The fourth note is the bended g-string in his blues licks

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DandelionPowderman
Imagine making every top 10 world's best guitar player list, when you only can play four notes...

That says something about feel, signature sound and attack, don't you think?

I don't believe in top ten lists, I believe in taste, although I get your point.
I would recommend any beginning player to listen to Richards in the first place.

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

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Mathijs

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

If I remember it well my first remark after the first gig in 2012 was: "Mick Taylor starts sounding like Ron Wood. Whether this is a compliment or not is up to anybody else here". So I still think my comments on Taylor are coming from a different angle than yours, albeit at the same time - coincidentally.

So please keep me out of your "inner circle". Thank You.

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Mathijs

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

check out mick taylor with the stones in las vegas at the mgm grand garden arena 5/11/13 and tell me what you think of mick taylor's solo . dare i say the best one on the 50 tour !

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Mathijs

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

Memory problems? Your comment on the first Rambler in London was simply: "fantastic!" O well, not because of Taylor, duh.

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svt22

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Mathijs

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

If I remember it well my first remark after the first gig in 2012 was: "Mick Taylor starts sounding like Ron Wood. Whether this is a compliment or not is up to anybody else here". So I still think my comments on Taylor are coming from a different angle than yours, albeit at the same time - coincidentally.

So please keep me out of your "inner circle". Thank You.

You're mixing yourself up with His Majesty, the very one who wrote this epic sentence. What a compliment for Wood!

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kleermaker

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svt22

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Mathijs

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

If I remember it well my first remark after the first gig in 2012 was: "Mick Taylor starts sounding like Ron Wood. Whether this is a compliment or not is up to anybody else here". So I still think my comments on Taylor are coming from a different angle than yours, albeit at the same time - coincidentally.

So please keep me out of your "inner circle". Thank You.

You're mixing yourself up with His Majesty, the very one who wrote this epic sentence. What a compliment for Wood!

Nope, I wrote this, unless HM copied me, which I doubt.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-07-03 22:24 by svt22.

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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Mathijs

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svt22

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kleermaker

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svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

If I remember it well my first remark after the first gig in 2012 was: "Mick Taylor starts sounding like Ron Wood. Whether this is a compliment or not is up to anybody else here". So I still think my comments on Taylor are coming from a different angle than yours, albeit at the same time - coincidentally.

So please keep me out of your "inner circle". Thank You.

You're mixing yourself up with His Majesty, the very one who wrote this epic sentence. What a compliment for Wood!

Nope, I wrote this, unless HM copied me, which I doubt.

Let's say: what a coincidence.

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kleermaker

Quote
svt22

Quote
kleermaker

Quote
svt22

Quote
Mathijs

Quote
svt22

Quote
kleermaker

Quote
svt22

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

If I remember it well my first remark after the first gig in 2012 was: "Mick Taylor starts sounding like Ron Wood. Whether this is a compliment or not is up to anybody else here". So I still think my comments on Taylor are coming from a different angle than yours, albeit at the same time - coincidentally.

So please keep me out of your "inner circle". Thank You.

You're mixing yourself up with His Majesty, the very one who wrote this epic sentence. What a compliment for Wood!

Nope, I wrote this, unless HM copied me, which I doubt.

Let's say: what a coincidence.

I think HM has a good taste when it comes to music, at least he and I have a similar one, to a certain extend of course, so it might be no coincidence.

soooo.. ahem

more playing time for Taylor yeah?

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Mathijs

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kleermaker
I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

If I remember it well my first remark after the first gig in 2012 was: "Mick Taylor starts sounding like Ron Wood. Whether this is a compliment or not is up to anybody else here". So I still think my comments on Taylor are coming from a different angle than yours, albeit at the same time - coincidentally.

So please keep me out of your "inner circle". Thank You.

You're mixing yourself up with His Majesty, the very one who wrote this epic sentence. What a compliment for Wood!

Nope, I wrote this, unless HM copied me, which I doubt.

Let's say: what a coincidence.

I think HM has a good taste when it comes to music, at least he and I have a similar one, to a certain extend of course, so it might be no coincidence.

If memory serves HM despises the Taylor you love and vice versa.

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Captainchaos



soooo.. ahem

more playing time for Taylor yeah?

I hope he's going to play for himself, make a new record or get a great band together, and foremost: play the guitar a lot. His Stones connection is not there anymore, not to my taste.

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Mathijs

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I think you're missing the point svt. It's not about Taylor's guitarist's skills at all. He still has them, shown them a year ago by that Shine A Light solo you know now and also during the Sways and Knockings he did during the American tour.

"At this moment"
The whole issue for Taylor is to be permitted to play with the band as long as possible. His whole behaviour shows that: adapting his style to the way they play MR nowadays, playing third fiddle and even inaudible acoustic on SF, being ready to play a showcase song like Knocking on demand, playing Sway according to the Stones arrangement with little room to nail the song.

He wants to remain part of the band, that's what he signs (think about the genuflecting etc). Result is an insecure position (at first not present at the final bow, later on present). Taylor seems to accept anything to be able to play with the band. It's conspicuous how his role on MR has diminished since November 2012, resulting in an humble one during Glastonbury (the least Rambler of the tour so far, btw).

Well, there are two Taylors to me: The splendid Taylor era guitarist and the one we have today, who sometimes has his moments, just like the rest of the band. I must admit the last Glastonbury gig was quite ok though.

Let me quote a poster here, who nailed it very well, imo:

"All three guitarists are definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment. I think that is a fair and democratic representation of reality. But so what? They are there together, playing and having fun, charismatic as ever, and they can still "click" as a band. Just play on!"

Let's leave it at that.

I don't agree that Taylor is "definitely musically senile to the same degree at this moment" as the other guitarists. He's still of another level. You know that, but are disappointed not to hear the Taylor from 1973. I've argued he theoretically still could play almost like that (think about the proof of the SAL solo from last year), but in this setting, playing on these songs, regarding his position in the band, it's simply impossible and has nothing to do with skills or senility at all.

"At this moment"

Then why does he refuse to play decent on MR, playing the same few uninspired lame licks every time, playing ten decent notes on CHMN, doesn't play decent fills on Sway, yes his solo was too short cause of the band. Why not have a word with the band then??? His timing is unstable, having trouble with his sound, forgets his bottleneck on LiV, the last time Ron Wood had to give him his?
The guy has days of time to prepare his stuff.

These symptoms remind me of senility or he's just extremely lazy/absent minded.. Can someone have a word with him then, or just pay him his pension and send him on holiday for the rest of his life. He deserves it, he has done enough for the Stones in the past, but please not this. I want to hear Taylor, I'm not a Taylor tourist, or a Stones tourist. People that don't hear this huge difference and just keep on stating the Stones/ Taylor are still great, are equal senile to me. But then again, enjoy. I'm up to Artis zoo in Amsterdam with my 12 years old niece. I'm sorry.

I don't understand this. You guys sound exactly the same as me since November 2012, when I stated that I just didn't feel Taylor brought anything to the band, and that he was just a mere shadow of his former self, being lazy, not rehearsed, sounding bad, being unprofessional, and what ever more.

You guys slagged me off completely, attacked me and DP like crazy, and what do we have here?

Make up your mind, I am getting confused....

Mathijs

If I remember it well my first remark after the first gig in 2012 was: "Mick Taylor starts sounding like Ron Wood. Whether this is a compliment or not is up to anybody else here". So I still think my comments on Taylor are coming from a different angle than yours, albeit at the same time - coincidentally.

So please keep me out of your "inner circle". Thank You.

You're mixing yourself up with His Majesty, the very one who wrote this epic sentence. What a compliment for Wood!

Nope, I wrote this, unless HM copied me, which I doubt.

Let's say: what a coincidence.

I think HM has a good taste when it comes to music, at least he and I have a similar one, to a certain extend of course, so it might be no coincidence.

If memory serves HM despises the Taylor you love and vice versa.

Is it prohibited by Taylorite law to appreciate the 1969 Taylor, and not so much his playing in 1973?

Don't catch me on the exact phrases, but basically for the last couple of years you two guys are cumming on basically anyything Taylor -you even prefer Taylor's farts over Wood's...Day in day out you guys wrote on how frigging fantastic Taylor was and is, and how everything wonderful about the Stones was due to Taylor.

With this tour you guys kept on blabbing how frigging wonderful fantastic taylor was on Sway and CYHMK, and how he lifted the band to an entire, bloody fantastic level, and how poor old Ron Wood was never able to do that.

Whenever Taylor was mentioned you guys started masturbating.

And now this 180....

Mathijs

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Mathijs
Don't catch me on the exact phrases, but basically for the last couple of years you two guys are cumming on basically anyything Taylor -you even prefer Taylor's farts over Wood's...Day in day out you guys wrote on how frigging fantastic Taylor was and is, and how everything wonderful about the Stones was due to Taylor.

With this tour you guys kept on blabbing how frigging wonderful fantastic taylor was on Sway and CYHMK, and how he lifted the band to an entire, bloody fantastic level, and how poor old Ron Wood was never able to do that.

Whenever Taylor was mentioned you guys started masturbating.

And now this 180....

Mathijs

Keep your personal and sexual fantasies for yourself please, I'm perfectly happy with my girlfriend. And stay on topic - you fabricate too much.

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DandelionPowderman


Is it prohibited by Taylorite law to appreciate the 1969 Taylor, and not so much his playing in 1973?

Nope, feel free to enjoy the entire Taylor era, it all sounds Taylorish.

Thank you. Now I have it in writing

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svt22

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Mathijs
Don't catch me on the exact phrases, but basically for the last couple of years you two guys are cumming on basically anyything Taylor -you even prefer Taylor's farts over Wood's...Day in day out you guys wrote on how frigging fantastic Taylor was and is, and how everything wonderful about the Stones was due to Taylor.

With this tour you guys kept on blabbing how frigging wonderful fantastic taylor was on Sway and CYHMK, and how he lifted the band to an entire, bloody fantastic level, and how poor old Ron Wood was never able to do that.

Whenever Taylor was mentioned you guys started masturbating.

And now this 180....

Mathijs

Keep your personal and sexual fantasies for yourself please, I'm perfectly happy with my girlfriend. And stay on topic - you fabricate too much.

You don't answer my question. This all really makes your and Kleermaker's postings on this board for the last few years just totally duff and useless.

Mathijs

Who will get the first post on page 100 in this thread, and will we get there before July 13??

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DandelionPowderman
Who will get the first post on page 100 in this thread, and will we get there before July 13??

i was thinking before the first hyde park show!

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Acoustic guitar on Satisfaction to compete with two electric guitars - what a joke! It must have something to do with Taylor, supposedly, being paid per song. You could actually pick up a person from the public and let him/her play on a very small triangle and that would have a greater impact on the song!

You might as well give that triangle to Keith or Ron. When Taylor played the electric on SF they were equal "brillant".

As long as Keith was sticking to the rhythm all was brilliant?

It would be quite a disaster if Keith couldn't play 3 tones he's been playing for let's say 45 years already.

Funny thread, I start to like it.

i don't get the ragging on KR's guitar playing. he is the first one to admit that he's no virtuoso and that guitar playing is not what he is best at. since there's no dispute about his technical capabilities as a guitarist, and we're all supposed to be stones fans, why keep poking at his skills? it is kind of like making fun of picasso for not being able to paint between the lines or to paint a photo-realistic painting - completely misses the point.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-07-04 01:46 by sonomastone.

Worst career decision in the history of any business. Jagger net worth 305 mil est,Keith 280 est,Charlie 280 est. Mick Taylor 300,000. Now when I have more money than Mick Taylor a Rolling Stone somebody made a bad move in their career.If he is the greatest guitart player ever he sure as hell has wasted a lot of time.How could you quit the Stones unless you were Wyman and already had enought to last a few years.

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Eleanor Rigby
Yep that is true. The band only gives him the stage and a choice of song, but MT would have no say about the arrangement of that song.
Therefore he finds it hard to "shine" to his potential.

What "arrangement" would have helped exactly?

- He gets several minutes while band calms down on CYHMK
- He gets an extended slot on Sway
- He gets a "free-ride" on Midnight Rambler
- He was kept on a leash on Satisfaction, and now he plays acoustic guitar

I'd say you're looking for excuses here - but there isn't really anything to excuse, imo. He plays as well as he can, and I think he's doing fine.

I think 'Sway' is a flop though, Dandelion, because of the faster tempo it is played, and also i believe the Stones could be a little more accommodating towards Taylor, who has played as well as he can on the song given the circumstances. The other songs, 'Satisfaction' aside, have given Taylor ample room to show off his capabilities, which he has done very convincingly at times, but not quite so convincingly, at others. If you are looking for the intricate flowing story tellingly eloquent guitar playing Taylor from the seventies, where each note contributes to the greater whole, as in pieces of a jigsaw, so to speak, the consistency isn't quite there, whether that's to do with lack of practice, or advancing age, or a combination of the two, i'm not quite sure. When Taylor manages to string a few nice guitar lines together, however, he can still be mesmerising, which as i have said before, can still transcend a Stones performance. It's just sometimes a case of Taylor managing to maintain that consistency a little more and to build on it.

Taylor from the seventies in a live setting was a true marvel, not just because of his musical ability, but also through his dedication. Sometimes i think today, that's what he needs a little more of. There are times he does appear a little unsure of himself, or at least the very least, a little restless.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-07-04 10:08 by Edward Twining.

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Edward Twining

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DandelionPowderman

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Eleanor Rigby
Yep that is true. The band only gives him the stage and a choice of song, but MT would have no say about the arrangement of that song.
Therefore he finds it hard to "shine" to his potential.

What "arrangement" would have helped exactly?

- He gets several minutes while band calms down on CYHMK
- He gets an extended slot on Sway
- He gets a "free-ride" on Midnight Rambler
- He was kept on a leash on Satisfaction, and now he plays acoustic guitar

I'd say you're looking for excuses here - but there isn't really anything to excuse, imo. He plays as well as he can, and I think he's doing fine.

I think 'Sway' is a flop though, Dandelion, because of the faster tempo it is played, and also i believe the Stones could be a little more accommodating towards Taylor, who has played as well as he can on the song given the circumstances. The other songs, 'Satisfaction' aside, have given Taylor ample room to show off his capabilities, which he has done very convincingly at times, but not quite so convincingly, at others. If you are looking for the intricate flowing story tellingly eloquent guitar playing Taylor from the seventies, where each note contributes to the greater whole, as in pieces of a jigsaw, so to speak, the consistency isn't quite there, whether that's to do with lack of practice, or advancing age, or a combination of the two, i'm not quite sure. When Taylor manages to string a few nice guitar lines together, however, he can still be mesmerising, which as i have said before, can still transcend a Stones performance. It's just sometimes a case of Taylor managing to maintain that consistency a little more and to build on it.

Taylor from the seventies in a live setting was a true marvel, not just because of his musical ability, but also through his dedication. Sometimes i think today, that's what he needs a little more of. There are times he does appear a little unsure of himself, or at least the very least, a little restless.

But it isn't necessarily the Stones's fault, is it?

And what are we expecting? I think Taylor's days of fluidity, where every note mattered, are over. Personally, I think it was over back in 1973 already, when he took it too far. If you're playing too much, every note won't matter anymore - but that's me. I know that many of the fans love it the more he plays.

Sway has been far from perfect on this tour. Taylor plays his solo fine on Sway, but like the other guitarists he is fumbling a lot in his rhythm playing on this one. He is playing nice solos, in spite of the tempo (I'm not sure if it's the wrong tempo or wrong rhythm from Charlie, though) - and I can't see the reason for using that as an example for him not getting the spot he deserves. When he didn't have the flow, Jagger cut him "short" (still a long solo, though).

He also does a solid job on CYHMK. To claim that he is not given room to do his thing on this one, as others on this board have, is misunderstood at best, imo.

Today we see glimpses of old greatness, albeit with a cleaner sound than back in the day. To be honest, it's like that with the whole band as well. However, those glimpses makes it so worthwhile to be a Stones fan

I think people are expecting too much of Taylor, and that some are looking at the band to find the culprit, rather than the obvious: It's not 1972 anymore.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-07-04 10:41 by DandelionPowderman.

My favorite era for the Stones is with Mick Taylor as well. Not just because of MT (although that too) but I thought it sounded great when KR would sing along with MJ, which was almost all of the time. Their voices blended so well, kind of a hard rock version of Lennon and McCartney.

Many comments state that MT's skills as an axslinger aren't what they use to be. I think the loss of Keith’s harmonies was huge to the band, and has changed their sound as much as the lack of MT's guitar.

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DandelionPowderman

Sway has been far from perfect on this tour. Taylor plays his solo fine on Sway, but like the other guitarists he is fumbling a lot in his rhythm playing on this one. He is playing nice solos, in spite of the tempo (I'm not sure if it's the wrong tempo or wrong rhythm from Charlie, though) - and I can't see the reason for using that as an example for him not getting the spot he deserves. When he didn't have the flow, Jagger cut him "short" (still a long solo, though).

He also does a solid job on CYHMK. To claim that he is not given room to do his thing on this one, as others on this board have, is misunderstood at best, imo.

Today we see glimpses of old greatness, albeit with a cleaner sound than back in the day. To be honest, it's like that with the whole band as well. However, those glimpses makes it so worthwhile to be a Stones fan

I think people are expecting too much of Taylor, and that some are looking at the band to find the culprit, rather than the obvious: It's not 1972 anymore.

No, i am not looking for a culprit, Dandelion, i just believe the arrangement of 'Sway' is horrible, because the emphasis of the song has shifted from that of a heavy and lethargic feel, and a slower tempo, to being that of a pop song. I believe that that arrangement is ill suited in order to show off the song's strengths (and one of them being Taylor), although Taylor hasn't actually done a bad job in trying to accommodate this. The other songs as i have said previously, give Taylor ample opportunity to show off his guitar playing prowess.

Sway has been terrible whenever it's been played live the fault is not Taylor's it is the arrangement that is wrong.

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Edward Twining

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DandelionPowderman

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Eleanor Rigby
Yep that is true. The band only gives him the stage and a choice of song, but MT would have no say about the arrangement of that song.
Therefore he finds it hard to "shine" to his potential.

What "arrangement" would have helped exactly?

- He gets several minutes while band calms down on CYHMK
- He gets an extended slot on Sway
- He gets a "free-ride" on Midnight Rambler
- He was kept on a leash on Satisfaction, and now he plays acoustic guitar

I'd say you're looking for excuses here - but there isn't really anything to excuse, imo. He plays as well as he can, and I think he's doing fine.

I think 'Sway' is a flop though, Dandelion, because of the faster tempo it is played, and also i believe the Stones could be a little more accommodating towards Taylor, who has played as well as he can on the song given the circumstances. The other songs, 'Satisfaction' aside, have given Taylor ample room to show off his capabilities, which he has done very convincingly at times, but not quite so convincingly, at others. If you are looking for the intricate flowing story tellingly eloquent guitar playing Taylor from the seventies, where each note contributes to the greater whole, as in pieces of a jigsaw, so to speak, the consistency isn't quite there, whether that's to do with lack of practice, or advancing age, or a combination of the two, i'm not quite sure. When Taylor manages to string a few nice guitar lines together, however, he can still be mesmerising, which as i have said before, can still transcend a Stones performance. It's just sometimes a case of Taylor managing to maintain that consistency a little more and to build on it.

Taylor from the seventies in a live setting was a true marvel, not just because of his musical ability, but also through his dedication. Sometimes i think today, that's what he needs a little more of. There are times he does appear a little unsure of himself, or at least the very least, a little restless.

Well, I don't know how many excuses Taylor really needs either. He has been inconsistent, but they plucked him out of rehab, and judging from what I've seen, and Bill's comments, The Stones' guests don't get much in the way of preparation. (Lady GaGa was a marvel in that regard I thought; took control of the stage and acquitted herself well). Still, I am glad to see Taylor with the Stones and hope to see him, however unrealistically, on a couple of more songs.

Yes! I am rather sure - see my calculations at Hyde Park thread - that "Love In Vain" will be played tomorrow!

Jagger will introduce it by saying that they played this song first time live ever here at Hyde Park and mention that they hadn't even released it in record at the time. And that the guy who made his debut here as well will be guesting them. ("Unfortunately" the same will go for "Midnight Rambler" as well... )

But if they have a little Glastonbury spirit left - and why not? - they may play "Loving Cup" as well (for which the description suits even better). And of course, with Taylor!

- Doxa



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2013-07-05 08:53 by Doxa.