Silver Train was rarely played live in 73, untill 2014 in Tokyo and Brisbane with Mick Taylor in the line-up! I enjoyed this clip: Rolling Stones-Silver Train-Brisbane-11/18/2014

Here's a live version (Cologne) from 1973:





[www.youtube.com]

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DandelionPowderman
Here's a live version (Cologne) from 1973:





[www.youtube.com]

I’ve listened to this track but thanks for posting and 3 tracks of GHS were performed live in Rotterdam 73, Angie was a nr:1 in the Dutch top Charts.

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runaway

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DandelionPowderman
Here's a live version (Cologne) from 1973:





[www.youtube.com]

I’ve listened to this track but thanks for posting and 3 tracks of GHS were performed live in Rotterdam 73, Angie was a nr:1 in the Dutch top Charts.

They skipped Heartbreaker on Oct 13, and played it the next day?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-26 13:06 by DandelionPowderman.

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DandelionPowderman

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runaway

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DandelionPowderman
Here's a live version (Cologne) from 1973:





[www.youtube.com]

I’ve listened to this track but thanks for posting and 3 tracks of GHS were performed live in Rotterdam 73, Angie was a nr:1 in the Dutch top Charts.

They skipped Heartbreaker on Oct 13, and played it the next day?

Yep exactly, Heartbreaker was played on the first of the second day! 3 Sold Out Concerts were performed in Rotterdam!

For me, I've always just loved this one.
find it refreshing every time.
a little hard to take the blue eye shadow monkey show i think
he's camping it up and having fun though; his moves as always
are magnetic but just as a song off the album?
YES. love it; not a thing wrong with it;
oh, it's not much of a song lol, but that makes it more special groover mover
in it's wonederfully rooted and decidely off-kilter kinda thrust.
____________obviously not the big hit or big message stuff but i adore it.----------



[www.youtube.com]

ROLLING STONES: Silver Train (Differently Mixed Acetate-Version)
Studio Session, Goats Head Soup

28th May 1973: Island Recording Studios, London, England
Ian Stewart on Piano - Jimmy Miller on Percussion
______________________-

The Rolling Stones - Silver Train - OFFICIAL PROMO
[www.youtube.com]
______________________________________
and:
[www.youtube.com]
My personal fave is this one.
The original Goat's Head Soup album track.
starring Bill Wyman. ;-)

Love that Bridge. haha don't think they even bother to change a chord till then,k mayhbe one .
that's fine, gives Bill room to do the bliserting meadnering wandering precise grooving magic for sure. great stuff. like the harmonica too.
not much of a song per se but that's what i kinda dig about it.
it's a bit out of it's mind with Mick there and i'm buying it.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-27 10:03 by hopkins.

Did Silver Train originate from the Sticky Fingers sessions at Stargroves? It was probably dropped from consideration from Exile because there was already a song with train references and slide guitar.

It sounds like some of the playful rock they were doing at the time of Sticky Fingers.

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TravelinMan
Did Silver Train originate from the Sticky Fingers sessions at Stargroves? It was probably dropped from consideration from Exile because there was already a song with train references and slide guitar.

It sounds like some of the playful rock they were doing at the time of Sticky Fingers.

I think you're probably right. When they started that big group of songs that went on to become "Sticky Fingers" and "Exile"; plus outtakes such as your alter-name.

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Palace Revolution 2000

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TravelinMan
Did Silver Train originate from the Sticky Fingers sessions at Stargroves? It was probably dropped from consideration from Exile because there was already a song with train references and slide guitar.

It sounds like some of the playful rock they were doing at the time of Sticky Fingers.

I think you're probably right. When they started that big group of songs that went on to become "Sticky Fingers" and "Exile"; plus outtakes such as your alter-name.

701017 17th October - 31st October: Newbury, Stargroves (MJ’s house) with Mobile
Record Unit and London, Olympic Sound Studios. Producer: Jimmy Miller.
Sound engineer: Glyn Johns.
- All Down The Line III (MJ/KR) -second, unverified acoustic version
- Bitch I (MJ/KR) -Bobby Keys on sax, Jim Price on trumpet, Jimmy Miller on
percussion; Extended Version; Sticky Fingers Deluxe-version
- Bitch II (MJ/KR) -Bobby Keys on sax, Jim Price on trumpet, Jimmy
Miller on percussion; slightly different mix to II, with more audible ad-lib
vocals of MJ during KR's solo
- Bitch III (MJ/KR) -Bobby Keys on sax, Jim Price on trumpet, Jimmy
Miller on percussion; Sticky Fingers-version
- Hide Your Love I (MJ/KR) -unverified early version
- Highway Bound (MJ/KR) -a/k/a Highway Child
- Moonlight Mile I (MJ/KR) -Jim Price on piano; instrumental; Crossfire
Hurricane-version
- Moonlight Mile II (MJ/KR) -Jim Price on piano, strings arranged by Paul
Buckmaster; Sticky Fingers-version
- Potted Shrimps (MJ/KR) -Nicky Hopkins on piano; instrumental
- Red House (Jimi Hendrix) -unverified
- Shake Your Hips II (James Moore) -STU on piano; early version
- Silver Train I (MJ/KR) -early version with slightly longer finish
- So Divine (Aladdin Story) II (MJ/KR) -Bobby Keys on sax, Jim Price on vibes;
instrumental
- Stop Breaking Down II (Robert Johnson) -STU on piano; early (rough) take
- Sway I (MJ/KR) - Nicky Hopkins on piano, strings arranged by Paul
Buckmaster; flipside of US Wild Horses-single
- Sway II (MJ/KR) -Nicky Hopkins on piano, strings arranged by Paul
Buckmaster; Sticky Fingers-version
- Sweet Black Angel I (MJ/KR) -instrumental, under title Bent Green
Needles; unverified
- Sweet Virginia III (MJ/KR) -STU on piano, Bobby Keys on sax; early
version without backing vocals

- Travelling Man (MJ/KR) -Nicky Hopkins on piano
- Tumbling Dice II (MJ/KR) -Nicky Hopkins on piano; with different lyrics,
under title Good Time Women; Exile On Main St. 2010-remaster-version

[www.nzentgraf.de]

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Spud
It's like loads of Stones songs before & since .

Pretty ordinary...

... but because the Rolling Stones are playing it, it sounds fantastic !

You hit the bullseye with your last sentence! The Blues was there long before they were even born, but one of the biggest qualities of the Rolling Stones is to lift something pretty ordinary up to something that fools many, thinking it IS ordinary: great renditions/recordings (and I haven't even mentioned their unbeaten nr 1 position as a live act).
I will always maintain that there are/were great bands formed on this planet, but the Rolling Stones came from Outer Space ... just like the comets that created life on Earth
Silver Train ... I always loved that song

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His Majesty

Exile makes for a perfect book end and end to the story that began, album wise, with their UK debut. The covers are now originals, they have mastered the various blues and related forms and made them their own. Not only have they brought R&B to the masses, they have added their own distinctive and respected contribution to that music.

Job done, right?

What follows does feel like a band wondering what it is and where it is going. Keith's vision of how things should be is stretched beyond his comfort zone and Mick is in the early throws of the whole jet set thing and probably thirsty for more of the new and less of the old.

Exactly. I also get the feeling that after EXILE the 'job was done' - their biggest artistic motivation was satisfied and mission completed. There was not much to 'say' or to develop further by their own means and natural instincts. Add there that EXILE, while being without a doubt one of the strongest albums by anyone ever, was actually not that nerve at the times any longer, but as an artistic statement was drifting the Stones to more like to a sphere of their own. It was not an album looking forward but more like the last fruition of anything they have learned from rootsie, R&B-based Americana by then - them playing the stuff with an inspiration and maturity. It was an album 'looking back' actually. I think one of the reasons why it didn't get such a hyped attention at the time of its relaese was due to its nature: it has an universal and eternal appeal, beyond time and place, that is, going beyond the trends of the day. It took some time that people really grasped it's uniqueness. Probably The Stones releasing some lesser-quality albums helped to that (and with that the concept of 'best since EXILE' started to grow). Probably by the time of releasing EXILE the quality of it wasn't such a surprise but more like 'yep, that's Standard Stones quality we are used to'... I mean what else can people think after BEGGARS BANQUET, LET IT BLEED and STICKY FINGERS? I wouldn't be surprised if some people (especially always trendy-kissing critics) even felt that it was a minor disappointment. The expectations probably were incredible for them at the time.

Anyway, I think the general trait of the Stones albums after EXILE have been them trying to cope with some new things they probably haven't such a natural instinct - or a real inspiration - for as they previusly had. Very rarely it has clicked completely, SOME GIRLS being almost an exception to a rule. More generally one can hear 'aha, that's the Stones trying to readjust their game to something novel and contemporary', or to do something 'different', the results sounding many times very good no doubt, but not any longer as natural-sounding and convincing as their old masterpieces on which they just simply ruled the music and scene (I am thinking here things like "Fingerprint File", "Hot Stuff", "Cherry Oh Baby", "Emotional Rescue", "Undercover of The Night", "One Hit", etc). Add there that the Stones are rather artistic-minded - or they used to be - in that sense that they don't sound too inspired repeating something they have already mastered. It so easily sounds 'Stones-by-numbers' - something I think they intentionally tried to avoid in their post-EXILE albums, probably all the way to DIRTY WORK (but of course, there were exceptions, sometimes more, sometimes less).

So to sum this up: the general problem or dilemma of post-Big Four-era Stones stuff is: they are not that convincing to do something novel ('old dogs learning new tricks'), but they are not too inspired to repeat the old same ('been there, done that')...

Of course, all of this is logically linked to "Silver Train"....

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-29 12:40 by Doxa.

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Doxa

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His Majesty

Exile makes for a perfect book end and end to the story that began, album wise, with their UK debut. The covers are now originals, they have mastered the various blues and related forms and made them their own. Not only have they brought R&B to the masses, they have added their own distinctive and respected contribution to that music.

Job done, right?

What follows does feel like a band wondering what it is and where it is going. Keith's vision of how things should be is stretched beyond his comfort zone and Mick is in the early throws of the whole jet set thing and probably thirsty for more of the new and less of the old.

Exactly. I also get the feeling that after EXILE the 'job was done' - their biggest artistic motivation was satisfied and mission completed. There was not much to 'say' or to develop further by their own means and natural instincts. Add there that EXILE, while being without a doubt one of the strongest albums by anyone ever, was actually not that nerve at the times any longer, but as an artistic statement was drifting the Stones to more like to a sphere of their own. It was not an album looking forward but more like the last fruition of anything they have learned from rootsie, R&B-based Americana by then - them playing the stuff with an inspiration and maturity. It was an album 'looking back' actually. I think one of the reasons why it didn't get such a hyped attention at the time of its relaese was due to its nature: it has an universal and eternal appeal, beyond time and place, that is, going beyond the trends of the day. It took some time that people really grasped it's uniqueness. Probably The Stones releasing some lesser-quality albums helped to that (and with that the concept of 'best since EXILE' started to grow). Probably by the time of releasing EXILE the quality of it wasn't such a surprise but more like 'yep, that's Standard Stones quality we are used to'... I mean what else can people think after BEGGARS BANQUET, LET IT BLEED and STICKY FINGERS? I wouldn't be surprised if some people (especially always trendy-kissing critics) even felt that it was a minor disappointment. The expectations probably were incredible for them at the time.

Anyway, I think the general trait of the Stones albums after EXILE have been them trying to cope with some new things they probably haven't such a natural instinct - or a real inspiration - for as they previusly had. Very rarely it has clicked completely, SOME GIRLS being almost an exception to a rule. More generally one can hear 'aha, that's the Stones trying to readjust their game to something novel and contemporary', or to do something 'different', the results sounding many times very good no doubt, but not any longer as natural-sounding and convincing as their old masterpieces on which they just simply ruled the music and scene (I am thinking here things like "Fingerprint File", "Hot Stuff", "Cherry Oh Baby", "Emotional Rescue", "Undercover of The Night", "One Hit", etc). Add there that the Stones are rather artistic-minded - or they used to be - in that sense that they don't sound too inspired repeating something they have already mastered. It so easily sounds 'Stones-by-numbers' - something I think they intentionally tried to avoid in their post-EXILE albums, probably all the way to DIRTY WORK (but of course, there were exceptions, sometimes more, sometimes less).

So to sum this up: the general problem or dilemma of post-Big Four-era Stones stuff is: they are not that convincing to do something novel ('old dogs learning new tricks'), but they are not too inspired to repeat the old same ('been there, done that')...

Of course, all of this is logically linked to "Silver Train"....

- Doxa

I think we also have to take into account the Stones' personal situation with a tiring world tour - USA 72/Pacific 72/73 and Europe 73 - wearing them down. Let's not forget that there were already quite a few great songs knocking around from 69/71 that they used for Exile.

Also the conditions that brought about Exile, of them more or less living together in an inspiring beauty spot on the French Riviera were also conducive to creating such a masterpiece.

So when they arrived in Jamaica in November 72 their circumstances had changed a lot. Keith needed to find a new home - Cheyne Walk near Jagger's home while Billy stayed in Arles in the south of France.

They'd also holidayed after such a grueling tour and hadn't had too much time to work on new songs. I think this is telling in the fact that they resorted to several 12 bar jam style songs that they knocked into shape and which became Star Star, Hide Your Love and Silver Train.

For me, it's a wonder and a testament to their still great songwriting skills that they could come up with beautiful tunes such as Winter, Can You Hear The Music, Coming Down Again and Angie at all. With Billy Preston's help they also came up with the funky, clavinet-driven 100 Years Ago and Doo Doo Doo Doo Doo (heartbreaker).

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Silver Dagger

They'd also holidayed after such a grueling tour and hadn't had too much time to work on new songs. I think this is telling in the fact that they resorted to several 12 bar jam style songs that they knocked into shape and which became Star Star, Hide Your Love and Silver Train.

I wouldn't want to exaggerate the 'grueling-ness' of a Stones tour. In the end touring is 23 hours per day travel or waiting in a hotel room, which in the case of the Stones is that of multimillionaire's luxury. The 24th hour is spent on a show. I think 'utter boredom' is a better expression to describe touring.

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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Silver Dagger

They'd also holidayed after such a grueling tour and hadn't had too much time to work on new songs. I think this is telling in the fact that they resorted to several 12 bar jam style songs that they knocked into shape and which became Star Star, Hide Your Love and Silver Train.

I wouldn't want to exaggerate the 'grueling-ness' of a Stones tour. In the end touring is 23 hours per day travel or waiting in a hotel room, which in the case of the Stones is that of multimillionaire's luxury. The 24th hour is spent on a show. I think 'utter boredom' is a better expression to describe touring.

Mathijs

It all depends what condition you're in, in the first place. If you're junked out, drinking too much and not eating properly then it's likely to wear the body down even further with no time for recovery.

By all accounts, this tour was a megafest of debauchery - and I think the longest tour they had ever undertaken. And let's not forget they were coming from Nellcote so probably weren't in the healthiest of conditions.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-30 15:46 by Silver Dagger.

I personally think the so-called decline of GHS/IORR/BAB would be the crowning achievement of almost any other bands' career.

My son and I had this discussion over the weekend. We concluded SW/Undercover/DW were not as good as the classic albums, but were the among the best albums released in their respective years. Most played ones at my house anyway.

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Elmo Lewis
I personally think the so-called decline of GHS/IORR/BAB would be the crowning achievement of almost any other bands' career.

My son and I had this discussion over the weekend. We concluded SW/Undercover/DW were not as good as the classic albums, but were the among the best albums released in their respective years. Most played ones at my house anyway.

My sentiments entirely.
The bar is set so high for the Stones that they can never win.

It's a similar thing with folks being severely critical of the "modern Era" output.

If albums like B2B or ABB had been released by previously unknown bands they would be lauded as the best thing since sliced bread...

...or since the Rolling Stones.

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Elmo Lewis
I personally think the so-called decline of GHS/IORR/BAB would be the crowning achievement of almost any other bands' career.

My son and I had this discussion over the weekend. We concluded SW/Undercover/DW were not as good as the classic albums, but were the among the best albums released in their respective years. Most played ones at my house anyway.

That is so right. It is relative. Because we can bitch and moan about a Stones album or song. But - I'll take bad Stones over good Most-Anyone-Else any day.

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His Majesty

Exile makes for a perfect book end and end to the story that began, album wise, with their UK debut. The covers are now originals, they have mastered the various blues and related forms and made them their own. Not only have they brought R&B to the masses, they have added their own distinctive and respected contribution to that music.

Job done, right?

What follows does feel like a band wondering what it is and where it is going. Keith's vision of how things should be is stretched beyond his comfort zone and Mick is in the early throws of the whole jet set thing and probably thirsty for more of the new and less of the old.

Job done indeed. What follows after, with a few exceptions, are just ...songs and of course some great live performances in the early 7-tees an a lot of kitch/ parody of themselves later on.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-30 00:22 by TheflyingDutchman.

what a wild blistering wonderful track. whoa
there ya go. lead guitar...whoa...
into the bridge thing again this time he's meanin' it...
whoa last verse; here comes Bill; holy moly here comes Bill on 'charge' baby
listen to him slip-sliding booming barking from just 3rd verse on out.
i mean what do people expect. whooo whoooo goes that harmonica baby...
mick t is sliding to heaven, keith is down in it; charlie is pumping steady as shit; crassshhhh yes, whoa Bill after the crash; these guys are talking to each other; this is IT. this is what you came for.
dig in or get out.

and that 'ding dong,' exactly where and how, is among their finest lyrical achievement; he got that 'eye roll' on tape; the cat is doin his job; those
little snots are taking off right here; that's what this band is about.
right here. ding dong; hello?

ONLY thing you could bitch about is the piano.
oh wait a minute. that's the other Stone. never mind.

it's great; it's totally great;
this is great classic stones.
silver train is tops.
it's among the most refreshing solid tracks, imo.
it's easily as good as rip this joint and rip this joint is near perfect.
what exactly would be 'wrong' with it?
song structure couldn't be more casually sloppy and just jam-roll each section into the next till its a beautiful buzz a beautiful buzzz...



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-30 00:27 by hopkins.

Easy eeeeasy Hopy … keep an eye on dat boiler tank …….



ROCKMAN

just for fun; for fan friends that are more take-it-away, than just liking the drive well enough and etc...(into over the top fools such as I with this one, for whatever personal reasons when it came out and was FRESH; it was NEWS from the Rock and Roll Front for certain generation of, first kid fans at 12, then increasingly more informed and experienced teenage fandom while they were killing it all through the entire rest of the decade. there WAS a time when they were well considered and very well liked and appreciate by young beatlemania age kids under 13; but so were the Dave Clark 5, and hitmakers Mick seems to affectionately joke about, as he doesn't cut Peter Noone down; but will slip in Erman's Ermit remarks into interviews in later years, sort of humbling himself amidst the many fellow-bands who were KIDS scoring hits, and all that. a BUNCH of em' some important, long-lasting and very, very good. most not, but we know the brilliance that came out of northern, then everywhere else in uk when skiffle cracked into rhythm and blues. and you know what else...

so for me, well maybe if i was born in another generation; had been swept away with ther mastery of Beast and a LOT of stuff really wonderful, it would have seemed to a more mature Hoppy with a different roots in music from childhood....
on another note; i think they wrote this for Johnny Winter?

[www.youtube.com]

so that's pretty good so far; i'm listening w you
yep good first verse;
whoa
bass sticking out like bill; good very good

verrry solid,,,,
ayyy yiii yiiiii
fricken great...
he did not know her name kids
she called him honey;
he liked it; he said it twice; he likes he likes it...
ding fricken dong this is super song.
this is the best song ever written
go johhny go

ayyy hyiiiiiiiii
did not know my name!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
shit....i'm famous. that sucks......
get on board chillun'



oooh my soul there BETTER BE A LEAD...






there was.

get me a glass of red



honeeeeeeeeyyyyyy YES YES YES YES YES YES YES



!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!111



WHOOOOOO honey HONEY GUESS I'M GONNA GET PON DOWN OH YEAH OH YEAH AII AIII YHIIIIII

send me YOUR lyrics,

i mean to say it had it's own sound.
the stones were innovators sonically here.
mick's blue shadow keeps me from posting this on facebook.
cheezus; now i know how charlie occasionally feels; tho he loves him
and relies on him; and is as intuitive and stomping king as any drummer
in the biz...
this sound made history to US; listen to what else premier bands
wsere doing; this was all stones...and winter just nailed it;
i don't know why he didn't have it as a single.
did the stones? did johnny? he 'moved units' a'plenty for about a 3 years i think;
and his brother got famous with hit songs too...
johnny winter is pretty 'authentic' if you consider his age; he's not b.b.king kinda old; more like clapton and these stones kids in their late twenties or cresting 30 w bill and charles....?

it's not like i thought this was a 'single' kinda deal when first listening to the album; maybe it was but i don't remmeber it on radio....i remember the record sliding to that one and it was always worth the money right there...
for me...
i love the site and the ruminations; and know for myself that i did NOT like stones songs i later came to love; and also big important hits for me as a kid, well as a young man all through those decades, (and now), sometimes finding a song i really love, and might have even big a really important hit; is laughed at my fans i respect here who write well and have excellent information and aesthetics, so it's interesting the various things we all get out of them;
i had to be DRAGGED back to '75 cause i saw a show that was so-so; didn't Judge them; just didn't go back and then missed 78 like an idiot too.
and then when the disco stuff came out i didn't like what i now think is brilliantr, smooth, revelatory; and it has puhlenty Bill; so....

it's not like i want people to listen to shit that bores them and feel wrong about it cause they're not.
it's just fun for me to still be so driven by this basic crazy boogie with this silvery mechanic thing goin' on....maybe it's my imagination, but i thought it was a real 'blast' i don't know how else to put it more effectively...
so maybe think of it as a novelty single; we had some GREAT ones...
think of it as a progressive jazz boogie bass jazz guy who did a session
with young white uk cats that had some studio experience....slightly younger...
just go with the bottom and don't even think of it as a song.
just for fun.
don't you hear the expressiveness of Bill; that 'perfectly' sloppy rubbery 'exact' kinda pump push deal; it's not like he EVER could play that song that exact way again, and good luck transcribing it; especially the pianosmiimomomos and fortitudinals....yeh yeh check with webster... ;-)

so i'm being silly in a a few of these postings; but affectionate toward the fans who just skip it; i skipped entire albums that i went back and liked quite a bit; or found gems that were important and worthwhile to me...
and some i just do not need; simply that; like others don't need this one...
but just as big bill fan, so much so i want a bass even tho i am practicing guitar a lot in my old age; and trying to write some decent songs myself; where I DO care about structure and form; and i sweat over every line after getting enough chunks 'at once' with keith's antannea analogy, to feel it's worth trying to figure out...... but there is nothing about the obviously simplistic apporach; and i'm not proposing it was a deep intellectual decision like lou reed did with metal machine music; or lennon with that avant garde stuff..
soncially....
but i liked the RUSSSHHH of this one. i think part of that is due to it
maybe being a Great train song after all; at least in the hands of Johnny here i bet, even amidst some iorr'ers who want more writing chops per se....
like both of them HAVE aced; to do that even ONCE in the world of hit pop music is an enormous enormous triumph for people who love their music i think.
jeepers; we like some and not others, like i like stuff on vl that no one else seems to; some deride....swith the Stones i even feel free, lol, to like stuff i Don't particularly like; like it enouvh to really listen closely cause i am a big fan and am always intersted in whatever little thinvs we can get from their studio lives. this is a fine finished classic stones track that i would introduce a new kid to the Stones with confidence that i was also giving them a traditional blues form; and change in the bridge; and very much trad inspired hot boogie-type original blues rock with mick taylor, ian stewart, bill wyman, keith richards and michael p. jagger. as for the vid; it's just not the right shade of blue, Mick. i guess you learned that as you went along . lookin GOOD Gramps! ever the inspiration; and still beautiful you are...
this is insanely good stones music; it's tempo is perfecf.
i'm gonna listen to johnny's version again; i had not heard for many DECADES
and it sounds Great Hot Loud and really good to me.....and guess what?
when i heard this one back then; (i bought a lot of stuff and worked in a record store w a discount) i did not think it a major thing; but rather thin
in comparison; and i think. well, i'm just glad for the thread cause i got to trip back into what i really like about the band.

Quote
georgie48
I will always maintain that there are/were great bands formed on this planet, but the Rolling Stones came from Outer Space ... just like the comets that created life on Earth

YES!!!! That perfectly explains why the Stones have had such incredible talent, staying power, and charisma for over 55 years ... it all makes sense now!!

Drew

Quote
Spud

Quote
Elmo Lewis
I personally think the so-called decline of GHS/IORR/BAB would be the crowning achievement of almost any other bands' career.

My son and I had this discussion over the weekend. We concluded SW/Undercover/DW were not as good as the classic albums, but were the among the best albums released in their respective years. Most played ones at my house anyway.

My sentiments entirely.
The bar is set so high for the Stones that they can never win.

It's a similar thing with folks being severely critical of the "modern Era" output.

If albums like B2B or ABB had been released by previously unknown bands they would be lauded as the best thing since sliced bread...

...or since the Rolling Stones.

I agree at least to the extent with the sentiments shared by both posts. The bar set by the Big Four and the classic singles was simply set so ridiculously high that it is natural that the music since then released by them suffers from that comparison. I think all of those 'mid-70's decline' era albums are very good albums, and each of them containing damn great songs, and the over-all quality is way beyond a 'normal' rock act. And I think all of these albums have done well in the long run. They are much better albums than their reputation is. But it is a cruel 'fact' that none of them is any EXILE or LET IT BLEED nor the singles being any satisfactions, paintitblacks, jumpingjackflashes, honkytonkwomens or brownsugars... (although I think "Angie" doesn't really drop in any quality, and I suppose the song is today as classical Stones song as any of those mentioned).

So if one wants to be critical (not in negative but in Kantian sense of the word) about what is going on that drop in quality needs to recognized and considered, no matter how superior that stuff is compared to almost any music, for example, in my household...

I think that kind of 'more serious criticism' is something a class act like The Stones simply deserves. There are highs and lows and the lows are as exciting and worth of serious scrutiny as the highs... They matter. It could be that I sometimes sound way too critical, even 'bashing' their doings, but still that is stemming out of pure admiration and interest.

- Doxa



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-30 09:52 by Doxa.

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Doxa
[.. . It could be that I sometimes sound way too critical, even 'bashing' their doings, but still that is stemming out of pure admiration and interest.

- Doxa

Don't worry on that score.

It's usually very easy on these pages to tell whether criticism is borne of affection or malice ...

Quote
Spud

Quote
Doxa
[.. . It could be that I sometimes sound way too critical, even 'bashing' their doings, but still that is stemming out of pure admiration and interest.

- Doxa

Don't worry on that score.

It's usually very easy on these pages to tell whether criticism is borne of affection or malice ...

Exactly!

Another thing is that the context matters. The shadow of the Big Four is still there, and the comparison of especially GOATS HEAD SOUP in regard to EXILE is still relevant, one cannot avoid it. But with albums like A BIGGER BANG or VOODOO LOUNGE the context starts to be so different that the comparasion starts to sound simply stupid.

Or if we take our song "Silver Train" here. The comparison to a thing like "All Down The Line" sounds to me valid, and the song clearly suffers from it. But I think with things like "You Got Me Rocking" or "Rough Justice" - their generic grandgrand childs - the whole idea of putting "All Down The Line" or even "Silver Train" next to them sounds simply absurd. That doesn't mean that those two songs aren't good by their own rights. They are, but I think the whole criterion in quality has dropped big time. So much that the whole basis from which to judge them has changed. Usually their greatness is based on making a sort of Stonesian intervention to a contemporary scene. They sound so sweetly archaic and 'Stonesy' in compared to anything else popular at the time. Like a remainder 'this is how great rock music once sounded like'. That impression is so important and fresh-like that the even seeing how 'generic' or 'Stones-by-numbers' the songs are doesn't really matter (or that they are forgotten rather quickly even by die-hard fans). They are so irrelevant that it makes them almost relevant...

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2018-10-30 12:27 by Doxa.

The songs have always been secondary to the sound for me.

I just love the glorious racket that, on a good day, this band can still make .