I was at that show. It was the first time I saw Taylor and it was pretty good.

there was no comparison however to the show the Stones put on at Wembley 24 hours later.

Be careful OpenG - you'll get hung by a few members for saying that !

Esky

Its okay the music does not lie and chuck leavell carrys the band with the
backup singers.

Bootleg dealers get busted if you post their details here okay !

It use to be easy to pick up boots but these days I don't get so many offers, sad.

Meanwhile Open G glad you liked the Taylor recording, it was probably mine.

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> JumpingKentFlash Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
> > Question: Is it OK to tell about trades? Is
> that
> > legal at all?
> >
> > www.JumpingKentFlash.tk - My website with
> tons of
> > good stuff.
> >
> > - Images of me, The Rolling Stones and my
> > home-made artwork.
>
>
> Trading isnt illegal. Selling bootlegs is.

Thanks Gazza. That's all I needed to know. I think it's still OK to call it the Buy/Sell/Trade forum. It's not illegal to sell a Stones T-shirt I think.



JumpingKentFlash

I wouldnt bet on it.

A friend of mine in California who made her own Stones merchandise and jewellery was harassed and threatened by the band's lawyers and had to withdraw it from sale on her own site. They even harassed her about giving away stuff as competition prizes which she'd BOUGHT legally!

these people are an embarrassment

Gazza Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------

> if you're taping, videoing or even photographing any show,
> you're liable to get your equipment confiscated by
> security if you're seen.

No one can legally take your equipment or tape unless you give it to them.
However, they DO have every right to eject you from the venue.

"No one can legally take your equipment or tape unless you give it to them"

Yep. But try to explain this very simple statement to the French or German security ...

C

Tornandfrayed Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> Gazza Wrote:
> --------------------------------------------------
> -----
>
> > if you're taping, videoing or even
> photographing any show,
> > you're liable to get your equipment
> confiscated by
> > security if you're seen.
>
> No one can legally take your equipment or tape
> unless you give it to them.
> However, they DO have every right to eject you
> from the venue.



well, they can stop you using it so whilst they cant take it permanently, they can and do confiscate it until after the show.

I'd my camera impounded at the Stones' first Wembley show. During the first song! They marched me out of the arena and I thought I was going to be thrown out. However, once we got out to the foyer they were actualy surprisingly pleasant and matter of fact about it. I had to give the camera to a woman behind the desk who gave me a ticket to re-claim it afterwards. It was almost like she was a cloakroom attendant!

if the stones dont care then why do they employ people to watch these boards

...maybe it's the record companies?

Or Mr Klein's people

I agree about with the bootleg policy....can we we also have a policy against Taylor vs Wood vs. Jones vs. Clapton vs.Jeff Beck vs my mother debates?

melillo Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> if the stones dont care then why do they employ
> people to watch these boards


to be honest, I think its more to do with their management

What I meant, Marc, was that the band WOULD care about people profiting from selling unlicensed and unauthorised material that they would define as substandard (insert your own lame "Live Licks" joke here). If there was no money changing hands, I doubt they'd give a shit.

Most bootlegs run in 1000 copies or a few more. Thn Stones are selling in millions. And those who buy a bad audience recording of Olympia 1995 do have all the official releases in may be 10 different colors and separate country releases anyway. That is not the problem.

The real problem is counterfeits - real copies of original releases. You find them mostly in Asia, but also in Europe. Then people are actually selling 1000's of true copies of original work, which is stealing from the band. But for a guy working in the local piracy cop in a small city it is hard to know the difference. A piracy copy of Forty Licks looks the same, and even a bootleg looks very original. Bootlegs are mostly for the hard core fans, and the production cost and work don't normally make fortunes for the guys who make them, while the guys copying through piracy productions of real releases makes lots and lots of money.

Bjornulf

It's only rock´n roll, but I like it!!!

but if the stones know all of this then why dont they for once
try to give the hard core fan what they want, bruce does it
dylan and zep do it, pearl jam does it, and so do many others

You don't want this website to close down, now do you?

The bootlegs are not the real issue. Everybody has at least a few. And there's hundreds of ways to get them. If bv allows the members of this board to advertise and sell them, we all need to find another place to meet eachother. And we don't want that!

So please respect bv!

saintmick Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> The bootlegs are not the real issue. Everybody has
> at least a few. And there's hundreds of ways to
> get them. If bv allows the members of this board
> to advertise and sell them, we all need to find
> another place to meet eachother. And we don't want
> that!

He has always allowed (and continues to allow) members of this board to sell bootlegs here, and it hasn't been closed down...

Bootlegs are overwhelming for fans who
already have everything many times over,
that is officially for sale. They help
keep a buzz going for the band, and
even contribute to their street
credibility. Attempts to quash this
are futile, and based on an outdated
business/ sales paradigm that will
ultimately be the downfall of the big
labels. I bet the stones don't really
give much of a shit about this but
Virgin and their business interests
in their own small minded way do, and
since legally (whatever that really means
to these corporate swindlers...) they are in
the right, it's best for the Stones to say little
or nada, one way or another, as they often
seem to be doing.................

"Most bootlegs run in 1000 copies or a few more. Thn Stones are selling in millions. And those who buy a bad audience recording of Olympia 1995 do have all the official releases in may be 10 different colors and separate country releases anyway. That is not the problem.

The real problem is counterfeits - real copies of original releases. You find them mostly in Asia, but also in Europe. Then people are actually selling 1000's of true copies of original work, which is stealing from the band. But for a guy working in the local piracy cop in a small city it is hard to know the difference. A piracy copy of Forty Licks looks the same, and even a bootleg looks very original. Bootlegs are mostly for the hard core fans, and the production cost and work don't normally make fortunes for the guys who make them, while the guys copying through piracy productions of real releases makes lots and lots of money.

Bjornulf"
Finally we reach the point. Bootlg as word is same for bootleg of official release or bootleg of crapy Wien 1970 for example!I am pretty sure that 50% of this people who discuss on this topic have at least 1 copy of official release which is bootleg!!!(for sure they don't know that).Yes it is problem.anybody can imagine how many "forty licks" produced in China and transfered to EU, with mark "printed in EU"???????Anybody can imagine how many copies of original releases sold in Russia?????Argentina???If you pay for CD 20 euro, you think that it is original???In some countries till the midnight factory produce legal stuff, after midnight they produce same stuff but without of control of record companies and the band, you guess CD which cost 1 euro in production they sell for 10 euro on the "black" market
I am pretty sure that every store which sell concert bootlegs don't afraid too much, but store which sell bootlegs copies of officials..hmmmm.
I hope that we will resolve discusses about selling/buying bootlegs.
It is market as a local green market, if nobody want to buy bootleg, seller will fade away and DON'T exist bootlegs as a word, only for history, but...
What about internet bootlegars???you can rent server for one month with 1000 Gb bandwich for $70 , it is nearly or exactly 2000 copies of one CD!!

Most of the fans who buy boots or trade have all the official releases worth having. By "worth having" I do not mean the live releases ... sorry Mick, Keith, Ron and Charlie but you guys really need to figure out if you want to make a live CD for the fans or for the masses. Until then live boots are going to be cherished by all your fans. Also, how do the studio outtakes, rehearsals and demos get out without a little help from the guys? KEITH'S HONEYMOON TAPES is a good example of this. I am sure Keith had something to do with getting this stuff out. Who knows?
And at this time I'd like to send a personal thank you to Bjornulf for keeping up such a great site. An American coming to a European fan club site??? But it's just so damn good! And it's been good the 8 years I've been checking in.

A friend of mine works Security in the parking lot at the Meadowlands Arena in New Jersey, and when Keith and the Winos were there, on his break time, he went to his car and got his camera. They took his camera away from him, and he never got it back...and he works there! He still does. It was somebody connected to the band.

Pirate counterfeits, as opposed to bootlegs,
are the big cash cow. May be syndicate crime
which even the big labels have a hand in, who
knows, when they cry wolf?

Pirate counterfeits are mostly the latest big hits
of the day. So if the Stones have a hit, like 40 Licks,
that would be counterfeited too. But really it could
be anyone, these arew not band dedicated fan operations.

Real crime, IMHO, is the rip off prices the labels charge
for the same old media sold to us classic rock fans over
and over again in different packages/ media. If the labels
are in fact taking a hit, they've had it coming a long time!

Bob Dylan said it best, here's the "jest" of what he sad.

"I don't tell people my business, there's always someone out there to ruin it for you."

Dylan said this during that well documented Interview not too long ago on TV.

How many times have you mentioned something in confidence to someone, only to find out that someone, who someone, who told someone, and then "poof" went your idea, plans, etc.?

Guys, I'll give you a story:

Location: South Finland, city of Turku
Who: A good friend of mine running a music shop, big Stones fan
When: October of 2004

Well, this friend of mine has a boot Stones collection of close to 1000 vinyls and much more of silver pressed CD's. He just loves the band so he tries to supply also other fans with boots through his music shop.
In october a bunch of guys walks into the shop, he gets busted for offering "non original" stuff. He goes to court. All "very special issues" as he calls them are taken away. In december the judge gives him a small fine to pay just 45.000 euros = 50.000 usd.

So, what's the catch here then?? Well, it was not a story but a fact.

Now I cannot get any original silver pressed boots in Finland anymore.

So, all you cats out there. please use the thing you have in between your ears next time you give away a shop that offers interesting stuff

i am 100% with BV on this one and that should every guy and gal on this forum be also.

Jan Richards

www.stonesvikings.com

all the more reason the stones should put out boots themselves
like all the other classic rock bands

Well the boots are more fun. When officially
released they've often been tinkered with, edited etc.,
and or never seem to dig deep and wide enuff to wipe
out the market for the true fan, the Beatles Anthology
albums being a case in point................

Rockman Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> No posting if intoxicated by drugs or alcohol.
>
> ROCKMAN

We'd lose 99.9% of the members!!!

Surely Bjornulf's original request makes perfect sense

a) it's a matter of discretion

b) he runs a fantastic site and a great forum

there may well be a big debate about bootlegs, their legitimacy (or lack thereof), why they exist etc...

....but Bjornulf's post is irrefutable logic, methinks

I still don't see the problem. If you want to know some places where you can bootlegs you can ask people via email!!!


Cheers,
Wuudy