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kleermaker

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Naturalust

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kleermaker

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71Tele

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Naturalust
Ronnie had it going on for this one!






peace

I just don't hear it. Huge step down from two years earlier, and I mean the whole thing, not just the solos.

Let's compare (though Taylor never played a 6 (six!) minutes long solo! I think this is the longest solo he ever played with the Stones (4:10 - 7:35), thus 3:25 only:

Well, I like 'em both. They are both pretty representative of the styles of the two guitarists. It's not my favorite Taylor solo by a long shot, his noodling up and down the scales is technically competent but doesn't have as much emotional content as much of his other work, imo.

peace

If you only hear "noodling up and down the scales" and experience no emotional content - the different moods of this song his guitar do reflect - well, then it's end of story.

Imo the essential differences between those two solos are that one of them has nothing to tell, it's just trial and error with the chords of the song, even randomly, telling nothing, just loose notes, and the other is built according a lyrical pattern. But as Luxury Stones said elsewhere: one has to have ears for that. I would admit: also an emotional antenna.

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Sacke


Wew, I thought Naturalist wasn't serious ('Ronnie had it going on for this one!'), but he was...
Although Ron his sound is okay on this version, I stopped counting the notes he is missing ('just trial and error'). What a mess...

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Naturalust
Ok kleerie, I re-listened to both solos. This time I listened to the whole song. With Taylor, there are moments of pure brilliance in his playing. When he comes in with the solo, it's pretty powerful, the first half of the solo is awesome, the second half is a bit less so. Considering how simple musically the vocal line is, it's hard to hear where he is specifically playing off the vocal line, a you suggest. Perhaps you could point out where you are talking about. To me he is just riffing off the minor and major pentatonic scales.

The Wood solo actually seems to draw from the vocal line more than the Taylor solo, at least initally, certainly less notes, but some sweet ones, imo. Ronnie seems to find something that sound good and then exploits it for a few bars. One thing I like about it is that he seems to be listening to the others a bit more, leaving more space between his playing for the groove to re-establish itself. And overall it seems a bit less repetitive than Taylor's approach. Ronnie's also seems to built a slight bit better, starting less adventurous and building to some rather exciting playing, while Taylor leaves the gate at full throttle and seems to slowly bring it back down by the end. Different guitarists, different approach.

But like I said earlier, I like them both. Both are great examples of Stones solos and both work well of the simple two chord groove. Ronnie's is one of the best I've ever heard from him and Taylor's another great one in a huge pile of great ones.

peace

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kleermaker

I guess it's difficult to listen to it without guitarists ears, but that is needed. Put those guitarists ears off and listen with emotional ears, so to speak. Taylor is telling a story, he is 'wording' the emotions that are in the song: the wanting, the longing, the trying, the frustration, and in the end, played wonderfully softly, (talking about dynamics), it's resignation: you can't always get what you want, however hard you try. Man, he telling the story of the song. Vocal lines don't matter then. The last part of his solo, the way he ends it, that's pure drama. Forget about scales and major and minor.

Ronnie's one on the contrary is trial and error with the melody, seeking and trying, but not finding any musical path, let alone hitting the emotions of the song. During his solo he's getting lost. And that for six long minutes. I wonder what Jagger might have thought.

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DandelionPowderman

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71Tele
Mick Taylor
I Don't Know Why
Love In Vain (Ya Yas version)
Sway
Shine A Light
You Can't Always Get What you Want (Brussels)
All Down The Line
Winter

Keith Richards
Little Queenie (Ya Yas)
Bitch
Sympathy For The Devil (Ya Yas)

Ron Wood
When The Whip Comes Down
Hey Negrita (ok, not really a solo)
Far Awy Eyes (pedal steel)

Did Brian or Mick J. play any solos? Can't think of any.

Brian played several slide solos, like the one I posted.

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Naturalust

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kleermaker

I guess it's difficult to listen to it without guitarists ears, but that is needed. Put those guitarists ears off and listen with emotional ears, so to speak. Taylor is telling a story, he is 'wording' the emotions that are in the song: the wanting, the longing, the trying, the frustration, and in the end, played wonderfully softly, (talking about dynamics), it's resignation: you can't always get what you want, however hard you try. Man, he telling the story of the song. Vocal lines don't matter then. The last part of his solo, the way he ends it, that's pure drama. Forget about scales and major and minor.

Ronnie's one on the contrary is trial and error with the melody, seeking and trying, but not finding any musical path, let alone hitting the emotions of the song. During his solo he's getting lost. And that for six long minutes. I wonder what Jagger might have thought.

Yes I do hear and understand your points, they are good ones. Perhaps one could describe Ronnie's trial and error approach as wanting, longing, frustration and not getting what you want too, maybe in a more literal sense. Ha. I guess one of the things I'm appreciating about the Wood solo is that he is indeed trying...its got some enthusiasm and tone that has disappeared from his playing for quite some time.

peace

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DandelionPowderman
It's baffling that people can't hear that fat tone on stuff like WAY and YCAGWYW, even in 2013/14.

Don't you even listen?

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Naturalust
Ronnie had it going on for this one!






peace

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DandelionPowderman
It's baffling that people can't hear that fat tone on stuff like WAY and YCAGWYW, even in 2013/14.

Don't you even listen?

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DandelionPowderman
How can three or four clean notes be godawful? One can blame the arrangement, but not the notes Ronnie plays on it, imo. There are some exceptions, of course.

Btw, I replied to the critique of his tone.

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kleermaker
You made me laugh by that one Naturalust.

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Naturalust
Now if you want to make me smile, find a good Wood solo and post it.

peace

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Naturalust

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kleermaker
You made me laugh by that one Naturalust.

Well that was my intention....sometimes we take it all a bit too seriously. Overall we are lucky to be able to have such good music and the time to analyse it in such detail. My love for Taylor's work is pretty obvious but sometimes I feel the need to give Ronnie his dues too.

Now if you want to make me smile, find a good Wood solo and post it.

peace

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Stoneburst

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DandelionPowderman
How can three or four clean notes be godawful? One can blame the arrangement, but not the notes Ronnie plays on it, imo. There are some exceptions, of course.

Btw, I replied to the critique of his tone.

Yes, but you also denied that he makes mistakes in his solos and implied that the only people who think he does aren't guitar players. This is nonsense. Take the Glastonbury solo, which we've discussed here before. It contains several glaringly obvious mistakes that no halfway decent player should make, and basically just sounds clumsy and phoned-in. If you don't hear that, you're the one that isn't listening.

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DandelionPowderman
And I wondered where the so-called errors were in his 1975 solo.

PS: Is it that hard to find good Keith and Brian solos?

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Naturalust

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DandelionPowderman
And I wondered where the so-called errors were in his 1975 solo.

PS: Is it that hard to find good Keith and Brian solos?

I didn't hear errors in his 1975 solo. I think the trial and error reference to that solo referred to his general approach of (fearlessly) trying different licks and runs as opposed to a more thought out cohesive approach. IMO, his trials all worked pretty well and his fearless approach was refreshing. That's one of the reasons like it and posted it.

Feel free to post those good Keith and Brian solos, I'm all ears.

peace