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Edith Grove
I suppose if new evidence came to light that justified Hunter's actions, then I would reconsider, but all we've heard since then is hearsay and conjecture.

and if you know anything about the history of race relations in this country (and it's obvious that you don't) you would know that plenty a redneck has slithered through the loopholes of hearsay and conjecture for years.

***********************************************************
"What I'm doing is a sexual thing. I dance and all dancing is a replacement for sex". - Mick Jagger

Re: Meredith Hunter documentary new
Posted by: dancingmisterd ()
Date: March 31, 2011 22:07


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MCDDTLC
#1 - the gun was loaded, which put's the Angel's claim that he was shooting at the stage = BS

He drew a loaded gun but because he hadn't fired it yet it's okay?

My typing error - everyone there stated his gun WASN'T loaded - sorry

Re: Meredith Hunter documentary new
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: March 31, 2011 22:18


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MCDDTLC
Hey LeonidP & 24FPS,

He pulled his gun thinking it would stop the Angels from beating him up as they started to do because he was with a Blonde white woman..

wow, should we all just make up things and claim them as fact? we know he pulled a gun - we don't know they were beating him or the reason if they were - nice way to assume the worst from the angels but give meredith the benefit of the doubt.

evidence - he pulled a gun, then we see the stabbing... no evidence - he was being beaten for being with a white woman

LeonidP - that was the quote from the Rolling Stone writer who was there - watching it - he saw the Angels checking Meredith out, watched them pick a fight with him for no reason, and when more than one started hitting him he pulled his (un-loaded) gun - they did the same with that fat Mexican dude that was dancing around - stoned - not hurting anyone... Angels smacked him around with their pool cues also - I believe the RS writer account of things.. MLC

theory - he doesn't pull a gun and he would still be alive.

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stateofshock
I just love all the racist excuses for a black man being killed...yeah I said it, you don't like it? fcku you, bigots.

Maybe you ought to take your racist rants somewhere else you jerk. The only bigot here is you @#$%&.

It doesn't matter if Meredith was carrying an unloaded weapon. There was no way to determine that. The poor guy was speeding his nuts off. You can see that from his tongue action in the documentary footage and the autopsy report, which said he was on meth. He was justifiably paranoid, and unfortunately felt threatened and pulled a gun. There proabably was a racial element to the Angels giving him extra attention. Read Hunter Thompson's book on the Angels and you'll see they had a history of racial problems. (There was even a shootout, I think, between the Angels and a black biker group.)

Let's not call each other bigots because someone states objective fact. I'm sure if a white guy had pulled a gun that day he also would have been shivved repeatedly. Didn't the Angels punch out someone from the Airplane that day? It was just a very, very sad day that started with good intentions. Let's not add to it 42 years later by attacking each other needlessly.

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24FPS
Let's not call each other bigots because someone states objective fact. I'm sure if a white guy had pulled a gun that day he also would have been shivved repeatedly. Didn't the Angels punch out someone from the Airplane that day? It was just a very, very sad day that started with good intentions. Let's not add to it 42 years later by attacking each other needlessly.

Thank you!

But that clip was cool anyways

I remember how the whole incident sort of diminished Mick. He seemed so helpless and silly in his jockey silks outfit. I think it made them back away from flirting with satanic images for a while. (At least until 'Dancing With Mr. D'.)

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MCDDTLC

LeonidP - that was the quote from the Rolling Stone writer who was there - watching it - he saw the Angels checking Meredith out, watched them pick a fight with him for no reason, and when more than one started hitting him he pulled his (un-loaded) gun - they did the same with that fat Mexican dude that was dancing around - stoned - not hurting anyone... Angels smacked him around with their pool cues also - I believe the RS writer account of things.. MLC

maybe, however there was a trial against the Angel that did the deed & meredith's own own girlfriend testified in court - and never brought up that they were beating him before this or that they were targeting him - and i've read a lot on this and never once read anything about the gun not being loaded (not that it mattered, as someone else pointed out, how would they know this anyway).

There's also footage which shows the whole incident and the lead up to his death, hunter is apparently seen jumping onto the stage, then being thrown off by the angels, perhaps this was the beginning of when the angels started to pick on him

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Eleanor Rigby
There's also footage which shows the whole incident and the lead up to his death, hunter is apparently seen jumping onto the stage, then being thrown off by the angels, perhaps this was the beginning of when the angels started to pick on him

Well, first time I hear this. Where can we see this footage?

All I've ever read in books and mags from those days from people that were around is that the Angels were hassling Hunter for some time from the stage while he was standing in front of it. As can be seen on pics and film. He drew the gun (no good decision . .) in despair when trying to get away from the Angels , - already in fear of his life.

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LeonidP

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MCDDTLC

LeonidP - that was the quote from the Rolling Stone writer who was there - watching it - he saw the Angels checking Meredith out, watched them pick a fight with him for no reason, and when more than one started hitting him he pulled his (un-loaded) gun - they did the same with that fat Mexican dude that was dancing around - stoned - not hurting anyone... Angels smacked him around with their pool cues also - I believe the RS writer account of things.. MLC

maybe, however there was a trial against the Angel that did the deed & meredith's own own girlfriend testified in court - and never brought up that they were beating him before this or that they were targeting him - and i've read a lot on this and never once read anything about the gun not being loaded (not that it mattered, as someone else pointed out, how would they know this anyway).

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Eleanor Rigby
There's also footage which shows the whole incident and the lead up to his death, hunter is apparently seen jumping onto the stage, then being thrown off by the angels, perhaps this was the beginning of when the angels started to pick on him

This is the discrepancy that has always puzzled me when this subject comes up: Did Meredith Hunter get harassed into it by the Angels or did Meredith Hunter do something which got the Angel's attention, something which precipitated the Angels harassing him, like jumping onstage?

For example Hunter crashes the stage, for whatever reason,words are exchanged as he is ejected, now he's on the Angel' radar, and they are pissed, and seize on the black & white thing to retaliate, hurling insults, etc. . ..

. . . And then came the alleged harassment of a black man for being with a white girl situation.

1.) A reporter says the white harassing black thing happened.

2.) Yet there is no supporting court testimony regarding that.


I would love to know what was said to the cops by the girl that perhaps did not get said in court.

I guess we'll never know if it was a case of a drugged up black man being harassed into wanting to get even with white thugs, or, a drugged up stage crasher drew the ire of the violent Angels who then give him a lot of shit in return.

We know what happened next whatever precipitated it.

This the Rolling Stones very own Grassy Knoll, or is the Grassy Knoll the Todger-Keith's book-Mick's solo- 2012 tour thing?

Rory Gallagher?



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-01 21:01 by deadegad.

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deadegad

I would love to know what was said to the cops by the girl that perhaps did not get said in court.

Eggzactly! She is the only one that could really answer what went on leading up to the incident ... and for some reason she never gets interviewed about it (i suppose more than likely she refuses to) - it's not even known what became of her. There was a quote from her that I found from several years ago, but they stayed away from asking her about what happened before he brought out the gun. It will be sad if no one ever gets this story straight before she dies.

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DartfordRenegade
Sad that he has no headstone to mark his grave.

According to Wikipedia, sufficient donations were received after the screening of the film to pay for a headstone.

The Hell's Angels beat the crap out of innocent white people all day long. That's part of the whole Altamont legacy. To say they killed MH because he was a black man with a white woman is quite a leap in logic.

MH brought this gun because he was with a white woman and knew he would need it as protection? Remember, this was San Francisco in 1969! This was the center of the hippie-peace-love everybody universe. This was not in Mississippi.

Remember, we are all speculating about motives and everyone's thought process. But a criminal court jury, who heard what real evidence there was to hear from actual witnesses, found the Angel, Not Guilty.

You or I don't have to like it or agree with it. I'm just sayin the jury was in a better position to judge this, than we are, with our pre-concieved notions of what transpired some 40 years go.

"Take all the pain...It's yours anyway"



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-01 19:15 by Woody24.

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The Sicilian

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stateofshock
I just love all the racist excuses for a black man being killed...yeah I said it, you don't like it? fcku you, bigots.

Maybe you ought to take your racist rants somewhere else you jerk. The only bigot here is you @#$%&.

Eat a dick, biotch.

***********************************************************
"What I'm doing is a sexual thing. I dance and all dancing is a replacement for sex". - Mick Jagger



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-01 19:10 by stateofshock.

Last comments

I'm sure Meredith's girlfriend was scared as all hell of the Angels and didn't
say a word against them.

First I heard of Meredith trying to rush the stage? I've never seen video of that.
I just remember the Rolling Stone account of the event, the writer saw the Angels
beating anyone they didn't like, 1st it was that Fat Mexican dude, the writer's comment: he was so ugly the Angels had to hit him...

then the Meredith incident, according to him and he said he knew some Angels,
they were red-neck, ass-kickers who didn't like seeing Black guys with white girls.. he watched them harass Meredith until he did a stupid thing, the cops
checked out his gun, hadn't been fired, and no bullets were found.. can't think the Angels would un-load it, a loaded gun would just back up their story.

And a jury bought the story that the "stabber" was just protecting everyone, how
would he know the gun wasn't loaded - self defense.. he got away with MURDER..

MLC

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MCDDTLC
...
And a jury bought the story that the "stabber" was just protecting everyone, how
would he know the gun wasn't loaded - self defense.. he got away with MURDER..

MLC

lol, yes, got away w/ murder ... let's just discount the fact that the shooter had a gun ... "wait, he's got a gun, but don't do anything yet, it might not be loaded, let's wait and see what happens first - if he shoots and we can then tell that there are bullets then we'll react"

He was doing something wrong, and illegal with a gun in his pocket as soon as he left the house that day...That was stupid enough, but to bring it to an event like this, well, beyond stupid...

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dewlover
He was doing something wrong, and illegal with a gun in his pocket as soon as he left the house that day...That was stupid enough, but to bring it to an event like this, well, beyond stupid...

Yes and the Angels did absolutey nothing illegal or stupid at all that day right?

Leon - do you have friends in the Angels or something??

Multiple Angels started hitting him, he stupidly pulled an un-loaded gun thinking
they would stop, the stabber knifed him over 30 times, and then the Angels wouldn't let anyone near him for 30 minutes to make sure he bled to death.
(Rolling Stone Writer's eye-witness account)

And that's justified to you??? if it is your sick

all they had to do was take him down, and with that many Angels they could have done it quite easily, the intent was to kill - which they did.. MLC

"Angels" are responsible for this murder cos I'm sure they could've avoided the stabbing...

but what about the Altamont organizers ?
what went through their minds to call these mad dogs to deal with the security ?

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sweetcharmedlife

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dewlover
He was doing something wrong, and illegal with a gun in his pocket as soon as he left the house that day...That was stupid enough, but to bring it to an event like this, well, beyond stupid...

Yes and the Angels did absolutey nothing illegal or stupid at all that day right?

Not the point (not mine, anyway)... all i am saying is that you can't pull a gun out and expect that all will be ok -- there are occasions when people pull guns out that they get killed. Angles probably didn't have to kill him but you can't predict the actions of every human.

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MCDDTLC
Leon - do you have friends in the Angels or something??

Multiple Angels started hitting him, he stupidly pulled an un-loaded gun thinking
they would stop, the stabber knifed him over 30 times,

first of all, you're completely making things up. There's no evidence multiple angels started hitting him (not saying that didn't happen but that's not on the film - so we just can't assume it happened, nor did that come up in court). Plus if memory serves, he was stabbed 5 or 6 times, not sure where you got 30 from. And stop with the 'unloaded gun' comment, that's completely irrelevant - there was no way for them to know that at the time.

Plenty of blame to go around - The Angels, Hunter, and the Stones themselves. Poor planning certainly didn't help - the bad drugs didn't either. Cold weather. Lot sof other stuff - you know the drill.

I've read somewhere that Hunter was a small time drug dealer and carried the gun becuase, as people above have stated, he was used to getting shit from being with a white girl - these were different times, out it in it's historical context. Apparently he had had a few run in with the angels earlier for being on/too near the stage and they had roughed him up so he was pretty pissed off with them and they with him. He then gets back in front of the stage, pulls a gun...the Angels have a split second to decide whether to leave it or not...they aren#t gonna leave it as they already dont like the guy and also they are 'employed' as security. The rest is history. Angels were stupid, Hunter was Stupid. There were more angels than hunter. He dies.

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stateofshock

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The Sicilian

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stateofshock
I just love all the racist excuses for a black man being killed...yeah I said it, you don't like it? fcku you, bigots.

Maybe you ought to take your racist rants somewhere else you jerk. The only bigot here is you @#$%&.

Eat a dick, biotch.

Hey enough of that man, cool down! It might be a good idea to tone down your rhetoric. How about stepping back and thinking logically about this.

When someone pulls a pistol out and they are amongst a band of very violent people typically, SOMEBODY'S getting severely injured or killed. I live in the most dangerous city in the United States (St. Louis, Missouri) and that fact is proven true all the time.

I think it was CrumblingDice that said he read something about Hunter getting messed with for being too close to the stage. I've never read that but for the sake of argument let's say it's true. I would have counted the number of Angels around, counted the bullets in my weapon making sure NOBODY saw it, quickly figured out I was outnumbered, taken off my Lime Green Jacket and moved away from the stage. With most of the people there being wasted, you can bet very few were thinking straight. A clouded mind can lead to very unfortunate outcomes.

A guy was killed and everyone was a fault bottom line.

CBII



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-03 01:21 by CBII.

great post. now you'd think oh, i don't know maybe the Stones (with all there money), would have a least done that much. a headstone.

geez. I come here because I thought you guys knew everything.

The Angles roughed up Hunter when he stepped on a speaker or something. One of them pushed or punched him. Thats when he pulled the gun. There is more video of Hunter at the concert but the Stones won't release it. He brought the gun because he was at the concert earlier and saw the Angels roughing people up. . She was a big Jagger fan and he wanted to take her to see the Stones.


Obviously he shouldn't have brought the gun, but had the Angels acted like human beings the gun never would have been an issue. After stabbing him they also stood on his head for a while and woulnd't let anyone near him to help him. I can't believe people are taking their side. Personally i wish he would have shot a couple of them ( the gun was loaded ) and got away. I wish Sonny Barger ended up with a hole in his throat many many years earlier. But hey I can't stand guys who think they are tough guys because they ride motorcycles and win fights when its 5 to 1 in their favor ALL THE TIME. But thats just me.

I also hate the Angels because they had Marty Balin on the ropes and didn't finish him off. Because of that we all had to endure his 80s music. They can all go to hell.





[www.timesonline.co.uk]



Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2011-04-03 04:39 by brianwalker.

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brianwalker
geez. I come here because I thought you guys knew everything.

The Angles roughed up Hunter when he stepped on a speaker or something. One of them pushed or punched him. Thats when he pulled the gun. There is more video of Hunter at the concert but the Stones won't release it. He brought the gun because he was at the concert earlier and saw the Angels roughing people up. . She was a big Jagger fan and he wanted to take her to see the Stones.


Obviously he shouldn't have brought the gun, but had the Angels acted like human beings the gun never would have been an issue. After stabbing him they also stood on his head for a while and woulnd't let anyone near him to help him. I can't believe people are taking their side. Personally i wish he would have shot a couple of them ( the gun was loaded ) and got away. I wish Sonny Barger ended up with a hole in his throat many many years earlier. But hey I can't stand guys who think they are tough guys because they ride motorcycles and win fights when its 5 to 1 in their favor ALL THE TIME. But thats just me.

I also hate the Angels because they had Marty Balin on the ropes and didn't finish him off. Because of that we all had to endure his 80s music. They can all go to hell.





[www.timesonline.co.uk]

I was with you up until the last line about Marty Balin. So much for crediblity.

remember on this site - whatever sweetcharmed...and Rockman say is gospel