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Yes, I think that that's his point. Doesn't mean the record won't be good or that die-hards won't enjoy it. Just means that by using these 20th century tools you have no chance to truly break-through and MATTER any more.
But are we supposed to care how long the album stays around. 1 or 2 weeks ??
As long as it stays around long enough for me to purchase it, i'm happy
I don't care what teeny boppers think of it
If Keith started to make albums with the incentive of impressing main stream, we would say he sold out !!!
So what are classic rock acts supposed to do, listen to this jokers advice and just roll over and die
The man is actually saying that it does not matter how good the album is ( he did not review the album did he ) it makes no difference to him because it will not sell well.
So what, the Stones have sold an incredible amount of albums over 43 years
That should garner some respect imho
Yeah, he's a curmudgeon, all right. Spent decades in the music biz and then split to do his own thing and has become a minor celebrity of sorts. He usually talks about how albums are over and how no one listens to them anymore and how it's all about singles, individual songs that can blow people away. In his view, given all the distractions available to us in the modern world, the only thing that can keep our attention is something that is GREAT, not just good. Why do musicians keep trying to produce 55 mins of music twice a year (that inevitably contains filler) that no one listens to again or talks about after the first week it comes out? Why not put out GREAT SONGS once a month or every few months that knock people's socks off?
One of the problems with that, of course, is that it's REALLY REALLY HARD to write a great song ...
That's a fascinating issue. I have no idea what the financials are behind Keith's record. Did he get an advance? If so, how much? What is his royalty rate? What are his marketing expenses? If he doesn't tour, and the record drops off the cliff in the second week as Lefsetz predicts, how likely is he to break even?
You could be absolutely right and no one is losing money releasing Keith's record ... but I think there are some data we would need in order to be sure of that.
right on, riffhards! we've been waiting on that for, what, going on 34 years?
what is that definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?
When The Stones formed their own record company and created recording and publishing companies they owned back in the 70's, the concept of a traditional separate record company became useless. They made distribution deals only and I'm sure they follow that general model to this day. Once recording, production, marketing and manufacturing costs are covered the rest is pure profit for them, split between the 4 members of the band.
I'm not sure what kind of deal Keith had made but you've got to assume it is similar. Keith obviously doesn't need an advance to make a record. I'd bet the marketing and distribution are the only things he's contracted out and his profits are similarly high to what the Stones receive. My guess is he will be in the black on this record within the first month of release. Obviously if he didn't sell enough to cover the relatively fixed initial costs he would lose money. I speculate that he is assuming the risk in order to achieve the higher profits.
It sounds reasonable to me. And if your chief assumption above is correct then, yes, it's hard to imagine Keith not getting into the black on the record fairly quickly.
But I think the original issue was "no one is losing money by releasing their albums." So, not referring to Keith himself but to the record company. How many do they need to stream/sell in order to break even on their costs (which as you say are likely marketing and distribution)?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-31 01:56 by LongBeachArena72.
Agree totally. I was just wondering if a Keith solo record is a viable financial undertaking for a record company. Surely it must be or they wouldn't be releasing it. Unless they're releasing it in order to continue to have access to The Stones' catalog.
But, yes, Keith most likely just wanted to make the best record he could, have some fun, and put it out there.
Yes, and 20 years from now still there will be people buying this album, just like what happens with his previous records.
I will not disagree. Taylor Swift is enormous now so I just went to youtube to give a listen to four of her tunes. The worst one was semi-rap and had 490 million views!!! None of them came close to the simple classy "As Tears Go By" done by Marianne Faithfull. So contemporary tastes can go to hell as far as I am concerned.
And for Stones fans a new Keith album is months long affair. Not a two week one. We are right and the modern world of pop music is wrong
Said the old farts in 1965.
They promised not to forget this week, so please ask on Keith's twitter and facebook pages where it is.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
LongBeachArena72
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:09
Quote
georgelicks
Sadly the guy is not so far from reality, nowadays no one cares about a Keith's solo album, hell no one was interested in 1992 when his album charted at #99 on the charts, he's a cult act with big press coverage, but the audience is not there.
Sadly its the same for any old act, nothing sticks around more than 1 or 2 weeks, the general public is not interested on rock music.
Yes, I think that that's his point. Doesn't mean the record won't be good or that die-hards won't enjoy it. Just means that by using these 20th century tools you have no chance to truly break-through and MATTER any more.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
keefriffhards
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:12
Quote
georgelicks
Sadly the guy is not so far from reality, nowadays no one cares about a Keith's solo album, hell no one was interested in 1992 when his album charted at #99 on the charts, he's a cult act with big press coverage, but the audience is not there.
Sadly its the same for any old act, nothing sticks around more than 1 or 2 weeks, the general public is not interested on rock music.
But are we supposed to care how long the album stays around. 1 or 2 weeks ??
As long as it stays around long enough for me to purchase it, i'm happy
I don't care what teeny boppers think of it
If Keith started to make albums with the incentive of impressing main stream, we would say he sold out !!!
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
keefriffhards
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:18
Quote
LongBeachArena72
Don't think he's anti-Keith, per se. In fact he digs The Stones, liked Staples 2013 and Fonda 2015.
He's just consistently amazed at how oblivious classic rockers are to the modern music marketplace.
He's all about data and knows that by the 2nd week, Keith's record will be done.
So what are classic rock acts supposed to do, listen to this jokers advice and just roll over and die
The man is actually saying that it does not matter how good the album is ( he did not review the album did he ) it makes no difference to him because it will not sell well.
So what, the Stones have sold an incredible amount of albums over 43 years
That should garner some respect imho
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
georgelicks
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:31
That's the point, in fact the Stones' albums are selling very well this year, Sticky Fingers went Top 5, Hot Rocks spent 14 weeks on the Billboard 200 in 2015 and their classic songs are big on Spotify, but nothing post Start Me Up is selling or streaming.
New music from old acts (40+ years) is very hard to sell nowadays, it was never the same after 1991-92.
New music from old acts (40+ years) is very hard to sell nowadays, it was never the same after 1991-92.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
LongBeachArena72
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:34
Quote
keefriffhardsQuote
LongBeachArena72
Don't think he's anti-Keith, per se. In fact he digs The Stones, liked Staples 2013 and Fonda 2015.
He's just consistently amazed at how oblivious classic rockers are to the modern music marketplace.
He's all about data and knows that by the 2nd week, Keith's record will be done.
So what are classic rock acts supposed to do, listen to this jokers advice and just roll over and die
The man is actually saying that it does not matter how good the album is ( he did not review the album did he ) it makes no difference to him because it will not sell well.
So what, the Stones have sold an incredible amount of albums over 43 years
That should garner some respect imho
Yeah, he's a curmudgeon, all right. Spent decades in the music biz and then split to do his own thing and has become a minor celebrity of sorts. He usually talks about how albums are over and how no one listens to them anymore and how it's all about singles, individual songs that can blow people away. In his view, given all the distractions available to us in the modern world, the only thing that can keep our attention is something that is GREAT, not just good. Why do musicians keep trying to produce 55 mins of music twice a year (that inevitably contains filler) that no one listens to again or talks about after the first week it comes out? Why not put out GREAT SONGS once a month or every few months that knock people's socks off?
One of the problems with that, of course, is that it's REALLY REALLY HARD to write a great song ...
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
TeddyB1018
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:34
Bob Lefsetz is an utter prat. His raison d'être as an old guy himself is to show how with it he is in terms of the business. Why should Keith Richards or even the Rolling Stones bend their work to the realities of the current music business. No one is losing money by releasing their albums.
The equivalent comment in filmed entertainment would be to suggest that the creators just make a really punchy Vine instead of movie or series. Basically Lefitz has taken his own advice and become a blogger. Not that he was ever cool.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-31 00:38 by TeddyB1018.
The equivalent comment in filmed entertainment would be to suggest that the creators just make a really punchy Vine instead of movie or series. Basically Lefitz has taken his own advice and become a blogger. Not that he was ever cool.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-31 00:38 by TeddyB1018.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
LongBeachArena72
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:40
Quote
TeddyB1018
Bob Lefsetz is an utter prat. His raison d'être as an old guy himself is to show how with it he is in terms of the business. Why should Keith Richards or even the Rolling Stones bend their work to the realities of the current music business. No one is losing money by releasing their albums.
That's a fascinating issue. I have no idea what the financials are behind Keith's record. Did he get an advance? If so, how much? What is his royalty rate? What are his marketing expenses? If he doesn't tour, and the record drops off the cliff in the second week as Lefsetz predicts, how likely is he to break even?
You could be absolutely right and no one is losing money releasing Keith's record ... but I think there are some data we would need in order to be sure of that.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
keefriffhards
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:54
The fact of the matter is this. If the Stones make a great album and play 4 to 5 new tracks live every show, it would hugely improve sales,
and also give us die hard fans a real buzz from them playing new material.
It would feel like the good old days
Personally i don't like nostalgia tours per se, its far more exciting when they tread the boards with fresh material
and also give us die hard fans a real buzz from them playing new material.
It would feel like the good old days
Personally i don't like nostalgia tours per se, its far more exciting when they tread the boards with fresh material
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
LongBeachArena72
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:57
Quote
keefriffhards
The fact of the matter is this. If the Stones make a great album and play 4 to 5 new tracks live every show, it would hugely improve sales,
and also give us die hard fans a real buzz from them playing new material.
It would feel like the good old days
Personally i don't like nostalgia tours per se, its far more exciting when they tread the boards with fresh material
right on, riffhards! we've been waiting on that for, what, going on 34 years?
what is that definition of insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result?
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
mailexile67
()
Date: August 31, 2015 00:58
Aaaah!!!+1
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 31, 2015 01:01
Several hundred thousand fans care about a Keith album. They want it the old fashioned way.
Should there be others who care, they have it through all the hyper modern channels there is. Then we have the plaque campaign.
I don't see the problem here. He has a release plan, and he follows it.
Remember that hundreds of thousands albums sold would be a high number in today's market. And what does it matter if the album stalls after two weeks, as long as many people will buy it? The music won't be forgotten..
Should there be others who care, they have it through all the hyper modern channels there is. Then we have the plaque campaign.
I don't see the problem here. He has a release plan, and he follows it.
Remember that hundreds of thousands albums sold would be a high number in today's market. And what does it matter if the album stalls after two weeks, as long as many people will buy it? The music won't be forgotten..
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
keefriffhards
()
Date: August 31, 2015 01:06
That's right, music, once its out there is never forgotten
I'm just grateful that Keith has put it out there for anyone who wants it
Take it or leave it, its out there !!
I'm just grateful that Keith has put it out there for anyone who wants it
Take it or leave it, its out there !!
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
Naturalust
()
Date: August 31, 2015 01:07
Quote
LongBeachArena72Quote
TeddyB1018
Bob Lefsetz is an utter prat. His raison d'être as an old guy himself is to show how with it he is in terms of the business. Why should Keith Richards or even the Rolling Stones bend their work to the realities of the current music business. No one is losing money by releasing their albums.
That's a fascinating issue. I have no idea what the financials are behind Keith's record. Did he get an advance? If so, how much? What is his royalty rate? What are his marketing expenses? If he doesn't tour, and the record drops off the cliff in the second week as Lefsetz predicts, how likely is he to break even?
You could be absolutely right and no one is losing money releasing Keith's record ... but I think there are some data we would need in order to be sure of that.
When The Stones formed their own record company and created recording and publishing companies they owned back in the 70's, the concept of a traditional separate record company became useless. They made distribution deals only and I'm sure they follow that general model to this day. Once recording, production, marketing and manufacturing costs are covered the rest is pure profit for them, split between the 4 members of the band.
I'm not sure what kind of deal Keith had made but you've got to assume it is similar. Keith obviously doesn't need an advance to make a record. I'd bet the marketing and distribution are the only things he's contracted out and his profits are similarly high to what the Stones receive. My guess is he will be in the black on this record within the first month of release. Obviously if he didn't sell enough to cover the relatively fixed initial costs he would lose money. I speculate that he is assuming the risk in order to achieve the higher profits.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
LongBeachArena72
()
Date: August 31, 2015 01:26
Quote
NaturalustQuote
LongBeachArena72Quote
TeddyB1018
Bob Lefsetz is an utter prat. His raison d'être as an old guy himself is to show how with it he is in terms of the business. Why should Keith Richards or even the Rolling Stones bend their work to the realities of the current music business. No one is losing money by releasing their albums.
That's a fascinating issue. I have no idea what the financials are behind Keith's record. Did he get an advance? If so, how much? What is his royalty rate? What are his marketing expenses? If he doesn't tour, and the record drops off the cliff in the second week as Lefsetz predicts, how likely is he to break even?
You could be absolutely right and no one is losing money releasing Keith's record ... but I think there are some data we would need in order to be sure of that.
When The Stones formed their own record company and created recording and publishing companies they owned back in the 70's, the concept of a traditional separate record company became useless. They made distribution deals only and I'm sure they follow that general model to this day. Once recording, production, marketing and manufacturing costs are covered the rest is pure profit for them, split between the 4 members of the band.
I'm not sure what kind of deal Keith had made but you've got to assume it is similar. Keith obviously doesn't need an advance to make a record. I'd bet the marketing and distribution are the only things he's contracted out and his profits are similarly high to what the Stones receive. My guess is he will be in the black on this record within the first month of release. Obviously if he didn't sell enough to cover the relatively fixed initial costs he would lose money. I speculate that he is assuming the risk in order to achieve the higher profits.
It sounds reasonable to me. And if your chief assumption above is correct then, yes, it's hard to imagine Keith not getting into the black on the record fairly quickly.
But I think the original issue was "no one is losing money by releasing their albums." So, not referring to Keith himself but to the record company. How many do they need to stream/sell in order to break even on their costs (which as you say are likely marketing and distribution)?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2015-08-31 01:56 by LongBeachArena72.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
Bashlets
()
Date: August 31, 2015 01:48
i think this album will do as well as TIC chart wise. The press is starting to pick up. Hoping for a Rolling Stones magazine cover and interview the week the album streets. Barnes and Noble has quadrupled their vinyl sales. I think a lot of older folks want this on vinyl. I have been so psyched about this release that Ive gone a little psychotic. I have purchased:
the vinyl off Amazon Prime
the cd off Amazon Prime
SHM CD from CD Japan
CD with bonus from Best Buy
Itunes( my kid has 100.00 on it) so I can play it that morning before my mail comes with the real deal.
the vinyl off Amazon Prime
the cd off Amazon Prime
SHM CD from CD Japan
CD with bonus from Best Buy
Itunes( my kid has 100.00 on it) so I can play it that morning before my mail comes with the real deal.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
keefriffhards
()
Date: August 31, 2015 01:50
You guys are talking like Keith may be doing this album for the money, or for profit
The guys worth roughly 200 million pounds, does he care if his album or a mini winos tour is profitable
I strongly doubt those are his incentives or motives
Come on, try to get real, these issues are interesting for us to ponder, but financially he lives in a different world to us.
If he broke even and paid all his musiscians generously he would probably think, job done
The guys worth roughly 200 million pounds, does he care if his album or a mini winos tour is profitable
I strongly doubt those are his incentives or motives
Come on, try to get real, these issues are interesting for us to ponder, but financially he lives in a different world to us.
If he broke even and paid all his musiscians generously he would probably think, job done
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
LongBeachArena72
()
Date: August 31, 2015 01:58
Quote
keefriffhards
You guys are talking like Keith may be doing this album for the money, or for profit
The guys worth roughly 200 million pounds, does he care if his album or a mini winos tour is profitable
I strongly doubt those are his incentives or motives
Come on, try to get real, these issues are interesting for us to ponder, but financially he lives in a different world to us.
If he broke even and paid all his musiscians generously he would probably think, job done
Agree totally. I was just wondering if a Keith solo record is a viable financial undertaking for a record company. Surely it must be or they wouldn't be releasing it. Unless they're releasing it in order to continue to have access to The Stones' catalog.
But, yes, Keith most likely just wanted to make the best record he could, have some fun, and put it out there.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 31, 2015 02:05
The name Keith Richards means money - for everyone. It doesn't matter what some blog hack thinks, imo.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: August 31, 2015 03:01
I don't like Trouble, but i'm half laughing, half impressed by Amnesia and Substantial Damage.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
Cristiano Radtke
()
Date: August 31, 2015 04:27
Quote
DandelionPowderman
Several hundred thousand fans care about a Keith album. They want it the old fashioned way.
Should there be others who care, they have it through all the hyper modern channels there is. Then we have the plaque campaign.
I don't see the problem here. He has a release plan, and he follows it.
Remember that hundreds of thousands albums sold would be a high number in today's market. And what does it matter if the album stalls after two weeks, as long as many people will buy it? The music won't be forgotten..
Yes, and 20 years from now still there will be people buying this album, just like what happens with his previous records.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
Turner68
()
Date: August 31, 2015 06:14
Let's listen to the album before we write its obituary. So far we have every reason to be excited - initial songs are good, the musicians on the album are great, Keith is getting lots of press, and a new documentary is coming out. This is all good news to anyone who is a stones fan.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
triceratops
()
Date: August 31, 2015 07:04
Quote
georgelicks
Sadly the guy is not so far from reality, nowadays no one cares about a Keith's solo album, hell no one was interested in 1992 when his album charted at #99 on the charts, he's a cult act with big press coverage, but the audience is not there.
Sadly its the same for any old act, nothing sticks around more than 1 or 2 weeks, the general public is not interested on rock music.
I will not disagree. Taylor Swift is enormous now so I just went to youtube to give a listen to four of her tunes. The worst one was semi-rap and had 490 million views!!! None of them came close to the simple classy "As Tears Go By" done by Marianne Faithfull. So contemporary tastes can go to hell as far as I am concerned.
And for Stones fans a new Keith album is months long affair. Not a two week one. We are right and the modern world of pop music is wrong
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
KRiffhard
()
Date: August 31, 2015 09:21
"We are right and the modern world of pop music is wrong"
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: August 31, 2015 09:26
Quote
KRiffhard
"We are right and the modern world of pop music is wrong"
Said the old farts in 1965.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
Deathgod
()
Date: August 31, 2015 12:04
I don't give a rats how many it sells.
It could sell only one copy and I would be happy, if that copy was of course mine.
It's a good time to be a Stones fan
It could sell only one copy and I would be happy, if that copy was of course mine.
It's a good time to be a Stones fan
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: August 31, 2015 12:12
Quote
Deathgod
I don't give a rats how many it sells.
It could sell only one copy and I would be happy, if that copy was of course mine.
It's a good time to be a Stones fan
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
HMS
()
Date: August 31, 2015 12:44
I do care how many it sells. The more it sells, the more possible is a new Stones-album, imo. If nobody cares for Crosseyed Heart, the boys would say "Why recording again, nobody cares." A successful Richards-album would be a good reason to enter the recording studios again.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
Deathgod
()
Date: August 31, 2015 13:48
any news on the latest unlock, or has the social media crew forgotten again ?
Hope it's 'Nothing On Me'
Hope it's 'Nothing On Me'
Re: The Department of Words of One Syllable
Posted by:
with sssoul
()
Date: August 31, 2015 14:45
Quote
with sssoulQuote
with sssoul
... from the app designers, responding very promptly to my email to them:
"Hi,
Thanks for your mail, and for letting us know of your/others frustration.
I've forwarded your comments on to the team running the campaign for a proper response.
Meanwhile hopefully it's reassuring to let you know that, to our knowledge,
the rest of the plaques should be revealed as planned!"
And a follow-up:
"Just got the following back from the team:
‘Due to an unforeseen illness to a member of the Cross Eyed Heart Plaque campaign team,
the second plaque location was revealed later than planned.
The next and final two plaque locations will be revealed, as planned, on Monday 31st of August and Monday 7th September.
Apologies to the fans left waiting, we’re glad you’re all enjoying the campaign!’
They promised not to forget this week, so please ask on Keith's twitter and facebook pages where it is.
Re: Keith Richards solo album 'Crosseyed Heart' - out September 18
Posted by:
Moonshine
()
Date: August 31, 2015 15:14
Really enjoying the latest two, better on the cans. Fun lol lines, bit of a TW feel to it all but in a good way.
Was a bit worried after Trouble but these are great and all his stuff is slow burning.
Was a bit worried after Trouble but these are great and all his stuff is slow burning.
This Thread has been closed
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