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2000 LYFH

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Mathijs

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bleedingman
Speaking for myself, I'm not the least bit surprised. Just as they shouldn't be surprised to know that I haven't paid for one of their releases since I discovered torrents. What comes around goes around.

Exactly, what comes around...ticket prices have sky rocketed the last years mainly due to the artists and record companies loosing about all of their royalties income as nobody pays for music anymore but downloads it. In the 70's artist income would be something divided like 70% album sales, 20% touring and 10% radio play (mechanical rights), nowadays its 10% album sales, 60% touring and 30% mechanical rights.

It sure goes around.

Mathijs

So Mathijs, has many record companies shut down over the last 10-15 years due to a decrease from 70% to 10%? And in general, has the concert promoters been able to capture any of this increase (20% to 60%) that the artists are now receiving or does it all just go to the artists?

Of course, out of the 20 or so major record labels there's now only 3 or 4 left. And the artists are getting less of course -in the old days touring profits would go to the artists mainly as the labels already had earned their money. Now, part of the proceedings of live gigs are going to the label to compensate for the loss of income.

It doesn't hurt all the big names of course, but you can see it with the majority of smaller bands: only ten years ago many bands sold out the Paradiso in Amsterdam (about 1700 tickets), and most of the earnings went to the band playing. Now prices are raised to make up for the loss in margins over records, and a bigger part of the margin goes to the label instead of the band. Sothese days the band that used to sell out is playing for a fantastic club that is not sold out, and is getting a smaller part of the margins than before.

Mathijs

What turns my stomach is seeing £106 tickets being advertised for £1,599 on ebay.

Ticket prices are high and I can understand that to some extent, though I'd prefer they were lower. But it the criminal scalpers who extort real fans like this make me very angry indeed.

Somebody on facebook, whose stomach was also turned by ticket prices, created
this new avatar for themselves

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sjs12
But it the criminal scalpers who extort real fans like this make me very angry indeed.

criminal scalpers have to make a living too, you know. how else can they do that except by extorting real fans?

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StonesTod

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sjs12
But it the criminal scalpers who extort real fans like this make me very angry indeed.

criminal scalpers have to make a living too, you know. how else can they do that except by extorting real fans?

Ha ha! I suppose I shouldn't begrudge them their hard earned money.

How far will they go






Above the latest pics of the campaign against overfishing with member and ex-member of Jagger's family.

After those crazy prices...now it really turns my stomach.

HMN



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-10-21 03:08 by Honestman.

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Monkeytonkman
can't really argue with any of that

Why are you standing on that van?

It made sense at the time

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treaclefingers

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Gazza

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TippyToe
Mick wil borrow a few lines from John Lennon for his banter with the audience at the upcoming shows:

"Those of you in the cheap seats clap your hands; the rest of you just rattle your jewelry!"

There wont be much clapping, then!!

Isn't it 3 in the morning in Ireland...isn't it bedtime?!

Not unless 3AM is bedtime. Because if it's not then it's not bedtime, it's past it or before it.

Why you gotta take something SO simple and difficult it up like that? Damn.

The majority of fans attending these shows will NOT care about bum notes, nasal singing or warhorses played for the millionth time. By designing the ticket prices to be at this specific price point, the Stones have in essence secured the exact "type" of fan they want in there watching them perform at these shows.

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sjs12
What turns my stomach is seeing £106 tickets being advertised for £1,599 on ebay.

Ticket prices are high and I can understand that to some extent, though I'd prefer they were lower. But it the criminal scalpers who extort real fans like this make me very angry indeed.

I dunno. At least that £1,599 isn't £1,600. That would be rough.

Is it because the £106 isn't £105.99?

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Mathijs

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2000 LYFH

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Mathijs

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bleedingman
Speaking for myself, I'm not the least bit surprised. Just as they shouldn't be surprised to know that I haven't paid for one of their releases since I discovered torrents. What comes around goes around.

Exactly, what comes around...ticket prices have sky rocketed the last years mainly due to the artists and record companies loosing about all of their royalties income as nobody pays for music anymore but downloads it. In the 70's artist income would be something divided like 70% album sales, 20% touring and 10% radio play (mechanical rights), nowadays its 10% album sales, 60% touring and 30% mechanical rights.

It sure goes around.

Mathijs

So Mathijs, has many record companies shut down over the last 10-15 years due to a decrease from 70% to 10%? And in general, has the concert promoters been able to capture any of this increase (20% to 60%) that the artists are now receiving or does it all just go to the artists?

Of course, out of the 20 or so major record labels there's now only 3 or 4 left. And the artists are getting less of course -in the old days touring profits would go to the artists mainly as the labels already had earned their money. Now, part of the proceedings of live gigs are going to the label to compensate for the loss of income.

It doesn't hurt all the big names of course, but you can see it with the majority of smaller bands: only ten years ago many bands sold out the Paradiso in Amsterdam (about 1700 tickets), and most of the earnings went to the band playing. Now prices are raised to make up for the loss in margins over records, and a bigger part of the margin goes to the label instead of the band. Sothese days the band that used to sell out is playing for a fantastic club that is not sold out, and is getting a smaller part of the margins than before.

Mathijs

Yes, record companies solve the profit dilemma through corporate mergers. Rather than record companies going under, it is recording studios that have gone out of business. Olympic Studios is no more, and very recently EMI was putting Abbey Road Studios up for sale because it was no longer profitable.

That would be a great song title!

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Honestman
How far will they go






Above the latest pics of the campaign against overfishing with member and ex-member of Jagger's family.

After those crazy prices...now it really turns my stomach.

Same result as if she forgot to clean up her pussy. It smells the sea!

Just finished to watch the news on France 2.
They talked about the shows that have been sold out in less than 7 minutes,
show a french fan who never miss them since 1976 except this time for which he told the reporter that it's far too much for him and a sad ending for such a band like this one.
And in the end , one french rock journalist says that its doesn't matter how much people pay for that kind of show, the thing is to be there because the same people have to be there.
In the end, the France 2 journalist says
that it will bring back to the STONES 100 000 000 €...
Hail Hail Rock'n'Roll

HMN



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-10-21 14:28 by Honestman.

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Honestman
Just finished to watch the news on France 2.
They talked about the shows that have been sold out in less than 7 minutes,
show a french fan who never miss them since 1976 except this time for which he told the reporter that it's far too much for him and a sad ending for such a band like this one.
And in the end , one french rock journalist says that its doesn't matter how much people pay for that kind of show, the thing is to be there because the same people have to be there.
In the end, the France 2 journalist says
that it will bring back to the STONES 100 000 000 €...
Hail Hail Rock'n'Roll

This is disingenuous and giving the band and promoters credit unnecessarily.

The shows 'sold out' fast because THOUSANDS of wannabe ticket touts decided to buy tickets for an event they have no intention of going to.

A band and promoter who had any scruples would take some anti-scalping measures to prevent tickets being resold above face value. In this case, neither party has any whatsoever.

The Stones demanded and were offered a crazy price for four shows. £16 million, apparently. They clearly dont care WHO gets the tickets as long as they get paid. The onus then falls on the promoter to get a return on his investment. Taking anti scalping measures makes it harder to sell the shows out. So, they do nothing and allow it to become a free-for-all between people who want to go to the show and opportunists who want to do nothing else but make a few hundred quid.

There's clearly enough people in both categories to sell the event out. Which is fine for the promoter as now THEIR work is done, they've made the profit they aimed for and its NOW up to the secondary market, scalpers and e-bay chancers to price their 'goods' accordingly to fill the venue. And even if they fail to do so, it doesnt matter - the band and the promoters have made the money they wanted.

Had they taken anti scalping measures, they would have found it probably quite hard to sell the REALLY over priced tickets (ie, the £400 nosebleeds). Anyone who panic buys way over the face value at this point is a mug because there are literally thousands of seats available. There are only so many casual fans who will pay hundreds of pounds for bad seats. They'll be plentiful around the time of the gig for around face value. Maybe less.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-10-21 16:56 by Gazza.

I agree Gazza. Think I'll hold my nerve and hang outside the venue and hopefully pick one up off a tout for a reasonable price just as the band are about to go on. It's worked before, so fingers crossed!

-



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2012-10-22 02:52 by Max'sKansasCity.

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Gazza

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Honestman
Just finished to watch the news on France 2.
They talked about the shows that have been sold out in less than 7 minutes,
show a french fan who never miss them since 1976 except this time for which he told the reporter that it's far too much for him and a sad ending for such a band like this one.
And in the end , one french rock journalist says that its doesn't matter how much people pay for that kind of show, the thing is to be there because the same people have to be there.
In the end, the France 2 journalist says
that it will bring back to the STONES 100 000 000 €...
Hail Hail Rock'n'Roll

This is disingenuous and giving the band and promoters credit unnecessarily.

The shows 'sold out' fast because THOUSANDS of wannabe ticket touts decided to buy tickets for an event they have no intention of going to.

A band and promoter who had any scruples would take some anti-scalping measures to prevent tickets being resold above face value. In this case, neither party has any whatsoever.

The Stones demanded and were offered a crazy price for four shows. £16 million, apparently. They clearly dont care WHO gets the tickets as long as they get paid. The onus then falls on the promoter to get a return on his investment. Taking anti scalping measures makes it harder to sell the shows out. So, they do nothing and allow it to become a free-for-all between people who want to go to the show and opportunists who want to do nothing else but make a few hundred quid.

There's clearly enough people in both categories to sell the event out. Which is fine for the promoter as now THEIR work is done, they've made the profit they aimed for and its NOW up to the secondary market, scalpers and e-bay chancers to price their 'goods' accordingly to fill the venue. And even if they fail to do so, it doesnt matter - the band and the promoters have made the money they wanted.

Had they taken anti scalping measures, they would have found it probably quite hard to sell the REALLY over priced tickets (ie, the £400 nosebleeds). Anyone who panic buys way over the face value at this point is a mug because there are literally thousands of seats available. There are only so many casual fans who will pay hundreds of pounds for bad seats. They'll be plentiful around the time of the gig for around face value. Maybe less.

i'm confused. are they gonna play brown sugar or not?

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Mathijs
What a load of crap. We all have to face the fact that Stones are not a normal band, but an instutution, a museum of 50 years R&R history. Combined with the fact that it will all be over soon: high ticket prices.

Compare it to a very fine 3 Michelin star restaurant. It'll cost you 500 bucks to eat a full menu. Is it worth it? That's up to you -if you think not go dine somewhere else. But you can't go screaming about that the chef used to work at your local pizza parlour when you where young 40 years ago, and that he made $6 pizza's then. The guy's evolved to be a super chef, and the 3 stars he's earned makes it possible for him to charge as much money as he wants. And guess what? Try to book a reservation at Noma in Denmark, or The Fat Duck in London. You won't get one, it's fully booked for the coming 9 months.

The Rolling Stones are the Fat Duck of the entertainment industry.

Mathijs

A load of crap indeed.


I would rather compare them to McDonalds these days. You have to pay 15 € for a crappy menu (read song), digested within 3 minutes, and you will have to join the queue for half an hour to get it anyway.. And what's worse: the Stones forgot how to prepare the main course. Now that turns my stomach.


Bon appetit.

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VT22

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Mathijs
What a load of crap. We all have to face the fact that Stones are not a normal band, but an instutution, a museum of 50 years R&R history. Combined with the fact that it will all be over soon: high ticket prices.

Compare it to a very fine 3 Michelin star restaurant. It'll cost you 500 bucks to eat a full menu. Is it worth it? That's up to you -if you think not go dine somewhere else. But you can't go screaming about that the chef used to work at your local pizza parlour when you where young 40 years ago, and that he made $6 pizza's then. The guy's evolved to be a super chef, and the 3 stars he's earned makes it possible for him to charge as much money as he wants. And guess what? Try to book a reservation at Noma in Denmark, or The Fat Duck in London. You won't get one, it's fully booked for the coming 9 months.

The Rolling Stones are the Fat Duck of the entertainment industry.

Mathijs

A load of crap indeed.


I would rather compare them to McDonalds these days. You have to pay 15 € for a crappy menu (read song), digested within 3 minutes, and you will have to join the queue for half an hour to get it anyway.. And what's worse: the Stones forgot how to prepare the main course. Now that turns my stomach.

Bon appetit.

Man, your're sharp. Really sharp.

And fast. Man you're fast.

Mathijs

The prices are beyond any sanity.
And I don't think its really sold out. Just ticket shortening and hype. The old game.
In a weak moment I searched some net offers for tics/hotel/flight to London. Even those organisations were apologizing for the prices. And I won't do it- because of the money and more so cause of principle.It's just too much!
Getting abstruse . .

I would love it when they would fail with it. but unfiortunately i don't think so. They chose those 2 mega markets London and N. York, - where there is enough money power. Who needs fans . .?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-10-22 02:35 by CousinC.

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His Majesty
It's more stomach churning that it's not really The Rolling Stones.

When exactly did they stop being the (real) Rolling Stones?

Lets see, we have the not real fans going to see the not real Rolling Stones, that makes sense!



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-10-24 05:21 by 2000 LYFH.

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2000 LYFH

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His Majesty
It's more stomach churning that it's not really The Rolling Stones.

When exactly did they stop being the (real) Rolling Stones?

When they stopped Rolling and sat idle.

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stonesnow

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Mathijs

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2000 LYFH

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Mathijs

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bleedingman
Speaking for myself, I'm not the least bit surprised. Just as they shouldn't be surprised to know that I haven't paid for one of their releases since I discovered torrents. What comes around goes around.

Exactly, what comes around...ticket prices have sky rocketed the last years mainly due to the artists and record companies loosing about all of their royalties income as nobody pays for music anymore but downloads it. In the 70's artist income would be something divided like 70% album sales, 20% touring and 10% radio play (mechanical rights), nowadays its 10% album sales, 60% touring and 30% mechanical rights.

It sure goes around.

Mathijs

So Mathijs, has many record companies shut down over the last 10-15 years due to a decrease from 70% to 10%? And in general, has the concert promoters been able to capture any of this increase (20% to 60%) that the artists are now receiving or does it all just go to the artists?

Of course, out of the 20 or so major record labels there's now only 3 or 4 left. And the artists are getting less of course -in the old days touring profits would go to the artists mainly as the labels already had earned their money. Now, part of the proceedings of live gigs are going to the label to compensate for the loss of income.

It doesn't hurt all the big names of course, but you can see it with the majority of smaller bands: only ten years ago many bands sold out the Paradiso in Amsterdam (about 1700 tickets), and most of the earnings went to the band playing. Now prices are raised to make up for the loss in margins over records, and a bigger part of the margin goes to the label instead of the band. Sothese days the band that used to sell out is playing for a fantastic club that is not sold out, and is getting a smaller part of the margins than before.

Mathijs

Yes, record companies solve the profit dilemma through corporate mergers. Rather than record companies going under, it is recording studios that have gone out of business. Olympic Studios is no more, and very recently EMI was putting Abbey Road Studios up for sale because it was no longer profitable.

Wow 3 or 4 major labels left down from 20. Also, many of the studio musicians are probably long gone as well.

When did Olympic shutdown and what became of the building(s)? Did they sell out to another studio? And any word on the status of Abbey Road? Wonder if McCartney ever considered buying it...

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Justin
The majority of fans attending these shows will NOT care about bum notes, nasal singing or warhorses played for the millionth time. By designing the ticket prices to be at this specific price point, the Stones have in essence secured the exact "type" of fan they want in there watching them perform at these shows.

I keep forgetting that you know everything....fool.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2012-10-24 16:51 by More Hot Rocks.

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2000 LYFH

Wow 3 or 4 major labels left down from 20. Also, many of the studio musicians are probably long gone as well.

When did Olympic shutdown and what became of the building(s)? Did they sell out to another studio? And any word on the status of Abbey Road? Wonder if McCartney ever considered buying it...

The Olympic building has been bought by someone who has plans to convert it into an independent cinema (pity it wasn't ready in time for Crossfire Hurricane).