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floodonthepage
Maybe this edition will have the longer "Tell Me"? Isn't there a 4:05 floating around, whereas most editions have the 3:48 or something?
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ironbellyHardly.Quote
floodonthepage
Maybe this edition will have the longer "Tell Me"? Isn't there a 4:05 floating around, whereas most editions have the 3:48 or something?
Here are the CDs where you can find cold-ended Tell Me (4.07 or 4.09, depending on pre-gap, 2 extra seconds of silence before the track):
- The Rolling Stones [London 820 047-2]. Made in West Germany. CD pressed from glass master 01 #. The easiest way to spot one - the front cover has red diagonal banner in the upper left corner. Beware, all other West German, French, Spanish, Brazilian and Australian CDs has Tell Me with fade, although share the same catalog number.
- The Rolling Stones CDs pressed in Japan (there were three editions). Catalog numbers: P33L-25014 (May 1, 1987), P25L-25031 (April 25, 1989) and POCD-1911 (February 25, 1995). These utilized the same tape transfer as the West German CD but are mastered slightly differently.
All other editions came with Tell Me with fade. The longest version (4:05.65) is on original SACD-hybrid England's Newest Hitmakers. Catalog numbers: 882 287-2 (EU), 9375-2 (US) and UIGY-7001 (Japan). Also on all re-issues of this title with corresponding modifications of the catalog number.
The new release will be based on 2016 tape transfer. Same as for the In Mono box. Thus, Tell Me will be with fade and clocks 0:03:49.40
It is because I am a big fan of those old West German London CDs .Quote
floodonthepage
Wow! You just pulled all that out of nowhere? I know who to go to! I have a French made UK edition of the debut with the 4:05 fade. I don't think I've ever heard the cold ending version. I also have a Japanese edition of RS No.2, neither of which probably need to be kept now that I have the Mono Box...as well as the US SACD-Hybrid editions.
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ironbellyIt is because I am a big fan of those old West German London CDs .Quote
floodonthepage
Wow! You just pulled all that out of nowhere? I know who to go to! I have a French made UK edition of the debut with the 4:05 fade. I don't think I've ever heard the cold ending version. I also have a Japanese edition of RS No.2, neither of which probably need to be kept now that I have the Mono Box...as well as the US SACD-Hybrid editions.
If you need cold ended Tell Me just search ebay. That particular CD is not rare but in great demand. However, with some patience you can find it within 10-12 € price range.
Anyway, your french disc for s/t album is pressed using stamplers from German glass master 03 #. It is a kind of 're-make' of the original tape transfer. It is not bad at all, just not perfect (or like other people say - not ultimate).
Japanese No.2 is, most probably, made on site in Japan using master tape of the vinyl they had in hands. Generally, all tracks presented there are inferior to their counterparts that can be found on other West German CDs. But it has a charm, a few wide stereo tracks (and for sure - certain collector's value). Although, the one from In Mono box is much better in terms of sound quality.
Rockman
West German CD from 01 # glass master is an ultimate edition forever. It is mastered flat, without any tricks. According to urban legend digital tape transfer was made at MFSL. If you have it in it's original heavy jewel case you can add also tactile feelings .
I gave up with discogs (almost). In past few months I contacted 8 sellers for the details about their listings. Like - would you kindly send me the photos of the actual item that is up for sale. In 5 cases they sent me images of the items that were different from the release page and in 3 cases there were no reply. Although some believe that discogs is better than ebay and the sellers are more responsible my experience is quite different.Quote
floodonthepage
UPDATE: I have found some fairly affordable copies of the West Germany "Red Banner" debut on Discogs. One of the sellers tried to sell me one of those other non-820 047-2 editions from West Germany citing that the catalog number is the same, and thanks to your information Ironbelly, I was able to quickly flag it and say "no thanks". The search continues....but thanks again!
P33L-25014 is from May 1, 1987. That is certain. The back cover carries date code O-5-1. Letter 'O' here is a code for 1987, 5 = May, 1 = 1. This is well known coding. I am surprised that somebody mess with thatQuote
floodonthepage
I'm now being told they have one of the Japanese P33 editions, but they say it's from 1986....not the May 1 1987 you listed.
Well... It is what it is. Yes, there is no crash or something. It seems that they simply press stop button during recording. But this is how the track appeared on the '2nd' pressing of the UK LP and it is called 'cold ended' for many years.Quote
floodonthepage
My P25L-25031 Japanese edition of the debut album finally came, featuring the "no fade" 'Tell Me'. (4:06)
I gotta be honest, it's a let down. Sure it's a "cold" ending, but it kinda sounds like it's cut off, instead of a truly intentional cold ending (i.e. with a cymbal crash or something of the like).
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ironbelly
That is interesting story.I gave up with discogs (almost). In past few months I contacted 8 sellers for the details about their listings. Like - would you kindly send me the photos of the actual item that is up for sale. In 5 cases they sent me images of the items that were different from the release page and in 3 cases there were no reply. Although some believe that discogs is better than ebay and the sellers are more responsible my experience is quite different.Quote
floodonthepage
UPDATE: I have found some fairly affordable copies of the West Germany "Red Banner" debut on Discogs. One of the sellers tried to sell me one of those other non-820 047-2 editions from West Germany citing that the catalog number is the same, and thanks to your information Ironbelly, I was able to quickly flag it and say "no thanks". The search continues....but thanks again!P33L-25014 is from May 1, 1987. That is certain. The back cover carries date code O-5-1. Letter 'O' here is a code for 1987, 5 = May, 1 = 1. This is well known coding. I am surprised that somebody mess with thatQuote
floodonthepage
I'm now being told they have one of the Japanese P33 editions, but they say it's from 1986....not the May 1 1987 you listed.
1984 - N
1985 - I
1986 - H
1987 - O
1988 - R
1989 - E
1990 - C
1991 - DWell... It is what it is. Yes, there is no crash or something. It seems that they simply press stop button during recording. But this is how the track appeared on the '2nd' pressing of the UK LP and it is called 'cold ended' for many years.Quote
floodonthepage
My P25L-25031 Japanese edition of the debut album finally came, featuring the "no fade" 'Tell Me'. (4:06)
I gotta be honest, it's a let down. Sure it's a "cold" ending, but it kinda sounds like it's cut off, instead of a truly intentional cold ending (i.e. with a cymbal crash or something of the like).
BTW. True 1st West German pressing with original jewel case is currently on sale on ebay.
[www.ebay.de]
I know the seller, used to deal with him in the past, he is very responsible person. Currently, the price is reasonable (considering overall very good shape of this CD). But the auction is not ended yet.
Yes, early German and Japanese CDs were sourced from the same A/D transfer. But Japanese CDs were made (most probably) from dupe tapes and slightly adjusted on site - peak level, EQ, etc. That is called production mastering and in Japan they used to play with that a lot. But otherwise they contain the same mixes and Tell Me is the same cold ended. This is in terms of audio.Quote
floodonthepage
Oh wow! Thanks for the head's up, Ironbelly. And the main difference with this first pressing West German release is that it is mastered slightly differently from the Japanese edition, I believe you said? but is it otherwise same style of cold ending (and of course the red banner in the upper left corner a difference too).
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ironbellyYes, early German and Japanese CDs were sourced from the same A/D transfer. But Japanese CDs were made (most probably) from dupe tapes and slightly adjusted on site - peak level, EQ, etc. That is called production mastering and in Japan they used to play with that a lot. But otherwise they contain the same mixes and Tell Me is the same cold ended. This is in terms of audio.Quote
floodonthepage
Oh wow! Thanks for the head's up, Ironbelly. And the main difference with this first pressing West German release is that it is mastered slightly differently from the Japanese edition, I believe you said? but is it otherwise same style of cold ending (and of course the red banner in the upper left corner a difference too).
In terms of booklet and other 'paperwork'. Early West German disc were packed with very basic booklets, 4 pages only. Japanese booklets are thick and contain essay in Japanese and lyrics in English and Japanese. Also there were different OBIs for different series and special promo sticker (reproduction of album cover) for the 1st edition of POCD-1911. But all these extras are for hardcore collectors only .
Regarding the 1st West German pressing, July 1984. It has unique black and red London ffrr label. Also, it was pressed in limited quantities and is very thought of. This is a collector's candy, you know .
I made a compilation about different pressings while ago
[iorr.org]
But it is a bit outdated. In past years I tracked 3 or 4 extra pressing from Germany, a couple from France and there are more pressings from Japan (with different OBIs). It should be updated, but I am lazy. And who cares about CDs in the times of streaming and downloads .
There were no 2002 SACD-hybrid edition of The Rolling Stones (UK) and The Rolling Stones No. 2. Only The Rolling Stones: England's Newest Hitmakers (US).Quote
timbernardis
OK, Ironbelly and others on this thread: I am not an audiophile though I have learned some things by reading threads such as these and seeing Ironbelly's posts on other threads.
Couple of questions:
how do these Japanese and West German CDs compare to the hybrid SACD editions that were released in August 2002?
And were those all Abkco/US only editions? Were there Decca SACD editions of the Stones catalog through 1971? I've never seen an original Rolling Stones (# 1) in this hybrid SACD series, only The Rolling Stones: England's Newest Hitmakers, the US edition. I've also never seen one of The Rolling Stones # 2 on Decca.
I know my knowledge is incomplete and maybe inaccurate, so don't kill me for that, just explain and correct, please.
plexi
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ironbelly
Although, there was mono Rolling Stones No.2 as digital download a few years before In Mono box.
Completely useless for me. None of the services available in my woods. I'll stick to old good CDs for awhileQuote
IrixQuote
ironbelly
Although, there was mono Rolling Stones No.2 as digital download a few years before In Mono box.
And still is:
The Rolling Stones: [www.HighResAudio.com] , [www.Qobuz.com] , [Store.AcousticSounds.com] ,
The Rolling Stones No. 2: [www.HighResAudio.com] , [www.Qobuz.com] , [Store.AcousticSounds.com] .
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ironbellyYes, early German and Japanese CDs were sourced from the same A/D transfer. But Japanese CDs were made (most probably) from dupe tapes and slightly adjusted on site - peak level, EQ, etc. That is called production mastering and in Japan they used to play with that a lot. But otherwise they contain the same mixes and Tell Me is the same cold ended. This is in terms of audio.Quote
floodonthepage
Oh wow! Thanks for the head's up, Ironbelly. And the main difference with this first pressing West German release is that it is mastered slightly differently from the Japanese edition, I believe you said? but is it otherwise same style of cold ending (and of course the red banner in the upper left corner a difference too).
In terms of booklet and other 'paperwork'. Early West German disc were packed with very basic booklets, 4 pages only. Japanese booklets are thick and contain essay in Japanese and lyrics in English and Japanese. Also there were different OBIs for different series and special promo sticker (reproduction of album cover) for the 1st edition of POCD-1911. But all these extras are for hardcore collectors only .
Regarding the 1st West German pressing, July 1984. It has unique black and red London ffrr label. Also, it was pressed in limited quantities and is very thought of. This is a collector's candy, you know .
I made a compilation about different pressings while ago
[iorr.org]
But it is a bit outdated. In past years I tracked 3 or 4 extra pressing from Germany, a couple from France and there are more pressings from Japan (with different OBIs). It should be updated, but I am lazy. And who cares about CDs in the times of streaming and downloads .
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Rockman
Yep yep ironbelly .... dats the one I got ....
I sleep with it under the pillow along with my 44 ......
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Rockman
....not quite but i know a woman from there ....
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Rockman
.... Seeeezzz hopes it not the same woman