Tell Me :
Talk
Why are you holding Taylor to a different standard than brilliant musicians in other bands? Do you criticize Charlie for not being a writer? Most bands are lucky to have one great writer, let alone two. Taylor's role was as a supporting musician supplying color and texture, and he did that brilliantly. To criticize him for not being a writer is like criticizing Willie Mays for not being a pitcher (baseball reference in case you are not a Yank).
Tele, I guess due to your long absence you don't know much about HMS's posts and his endless campaigning for Dirty Work being a great album (kind of a HMS trademark!), along with Shine A Light being their best live album while regarding YaYas as "just mediocre" and "boring"... I mean, it's free speech and all that and everybody is entitled to his/her own opinions, but some opinions just seem so odd and so out of frame that I have a hard time not believing that HMS is just a troll. Or maybe just too young to know - who knows.
I mean, everybody with at least a glimpse of understanding of the music business in general should understand that the sheer fact of playing in a band like the Rolling Stones for five years alone is enough to gain a "legendary status" even if one does not understand the value of Taylor's contributions to their studio output and live sound, in particular in the context of the times.
Now he's even bashing GHS and IORR as "two of the Stones most mediocre albums" containing "rather ridiculos Jagger-ballads" (Winter? Time Waits For no One?) - I'm quite speechless. A hopeless case.
I have to admit that I dont like most of the ballads on GHS/IORR.
Till The Next Goodbye, Time Waits For No One, If You Really Want To Be My Friend, Angie, Winter are all bloated, rather unispired, over-long and overproduced to my ears. Sometimes it´s pure schmaltzy kitsch and MJ at times sounds like a caricature.
Its been said that Mick Taylor co-wrote Winter, Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One, so I refuse to imagine what further schmaltz a Mick/Mick-songwriting-partnership would have produced. Those songs are pointing straight ahead into a very, very wrong direction. GHS and IORR, imo, are the Stones-albums with the smallest amount of great and real outstanding songs, just about two, maybe three killers can be found on those albums, definitely not enough for an enjoyable album. Even very weak Steel Wheels has more killer tracks. So GHS/IORR are indeed mediocre to my ears and at the same time GHS/IORR are remarkably the albums on which Mick Taylor is most prominent as a guitar player. All this makes me often think that Mick Taylor´s influence wasnt good for the Stones.
It sounds like Donald Trump has joined the board....
In this kook's instance, opinions can be wrong, and HMS' is very very wrong.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-29 16:37 by GasLightStreet.
Let's see... for someone that says "Sometimes it´s pure schmaltzy kitsch and MJ at times sounds like a caricature" isn't talking about DIRTY WORK says a lot.
So "Its been said that Mick Taylor co-wrote Winter, Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One, so I refuse to imagine what further schmaltz a Mick/Mick-songwriting-partnership would have produced. Those songs are pointing straight ahead into a very, very wrong direction." gives you reason to refuse to imagine what further... yet you choose to neglect songs from STICKY FINGERS and EXILE (one for sure) in terms of what Taylor had a hand in co-writing that he gets no credit for except for the EXILE one.
You do know there are ballads on Black & Blue?
"As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four."
It is part of big four: BB, LIB, SF and EOMS.
Exile was Keith's masterpiece.
Mick didn't like it.
He wasn't happy with the mix. You'll never find a quote where Mick says he didn't like Exile.
Because Mick was the one who "edited" the album, put it together, sequenced it, hired the additional musicians that put the final touch to the album and made it really fantastic.
It took him almost three months on and off between Dec. 71 and Feb. 72.
By comparison, "finishing" Fingers was a breeze.
Then, that it is not one of the best....
"Exile On Main Street is not one of my favourite albums, although I think the record does have a particular feeling. I'm not too sure how great the songs are, but put together it's a nice piece. However, when I listen to Exile it has some of the worst mixes I've ever heard. I'd love to remix the record, not just because of the vocals, but because generally I think it sounds lousy... Of course I'm ultimately responsible for it, but it's really not good and there's no concerted effort or intention... As long as people like the album, that's fine. It's just that I don't particularly think it's a great album.
-Mick Jagger, 2003
But he has also mentioned good things about it.
He agrees with all the hard core fans about the vibe, wholeness and feeling of it, and dislikes the mix (which baffles me)...
Black And Blue has about 4 decent songs. Cherry Oh Baby and Melody are not very interesting and Fool To Cry makes me cringe. I don't care much for Hot Stuff either. It would have been much better if Slave and Worried About You would have been included instead.
I like both Goats Head Soup and It's Only Rock 'N' Roll better than Black And Blue.
Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-30 06:22 by boogaloojef.
The only way HMS is right about EOMS being better as a single LP is that... it wouldn't be bad. How could it be?
Aside from that... how someone can't hear the brilliance of Moonlight Mile is just horrific. Of course, it says a lot that the loaf loves the yellow, green, pink, red and blue rubbish. There's colour blind and obviously there's Good Music Blind, er, Deaf. As well as Bad Music Deaf.
No one goes on and on about Taylor hardly being on LIB because, well, only HMS goes on and on about how much Taylor is not on LIB and make s a big whup about something that is well know. As usual he can't hear what makes GHS and IORR great and good albums in the post-EOMS way that they are yet blathers about BAB being as good as EMOS because... Taylor isn't on it. Taylor couldn't save GHS and IORR? So... he saved SF and EOMS then, at least, according to the "logic" of Looney Kooks. Almost as if Taylor said it himself. Total lunacy, as usual.
He is wrong, as usual, again, this time about EOMS not being in The Big Four because he implies it could have been part of their Big Four but not only doesn't say what he thinks they are but somehow doesn't think The Big Four ends with EOMS and he is either ignorant of that fact or, well, he does think their worst album is a masterpiece so... Looney Kooks is on full time reruns.
I fully agree.
Exile isnt part of the Big Four, it just isnt.
I´ve always said that and will keep on saying that no matter how unpopular that opinion might be amongst fans.
Do you stand the whole time and cheer in between songs?
I've often said Dirty Work isn't in the Big 20. It may be unpopular, but I stand by it!
Not quoted from my post..
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
stonesrule
()
Date: July 28, 2016 19:49
Well-put TravelinMan!
Taylor was a wonderful guitarist..in those days. And the Stones fully
appreciated his talent. He was also a "mixed up kid" as a person. Being around Keith and Bobby was not necessarily easy.
Taylor was a wonderful guitarist..in those days. And the Stones fully
appreciated his talent. He was also a "mixed up kid" as a person. Being around Keith and Bobby was not necessarily easy.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
shortfatfanny
()
Date: July 28, 2016 20:43
Quote
TravelinManQuote
TravelinManQuote
dcbaQuote
shortfatfanny
Welcome to the Taylor bashing patrol.
Bashing? I called him an exceptional embellisher. Where's the bashing?
MT cannot write a memorable tune to save his life (unless you think "Twisted Sister" is as good as a Stones song) that's fact not bashing.
And you could ask yourself one thing :
if Taylor brought everything that was good in the Stones's music circa 69-74 how come what he did with Jack Bruce in 75 was complete crap? Taylor was still young hot and t the height of his talent, right? How come his "genius" that had infused SF Exile and others did not infuse Bruce's horrible prog mush?
Answers?
Twisted Sister and other songs from his self titled and A Stone's Throw albums are more enjoyable than many Stones songs from the 80's/90's. Jagger/Richards wrote a lot of garbage in addition to their many gems.
Taylor should have gone solo while he was a known guitarist if he wanted to make a splash. By the time he went solo, he was out of the limelight. Keith Richards said his solo album was excellent, and Richards has penned some of the greatest rock songs ever! The Jack Bruce period was a drug-induced haze of self indulgence for all included. It is what it is, and couldn't be saved.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: July 29, 2016 00:06
Quote
HMS
He´s just a player with almost no writing skills. He is lost without songs and he havent had a song since he left the Stones. Maybe another player would have added even more to albums like Exile, SF, GHS, IORR. We will never know... In fact he stretched out only a very times with the Stones, mostly on rather ridicilous Jagger-ballads, as can be found on GHS & IORR. He´s most prominent on two of the Stones´ most mediocre albums (GHS, IORR), has a spot on CYHMK & Sway and is very inconspicuous on Exile, has two overdubs on LIB. That´s not very much, imo. I dont know how can some people build a legend on that...
Why are you holding Taylor to a different standard than brilliant musicians in other bands? Do you criticize Charlie for not being a writer? Most bands are lucky to have one great writer, let alone two. Taylor's role was as a supporting musician supplying color and texture, and he did that brilliantly. To criticize him for not being a writer is like criticizing Willie Mays for not being a pitcher (baseball reference in case you are not a Yank).
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
alimente
()
Date: July 29, 2016 04:36
Quote
71TeleQuote
HMS
He´s just a player with almost no writing skills. He is lost without songs and he havent had a song since he left the Stones. Maybe another player would have added even more to albums like Exile, SF, GHS, IORR. We will never know... In fact he stretched out only a very times with the Stones, mostly on rather ridicilous Jagger-ballads, as can be found on GHS & IORR. He´s most prominent on two of the Stones´ most mediocre albums (GHS, IORR), has a spot on CYHMK & Sway and is very inconspicuous on Exile, has two overdubs on LIB. That´s not very much, imo. I dont know how can some people build a legend on that...
Why are you holding Taylor to a different standard than brilliant musicians in other bands? Do you criticize Charlie for not being a writer? Most bands are lucky to have one great writer, let alone two. Taylor's role was as a supporting musician supplying color and texture, and he did that brilliantly. To criticize him for not being a writer is like criticizing Willie Mays for not being a pitcher (baseball reference in case you are not a Yank).
Tele, I guess due to your long absence you don't know much about HMS's posts and his endless campaigning for Dirty Work being a great album (kind of a HMS trademark!), along with Shine A Light being their best live album while regarding YaYas as "just mediocre" and "boring"... I mean, it's free speech and all that and everybody is entitled to his/her own opinions, but some opinions just seem so odd and so out of frame that I have a hard time not believing that HMS is just a troll. Or maybe just too young to know - who knows.
I mean, everybody with at least a glimpse of understanding of the music business in general should understand that the sheer fact of playing in a band like the Rolling Stones for five years alone is enough to gain a "legendary status" even if one does not understand the value of Taylor's contributions to their studio output and live sound, in particular in the context of the times.
Now he's even bashing GHS and IORR as "two of the Stones most mediocre albums" containing "rather ridiculos Jagger-ballads" (Winter? Time Waits For no One?) - I'm quite speechless. A hopeless case.
Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: July 29, 2016 07:33
Shine A Light is better than Ya Yas like Millard Fillmore was better than Abraham Lincoln.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-29 07:34 by 71Tele.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-29 07:34 by 71Tele.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: July 29, 2016 14:02
Quote
alimente
Now he's even bashing GHS and IORR as "two of the Stones most mediocre albums" containing "rather ridiculos Jagger-ballads" (Winter? Time Waits For no One?) - I'm quite speechless. A hopeless case.
I have to admit that I dont like most of the ballads on GHS/IORR.
Till The Next Goodbye, Time Waits For No One, If You Really Want To Be My Friend, Angie, Winter are all bloated, rather unispired, over-long and overproduced to my ears. Sometimes it´s pure schmaltzy kitsch and MJ at times sounds like a caricature.
Its been said that Mick Taylor co-wrote Winter, Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One, so I refuse to imagine what further schmaltz a Mick/Mick-songwriting-partnership would have produced. Those songs are pointing straight ahead into a very, very wrong direction. GHS and IORR, imo, are the Stones-albums with the smallest amount of great and real outstanding songs, just about two, maybe three killers can be found on those albums, definitely not enough for an enjoyable album. Even very weak Steel Wheels has more killer tracks. So GHS/IORR are indeed mediocre to my ears and at the same time GHS/IORR are remarkably the albums on which Mick Taylor is most prominent as a guitar player. All this makes me often think that Mick Taylor´s influence wasnt good for the Stones.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
mtaylor
()
Date: July 29, 2016 14:27
Quote
HMSQuote
alimente
Now he's even bashing GHS and IORR as "two of the Stones most mediocre albums" containing "rather ridiculos Jagger-ballads" (Winter? Time Waits For no One?) - I'm quite speechless. A hopeless case.
I have to admit that I dont like most of the ballads on GHS/IORR.
Till The Next Goodbye, Time Waits For No One, If You Really Want To Be My Friend, Angie, Winter are all bloated, rather unispired, over-long and overproduced to my ears. Sometimes it´s pure schmaltzy kitsch and MJ at times sounds like a caricature.
Its been said that Mick Taylor co-wrote Winter, Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One, so I refuse to imagine what further schmaltz a Mick/Mick-songwriting-partnership would have produced. Those songs are pointing straight ahead into a very, very wrong direction. GHS and IORR, imo, are the Stones-albums with the smallest amount of great and real outstanding songs, just about two, maybe three killers can be found on those albums, definitely not enough for an enjoyable album. Even very weak Steel Wheels has more killer tracks. So GHS/IORR are indeed mediocre to my ears and at the same time GHS/IORR are remarkably the albums on which Mick Taylor is most prominent as a guitar player. All this makes me often think that Mick Taylor´s influence wasnt good for the Stones.
It sounds like Donald Trump has joined the board....
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: July 29, 2016 16:36
Quote
alimenteQuote
71TeleQuote
HMS
He´s just a player with almost no writing skills. He is lost without songs and he havent had a song since he left the Stones. Maybe another player would have added even more to albums like Exile, SF, GHS, IORR. We will never know... In fact he stretched out only a very times with the Stones, mostly on rather ridicilous Jagger-ballads, as can be found on GHS & IORR. He´s most prominent on two of the Stones´ most mediocre albums (GHS, IORR), has a spot on CYHMK & Sway and is very inconspicuous on Exile, has two overdubs on LIB. That´s not very much, imo. I dont know how can some people build a legend on that...
Why are you holding Taylor to a different standard than brilliant musicians in other bands? Do you criticize Charlie for not being a writer? Most bands are lucky to have one great writer, let alone two. Taylor's role was as a supporting musician supplying color and texture, and he did that brilliantly. To criticize him for not being a writer is like criticizing Willie Mays for not being a pitcher (baseball reference in case you are not a Yank).
Tele, I guess due to your long absence you don't know much about HMS's posts and his endless campaigning for Dirty Work being a great album (kind of a HMS trademark!), along with Shine A Light being their best live album while regarding YaYas as "just mediocre" and "boring"... I mean, it's free speech and all that and everybody is entitled to his/her own opinions, but some opinions just seem so odd and so out of frame that I have a hard time not believing that HMS is just a troll.
In this kook's instance, opinions can be wrong, and HMS' is very very wrong.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-29 16:37 by GasLightStreet.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: July 29, 2016 16:46
Quote
HMSQuote
alimente
Now he's even bashing GHS and IORR as "two of the Stones most mediocre albums" containing "rather ridiculos Jagger-ballads" (Winter? Time Waits For no One?) - I'm quite speechless. A hopeless case.
I have to admit that I dont like most of the ballads on GHS/IORR.
Till The Next Goodbye, Time Waits For No One, If You Really Want To Be My Friend, Angie, Winter are all bloated, rather unispired, over-long and overproduced to my ears. Sometimes it´s pure schmaltzy kitsch and MJ at times sounds like a caricature.
Its been said that Mick Taylor co-wrote Winter, Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One, so I refuse to imagine what further schmaltz a Mick/Mick-songwriting-partnership would have produced. Those songs are pointing straight ahead into a very, very wrong direction. GHS and IORR, imo, are the Stones-albums with the smallest amount of great and real outstanding songs, just about two, maybe three killers can be found on those albums, definitely not enough for an enjoyable album. Even very weak Steel Wheels has more killer tracks. So GHS/IORR are indeed mediocre to my ears and at the same time GHS/IORR are remarkably the albums on which Mick Taylor is most prominent as a guitar player. All this makes me often think that Mick Taylor´s influence wasnt good for the Stones.
Let's see... for someone that says "Sometimes it´s pure schmaltzy kitsch and MJ at times sounds like a caricature" isn't talking about DIRTY WORK says a lot.
So "Its been said that Mick Taylor co-wrote Winter, Till The Next Goodbye and Time Waits For No One, so I refuse to imagine what further schmaltz a Mick/Mick-songwriting-partnership would have produced. Those songs are pointing straight ahead into a very, very wrong direction." gives you reason to refuse to imagine what further... yet you choose to neglect songs from STICKY FINGERS and EXILE (one for sure) in terms of what Taylor had a hand in co-writing that he gets no credit for except for the EXILE one.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: July 29, 2016 17:33
Well,
Sticky Fingers:
I´ve been told that MT co-wrote Sway & Moonlight Mile. Without any doubt Sway can be seen as a masterpiece in their catalogue, but Moonlight Mile is one of my Stones´ anti-favorites, so strange and totally weird - it is hard for me to sit this one through. Always watching the clock and hoping it will end soon. Honestly I prefer to listen to Gomper.
Exile:
He got credit for Ventilator Blues, which of course is hardly a highlight on Exile, decent at best. I personally would have dropped it (amongst other tracks) in order to create a single LP. As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four.
So when I look at the studio-albums Taylor recorded with the Stones, I see this:
His participation on LIB is so minimal that it is almost not worth talking about. Sticky Fingers is a true masterpiece (one clunker - Moonlight Mile - does not bother me when it comes to rating the album). Exile could have been a masterpiece but it isnt for reasons I´ve explained above and in posts before.
Then they made a crash landing with GHS, an album that lacks almost everything: inspiration, crafted songwriting etc. IORR is a little bit better but still very mediocre compared to it´s successor Black & Blue which presents the Stones without Taylor and in great form again for the first time since Exile.
Sticky Fingers:
I´ve been told that MT co-wrote Sway & Moonlight Mile. Without any doubt Sway can be seen as a masterpiece in their catalogue, but Moonlight Mile is one of my Stones´ anti-favorites, so strange and totally weird - it is hard for me to sit this one through. Always watching the clock and hoping it will end soon. Honestly I prefer to listen to Gomper.
Exile:
He got credit for Ventilator Blues, which of course is hardly a highlight on Exile, decent at best. I personally would have dropped it (amongst other tracks) in order to create a single LP. As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four.
So when I look at the studio-albums Taylor recorded with the Stones, I see this:
His participation on LIB is so minimal that it is almost not worth talking about. Sticky Fingers is a true masterpiece (one clunker - Moonlight Mile - does not bother me when it comes to rating the album). Exile could have been a masterpiece but it isnt for reasons I´ve explained above and in posts before.
Then they made a crash landing with GHS, an album that lacks almost everything: inspiration, crafted songwriting etc. IORR is a little bit better but still very mediocre compared to it´s successor Black & Blue which presents the Stones without Taylor and in great form again for the first time since Exile.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
TravelinMan
()
Date: July 29, 2016 17:40
Quote
HMS
Well,
Sticky Fingers:
I´ve been told that MT co-wrote Sway & Moonlight Mile. Without any doubt Sway can be seen as a masterpiece in their catalogue, but Moonlight Mile is one of my Stones´ anti-favorites, so strange and totally weird - it is hard for me to sit this one through. Always watching the clock and hoping it will end soon. Honestly I prefer to listen to Gomper.
Exile:
He got credit for Ventilator Blues, which of course is hardly a highlight on Exile, decent at best. I personally would have dropped it (amongst other tracks) in order to create a single LP. As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four.
So when I look at the studio-albums Taylor recorded with the Stones, I see this:
His participation on LIB is so minimal that it is almost not worth talking about. Sticky Fingers is a true masterpiece (one clunker - Moonlight Mile - does not bother me when it comes to rating the album). Exile could have been a masterpiece but it isnt for reasons I´ve explained above and in posts before.
Then they made a crash landing with GHS, an album that lacks almost everything: inspiration, crafted songwriting etc. IORR is a little bit better but still very mediocre compared to it´s successor Black & Blue which presents the Stones without Taylor and in great form again for the first time since Exile.
You do know there are ballads on Black & Blue?
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: July 29, 2016 20:51
Yes I do.
Fool To Cry is indeed a clunker as big as a skyscraper, it´s awful bad. The other ballad, Memory Motel, is a true gem and so much better than all of the ballads on GHS/IORR. I dont say Black & Blue is that great because there´s finally no Taylor involved. But it shows that the Stones didnt need Taylor to create great albums (and Black & Blue is a truly great album). Both GHS/IORR on the other hand show that the presence of Taylor is no garantee for making great albums.
Fool To Cry is indeed a clunker as big as a skyscraper, it´s awful bad. The other ballad, Memory Motel, is a true gem and so much better than all of the ballads on GHS/IORR. I dont say Black & Blue is that great because there´s finally no Taylor involved. But it shows that the Stones didnt need Taylor to create great albums (and Black & Blue is a truly great album). Both GHS/IORR on the other hand show that the presence of Taylor is no garantee for making great albums.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
mtaylor
()
Date: July 29, 2016 21:31
Quote
TravelinManQuote
HMS
Well,
Sticky Fingers:
I´ve been told that MT co-wrote Sway & Moonlight Mile. Without any doubt Sway can be seen as a masterpiece in their catalogue, but Moonlight Mile is one of my Stones´ anti-favorites, so strange and totally weird - it is hard for me to sit this one through. Always watching the clock and hoping it will end soon. Honestly I prefer to listen to Gomper.
Exile:
He got credit for Ventilator Blues, which of course is hardly a highlight on Exile, decent at best. I personally would have dropped it (amongst other tracks) in order to create a single LP. As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four.
So when I look at the studio-albums Taylor recorded with the Stones, I see this:
His participation on LIB is so minimal that it is almost not worth talking about. Sticky Fingers is a true masterpiece (one clunker - Moonlight Mile - does not bother me when it comes to rating the album). Exile could have been a masterpiece but it isnt for reasons I´ve explained above and in posts before.
Then they made a crash landing with GHS, an album that lacks almost everything: inspiration, crafted songwriting etc. IORR is a little bit better but still very mediocre compared to it´s successor Black & Blue which presents the Stones without Taylor and in great form again for the first time since Exile.
You do know there are ballads on Black & Blue?
"As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four."
It is part of big four: BB, LIB, SF and EOMS.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
NICOS
()
Date: July 29, 2016 21:40
I consider Exile as one of their BIG 5
__________________________
__________________________
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
stonesrule
()
Date: July 29, 2016 23:09
He has every right, I suppose, but HMS's opinions generally make my teeth grit.
I keep thinking of Keith reading through some of HMS's opinions and what he would likely say and do. And it wouldn't be pretty.
I keep thinking of Keith reading through some of HMS's opinions and what he would likely say and do. And it wouldn't be pretty.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
mtaylor
()
Date: July 29, 2016 23:54
Quote
stonesrule
He has every right, I suppose, but HMS's opinions generally make my teeth grit.
I keep thinking of Keith reading through some of HMS's opinions and what he would likely say and do. And it wouldn't be pretty.
Exile was Keith's masterpiece.
Mick didn't like it.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: July 30, 2016 00:03
Quote
mtaylorQuote
stonesrule
He has every right, I suppose, but HMS's opinions generally make my teeth grit.
I keep thinking of Keith reading through some of HMS's opinions and what he would likely say and do. And it wouldn't be pretty.
Exile was Keith's masterpiece.
Mick didn't like it.
He wasn't happy with the mix. You'll never find a quote where Mick says he didn't like Exile.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
dcba
()
Date: July 30, 2016 00:05
Quote
mtaylor
Exile was Keith's masterpiece.
Mick didn't like it.
Because Mick was the one who "edited" the album, put it together, sequenced it, hired the additional musicians that put the final touch to the album and made it really fantastic.
It took him almost three months on and off between Dec. 71 and Feb. 72.
By comparison, "finishing" Fingers was a breeze.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
mtaylor
()
Date: July 30, 2016 00:21
Quote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
mtaylorQuote
stonesrule
He has every right, I suppose, but HMS's opinions generally make my teeth grit.
I keep thinking of Keith reading through some of HMS's opinions and what he would likely say and do. And it wouldn't be pretty.
Exile was Keith's masterpiece.
Mick didn't like it.
He wasn't happy with the mix. You'll never find a quote where Mick says he didn't like Exile.
Then, that it is not one of the best....
"Exile On Main Street is not one of my favourite albums, although I think the record does have a particular feeling. I'm not too sure how great the songs are, but put together it's a nice piece. However, when I listen to Exile it has some of the worst mixes I've ever heard. I'd love to remix the record, not just because of the vocals, but because generally I think it sounds lousy... Of course I'm ultimately responsible for it, but it's really not good and there's no concerted effort or intention... As long as people like the album, that's fine. It's just that I don't particularly think it's a great album.
-Mick Jagger, 2003
But he has also mentioned good things about it.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: July 30, 2016 01:12
Quote
mtaylorQuote
DandelionPowdermanQuote
mtaylorQuote
stonesrule
He has every right, I suppose, but HMS's opinions generally make my teeth grit.
I keep thinking of Keith reading through some of HMS's opinions and what he would likely say and do. And it wouldn't be pretty.
Exile was Keith's masterpiece.
Mick didn't like it.
He wasn't happy with the mix. You'll never find a quote where Mick says he didn't like Exile.
Then, that it is not one of the best....
"Exile On Main Street is not one of my favourite albums, although I think the record does have a particular feeling. I'm not too sure how great the songs are, but put together it's a nice piece. However, when I listen to Exile it has some of the worst mixes I've ever heard. I'd love to remix the record, not just because of the vocals, but because generally I think it sounds lousy... Of course I'm ultimately responsible for it, but it's really not good and there's no concerted effort or intention... As long as people like the album, that's fine. It's just that I don't particularly think it's a great album.
-Mick Jagger, 2003
But he has also mentioned good things about it.
He agrees with all the hard core fans about the vibe, wholeness and feeling of it, and dislikes the mix (which baffles me)...
Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by:
TeddyB1018
()
Date: July 30, 2016 02:01
MT did embark on his solo career before 1979. He signed to Columbia before that. He took a while to get an album together.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
boogaloojef
()
Date: July 30, 2016 06:14
Quote
HMS
Yes I do.
Fool To Cry is indeed a clunker as big as a skyscraper, it´s awful bad. The other ballad, Memory Motel, is a true gem and so much better than all of the ballads on GHS/IORR. I dont say Black & Blue is that great because there´s finally no Taylor involved. But it shows that the Stones didnt need Taylor to create great albums (and Black & Blue is a truly great album). Both GHS/IORR on the other hand show that the presence of Taylor is no garantee for making great albums.
Black And Blue has about 4 decent songs. Cherry Oh Baby and Melody are not very interesting and Fool To Cry makes me cringe. I don't care much for Hot Stuff either. It would have been much better if Slave and Worried About You would have been included instead.
I like both Goats Head Soup and It's Only Rock 'N' Roll better than Black And Blue.
Edited 5 time(s). Last edit at 2016-07-30 06:22 by boogaloojef.
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
GasLightStreet
()
Date: July 30, 2016 21:17
Quote
mtaylorQuote
TravelinManQuote
HMS
Well,
Sticky Fingers:
I´ve been told that MT co-wrote Sway & Moonlight Mile. Without any doubt Sway can be seen as a masterpiece in their catalogue, but Moonlight Mile is one of my Stones´ anti-favorites, so strange and totally weird - it is hard for me to sit this one through. Always watching the clock and hoping it will end soon. Honestly I prefer to listen to Gomper.
Exile:
He got credit for Ventilator Blues, which of course is hardly a highlight on Exile, decent at best. I personally would have dropped it (amongst other tracks) in order to create a single LP. As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four.
So when I look at the studio-albums Taylor recorded with the Stones, I see this:
His participation on LIB is so minimal that it is almost not worth talking about. Sticky Fingers is a true masterpiece (one clunker - Moonlight Mile - does not bother me when it comes to rating the album). Exile could have been a masterpiece but it isnt for reasons I´ve explained above and in posts before.
Then they made a crash landing with GHS, an album that lacks almost everything: inspiration, crafted songwriting etc. IORR is a little bit better but still very mediocre compared to it´s successor Black & Blue which presents the Stones without Taylor and in great form again for the first time since Exile.
You do know there are ballads on Black & Blue?
"As a single LP Exile would have been much better received and could have even been part of their Big Four."
It is part of big four: BB, LIB, SF and EOMS.
The only way HMS is right about EOMS being better as a single LP is that... it wouldn't be bad. How could it be?
Aside from that... how someone can't hear the brilliance of Moonlight Mile is just horrific. Of course, it says a lot that the loaf loves the yellow, green, pink, red and blue rubbish. There's colour blind and obviously there's Good Music Blind, er, Deaf. As well as Bad Music Deaf.
No one goes on and on about Taylor hardly being on LIB because, well, only HMS goes on and on about how much Taylor is not on LIB and make s a big whup about something that is well know. As usual he can't hear what makes GHS and IORR great and good albums in the post-EOMS way that they are yet blathers about BAB being as good as EMOS because... Taylor isn't on it. Taylor couldn't save GHS and IORR? So... he saved SF and EOMS then, at least, according to the "logic" of Looney Kooks. Almost as if Taylor said it himself. Total lunacy, as usual.
He is wrong, as usual, again, this time about EOMS not being in The Big Four because he implies it could have been part of their Big Four but not only doesn't say what he thinks they are but somehow doesn't think The Big Four ends with EOMS and he is either ignorant of that fact or, well, he does think their worst album is a masterpiece so... Looney Kooks is on full time reruns.
Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by:
lem motlow
()
Date: July 31, 2016 00:09
the reason mick says those things about exile is because they are true.
the previous three albums had songs like street fighting man,sympathy,gimme shelter,midnight rambler,brown sugar etc.there are no songs on exile that are anywhere near the quality of writing as those. which is why he said "i'm not too sure how great the songs are"
and it doesn't have the greatest mix on it,its nowhere close to let it bleed or sticky fingers or even beggars.
i love the record just for those reasons,the mix works for those songs on that record and not having any real standout songs also makes it all hang together.
but that doesn't make what he's saying any less true.
anyone who thinks he's saying that because it's a "keith album" [its not any more or less than any of the others] probably also thinks it was recorded in keiths basement at nellcote.
the previous three albums had songs like street fighting man,sympathy,gimme shelter,midnight rambler,brown sugar etc.there are no songs on exile that are anywhere near the quality of writing as those. which is why he said "i'm not too sure how great the songs are"
and it doesn't have the greatest mix on it,its nowhere close to let it bleed or sticky fingers or even beggars.
i love the record just for those reasons,the mix works for those songs on that record and not having any real standout songs also makes it all hang together.
but that doesn't make what he's saying any less true.
anyone who thinks he's saying that because it's a "keith album" [its not any more or less than any of the others] probably also thinks it was recorded in keiths basement at nellcote.
Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by:
Stoneage
()
Date: July 31, 2016 00:19
Touring with the Stones on the 2012-14 tour didn't do Taylor much good. Except for the travel and money bit though.
In a way I think it would have been better for the myth around him had he not done it. One song a show, what a joke!
In a way I think it would have been better for the myth around him had he not done it. One song a show, what a joke!
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: July 31, 2016 00:24
Quote
DandelionPowderman
"Exile On Main Street is not one of my favourite albums [...] It's just that I don't particularly think it's a great album.
-Mick Jagger, 2003
I fully agree.
Exile isnt part of the Big Four, it just isnt.
I´ve always said that and will keep on saying that no matter how unpopular that opinion might be amongst fans.
Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by:
Stoneage
()
Date: July 31, 2016 00:29
I have always considered EOMS more of a live album than a studio album. That's how I listen to it.
Re: Mick Taylor Talk - what's on your mind right now...
Posted by:
latebloomer
()
Date: July 31, 2016 02:33
Quote
Stoneage
I have always considered EOMS more of a live album than a studio album. That's how I listen to it.
Do you stand the whole time and cheer in between songs?
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
TravelinMan
()
Date: July 31, 2016 02:52
Quote
HMSQuote
DandelionPowderman
"Exile On Main Street is not one of my favourite albums [...] It's just that I don't particularly think it's a great album.
-Mick Jagger, 2003
I fully agree.
Exile isnt part of the Big Four, it just isnt.
I´ve always said that and will keep on saying that no matter how unpopular that opinion might be amongst fans.
I've often said Dirty Work isn't in the Big 20. It may be unpopular, but I stand by it!
Re: Mick Taylor sidelined yet again
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: July 31, 2016 03:03
Quote
HMSQuote
DandelionPowderman
"Exile On Main Street is not one of my favourite albums [...] It's just that I don't particularly think it's a great album.
-Mick Jagger, 2003
I fully agree.
Exile isnt part of the Big Four, it just isnt.
I´ve always said that and will keep on saying that no matter how unpopular that opinion might be amongst fans.
Not quoted from my post..
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