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Olly

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keefriffhards

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Olly

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keefriffhards

Keith said the reason Bill left was because he refused to fly any more. He kept travelling from state to state, city to city by other means.

Yes, good point. This must've had an impact on the band dynamic.

I can see why that other site peed you off a bit.
I just has a look and they think i am a moron.
well their right about something lol

And I was referred to as 'dense', so that makes two of us!

making fun of stones fans is not exactly the most welcoming way to start a new forum for stones fans is it?

drake seems to have the best intentions however, i hope that it turns around when he puts the page with periscope embedded into a chat window up. course, that requires the band to tour... but i'm confident they will.

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Olly

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keefriffhards

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Olly

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keefriffhards

Keith said the reason Bill left was because he refused to fly any more. He kept travelling from state to state, city to city by other means.

Yes, good point. This must've had an impact on the band dynamic.

I can see why that other site peed you off a bit.
I just has a look and they think i am a moron.
well their right about something lol

And I was referred to as 'dense', so that makes two of us!

I suggested on here the other day that lipsogreen may of started their new site, so yes i am a moron and you are dense lol
Its all sticks and Stones to me.

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SweetThing

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Olly

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keefriffhards

Keith said the reason Bill left was because he refused to fly any more. He kept travelling from state to state, city to city by other means.

Yes, good point. This must've had an impact on the band dynamic.

I imagine that Bill's alternate travel plans are greatly exaggerated by Keith.

And how would it have an impact on band dynamics anyway? Keith and Bill barely spoke to each other for decades, and I don't think The Glimmers were spending any time together really... unless you believe they're "thick as thieves" ...surely another gross exaggeration.

Regardless, Bill's fear of flying was a major factor in his deciding to leave. He hasn't flown for touring purposes in the Rhythm Kings or other ventures.

Him quitting over fear of flying is silly. They should have just given him a qualude knocked him and thrown his ass on the plane. It worked for the A-Team

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TeddyB1018

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SweetThing

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Olly

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keefriffhards

Keith said the reason Bill left was because he refused to fly any more. He kept travelling from state to state, city to city by other means.

Yes, good point. This must've had an impact on the band dynamic.

I imagine that Bill's alternate travel plans are greatly exaggerated by Keith.

And how would it have an impact on band dynamics anyway? Keith and Bill barely spoke to each other for decades, and I don't think The Glimmers were spending any time together really... unless you believe they're "thick as thieves" ...surely another gross exaggeration.

Regardless, Bill's fear of flying was a major factor in his deciding to leave. He hasn't flown for touring purposes in the Rhythm Kings or other ventures.

Yes, that's not really in question. But did Bill travel separately for most of the Steel Wheels tour? He prefers not to fly, we know that. Goes out of his way nowadays not to fly. But he also said he thought he was going to be more involved in the 50 and counting and then felt it was not worth it to continue for only two songs. Presumably he would've flown to the US and some after that where unavoidable. And, he did fly to the US once since he quit didn't he? To promote something, but I don't recall what.

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Rockman
And the RS store would probably be selling metal-detectors ...

in addition to the Rolling Stones rock tumblers [www.ebay.com]

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Munichhilton
I prefer Darryl...

I do too

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More Hot Rocks

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Munichhilton
I prefer Darryl...

I do too

Fantastic. Please explain to me, if you would be so kind, what it is you like. I've never read a journalist mention anything at all about his Stones' playing. Myself I've never been able to get a hold of exactly what he does that adds anything to the Stones sound that couldn't be done by just about any competent bassist.

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Rollin92
Olly, it's a shame that you haven't appreciated Bill's bass playing throughout the recordings. I highlight the Hampton 1981 concert as one example. I hope one day you give him his dues, I know he's not as exciting as Darryl Jones or technically as able but that isn't the be all and end all, it's about understanding the music and the mood, and Bill did that just fine.

When was Darryl exciting with the Stones? I just listened to Bill pumping out the bass on Live With Me on the Marquee CD. THAT's exciting.

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Olly

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Naturalust

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Olly
Can we agree that Wyman made a wise decision to leave the band when he did?

Probably not Olly. I sure wish he had stayed from a purely selfish musical perspective. I think he could have hung in there and gained considerable financial reward as well. They have really developed the business since he left, I can't imagine playing bass for the Rolling Stones would be so difficult to endure considering the benefits. I also think if he would have stuck it out he would really enjoy the current more sober band.

But the real question is did he think he made a wise decision. He says so but I also get the feeling he misses the adoration and excitement of touring with the Stones and is a bit too proud to ever discuss it with brutal honesty.

Yes, it's hard for me to imagine Wyman on the more recent Stones tours; perhaps because of his relatively advanced years and his general stage presence.

Hell, he might seem more mobile than Keith, now that Keith's an arthritic mummy compared to earlier tours.

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24FPS

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Olly

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Naturalust

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Olly
Can we agree that Wyman made a wise decision to leave the band when he did?

Probably not Olly. I sure wish he had stayed from a purely selfish musical perspective. I think he could have hung in there and gained considerable financial reward as well. They have really developed the business since he left, I can't imagine playing bass for the Rolling Stones would be so difficult to endure considering the benefits. I also think if he would have stuck it out he would really enjoy the current more sober band.

But the real question is did he think he made a wise decision. He says so but I also get the feeling he misses the adoration and excitement of touring with the Stones and is a bit too proud to ever discuss it with brutal honesty.

Yes, it's hard for me to imagine Wyman on the more recent Stones tours; perhaps because of his relatively advanced years and his general stage presence.

Hell, he might seem more mobile than Keith, now that Keith's an arthritic mummy compared to earlier tours.

because of his stage presence? really olly? bill wyman defined the proper stage presence of a stones bassist : it is and will always be the job of the bass player to look bored, slightly aloof of the band, and giving creepy smiles to women in the crowd.

bill wyman defines what a stones bassist should be. whatever bill wyman did/would do is the definition of what the stones bassist should.

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Olly

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Naturalust

Olly if the grimace you are referring to is the one at 0:59 in the video below, I think you may be totally misinterpreting Bills expression. It actually looks to me as it he is actually getting into his own playing there at the start of the phrase in way that is quite characteristic of many rock guitarists (like Joe Walsh or even Ronnie). Not a common sight for Bill, of course, but it seems to me like just the opposite of what you describe.

[www.youtube.com]

Yes, that's the one Naturalust. You may be right and the moment's singular nature may be the reason it stands out to me.

Can we agree that Wyman made a wise decision to leave the band when he did?

I think he's dancing, there...

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Turner68

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24FPS

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Olly

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Naturalust

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Olly
Can we agree that Wyman made a wise decision to leave the band when he did?

Probably not Olly. I sure wish he had stayed from a purely selfish musical perspective. I think he could have hung in there and gained considerable financial reward as well. They have really developed the business since he left, I can't imagine playing bass for the Rolling Stones would be so difficult to endure considering the benefits. I also think if he would have stuck it out he would really enjoy the current more sober band.

But the real question is did he think he made a wise decision. He says so but I also get the feeling he misses the adoration and excitement of touring with the Stones and is a bit too proud to ever discuss it with brutal honesty.

Yes, it's hard for me to imagine Wyman on the more recent Stones tours; perhaps because of his relatively advanced years and his general stage presence.

Hell, he might seem more mobile than Keith, now that Keith's an arthritic mummy compared to earlier tours.

because of his stage presence? really olly? bill wyman defined the proper stage presence of a stones bassist : it is and will always be the job of the bass player to look bored, slightly aloof of the band, and giving creepy smiles to women in the crowd.

bill wyman defines what a stones bassist should be. whatever bill wyman did/would do is the definition of what the stones bassist should.

That reminds me of watching Miss You on Hampton. There's all this funky bass all over the place, encircling everything. You search for where the sound is coming from and it's like, "That little English guy? No."

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Rockman
he misses the adoration and excitement of touring with the Stones and is a bit too proud to ever discuss it with brutal honesty.

YEP!!! ...

Well put and he will never ever say the truth about missing the considerable financial rewards.

here is a clip from MTV covering bill's departure at the time...

notice keith is obviously not happy about it, saying they are still trying to convince to stay, doing whatever it takes, and that if he does go they will have a very large hole to fill.

Darryl and Bill are completely different stories. I respect both of them, but prefer Darryl. Their sound got groovier with him. I can't say HTW or IORR were taken into new heights when Bill guested at O2 in 2012. Still I would love to hear a full Stones concert with Bill again. Maybe it would refresh their sound. Somehow everything has gotten a bit too steady and rock solid and predictable with Darryl on the bass the last years. His playing does nothing to save the not so good Stones concerts these days. Bill is a far more adventurous bass player. Darryl is more advanced.

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TheBlockbuster
Darryl and Bill are completely different stories. I respect both of them, but prefer Darryl. Their sound got groovier with him. I can't say HTW or IORR were taken into new heights when Bill guested at O2 in 2012. Still I would love to hear a full Stones concert with Bill again. Maybe it would refresh their sound. Somehow everything has gotten a bit too steady and rock solid and predictable with Darryl on the bass the last years. His playing does nothing to save the not so good Stones concerts these days. Bill is a far more adventurous bass player. Darryl is more advanced.

do you think the much slower tempos of the songs these days impacts how darryl plays and what he can do?

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24FPS

Hell, he might seem more mobile than Keith, now that Keith's an arthritic mummy compared to earlier tours.

Calling Keith an "arthritic mummy" is way over the top. And it is a massive offense. None of us knows in what condition we will be at Keith´s age. I hope at 72 I will be as mobile as Keith is today. An apology for this very unkind words would be appropriate. It seems you like to get me into hammering my table and blushing with anger again.
To post at a stones-messageboard, "Keith is an arthritic mummy", that´s ubelievable, simply unbelievable...

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Turner68
I wish he'd stayed in the band. They wouldn't have written better songs, but their tours would have been much more fun.

Thoughts?

Wood, Richards and Jagger created enough fun, I think. Bill didn't move a step or two, but he delivered the perfect sound for a band like the Stones.

On a personal note: Taylor's departure was even a bigger loss to me, again, musically. He didn't move a step either.

Neither Bill nor MT was the core of the Stones. They were soldiers and soldiers can be replaced at any time. I became Stones-fan in 1982 long after MT´s departure. So he always was only part of Stones-history to me, very much like Brian. Bills departure made no big impression on me, he was always a soldier to me. I always knew the Stones would find proper substitute for Bill.

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HMS
They were soldiers and soldiers can be replaced at any time.

Maybe you should get an ear to the "Black Limousine" version of "Rock'n Roll Animals" 1st CD.

It's good to listen to all periods of the Stones up through 1990. Except for his outstanding multi-instrumental contributions, including impeccable slide, it's good to dig in and hear what Brian was doing on rhythm guitar. That 63-66 group is its own entity, and would be a treasured memory today if that's all they ever did.

And Mick Taylor didn't particularly change the inner workings of the Stones groove, IMO, but added a layer of melodic sophistication.

You've got to have a good bass player for the bottom and the melody, and Bill excelled at practically every turn they made. He was not a soldier. He's part of the sound. His counter melody on Satisfaction is what gives it the tension. Same with Start Me Up.

And HMS, I won't be apologizing today. I'll admit saying 'arthritic mummy' is a bit controversial, but that's because it strikes a nerve. Keith has been getting a little looser on stage lately, but damn, look at him in 2012. And he's not even chewing gum and looking for chicks!

And screw Darryl's playing. I still haven't heard him add anything lovely to a Stones ballad. What? Is Stones music too beneath him to contribute to? It's the old Mick Taylor syndrome.

Keith was indeed rather static in the beginning of the 50&counting tour. But that has changed with recent tours. He´s kicking the air like in old times and he´s even sometimes running, not bad at all for an arthritic mummy. One time he even fell on his face without crumbling to dust...

Darryl does not add much, maybe because the Stones or their "musical director" don´t want him to do so. They hired him for timekeeping. I think Darryl delivers what he´s got paid for. Nevertheless I do believe he and Charlie are a good team. Charlie loves Jazz and maybe he likes it a lot to have a Jazz player in the band.

I see lots of analogies between MT and DJ.

Both are younger than the rest of the band.

Both have "technical" skills that exceeded by far the needs of the repertoire of the band.

Both have a radically different style from their respective predecessors.

Both had a huge impact on the sound of the band. Yet, neither of them, as good as they are, can be considered particularly "original" in their respective fields (there are many guitarists a la MT, and many bassists a la DJ. There has been only one Brian and I can't think of another bassist that interpreted the role like Bill). So the big element of novelty with respect to the past has more to do with what they do not play rather than what they play.

Of course both MT and DJ had, in theory, the technical competence to easily play note by note what Brian and Bill did. But the attitude you need to play like Brian and Bill does not belong to their personalities.

In fact, neither MT nor DJ are "rock stars" (pun intended).

Years ago, when I saw my first and only Rhythm Kings' concert, I was impressed by the visual power that Bill still had. His band mates - all great musicians - looked just like any other bar-band player in the world. Bill had the charisma of a true rock star. Bill was a piece of rock history and you could see it.

I never saw Brian Jones in flesh and bones, but there are thousands of pictures and quite some footage too, that tell the same story.

But if we accept the fact that MT and DJ are no Brian and Bill, it's easier to recognize their contribution to the cause.

Well, MT already has a few fans.

I think it's about time we render unto Darryl the things that are Darryl's!

Since I've started playing bass, some years ago, I have a whole new dimension of respect for DJ.

The guy has a fantastic groove and tone. He pulls like a wild horse. His choice of note is less chic than Bill's but equally visceral.

Just listen to Street Fighting Man Zurich 2003 for example, and dare tell me that DJ doesn't fit in the stones!!


C

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liddas
I see lots of analogies between MT and DJ.

Both are younger than the rest of the band.

Both have "technical" skills that exceeded by far the needs of the repertoire of the band.

Both have a radically different style from their respective predecessors.

Both had a huge impact on the sound of the band. Yet, neither of them, as good as they are, can be considered particularly "original" in their respective fields (there are many guitarists a la MT, and many bassists a la DJ. There has been only one Brian and I can't think of another bassist that interpreted the role like Bill). So the big element of novelty with respect to the past has more to do with what they do not play rather than what they play.

Of course both MT and DJ had, in theory, the technical competence to easily play note by note what Brian and Bill did. But the attitude you need to play like Brian and Bill does not belong to their personalities.

In fact, neither MT nor DJ are "rock stars" (pun intended).

Years ago, when I saw my first and only Rhythm Kings' concert, I was impressed by the visual power that Bill still had. His band mates - all great musicians - looked just like any other bar-band player in the world. Bill had the charisma of a true rock star. Bill was a piece of rock history and you could see it.

I never saw Brian Jones in flesh and bones, but there are thousands of pictures and quite some footage too, that tell the same story.

But if we accept the fact that MT and DJ are no Brian and Bill, it's easier to recognize their contribution to the cause.

Well, MT already has a few fans.

I think it's about time we render unto Darryl the things that are Darryl's!

Since I've started playing bass, some years ago, I have a whole new dimension of respect for DJ.

The guy has a fantastic groove and tone. He pulls like a wild horse. His choice of note is less chic than Bill's but equally visceral.

Just listen to Street Fighting Man Zurich 2003 for example, and dare tell me that DJ doesn't fit in the stones!!


C

Nice well thought out analogy. Again, maybe Darryl's a great jazz player, but he ain't no rock and roller.

i'm not sure bill wyman is ever going to forgive me for not forgiving him for leaving.

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Munichhilton

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King Bee
No Jones No Stones

I like this. Its almost something a crowd could chant. Its not true but I like it.

Here let me try one

No beers no hangover....wait, that doesn't rhyme

No god, no dog.