For all of the Stones tours, I find it difficult to match the rock n roll intensity of the first five songs on the '78 tour: Let It Rock, All Down the Line, Honky Tonk Women, Starf*cker and When the Whip Comes Down.

Let's compare this to the first five on the fabled '73 tour: Brown Sugar, Gimme Shelter, Happy, Tumbling Dice, Starf*cker.

To my mind, featuring Keith so early in the '73 set was a mistake--but this is not the real point I'm getting at. Actually, this is really getting down to the basic difference between the Taylor & Wood eras. In '73, you have Taylor being showcased as the brilliant lead guitarist he was, particularly in Gimme Shelter--in '78, you have the Stones chugging along as a rock n roll machine, with all gears in synch.

In this light, after repeated comparisons between the two shows, I'll give the nod to '78. To take it further, the '78 Stones were closer to the original idea of the band than '73 was--a tight knit group playing as a rhythm machine, backing a charismatic lead singer who melded into the mix.

Right, I fully agree! Gonna play Handsome Girls now!

My favorite tour! Indeed the rock 'n roll machine doesn't stop 'till the end.
But... as i play handsome girls a lot, and by that i mean A LOT, i never thought Honky Tonk Women fitted in the set list. I always skip the song because i don't think it is part of the groove.
I also love the first five songs of the Licks arena tour. I don't know if they played same order every night but on the HBO show it a great first five songs. Street Fighting Man, Start Me Up, If You Can't Rock Me, Don't Stop and Monkey Man. Great start of a show!!!!

Cheers,
Wuudy

No, bassplayer. GS was not just a Taylor show-case. It was more a Keith showcase. That '73 version is the band so totally in sync. i'm not sure it can be beaten. And mainly due to Keith,(Charlie and Bill). Them three in charge. Taylor and Jagger at their liveliest best too. It all gels. When I listen to '73 shows I don't think "wonderful Taylor, oh listen to his stunning vibrato, etc etc"; I think, "f*ck, wasn't Keith amazing then, what a shame he's lost that instinctive flow".

From what I've heard, I'd say '73 was more consistent, night after night. But not complaining about '78!

This thread was just to illustrate the mastery of the Stones in pulling the audience into the groove with the first few songs-they obviously had to do this during their early days, but they haven't forgotten that most important lesson in stage performance as the years have passed.

let's not forget the '73 Tour of Europe opened up with our so-called "warhorses" which back then must have been amazing to watch!!!!

Imagine getting these songs blasting out as the opening 4 songs back in 1973:

Brown Sugar
Gimme Shelter
Happy (with Mick doing great backups)
Tumbling Dice

At the time these would have been songs that we would have LOVED and waited for the band to play.

I guess these days we take these songs for granted......

The 1978 Tour did start off as a great rock 'n roller intro....always a pleasure.

Esky

"the '78 Stones were closer to the original idea of the band than '73 was--a tight knit group playing as a rhythm machine, backing a charismatic lead singer who melded into the mix. "


At last, top thread! I soooooooo agree.

They played better in 1973, thats what counts - not the order of the songs in the set list.

I have to disagree with you, the worst. I think the band was slightly better in '78. Espescially Charlie and Bill. But it is hard to compare because they had a very different sound and they both where AWESOME!

Cheers,
Wuudy

Bassplayer,

Firstly it was you who introduced the comparison and the words RW and MT.

Secondly, why should they stick to the original ethos of the group. They had DEVELOPED from '62 to '73. '69 was the real re-birth of Stones live - and that was very different from early days. No complaints about Ya-Yas, surely. Is there necessarilly virtue in going back to an original idea. Perhaps it was important to do in a punk context - just to show their up-tempo metal.

Thirdly, although the spirit was there in '78, the guitarists were more ragged. Keith was nowhere near his former self. Bill and Charlie are great but the guitars were often ragged and less so. Often people have said on this site how shambolic some of the '78 shows were. Others were clearly good. But for quality and consistency AND excitement, '73.

As Esky says, in '73 all the songs were just a few years old, (most less than 2). All powerful, tour-de-force stuff. In 62-63-64, all the songs would have seemed fresh too. Sure, the '78 openers might have good rockin' credentials but most were at least five years old, Rather retro? Would have been braver, but less secure, to includ one or two more from SG. By starting with so many 'old' songs they were re-assuring their audience before venturing into the newer material.

BUT would have loved to see a '78-tour gig.


EDIT: Yes, theme of first 4-5 songs of each Stones tour is a good 'un.

81-82, mainly retro.

'89-90. Sad, Sad, Sad as 2nd number? Or Can't Be Seen? Can't remember. Starting with an 'old' favourite.

'94 - starting with very ol 'un but then LIS?

LICKS - totally retro intro songs........but after that, the '78-82 tours?

No, I'm wrong: Don't Stop was usually among the openers.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2005-04-28 20:37 by Deidre.

Well wuudy, as always it's a matter of taste. I agree Stones played well during the 78 tour, but the 72-73 live edition of the Rolling Stones was indeed the greatest rock and roll band in the world. First of all I like Taylor much more than Ronnie. Having said that - ron played good during the 78 tour, but for example the solos Taylor played live on songs like Gimme Shelter, Heartbreaker, Dancing With Mr. D, Midnight Rambler and Street Fighting Man is unbeatable. And of course Mick had a much, much better voice on the legenadary tours in 1972 and 1973. I also think the band sounded hotter,the energy and the power of the stones reached its height in this period - and IMHO they have never played better gigs before or since than 1972/1973.

The Worst - totally agree & Deidre - totally agree, but this thread is about the first 5 songs and although the '78 version has some hard-hitting rock songs which I enjoy listening to, I still think the '73 Euro Tour line-up was better because (as Deidre mentions) the songs are fresher and people who went to the shows have bought the "recent" albums at the time and want to hear these songs! Afterall, they are classics and "warhorses" today!

Esky

Mmm, I think the opening quintet of the '72 Us and '73 (Oz tour) beats the '73 European, the letter being a variation of the first. It's perfect, has the right variation, drama, energy.. everything:

Brown Sugar: best opener; fresh warhorse and great sing along to get the crowd into it.
Bitch: hard rocker, showing their chops; MT laying a solid rhythm foundation like a diesel train, Keith playing mean licks and a cutting solo. Some great unisono of brass and guitars.
Rocks Off: tour de force; the battle between the guitars and vocals, MJ going under one night, surviving the other. Something at stake there.
Gimme Shelter & Happy : Dall'inferno al paradiso.

As played in Sydney 26/2/'73 (their most energetic show ever) this remains my favourite 20 minutes of Stones music. Enough to leave one aghast.


----------------------------
"Music is the frozen tapioca in the ice chest of history."

"Shit!... No shit, awright!"

73 GETS MY VOTE

Vancouver, Pacific Coliseum 3.6.1972, 1st show of US tour 1972 was not bad either (dloaded it recently)

1. Brown Sugar
2. Bitch
3. Rocks Off
4. Gimme Shelter
5. Happy

this at least from our perspective. As far as my personal experience is concerned, new or fresh songs as openers don't work very well (this in almost all the concerts I've seen, by any group). Still I was not there in 72/73.

On the other hand I have to agree that when the '78 Stones were on, r'n'r could not get any better!!! From this point of view, the Chuck Berry intro is a statement.
Just think of it. At the time the "greatest r'n'r band in the world" could have opened with at least 20 classics form their catalogue. Instead no, they open with a Berry song. Cut the crap, it's only rock and roll!!!

C

73 without doubt. I can't get that exited over the 78 tour - although the Stones were still good there's a definite drop in quality - the loss of Taylor and the back to basics approach does not sit well with me. It's like comparing Some Girls with Exile. The Some Girls period may sound great on a first, second or third listen but it starts to ring hollow thereafter - the 72-73 period is for keeps.