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OpenG
Jagger has this strange way of deflecting anyone who tries to ask him anything . Burton Cummings of Guess Who comes up to Jagger and says wow I rediscovered Black And Blue and Jagger just shrugged him off.

Imho it's because Mick positively hates to turn back to his past. Talking to him about B&B is like asking you or me "hey you remember that chick you were with in 1976". The obvious reply would be "c'mon dude! It's 2003! Why are you digging up these old bones?".

"Good time, bad time" is a great song well played by LZ. First LZ lp is very good but Mick likes to compete;I understand Mick's angle. Don't forget that Mick went to see LZ's last show in London.Keith's timeless hatred of LZ's music is more strange I think.

Rockandroll,

Mops

this article brings up some interesting subjects to consider when assessing Led Zep.

[www.thedailybeast.com]

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rollmops
"Good time, bad time" is a great song well played by LZ. First LZ lp is very good but Mick likes to compete;I understand Mick's angle. Don't forget that Mick went to see LZ's last show in London.Keith's timeless hatred of LZ's music is more strange I think.

Rockandroll,

Mops

I think Keith really liked Jimmy Page and John Paul Jones, though. He collaborated with both of them.

It's not odd that he didn't like Bonham's drumming, and he never was a fan of high pitched screaming vocalists (he loved Marriott, though).

Perhaps the subject line should be edited in this thread, as Mick never said «It was awful»?

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DandelionPowderman
Mick never said «It was awful»?

Yes but he thinks MZ sucks! (cue "bad faith").

Seriously LZ is the antithesis of the Stones. They're "over" everything while the Stones practiced restraint.
Take a song like "Sway" and his outro solo which is faded out early. And imho this is a beautiful idea.

Had LZ recorded "Sway" Page would have punished us with 60 or 90 seconds of outro solo (blah blah blah all over the neck), which would have ruined this delicate song.

Mick blames Zeppelin for the fact that the Stones had to start playing "longer" shows in 1969. Once Zep hit the circuit, a rock band had a tough time playing less than 70-90 minutes without taking crap for it.

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mnewman505
Once Zep hit the circuit, a rock band had a tough time playing less than 70-90 minutes without taking crap for it.

Yeah and that was LZ's pitfall. As tours followed, they couldn't renew their live sound they just played longer and longer (yawn!).
From 120 minutes in 71 to 180, 200, 220 (!) in 75 or 77 including a sleep-inducing drum solo.
It gave them their "God-like" status among LZ aficionados (and Quaalude fans) but frankly what a borefest. A typical 1975 show would incude a 30-minute "No Quarter" a 45-minute "Dazed And Confused" plus a 40-minute drum solo.

Please...

Jealous of Plant's "todger".

Im with Keef on Zep.

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mnewman505
Mick blames Zeppelin for the fact that the Stones had to start playing "longer" shows in 1969. Once Zep hit the circuit, a rock band had a tough time playing less than 70-90 minutes without taking crap for it.

I would have guessed that Cream, who were already pretty much done before Zeppelin even got started, had been the ones to revolutionize the concert-going experience in that way. In any case, kudos to whoever and whatever caused the Stones to feel the need to up their game.

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tatters
In any case, kudos to whoever and whatever caused the Stones to feel the need to up their game.

I think they didn't. In 69/70 they played roughly 70 minutes. In 72/73 they played a tiny bit longer but that's it.
They did feel the need to play longer when they lost Taylor and welcomed RW on board. They basically doubled the duration of their shows between 72 and 75.

Imho I think Mick was referring to the notion that any rock show that lasts more than 90 minutes is verging on torture.

Perhaps Mick and Keith are a bit pissed off that in the wealth stakes Page and Plant are not as far behind them as you might think.
And that's after only 12 years of tours and recording.
And not becoming tax exiles.

I respect Zep's talents but there's no swing.

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KingmanBarstow
Always liked Led Zeppelin. Magnificent albums. I missed seeing them live unfortunately but I did get to see a Page/Plant gig and it was excellent. These guys (at least Page and JP Jones as session people) and The Stones bumped into one another. JP Jones with She’s A Rainbow and Page on One Hit To The Body. Also Page played slide on a version of Heart of Stone. Led Zeppelin used Stargroves and The Rolling Stones Mobile recording studio for Houses Of The Holy. And there is a Peter Grant management connection with Ronnie.

They talk a lot of smack, which does reek as jealousy, yet, as you pointed out... it's all bullshit. First listening of LED ZEPPELIN 1 was a bit of work for me but after a few more playings I loved it, along with everything else, although some were much more immediate, like 2, LZ, HOTH and PG.

Plant's voice though, phewee, that grates real quick. As does his use of "Baby!".

I listen to LZ for the great guitar riffs and sounds and JPJ's.

...

LZ appearing on R&R Circus would have been interesting.

[www.youtube.com]

Although Dazed and Confused is a bit pompous, it's powerful, exciting and something that would be hard to follow.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2019-01-16 17:20 by His Majesty.

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jlowe
Perhaps Mick and Keith are a bit pissed off that in the wealth stakes Page and Plant are not as far behind them as you might think.
And that's after only 12 years of tours and recording.
And not becoming tax exiles.

Oh I would not be envious one bit. Are you kidding? The RS have toured the world repeatedly, interacting energy with populations for multiple decades. That type of soul enrichment is accomplished by few. The Glimmers have put themselves out there to us year after year after year, and have evolved as a band from it.

I own LZ music and know some of it quite well. Respect for past recordings, of course, absolutely.

But the RS as a band are in a class of their own.

Led Zep are one of the best bands ever, absolutely love them. I can listen to an entire album all the way through, any one (with the exception of Presence).

But after one listen I'm done for awhile...not so with the stones and other bands.

That's the difference for me.

It's too bad the Stones didn't do a reissue campaign like Page did with Zep with the extra discs, they could've loaded them up with leftovers.

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GasLightStreet
It's too bad the Stones didn't do a reissue campaign like Page did with Zep with the extra discs, they could've loaded them up with leftovers.

A few obvious reasons why they haven't :
1.The Stones are still an active band..just.
2. Neither Mick or Keith would have the same focus and dedication as Page to trawl through the archives...to the same extent.
3. The Stones best work belongs to ABKCO..enough said.
4. Both Mick and Keith do work outside of The Stones...not sure what Page does professionally away from curating the Zeppelin catalogue (which in my opinion he has done a good job).
5. I suspect Roger Plant let's Page get on with it; can't see that happening with Mick and/or Keith.

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jlowe

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GasLightStreet
It's too bad the Stones didn't do a reissue campaign like Page did with Zep with the extra discs, they could've loaded them up with leftovers.

A few obvious reasons why they haven't :
1.The Stones are still an active band..just.
2. Neither Mick or Keith would have the same focus and dedication as Page to trawl through the archives...to the same extent.
3. The Stones best work belongs to ABKCO..enough said.
4. Both Mick and Keith do work outside of The Stones...not sure what Page does professionally away from curating the Zeppelin catalogue (which in my opinion he has done a good job).
5. I suspect Roger Plant let's Page get on with it; can't see that happening with Mick and/or Keith.

1. So what. It hasn't prevented them from releasing 18 million live albums, old and new.

2. Other people, namely Chris Kimsey and Don Was, have trawled through the archives so... doesn't matter what Mick and Keith focus on.

3. The Stones' best work doesn't just belong to ABKCO. That's just bunk.

4. No relevance. As their solo careers have shown.

5. See the end of 2.

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jlowe

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GasLightStreet
It's too bad the Stones didn't do a reissue campaign like Page did with Zep with the extra discs, they could've loaded them up with leftovers.

A few obvious reasons why they haven't :
1.The Stones are still an active band..just.
2. Neither Mick or Keith would have the same focus and dedication as Page to trawl through the archives...to the same extent.
3. The Stones best work belongs to ABKCO..enough said.
4. Both Mick and Keith do work outside of The Stones...not sure what Page does professionally away from curating the Zeppelin catalogue (which in my opinion he has done a good job).
5. I suspect Roger Plant let's Page get on with it; can't see that happening with Mick and/or Keith.

Look, that dude is not the singer for Led Zep.

I think Roger Plant either sings for Pink Floyd or the Who.

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jlowe

2. Neither Mick or Keith would have the same focus and dedication as Page to trawl through the archives...to the same extent.

Funny you say that as imo Page's valorisation of LZ archive legacy amounts to nil. The expanded version of the studio albums was laughable (wow, alt. mixes?) and for "How The West Was Won" Page couldn't help do what he always did : making a hodge-podge live album of trax merged from different nights and at times from different tours.
Can you imagine the Stones releasing a 1972 live album with a few licks borrowed from a show recorded during the 1973 tour.
Well Page thinks this is a good idea...

See here :
[en.wikipedia.org])

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dcba

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jlowe

2. Neither Mick or Keith would have the same focus and dedication as Page to trawl through the archives...to the same extent.

Funny you say that as imo Page's valorisation of LZ archive legacy amounts to nil. The expanded version of the studio albums was laughable (wow, alt. mixes?) and for "How The West Was Won" Page couldn't help do what he always did : making a hodge-podge live album of trax merged from different nights and at times from different tours.
Can you imagine the Stones releasing a 1972 live album with a few licks borrowed from a show recorded during the 1973 tour.
Well Page thinks this is a good idea...

See here :
[en.wikipedia.org])

How The West Was Won was compiled from two nights, plus an instrumental part from another night later on in that tour, from what I gather. Most live albums I know are compiled from a lot more shows, Stones included (Still Life, Flashpoint?). Besides, the Stones probably would have simply overdubbed that extra part, when, for obvious reasons, Zeppelin didnt. All in all, the cd represents the best of two consecutive nights. There's nothing uncommon about that practise, even filmed shows these days are usually compiled from two nights at one venue.
I agree that the expanded editions are totally unnecessary, as is the remastered How The West Was Won (which is shorter than the original one from 2003). And of course the re-remastered Song Remains The Same joke of a reissue.
Page should turn his attention to live shows from '75 and '77, preferably.

Well (and that was a surprise to me) the Wiki page for HTWWW shows Page hasn't changed since TSRTSame (1976).

He still likes to edit tracks to death, to the point where within a single song one verse might come from one night, the chorus might be from another night and we're back to show #1 for the 2nd verse, etc etc.

Cool video...

The Making of Jimmy Page's Mirrored and Dragon® Telecaster Models

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SomeGuy

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dcba

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jlowe

2. Neither Mick or Keith would have the same focus and dedication as Page to trawl through the archives...to the same extent.

Funny you say that as imo Page's valorisation of LZ archive legacy amounts to nil. The expanded version of the studio albums was laughable (wow, alt. mixes?) and for "How The West Was Won" Page couldn't help do what he always did : making a hodge-podge live album of trax merged from different nights and at times from different tours.
Can you imagine the Stones releasing a 1972 live album with a few licks borrowed from a show recorded during the 1973 tour.
Well Page thinks this is a good idea...

See here :
[en.wikipedia.org])

How The West Was Won was compiled from two nights, plus an instrumental part from another night later on in that tour, from what I gather. Most live albums I know are compiled from a lot more shows, Stones included (Still Life, Flashpoint?). Besides, the Stones probably would have simply overdubbed that extra part, when, for obvious reasons, Zeppelin didnt.

STILL LIFE
Hampton, Chicago, Largo, Temmpe, Rutherford - although the end of Hampton's LSTNT is not from that show that the song is from!

FLASHPOINT
Clemson, Atlantic City, Jacksonville, Tokyo, London, Barcelona, Turin.

Both albums had overdubs.

Much of Jimmy's most grievous editing is snipping out other songs from the WLL Live medley to save on royalty payments. But overall the Stones have done a much better job releasing their back catalog than the very frustrated Zeppelin fans

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keefriff99
Cool video...

The Making of Jimmy Page's Mirrored and Dragon® Telecaster Models

Thanks, and interesting quote at the end:

"The guitar is more important than I am at this point"

Yeah Jimmy, you better get back to remastering the old Zep catalogue again before everyone completely forgets about you!

Wondering if there's any progress on material for his new solo...uhhh...never mind...fuhgeddaboudit.
Between that and the supposed new Stones album (14 years and Counting), might as well hibernate for a few more years before anything sees the light of day!

_____________________________________________________________
Rip this joint, gonna save your soul, round and round and round we go......

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Hairball

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keefriff99
Cool video...

The Making of Jimmy Page's Mirrored and Dragon® Telecaster Models

Thanks, and interesting quote at the end:

"The guitar is more important than I am at this point"

Yeah Jimmy, you better get back to remastering the old Zep catalogue again before everyone completely forgets about you!

Wondering if there's any progress on material for his new solo...uhhh...never mind...fuhgeddaboudit.
Between that and the supposed new Stones album (14 years and Counting), might as well hibernate for a few more years before anything sees the light of day!

Lol, seriously. At least some of their peers are a bit more active when it comes to new material.