Tell Me :
Talk
All of your posts on this thread are great... Thanks!
Well, regarding destroying the band the vampire twins ala Keith did his best by being a junkie and messing with guns during 70's and Mick did his best sneeking solo deals and hanging with Elton John etc during 80's onwards.
What was left after all that selfish acts is a farce of a band with no soul, no passion and shit songs. Rock & @#$%& Roll baby!
Never post when your drunk.
Mathijs
I thought you were leaving anyway? >
<
. Wild Horses, Sway, Tumbling Dice, Shine A Light, Let It Loose, 100 Years Ago, Winter... I can go on and on and on...
Ruby Tuesday, such an overrated song. It's a nice little melody isn't it? Who give a damn about a recorder? That belongs in the boys' choir. There's no guitars in that song, ridiculous. And don't get me started on that Satanic Majesties Request trash, the psychedelic era was just an hazy and confused craze due to all the acid the bands were taking. And in case of the Stones they were just imitating the Beatles, such a mistake. There's a reason Jimmy Miller stiffened up things a year later and told them not to abandon the blues.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 03:51 by DiscoVolante.
Clueless.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 04:10 by neptune.
Like I said, just different, more rock orientated and with fancier solos.
The actual quality of songs was great before Taylor joined and during his time them, they are just fairly different in their arrangements due to the times they were recorded and his style of guitar playing.
Do you like Brians playing on No Expectations? Do you have anything positive to say about the vitally important first 7 or so years of the band?
If not why bother wasting your time talking about it?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 04:45 by His Majesty.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 06:33 by DiscoVolante.
Nasty and dangerous, huh? Did your homework, huh? They used to riot when the Stones hit the stage in the mid-60s. Shows had to be stopped. But you've seen that footage because you did your history of the band. You've seen Brian laughing maniacally as all hell breaks out on stage around them. What was 'Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby'? A pop song? After Brian, they became just a rock and roll guitar band. Before that they were so much more.
I don't see any difficulty about enjoying both the Jones and Taylor eras equally. They both have one thing in common: The songwriting was superb. Taylor joined when the band went "back to roots" and then developed the classic open G template. Jones was there when they were chasing The Beatles as pop craftsmen. Both eras are fantastically great. The Taylor was not just a matter of "fancier solos". Songs like Sway, Moonlight Mile, Let It Loose had great soul and depth. I like Ruby Tuesday just as much, for different reasons. It's what came after these two eras that I have a problem with, personally, buy why put down either of these great eras when we have such an embarrassment of riches?
The Stones aren't the only band who would have a different name:
One thing is funny though. You and Brian felt the same thing about Satanic Majesties. Brian even adviced Mick and Keith to stay true to their musical roots and don't follow the Beatles.
Thank god they didn't listen. SMR is kind of a flop as an album, but worth it for She's A Rainbow, 2000 Light Years, and yes, In Another Land. Also the other singles they cut in that era, Dandelion, etc. are wonderful. They can't even pull of that kind of musical experimentation now. The Rolling Stones were more than 'The Greatest Rock and Roll Band In The World'. They were an incredible pop band. That's why they seem at odds with comparison to Led Zeppelin. The Stones could make perfect 3 minute pop songs, with hard rock overtones. There's a lost art to that. They last achieved that on a grand scale with Miss You. Mick Jagger even said in an early 70s interview that he thought of them as an Elizabethan band. Lots of groups could pull off rock and roll. But how many could pull off Lady Jane?
Then why would Brian contribute so much to Satanic Majesties if he knew it was totally against his so-called "musical roots"?
You have no idea what kind of people went to ballrooms and concerts in places like the North of England in the 60s. There were some tough gits looking for trouble. Dazed hippies getting beaten by beer and speed crazed bikers wasn't much of a riot. The Angels waded into the crowd, knifed a guy, and came back to the stage for some more beer. Some riot.
[www.youtube.com]
There must have been some gaps in your homework. Take a look at this video from the Kurhaus
in The Hague. Where are the screaming girls and teenage boys?
I've always found it ironic that Brian didn't like Satanic since his work on it is amazing and it allowed him to go nuts with his instruments. Gomper for instance is a pure ode to Marocco and Brian, being this huge Marocco-fan must have loved that.
The experimental part of the Stones in the 60's is why I prefer that period.
But who knows?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 10:36 by tonterapi.
Put on the UK Aftermath real loud and hear an album that after 45 years hasn't lost anything of its energy and power. Guess who's an important factor on that album.
Mathijs
LOL yeah, that really put the band in danger
-------------------
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Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Marie
()
Date: April 28, 2011 23:58
Quote
24FPS
There are big geniuses and little geniuses. Brian was a little genius. There was something in his playing on slide and on the multi-instruments that was beyond normal, with an almost ethereal, non-verbal emotion to them. John Lennon, to me, was a big genius, a powerful poet with probably the best soul wrenching voice in rock and roll. Jimi Hendrix was an other worldly big genius. In time I have managed to hear a lot of Jimi's influences, from Earl Hooker to Buddy Guy. But what Jimi did with them was totally original. I think the same can be said for some of Brian Jones' slide solos. No one ever claimed that Brian was a master recorder/marimba/accordian player. Lennon said he himself wasn't a great instrumentalist, but that he was an artist who could pick up an instrument and create something interesting with it.
Other rock geniuses, in my humble opinion, are Brian Wilson and Kurt Cobain. I'm sure there are others, but those stand out. Maybe my criteria is originality and emotional depth. And every one of them, including the Brian, the little genius, struggled mightily with that genius. That they seem to be speaking from another world is what makes them so seductive.
All of your posts on this thread are great... Thanks!
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: April 29, 2011 00:45
Quote
mickschix
I understand completely why Mick and Keith lost patience with him and fortunately they cut him loose before he destroyed the band.
Well, regarding destroying the band the vampire twins ala Keith did his best by being a junkie and messing with guns during 70's and Mick did his best sneeking solo deals and hanging with Elton John etc during 80's onwards.
What was left after all that selfish acts is a farce of a band with no soul, no passion and shit songs. Rock & @#$%& Roll baby!
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: April 29, 2011 00:46
Quote
His MajestyQuote
mickschix
I understand completely why Mick and Keith lost patience with him and fortunately they cut him loose before he destroyed the band.
Well, regarding destroying the band the vampire twins ala Keith did his best by being a junkie and messing with guns during 70's and Mick did his best sneeking solo deals and hanging with Elton John etc during 80's onwards.
What was left after all that selfish acts is a farce of a band with no soul, no passion and shit songs. Rock & @#$%& Roll baby!
Never post when your drunk.
Mathijs
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: April 29, 2011 01:00
Quote
Mathijs
Never post when your drunk.
Mathijs
I thought you were leaving anyway? >
<Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
tonterapi
()
Date: April 29, 2011 01:00
To me I find it a bit "too much" to call Brian Jones a genius as that word lacks soul IMHO. Brian was an amazing player in regards of feeling and choice of notes. But I will always see him as a true musician's soul rather than a genius and they are pretty rare as well.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
DiscoVolante
()
Date: April 29, 2011 03:50
Yes there are a lot of better songs than the ones you're mentioningQuote
His Majesty
What from the Taylor era is better than Satisfaction, Ruby Tuesday, Paint It Black, The Last Time, 2000 Light Years From Home, Jumpin' Jack Flash, Street Fighting Man etc etc?
There isn't anything better, it's just different, more rock orientated and with fancier guitar solos.
. Wild Horses, Sway, Tumbling Dice, Shine A Light, Let It Loose, 100 Years Ago, Winter... I can go on and on and on...Ruby Tuesday, such an overrated song. It's a nice little melody isn't it?
Who give a damn about a recorder? That belongs in the boys' choir. There's no guitars in that song, ridiculous. And don't get me started on that Satanic Majesties Request trash, the psychedelic era was just an hazy and confused craze due to all the acid the bands were taking. And in case of the Stones they were just imitating the Beatles, such a mistake. There's a reason Jimmy Miller stiffened up things a year later and told them not to abandon the blues.Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 03:51 by DiscoVolante.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
neptune
()
Date: April 29, 2011 03:53
Quote
DiscoVolanteYes there are a lot of better songs than the ones you're mentioningQuote
His Majesty
What from the Taylor era is better than Satisfaction, Ruby Tuesday, Paint It Black, The Last Time, 2000 Light Years From Home, Jumpin' Jack Flash, Street Fighting Man etc etc?
There isn't anything better, it's just different, more rock orientated and with fancier guitar solos.
Ruby Tuesday, such an overrated song. It's a nice little melody isn't it?
Clueless.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 04:10 by neptune.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
neptune
()
Date: April 29, 2011 04:35
In a way, I'm happy DiscoVolante started this thread because I think he represents the majority of Stones fans here in America who have no inkling or understanding of who Brian Jones was. They are of the 'classic rock station' variety of Stones fan with little knowledge of the band's real history and their importance in the 1960's. And here's a little advice for DiscoVolante: shut up and go get England's Newest Hitmakers, 12x5, and Now! Those three albums should get you started in understanding the roots of the Rolling Stones and why they became the greatest rock and roll band in the world.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: April 29, 2011 04:40
Quote
DiscoVolanteYes there are a lot of better songs than the ones you're mentioningQuote
His Majesty
What from the Taylor era is better than Satisfaction, Ruby Tuesday, Paint It Black, The Last Time, 2000 Light Years From Home, Jumpin' Jack Flash, Street Fighting Man etc etc?
There isn't anything better, it's just different, more rock orientated and with fancier guitar solos.
Ruby Tuesday, such an overrated song. It's a nice little melody isn't it?
due to all the acid the bands were taking. And in case of the Stones they were just imitating the Beatles, such a mistake. There's a reason Jimmy Miller stiffened up things a year later and told them not to abandon the blues.
Like I said, just different, more rock orientated and with fancier solos.
The actual quality of songs was great before Taylor joined and during his time them, they are just fairly different in their arrangements due to the times they were recorded and his style of guitar playing.
Do you like Brians playing on No Expectations? Do you have anything positive to say about the vitally important first 7 or so years of the band?
If not why bother wasting your time talking about it?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 04:45 by His Majesty.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
BJPortugal
()
Date: April 29, 2011 04:41
Ruby Tuesday overrated song? By who?
There is a acoustic guitar in that song... and Brian plays recorder and piano.
Just imitating The Beatles? Where? You are confusing your personal tastes with the quality... Just because you don't like that "psychedelic era". And Brian was much more than that period... Don't forget that Keith was also very into.. Between the Buttons is very Keith... and take a listen to Satanic box set...
There is a acoustic guitar in that song... and Brian plays recorder and piano.
Just imitating The Beatles?
Where? You are confusing your personal tastes with the quality... Just because you don't like that "psychedelic era". And Brian was much more than that period... Don't forget that Keith was also very into.. Between the Buttons is very Keith... and take a listen to Satanic box set...Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
MKjan
()
Date: April 29, 2011 05:03
Ruby Tuesday is great.... and back in '67, I'm sure many of us knew a girl that song could have been about.
I just hope it wasn't the same girl
I just hope it wasn't the same girl
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
stones78
()
Date: April 29, 2011 05:13
I think the songwriting was at its peak during 66/67, so many different melodies and different arrangements, the "Big 4" of course are marvellous, but they lost a lot of diversity by focusing on bluesy-rock only.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
DiscoVolante
()
Date: April 29, 2011 05:31
Hey I've made myself through the Stones entire discography countless times and I did my Stones history homework a long time ago. Just because I wasn't there in the days or because I'm not british or anything doesn't mean that I don't understand the impact they had in the early days. I started this thread to understand what's so special about Brian Jones because I just don't see it. In my ears, the music they made in the midtime 60's was just a preview of what's to come. In the 70's the Stones reached a creative peak, Exile on Main St. speaks for itself, the only double-album they come to release. They were on fire. Nasty and dangerous.Quote
neptune
And here's a little advice for DiscoVolante: shut up and go get England's Newest Hitmakers, 12x5, and Now! Those three albums should get you started in understanding the roots of the Rolling Stones and why they became the greatest rock and roll band in the world.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 06:33 by DiscoVolante.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: April 29, 2011 07:15
Quote
DiscoVolanteHey I've made myself through the Stones entire discography countless times and I did my Stones history homework a long time ago. Just because I wasn't there in the days or because I'm not british or anything doesn't mean that I don't understand the impact they had in the early days. I started this thread to understand what's so special about Brian Jones because I just don't see it. In my ears, the music they made in the midtime 60's was just a preview of what's to come. In the 70's the Stones reached a creative peak, Exile on Main St. speaks for itself, the only double-album they come to release. They were on fire. Nasty and dangerous.Quote
neptune
And here's a little advice for DiscoVolante: shut up and go get England's Newest Hitmakers, 12x5, and Now! Those three albums should get you started in understanding the roots of the Rolling Stones and why they became the greatest rock and roll band in the world.
Nasty and dangerous, huh? Did your homework, huh? They used to riot when the Stones hit the stage in the mid-60s. Shows had to be stopped. But you've seen that footage because you did your history of the band. You've seen Brian laughing maniacally as all hell breaks out on stage around them. What was 'Have You Seen Your Mother, Baby'? A pop song? After Brian, they became just a rock and roll guitar band. Before that they were so much more.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
DiscoVolante
()
Date: April 29, 2011 07:46
Riots of screaming girls (and teenage boys) who wasn't there for the music but for the pretty boys on stage. It wasn't 'til the US tour of '69 that people actually came to listen to the band. Altamont late-1969, that's what I call a riot, people getting killed by the Hells Angels. It wasn't 'til the late 60's that people would associate the Stones as in cahoots with the devil. Goats Head Soup, the nasty theme surrounding that album would never be touched in the 60's.
I don't doubt that the Stones were mean in the mid-60's but they were still kids back then.
I don't doubt that the Stones were mean in the mid-60's but they were still kids back then.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
71Tele
()
Date: April 29, 2011 07:56
Quote
His MajestyQuote
DiscoVolanteYes there are a lot of better songs than the ones you're mentioningQuote
His Majesty
What from the Taylor era is better than Satisfaction, Ruby Tuesday, Paint It Black, The Last Time, 2000 Light Years From Home, Jumpin' Jack Flash, Street Fighting Man etc etc?
There isn't anything better, it's just different, more rock orientated and with fancier guitar solos.
Ruby Tuesday, such an overrated song. It's a nice little melody isn't it?
due to all the acid the bands were taking. And in case of the Stones they were just imitating the Beatles, such a mistake. There's a reason Jimmy Miller stiffened up things a year later and told them not to abandon the blues.
Like I said, just different, more rock orientated and with fancier solos.
The actual quality of songs was great before Taylor joined and during his time them, they are just fairly different in their arrangements due to the times they were recorded and his style of guitar playing.
Do you like Brians playing on No Expectations? Do you have anything positive to say about the vitally important first 7 or so years of the band?
If not why bother wasting your time talking about it?
I don't see any difficulty about enjoying both the Jones and Taylor eras equally. They both have one thing in common: The songwriting was superb. Taylor joined when the band went "back to roots" and then developed the classic open G template. Jones was there when they were chasing The Beatles as pop craftsmen. Both eras are fantastically great. The Taylor was not just a matter of "fancier solos". Songs like Sway, Moonlight Mile, Let It Loose had great soul and depth. I like Ruby Tuesday just as much, for different reasons. It's what came after these two eras that I have a problem with, personally, buy why put down either of these great eras when we have such an embarrassment of riches?
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Title5Take1
()
Date: April 29, 2011 08:44
Quote
Rockman
Heck ...Without Brian they coulda ended up being called The Kidney Stones ......
The Stones aren't the only band who would have a different name:
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: April 29, 2011 08:46
......The Saint Valentine's Day Massacre .........
ROCKMAN
ROCKMAN
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
tonterapi
()
Date: April 29, 2011 09:52
Well, hopefully you've read what people in this thread have answered you. Either you want to understand what was special about Brian or you've just decided that you don't think he was special and that's it.Quote
DiscoVolante
I started this thread to understand what's so special about Brian Jones because I just don't see it.
One thing is funny though. You and Brian felt the same thing about Satanic Majesties. Brian even adviced Mick and Keith to stay true to their musical roots and don't follow the Beatles.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:12
Quote
tonterapiWell, hopefully you've read what people in this thread have answered you. Either you want to understand what was special about Brian or you've just decided that you don't think he was special and that's it.Quote
DiscoVolante
I started this thread to understand what's so special about Brian Jones because I just don't see it.
One thing is funny though. You and Brian felt the same thing about Satanic Majesties. Brian even adviced Mick and Keith to stay true to their musical roots and don't follow the Beatles.
Thank god they didn't listen. SMR is kind of a flop as an album, but worth it for She's A Rainbow, 2000 Light Years, and yes, In Another Land. Also the other singles they cut in that era, Dandelion, etc. are wonderful. They can't even pull of that kind of musical experimentation now. The Rolling Stones were more than 'The Greatest Rock and Roll Band In The World'. They were an incredible pop band. That's why they seem at odds with comparison to Led Zeppelin. The Stones could make perfect 3 minute pop songs, with hard rock overtones. There's a lost art to that. They last achieved that on a grand scale with Miss You. Mick Jagger even said in an early 70s interview that he thought of them as an Elizabethan band. Lots of groups could pull off rock and roll. But how many could pull off Lady Jane?
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Rockman
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:13
But how many could pull off Lady Jane?
YEAH ....now that sure would be hard one
ROCKMAN
YEAH ....now that sure would be hard one
ROCKMAN
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
tomk
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:18
Quote
tonterapiWell, hopefully you've read what people in this thread have answered you. Either you want to understand what was special about Brian or you've just decided that you don't think he was special and that's it.Quote
DiscoVolante
I started this thread to understand what's so special about Brian Jones because I just don't see it.
One thing is funny though. You and Brian felt the same thing about Satanic Majesties. Brian even adviced Mick and Keith to stay true to their musical roots and don't follow the Beatles.
Then why would Brian contribute so much to Satanic Majesties if he knew it was totally against his so-called "musical roots"?
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
24FPS
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:19
Quote
DiscoVolante
Riots of screaming girls (and teenage boys) who wasn't there for the music but for the pretty boys on stage. It wasn't 'til the US tour of '69 that people actually came to listen to the band. Altamont late-1969, that's what I call a riot, people getting killed by the Hells Angels. It wasn't 'til the late 60's that people would associate the Stones as in cahoots with the devil. Goats Head Soup, the nasty theme surrounding that album would never be touched in the 60's.
I don't doubt that the Stones were mean in the mid-60's but they were still kids back then.
You have no idea what kind of people went to ballrooms and concerts in places like the North of England in the 60s. There were some tough gits looking for trouble. Dazed hippies getting beaten by beer and speed crazed bikers wasn't much of a riot. The Angels waded into the crowd, knifed a guy, and came back to the stage for some more beer. Some riot.
[www.youtube.com]
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
marcovandereijk
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:20
Quote
DiscoVolante
Riots of screaming girls (and teenage boys) who wasn't there for the music but for the pretty boys on stage
There must have been some gaps in your homework. Take a look at this video from the Kurhaus
in The Hague. Where are the screaming girls and teenage boys?
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
tonterapi
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:25
I totally agree with you. TSMR is my second favorite album by the Stones - only Beggar's Banquet is better IMHO.Quote
24FPS
Thank god they didn't listen. SMR is kind of a flop as an album, but worth it for She's A Rainbow, 2000 Light Years, and yes, In Another Land. Also the other singles they cut in that era, Dandelion, etc. are wonderful. They can't even pull of that kind of musical experimentation now. The Rolling Stones were more than 'The Greatest Rock and Roll Band In The World'. They were an incredible pop band. That's why they seem at odds with comparison to Led Zeppelin. The Stones could make perfect 3 minute pop songs, with hard rock overtones. There's a lost art to that. They last achieved that on a grand scale with Miss You. Mick Jagger even said in an early 70s interview that he thought of them as an Elizabethan band. Lots of groups could pull off rock and roll. But how many could pull off Lady Jane?
I've always found it ironic that Brian didn't like Satanic since his work on it is amazing and it allowed him to go nuts with his instruments. Gomper for instance is a pure ode to Marocco and Brian, being this huge Marocco-fan must have loved that.
The experimental part of the Stones in the 60's is why I prefer that period.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
tonterapi
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:35
My guess is that he contributed because 1. He got the chance to continue experiment with all kinds of instruments as it fitted the psychedelic move and 2. He had the chance to get close to Keith again since he, Keith and Nicky Hopkins seems to have worked close developing the songs.Quote
tomk
Then why would Brian contribute so much to Satanic Majesties if he knew it was totally against his so-called "musical roots"?
But who knows?
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-29 10:36 by tonterapi.
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Mathijs
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:38
Quote
DiscoVolante
Ruby Tuesday, such an overrated song. It's a nice little melody isn't it?
Put on the UK Aftermath real loud and hear an album that after 45 years hasn't lost anything of its energy and power. Guess who's an important factor on that album.
Mathijs
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Come On
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:39
But was it that revolutionary with the sounds on TSMR? I'm still dancing on the ceiling to Beach Boys 'Good Vibrations'...that's the stuff...
2 1 2 0
2 1 2 0
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
tonterapi
()
Date: April 29, 2011 10:43
The Stones did what everybody else did that year but in their own way. I don't think that it was revolutionary.Quote
Come On
But was it that revolutionary with the sounds on TSMR?
Re: Brian Jones. Overrated?
Posted by:
Rolling Hansie
()
Date: April 29, 2011 11:19
Quote
His Majesty
Mick did his best sneeking solo deals and hanging with Elton John
LOL yeah, that really put the band in danger
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Keep On Rolling
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