look At It", which I find one of their rare post-80s gems (the guitars especially, but also the singing and the looseness of the song)

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Rocky Dijon
I love BRIDGES TO BABYLON except for the Biz Markie sample and the version of "Juiced" they opted to release. Only other change I would make would be to add "Any Way You Look At It."

Agreed, and Gunface should have been a B-side, imo.

GUNFACE .......





[www.youtube.com]



ROCKMAN

Thanks, Terry. I always wondered what happened to Wayland Flowers and Madame.

Gunface on a B-side? What a waste, Gunface is one of the most impressive tracks on B2B.

Anyway You Look At It is a bore. And imo it doesnt fit on B2B. Cannot imagine where it should have been placed.

I have it right after "How Can I Stop?" after a gap. Works quite well. I agree about "GunFace" being an album highlight. The only flaw is the dreadful abbreviated title which sounds like they were watching anime.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-05-20 02:08 by Rocky Dijon.

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HMS
Gunface on a B-side? What a waste, Gunface is one of the most impressive tracks on B2B.

Anyway You Look At It is a bore. And imo it doesnt fit on B2B. Cannot imagine where it should have been placed.

You must be a fan of Mick's mannered singing, as well as his guitar sound on that track. That's cool. I just can't take it. Not the Mother Of A Man, part umpteenth-chorus either. To each his own

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Koen
Looking at the songlist, I just cannot remember any of the songs Low Down, Gunface and Might as well get juiced. Time to dust of the CD, I guess.

Don't bother - there's nothing worth revisiting. It's not that it's so bad...in fact, upon the first few listens Flip the Switch and Keith's closing ballads seem like heavy cuts. But unlike, say, Happy or Rocks Off, you can go years and years without listening to them. B2B should really be entitled 'Inconsequential & Unessential.'

Out of Control and Saint of Me are Mick's last painfully obvious attempts to write a 'classic.' Out of Control isn't bad I guess...but it ain't a classic.

Anybody Seen My Baby? Between giving credit to kd lang or simply writing another song I would like to think at least Keith was arguing for the latter. But sadly they probably all finally realized that they were no longer capable of writing anything better...

I kinda like You Don't Have To Mean It and Already Over Me...not that I ever have a desire to listen to them.

The other songs are so bad you almost wish they'd included more kd lang covers.

There is ALWAYS something worth revisiting, imo.

Keith brilliant guitar on Already Over Me, the coda on How Can I Stop, the lovely first verse on Always Suffering and the limping slow train-beat of Thief In The Night.

The songs aren't necessarily great, but there is beauty in them – if you can enjoy small, but crucial details, that it.

I love everything about "Flip the Switch." It's the promise of The X-Pensive Winos finally delivered by The Stones.

"Anybody Seen My Baby?" is easy to pick on, but musically the guitars are perfect as is the bass. The Biz Markie sample is awful. The "No Biz" mix still has that ugly synthesizer which the sample partially masks. What was needed was a guitar solo and there isn't one until the end, but it's a beauty. The drums at times sound like they were sampled as well, other times it's glorious Charlie.

"Low Down" is also very much Winos-style. No where close to the opener, but not terrible. I suspect the "Just between you and me" would have worked better for Keith than it does for Mick.

"Already Over Me" is easy to pick on for Mick's vocals, but I think the song is solid and displays real emotion. It works for me. I would have been curious to hear the Babyface version, but I see nothing wrong with this one at all. Miles above "Following the River" or "Streets of Love."

"GunFace" works for me. Great guitar and vocal. Convincing anger rather than the cartoonish "Fight" or the half-baked outrage of "Sweet Neo Con" or "I Can't Take It." For me, there's a direct line from "Commit a Crime" to this one. I love it almost as much as "Flip the Switch."

"You Don't Have To Mean It" is Keith's best Jamaican number after "Too Rude." Infectious is the word. A real beauty of a song.

"Out of Control" is a great song. I love the dichotomy between the melancholy verses and the literally out of control chorus. This one works great for me. I'll take Danny Saber's final mix over the album cut, though.

"Saint of Me" is another great one. The riff, the lyrics, the groove. It's both pop and gospel. Everything about it works. A real pleasure.

"Juiced" is a near-miss. Get rid of the synthesizers and you've got a mother of a blues song here that I can tell I love. It's not a ruined masterpiece, but it could have been much stronger without the trendiness applied.

"Always Suffering" is lovely. Serene and melancholy with a chorus that again, shows the influence of the Winos. I love it. An acoustic gem.

"Too Tight" is a treasure. Great riff and drumming. Great lyrics. Mick sounds as spiteful as he did thirty years earlier. A lost gem that should have traded places with "Low Down."

"Thief in the Night" is ponderous. Keith is lost in the groove. There are interesting ideas, but it all seems a bit unfocused. The drums and electric guitar kicking in at the end are welcome, though. As are the backing vocals. I don't think Keith's f-bomb is impressive in and of itself. Audience reaction to it always struck me as embarrassing. It was as if it was a naughty word to them.

"How Can I Stop?" is gorgeous. It's placement with "Thief in the Night" might erode some of its impact, but the thing is perfection. Keith getting lost in the groove works well with the hook line of not being able to stop and that coda is a joy to hear.

"Any Way You Look At It" is another acoustic gem. The reference to "Point of View" (Keith's Jamaican hideaway) recalls "Make No Mistake" and the mid-section is right out of "As Tears Go By." I love the tune.