Hey guys,

I have tickets to see the Stones in Adelaide (not premium), but browsing Viagogo and other lowlife scalping sites, I have noticed NO LESS than 200 premium section ($510 retail) tickets up for sale for $2000 to $3000. This has been stable for weeks, nothing up for sale is moving that I can see.

This works out to an average of 35 unsold seats in each premium block.

Apart from being a contemptible crime against anyone who missed out on retail priced tickets, what happens to these seats if they remain unsold on show day?

I'm guessing that if no one has paid the $2000-$3000 yet, then they probably won't sell.

So do the Viagogo sellers just lose their $510, or do the promoters buy the tickets back from them?
Will these seats remain empty if not sold prior to the concert?

In addition, the Ticketek website says it may cancel any tickets found for sale on third party websites that are being sold at over face value.
How do these sites risk $510 x 200 if the terms and conditions clearly state that resale has to be within a tight percentage of face value?



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2014-01-10 13:06 by Macnee2.

I guess the resellers will simply lower the price very close to show date. I used resellers only once to buy a Fleetwood Mac@ Ziggo Dome ticket but the resale price was very close to the original price.

Do the promoters (Ticketek and Frontier) actually enforce cancellation of tickets sold at a price greatly in excess of face value? Or is this just standard BS to make honest folks feel all warm and fuzzy that everything is squeaky clean?

it's all a question of time and patience. The prices usually fall every fast after the gates are open and they drop sharply after the opening act is on stage… So if you got good nerves you might be lucky…

Haha, I don't need the stress of waiting for the last minute to try and grab a bargain on a good seat in premium .

I have second class tickets, but to me, anywhere *only* 20 rows from the front for the Rolling Stones is bloody amazing! I was in GA last time 20 years ago when they played here.

My 13yo daughter loves modern hard rock but not old stuff at all.
She only knows Jagger is some kind of billionaire sex god and must have some value on that basis, given that he is 70 and still picks up models. Keith is Johnny Depp's father to her.

She's coming with me anyway simply cause I asked her to. A very good kid.

I am honestly hoping that the Stones can show her in an hour or so what real music played live is about. That being that a group playing very tightly together (Charlie and Daryl), yet with feeling and looseness (Keith and Ronnie), is something that you can actually feel rather than a pre-recorded, auto tuned click track presentation.

Add to this frontman charisma and freakish energy and prancing.

In quiet Adelaide, she may never see a more historically important band play any bigger selling songs than anything in the Stones set list. This is my honest belief as:

1.) Macca doesn't seem to be singing anywhere near as well as Jagger at this point. He's the only act genuinely on par with the Stones as far as historical impact. Macca performs bloody well with just a 5 piece band, and his keyboard guy plays JUST what he is supposed to!

2.) I can't see the environment these days being right for any modern band to reach Beatles/Stones heights. Ever again.


I think that even from 20 rows back, a 13yo girl in 2013 may enjoy herself!

Third party? Eh, I wasn't even invited to the first party!

And talking of parties...

Empty seats... But hey, people do self-upgrade!

Bjornulf

A lot of seats Viagogo sells are actually not even as tickets in their hands. At least this is the case or was the case in the US Shows. They might not even have all the Pit tickets which they try And yes they have People selling tickets outside of the Arenas if they have to much. And the private guys who try to sell via Viagogo will have either nothing or enjoy the tickets themselves. I do not know how it will work in Australia, but in the US you were able to get marvellous seats on the side for under 100 US$ if you had the nerve to wait. But hey that is already the case since 1982 were thought they make a fortune and gave tickets away in Germany for ONE German Mark at that time. To me it seems like a mix of calculation with the resellers. They try to make some good Money on only a small amount tickets and if they do sell more than expected they make much to much anyway.
At the end on all the concerts we've been to during 2012 and 2013 you saw very little empty seats.

When you arrange to buy tickets off a site like Viagogo for example, you're actually entering into a contract (so to say) whereby they undertake to supply you with whatever it is they're advertising for sale and that you agree to pay a certain amount of money for. At the time you click "BUY" on their website, the chances are they don't actually HAVE those tickets in their possession, but what they just inherit essentially is a contractual obligation to supply them to you. How they actually acquire them, and who from, and for how much .... god only knows. That's why on some of these re-selling sites you can often find a sneaky little clause they put in there in which they try to persuade you to tick a box saying that you agree to accept "substitute" tickets in the event that they're unable to supply you with what you've paid for. That in itself ought to explain to most rational thinking folk that these secondary reselling organisations do NOT for the most part HAVE the advertised items for sale in their possession. We've all noticed that quite often, you see "the same" tickets for sale on multiple such sites .......... something which by and large would reaffirm the average punters' belief that the secondary market is just one huge unregulated fiddle.

But to go back to the question, I have on countless occasions obtained great seats close to the stage late late late in the day, and even then ......... have often been surrounded by vacant seats that have remained vacant throughout the entire show(s). A sad sight, but as BV says ...... a perfect opportunity for a "self-service upgrade" !!

[ I want to shout, but I can hardly speak ]

Usually, seats on these websites are available at lower prices as the show date gets closer. There are exceptions. The last shows in London and Newark in 2012 were so popular that there were were few tickets available on the third party sites, even on the day of the show. At the second O2 show, there were a few hundred people outside the venue who could not get in. Quite a few of those people had been scammed by counterfeit tickets bought outside the Arena on the day of the show. I felt so sorry for them. Please be careful.

What happens to unsold 3rd Party tickets?

They recycle them for the next tour .....................are actually people who will pay $2000-$3000 for a ticked?

__________________________

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NICOS
What happens to unsold 3rd Party tickets?

They recycle them for the next tour .....................are actually people who will pay $2000-$3000 for a ticked?

Actually yes there are People who paid that much in the US because they did not wait. I know of one (not me) friend whom I warned to wait till the date the tickets go officially on sale, but she could not resist. During the Shows we met more people who did pay around the mentioned figures for the pit. In the US it was either the package, the 85 $ Thing or secondary market. I do not know how big the chances had been in the sales in Australia, but at least you had the Option to try for the pit at a normal high Price the Special 99$ or the package..

Macnee2, I doubt very much that your daughter will be disappointed in any way!

Let us know, okay? For now, it's so nice that she signed up to go with her dear old
dad...so to speak, just from her perspective.

~"Love is Strong"~

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drbryant
Usually, seats on these websites are available at lower prices as the show date gets closer. There are exceptions. The last shows in London and Newark in 2012 were so popular that there were were few tickets available on the third party sites, even on the day of the show. At the second O2 show, there were a few hundred people outside the venue who could not get in. Quite a few of those people had been scammed by counterfeit tickets bought outside the Arena on the day of the show. I felt so sorry for them. Please be careful.

Don't know about 3rd party sites, because I personally don't recall particularly looking on them for Newark tickets at any rate. But what I do clearly recall is getting two pairs of amazing seats about 8-10 rows up in the lower tiers in the nearest block to the stage overlooking the pit (one pair of each of the Newark shows) off Ticketmaster (so hence at face value obviously) ... very late in the day. I had to wait until something approaching the last minute before finalising travel plans and flights and all that boring stuff, and one of the factors that persuaded me to go across the Atlantic and attend those two shows was the surprising availability of great seats so relatively late in the day, I was truly astonished.

And when my cousin and I were there on 15th December 2012 in row H of that block overlooking the pit, we were exchanging stories with other people nearby, some of whom had paid very silly money indeed to be in that location. And yes ........ in and around where we were, guess what ? There WERE a few empty seats scattered about, so I guess they were probably the "unsold 3rd party seats" on this particular occasion. A shame, but there you go ! If you insist on playing the "speculation" game, some you win ... and some you definitely lose.

[ I want to shout, but I can hardly speak ]

Many people rely on ticket brokers i.e. 3rd party ticket distribution. They may not be that fast or that informed, and the initial ticket sale is done and all is gone. They might not even have a PC, and they rely on somebody to take care of everything over the telephone, or my meeting up in an office. Just like organizing a holiday travel. Some do it on their own, but many can not do flights, tickets, accomodation and so on by themselves.

So around 30% of all tickets in USA are sold by ticket brokers, and they simply ask for market price. It is a distribution channel just like buying milk, bread or a house. Most of us have unlimited access to food and houses, but a concert ticket is a limited item so then there is always a distribution option.

If you think this is strange just go to a country where items are limited, like Cuba, and you will see secondary channels not just on tickets but also on fish, meat anything that you can not find in unlimited quantities.

The unsold tickets are not interesting. Just like the bakery. What happens to the unsold bread or cakes? Well the old people pick them up and hand them over to the birds next day. As for a Stones, show, like it is said here, the scalper prices drop as show time get closer, but they don't drop their pants. These are pro scalpers. They make their living from many shows, not just one, and they keep a certain price level. They can stand a loss, because they do know next week Justin Beaber or One Direction will be around, and as we all know, when the cute little children age 12 ask dad, the sky is the limit. You don't say NO to your child when Justin is inside the building. But a grown up guy may sday no to him/herself if the Stones are inside and the price is sky rocket size...

Bjornulf

On some ticket sites, like craigslist, you can find ticket sellers who are selling the tickets directly. This can be a better way to go because they are more willing to sell at a steeply reduced price than a ticket broker would. Sometimes you are even lucky enough to get them for free. My kid lives close to several major concert venues so when One Direction came to town, she and her friend posted their request and hung out on craigslist to try to get tickets. At the last minute, a crew guy from One Direction contacted them and gave them some extra tickets located where the crew family members were seated. Great seats, and he asked only for them to make a donation to a charity in exchange for the tickets. Nice guy!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2014-01-12 15:39 by latebloomer.

I used to work for an airline, thus flew for free on "Standby". I had once tickets for a charity rock concert in London RAH - that was the 2nd night of the 2 concerts planned. I planned on taking a flight to London that will arrive by noon of the day before so did'nt but a ticket for the first show, as the "sure thing" flight was the one that would have arrived to London only in the late evening of "day before" (same time as the 1st concert). I did arrive to London hours before that concert after all. Went to 1-2 ticket offices around Piccadilly after getting out of the tube - they all had quite a few single tickets, including the cheap standing tickets, but were asking for high prices (for the seating) or "full price" for the cheaper ones (guess that the last type were also available through the official channels). I politely said "thank you" and went off, without anyone offering anything but the first prices. After I've checked in near Victoria I noticed a ticket office by the coach station there and paid a visit. The guy there said he had a few "single" tickets in rows 5-10 and took out a small note and wrote in pencil the price, that was I think "150" (pounds). That was way too much and I thanked him but then he asked me to wait, called someone and asked him something in a kind of a code name phrase. He then hangup and wrote on the paper again "46" (pounds). I do not know how exactly these place work - is it a "consignation" arrangement (they sell what they can and return what they dont) or whatever, but it seems that some places would squeeze whatever then can from a ticket, while others would prefer to keep a high price and not to sell a few of the tickets at all. BTW: at about 4PM the day of HPII I bought something near Piccadilly circus and the same shop also had a ticket stand: they had in their hands a "chain" of some 50 RS tickets. I think they eventually didn't sell each and every ticket, but the price they asked was the full price.

Having Google searched all around for "Rolling Stones Adelaide Tickets", I have found that there are certainly quite a few still available. Even GA standing tickets have an asking price of $600 on Viagogo and elsewhere, best of luck to them if they can get that.

I spent my limit on 2 tickets in platinum, only to find that they count high to low with seat numbers on Ronnie's side, and not intuitively low to high which would have had us at a great angle 17 rows back. Instead, having drawn part of the map up to scale using info from an actual ticket agency computer (nice girl at newsagent) and known dimensions of the oval, we find ourselves placed outside the LHS edge of the stage with a tight viewing angle. Not what I had believed to have been purchasing at all.

There's no way right now I can pay Viagogo prices, but I wonder how many locals who are bigger fans than me missed out by mere seconds for a chance to purchase retail what has now become out of reach for most - $2000 a ticket x 2 is very hard to justify.

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bv
Many people rely on ticket brokers i.e. 3rd party ticket distribution. They may not be that fast or that informed, and the initial ticket sale is done and all is gone. They might not even have a PC, and they rely on somebody to take care of everything over the telephone, or my meeting up in an office. Just like organizing a holiday travel. Some do it on their own, but many can not do flights, tickets, accomodation and so on by themselves.

So around 30% of all tickets in USA are sold by ticket brokers, and they simply ask for market price. It is a distribution channel just like buying milk, bread or a house. Most of us have unlimited access to food and houses, but a concert ticket is a limited item so then there is always a distribution option.

If you think this is strange just go to a country where items are limited, like Cuba, and you will see secondary channels not just on tickets but also on fish, meat anything that you can not find in unlimited quantities.

The unsold tickets are not interesting. Just like the bakery. What happens to the unsold bread or cakes? Well the old people pick them up and hand them over to the birds next day. As for a Stones, show, like it is said here, the scalper prices drop as show time get closer, but they don't drop their pants. These are pro scalpers. They make their living from many shows, not just one, and they keep a certain price level. They can stand a loss, because they do know next week Justin Beaber or One Direction will be around, and as we all know, when the cute little children age 12 ask dad, the sky is the limit. You don't say NO to your child when Justin is inside the building. But a grown up guy may sday no to him/herself if the Stones are inside and the price is sky rocket size...

What is not said is that the promoters are in on the whole thing, profits included. They work together with the third party brokers. nNobody is stuck with tickets. If the brokers can't sell them, the promoters get rid of them elsewhere, last minute drops, comps, whatever.

Again, this is not third-party scalper scum, this is part of this business model that allows the promoters to pay the Stones the $$$ they demand.

In other words, tickets are held back, not sold even for the outrageous face values, they are funneled by the promoters to the brokers and they all share in the money.

I sell tickets on viagogo and stubhub quite often, when I can't get to a show. I just used it a couple months ago to sell my Mott the Hoople tickets when my trip to London was cancelled.

I used to sell on Ebay, but it's much easier to sell on the third party sites because you can just upload your ticket and forget about it - Viagogo checks your tickets to make sure they are OK before they approve the listing. I like it because there is no time wasted answering emails and easing buyers' concerns about whether the tickets are legit, etc. I always price my tickets 10% lower than the lowest price I can find for a comparable seat. I would rather sell the ticket at a loss than eat the whole amount.