Sounds like Mick to me! Maybe sped up a bit.

Of course it's Mick.

Can't get enough of that instrumental, the chord progression reminds of Little Wing at times, Taylor just flies. Those two slide solos and his outro licks are fantastic.

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Palace Revolution 2000

Since these are confirmed to come through a Nicky connection, this could also be his headphone mixes. I could imagine him wanting a lot of Taylor in his cans.
And then him asking the engineer to run him off some tapes; and for convenience sake, since they were probably for work purposes he stuck with the rough headphone mix.

That is unlikely for a whole number of reasons.

They just sound like rough, works in progress/unfinished mixes, nothing mysterious or specific to Nicky.

chord changes are the same as "Tops."

Has anyone heard the unreleased track Separately? Supposedley that was recorded at Nellcote as well, right?

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Stones62
So cool to see new stuff turning up!

I still haven't heard anything NEW here. Am I missing something. Just bad mixes from the same old master tapes is my guess. Why all the friggin excitement over this?

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Naturalust

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Stones62
So cool to see new stuff turning up!

I still haven't heard anything NEW here. Am I missing something. Just bad mixes from the same old master tapes is my guess. Why all the friggin excitement over this?

So you've had the instrumental and the pre-vocal takes of the exile songs for years, have you? So why didn't you speak up, good man?!

BTW: The new instrumental has totally different chords then Tops. It really is new, though there are similarities to many of their ballads from the same period.

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Silver Dagger
I don't like doing torrent sites. Is there another way of downloading the Exile outtake stuff Erik? Has it ever appeared in Hotstuff?

You could ask at "Hot Stuff", if somebody could upload it there. I'm sure there are plenty there who could help you

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thijs1981
BTW: The new instrumental has totally different chords then Tops. It really is new, though there are similarities to many of their ballads from the same period.

Yeah, totally different, but the broken minor chord there leads you to the feeling of Wild Horses (especially live in 1975) as well as Tops.

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His Majesty

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Palace Revolution 2000

Since these are confirmed to come through a Nicky connection, this could also be his headphone mixes. I could imagine him wanting a lot of Taylor in his cans.
And then him asking the engineer to run him off some tapes; and for convenience sake, since they were probably for work purposes he stuck with the rough headphone mix.

That is unlikely for a whole number of reasons.

They just sound like rough, works in progress/unfinished mixes, nothing mysterious or specific to Nicky.

Well any of the theories here can be deemed unlikely for several reasons. This goes back 39 years into crazy, drug fueld years,archived by people who are notoriously not into record keeping.
And the reason they are specific to Nicky is from their origin. So they all are specific to Nicky, just by ownership. Had I heard these tapes ice cold w/o that knowledge, of course I would not have said "Oh that must be a mix just for Nicky".
But since they do come from him, it is perfectl;y reasonable to see a link to him as a possibility.
I spend a LOT of time in and about recording studios; and (while nowadays it is not tapes anymore) there are constantly huge numbers of rough copies of this and that run off for people in the inner circle; who want to taKe a few trax home in any variety of mix.
I am not dismissing any theories by anyone else here; it is way more fun to assume, and determine new historic facts and links, but I am saying there are just as many very unglamorous reasons for such recordings to exist.
Nobody knew these kinds of recordings would rock our world 40 years later.

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Naturalust

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Stones62
So cool to see new stuff turning up!

I still haven't heard anything NEW here. Am I missing something. Just bad mixes from the same old master tapes is my guess. Why all the friggin excitement over this?

? Did you actually listen to it?

Mathijs

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DandelionPowderman

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thijs1981
BTW: The new instrumental has totally different chords then Tops. It really is new, though there are similarities to many of their ballads from the same period.

Yeah, totally different, but the broken minor chord there leads you to the feeling of Wild Horses (especially live in 1975) as well as Tops.

I thought of Wild Horses as well. Is it an A minor chord as in Wild Horses?

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Silver Dagger

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DandelionPowderman

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thijs1981
BTW: The new instrumental has totally different chords then Tops. It really is new, though there are similarities to many of their ballads from the same period.

Yeah, totally different, but the broken minor chord there leads you to the feeling of Wild Horses (especially live in 1975) as well as Tops.

I thought of Wild Horses as well. Is it an A minor chord as in Wild Horses?

I think it's a broken B-minor-chord like when the verses start in WH.

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Palace Revolution 2000

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His Majesty

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Palace Revolution 2000

Since these are confirmed to come through a Nicky connection, this could also be his headphone mixes. I could imagine him wanting a lot of Taylor in his cans.
And then him asking the engineer to run him off some tapes; and for convenience sake, since they were probably for work purposes he stuck with the rough headphone mix.

That is unlikely for a whole number of reasons.

They just sound like rough, works in progress/unfinished mixes, nothing mysterious or specific to Nicky.

Well any of the theories here can be deemed unlikely for several reasons. This goes back 39 years into crazy, drug fueld years,archived by people who are notoriously not into record keeping.
And the reason they are specific to Nicky is from their origin. So they all are specific to Nicky, just by ownership. Had I heard these tapes ice cold w/o that knowledge, of course I would not have said "Oh that must be a mix just for Nicky".
But since they do come from him, it is perfectl;y reasonable to see a link to him as a possibility.
I spend a LOT of time in and about recording studios; and (while nowadays it is not tapes anymore) there are constantly huge numbers of rough copies of this and that run off for people in the inner circle; who want to taKe a few trax home in any variety of mix.
I am not dismissing any theories by anyone else here; it is way more fun to assume, and determine new historic facts and links, but I am saying there are just as many very unglamorous reasons for such recordings to exist.
Nobody knew these kinds of recordings would rock our world 40 years later.

What are 'headphone mixes'?

To me it sounds like rough mixes done at the end of the recording sessions. They spend up to late November 1971 recording at Nellcote, and it is known they recorded the basics of a dozen or so songs, including all brass overdubs. As far as known, Taylor and keys where not present in LA, so all their parts where recorded at Nellcote. It just sounds very much like a first rough mix done by Jimmy Miller or Glyn/Andy Johns for everybody to take home as a souvenir, or as a way to prepare for the upcoming sessions in LA. This is how most outtakes become available to collectors.

Mathijs

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big4

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RobertJohnson
I think it is an early version of "If You Really Want to be My Friend" from IORR.

I hear a bit of Winter and Till The Next Goodbye in it also.

Maybe it is a "mastertape" containing a bunch of new song ideas. The reverse procedure of "A Day in the Life": There Lennon and McCartney mixed up two songs. Maybe after recording this fragment Jagger/Richards sorted out some good tunes and made three new songs out of it.

I doubt it. Not one of the parts (intro, verse, chorus, outdo) sounds like a part that has been used later on. It's already, even without melody, too specific.

The more I listen to it, the more I like it. It's really delicate.

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Palace Revolution 2000

Well any of the theories here can be deemed unlikely for several reasons. This goes back 39 years into crazy, drug fueld years,archived by people who are notoriously not into record keeping.
And the reason they are specific to Nicky is from their origin. So they all are specific to Nicky, just by ownership. Had I heard these tapes ice cold w/o that knowledge, of course I would not have said "Oh that must be a mix just for Nicky".
But since they do come from him, it is perfectl;y reasonable to see a link to him as a possibility.
I spend a LOT of time in and about recording studios; and (while nowadays it is not tapes anymore) there are constantly huge numbers of rough copies of this and that run off for people in the inner circle; who want to taKe a few trax home in any variety of mix.

I am not dismissing any theories by anyone else here; it is way more fun to assume, and determine new historic facts and links, but I am saying there are just as many very unglamorous reasons for such recordings to exist.

Nobody knew these kinds of recordings would rock our world 40 years later.

I meant more unlikely for a number of reasons regarding it being some specific to Nicky headphone mix. Nothing to do with drugs, lack of record keeping, just the technology of the time.

Whether you spend a LOT of time in a studio or not has nothing to do with this.

Tis a bunch of rough mixes, nothing more nothing less.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-08-26 15:49 by His Majesty.

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Naturalust
I still haven't heard anything NEW here

Then you haven't heard anything at all. This is almost all new.

how can anyone scoff at this stuff? my god, it's like the dead sea scrolls - totally fascinating and enlightening and mysterious

Found it. At 7:53 it starts, where the Exile billboard comes in.





Also at 2:01 in this one:






Anyone know if this was ever done for Exile?

Ah - Fragile is the name of it!

Thanks thijs1981!

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Mathijs
You do miss Sweet Virginia though -the version is different to anything we've heard before. This very well could be the final take from London before they took it to LA. Amazing to hear that the famous 'Nellcote villa' choir vocals seem to have been added in LA.
Mathijs

Thanks for all the info.
As for SV, what is different from the generally circulating version? I compared this to the Custom Mixes cd as well as the Pro Series remaster and it seems to be the same to my ears, although a different speed and mix: Keys sax (the odd note after "fruit" is one example), Taylor's acoustic intro and fills, Hopkins trills, Jagger's wavering vox, etc.

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Mathijs

Shine a Light is to my ears not different to the version that is available since the Time Trip / Hillside Blues releases in the mid-90's. You do miss Sweet Virginia though -the version is different to anything we've heard before. This very well could be the final take from London before they took it to LA. Amazing to hear that the famous 'Nellcote villa' choir vocals seem to have been added in LA.

Mathijs

If Taylor wasn't there for the LA sessions - then they must have recorded SOME of the background vocals for Sweet Virginia at Nellcote. Taylor has stated that the higher pitched background singing on the coda to SV that is often mistaken for Gram Parsons is actually him....

Who actually started the rumours that Gram sang background on SV, TD & Loving Cup?
Gram was in LA when they were mixing/mastering Exile - did he ever make it to the studio?

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Mathijs

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Naturalust

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Stones62
So cool to see new stuff turning up!

I still haven't heard anything NEW here. Am I missing something. Just bad mixes from the same old master tapes is my guess. Why all the friggin excitement over this?

? Did you actually listen to it?

Mathijs

OK to be fair I'll do another listen for you Mathijis, which one is really rocking your nogalstic world today? that one will do. Rocks Off was probably the one that turned me sour. peace.

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Munichhilton
Those are really great listens.
I am grabbing them with soundforge as mp3 files, but I doubt youtube is any more than 128-160K?

Hi MH, I grab stuff off you tube at 24 bits , 44.1KHz. Storage is cheap and you can be sure of getting the best of what anyone uplaoded , you can always go cleanup and or play with the wave files later. I have gotten some fine sounding files in the end. But, I don't need smaller files for portable devices since I don't use em. Good enough. Just my 2 bit. peace.

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Mathijs

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thijs1981
The new instrumental reminds me somewhat of the bridge in Till The Next Time.
It is very melodic. Funny they throw the major 7th in there as well. They didn't do that on many songs, that is pushing experimental, chord wise for early 70s Stones.

Seems they just didn't have enough room for all these ballads, like Following The River, Separately. Could have been a Taylor idea as well, maybe that's why they didn't finish it. We'll just have to guess.

I'm pretty happy I don't have to listen to this one with faux-young-over-the-top Jagger vocals on it, though.

Well, the instrumental is very, very simular to how they did Wild Horses in '75! Chords, licks, except for the major 7th they threw in.

Mathijs

The maj 7th was probably a mistake knowing the stones, (1/2 the hand nodding out so to speak) ....lol

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with sssoul

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Mathijs
The uploader is called Robin M. Blind.

... as in "robbing 'em blind", eh? (or 'im, as the case may be)
anyway multi thanks for posting all this, people

that's a keen observation there soul sister...you're hired. peace

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Naturalust

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Munichhilton
Those are really great listens.
I am grabbing them with soundforge as mp3 files, but I doubt youtube is any more than 128-160K?

Hi MH, I grab stuff off you tube at 24 bits , 44.1KHz. Storage is cheap and you can be sure of getting the best of what anyone uplaoded , you can always go cleanup and or play with the wave files later. I have gotten some fine sounding files in the end. But, I don't need smaller files for portable devices since I don't use em. Good enough. Just my 2 bit. peace.

That's right. But I didn't think of it.
midnrambler later hinted at it and that's what we are trying to do here:

[www.iorr.org]

I'm actually still in shock over your comment about not hearing anything new. Obviously these are 39 year old recordings, but unless you have only just started exploring the unreleased world of the Rolling Stones...you should have known how valuable this find was?!?!