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Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: stones77 ()
Date: August 1, 2010 19:09

Quote
Nikolai
Quote
stones77
first Stones record I heard in entirety was Goats Head Soup in 73, but it didn't really resonate then as I was only 13.. but now at 50 it still stands for some reason as a favorite Stones record of mine

next I heard Love You Live at 16 or thereabouts and it really did register and I love it, no matter how sloppy the playing or indecipherable Jagger's singing is..

in 77 I heard Some Girls next and at this point do not regard it as a favorite, and some songs I am completely bored of (Shattered for instance).

But Miss You is fabulous, and I never get tired of Respectable, Beast of Burden, When The Whip Comes Down and Before They Make Me Run

other songs to me are non-remarkable - Some Girls, Far Away Eyes, Lies, Just My Imagination

If you think of Far Away Eyes as country-comedy, then you'll be laughing in the wings. (Maybe) I prefer the longer, unedited take of Just My Imagination (released on a couple of studio session boots) which is closer to the 1978 tour version and way more interesting. It can't touch the original, but I do like the way they take the song into new territory. I think it was meant to echo/ape the irreverent readings the Sex Pistols were giving Substitute et al at the time. The trouble is, The Stones were way better musicians than the Pistols and don't quite get away with it.

Some Girls is another song you really can't take at face value, lyrically, Jagger seemingly boasting about his status as an international cocksman in one line and then moaning about the same woman taking him for everything they can take get (money, jewelery, clothes, a house in Zuma beach, and - in the case of black women - all his 'jam'). I do think it's the last album where Jagger actually thought about his lyrics before he wrote them. Apart from Lies, that is - which is pure filler, musically and lyrically. Go to hell/ you ... Jezebel. Please!

Really pleased to hear you like Miss You. It's one of my favourites. I think the 12" version is the definitive one. You get more of Jagger's forlorn rap - 'girls will come and go/they're just like streetcars' - for a start, and loads more bluesy harmonica. Jagger obviously has a thing about casting himself as the rejected lover-as-obsessive-stalker creep: Anybody Seen My Baby and Love Is Strong mine exactly the same territory, lyrically, although they're not as much fun. If only his friends had phoned him, offering him wine and an orgy with some Puerto Rican girls ....

I really like the Handsome Girls disc 1 version of Miss You from 78. It's about 9 minutes long or something and the back and forth between richards and wood, for me at least - this was an example of the pinnacle of those two guys playing off each other

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: shortfatfanny ()
Date: August 1, 2010 20:01

Quote
Bimmelzerbott
Terribly overrated. One of my least fav Stones albums, along with turds like Dirty Work and Undercover. Songs like Miss You, Lies, Shattered and Respectable belong to the worst crap that was ever written.

A very very bad album.

Will you ever mention something good or nice about them ?
You´re hard to please,aren´t you ?


Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Nikolai ()
Date: August 1, 2010 20:04

Quote
stones77
Quote
Nikolai
Quote
stones77
first Stones record I heard in entirety was Goats Head Soup in 73, but it didn't really resonate then as I was only 13.. but now at 50 it still stands for some reason as a favorite Stones record of mine

next I heard Love You Live at 16 or thereabouts and it really did register and I love it, no matter how sloppy the playing or indecipherable Jagger's singing is..

in 77 I heard Some Girls next and at this point do not regard it as a favorite, and some songs I am completely bored of (Shattered for instance).

But Miss You is fabulous, and I never get tired of Respectable, Beast of Burden, When The Whip Comes Down and Before They Make Me Run

other songs to me are non-remarkable - Some Girls, Far Away Eyes, Lies, Just My Imagination

If you think of Far Away Eyes as country-comedy, then you'll be laughing in the wings. (Maybe) I prefer the longer, unedited take of Just My Imagination (released on a couple of studio session boots) which is closer to the 1978 tour version and way more interesting. It can't touch the original, but I do like the way they take the song into new territory. I think it was meant to echo/ape the irreverent readings the Sex Pistols were giving Substitute et al at the time. The trouble is, The Stones were way better musicians than the Pistols and don't quite get away with it.

Some Girls is another song you really can't take at face value, lyrically, Jagger seemingly boasting about his status as an international cocksman in one line and then moaning about the same woman taking him for everything they can take get (money, jewelery, clothes, a house in Zuma beach, and - in the case of black women - all his 'jam'). I do think it's the last album where Jagger actually thought about his lyrics before he wrote them. Apart from Lies, that is - which is pure filler, musically and lyrically. Go to hell/ you ... Jezebel. Please!

Really pleased to hear you like Miss You. It's one of my favourites. I think the 12" version is the definitive one. You get more of Jagger's forlorn rap - 'girls will come and go/they're just like streetcars' - for a start, and loads more bluesy harmonica. Jagger obviously has a thing about casting himself as the rejected lover-as-obsessive-stalker creep: Anybody Seen My Baby and Love Is Strong mine exactly the same territory, lyrically, although they're not as much fun. If only his friends had phoned him, offering him wine and an orgy with some Puerto Rican girls ....

I really like the Handsome Girls disc 1 version of Miss You from 78. It's about 9 minutes long or something and the back and forth between richards and wood, for me at least - this was an example of the pinnacle of those two guys playing off each other


Sublime isn't it?

I hate the panto version they've been playing since 1989. Hideous. Ripping the guts out of the song and reducing it to a 'whooop-along-with-The-Stones' number while they get their stair lift to the B Stage.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: LeonidP ()
Date: August 2, 2010 08:20

Eggcellent, from beginning to end. The song: Some Girls has got to be in my top 5 all-time Stones tracks. The guitar licks on the harder/faster songs are, imo, amazing. And Charlie's drumming is superb thru-out.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Edward Twining ()
Date: August 2, 2010 09:42

Quote
kleermaker
I won't spoil all the fun here.

Just some questions to Doxa and Tele.

Doxa, you said: "Let's just say that it [Some Girls] is the BEGGARS BANQUET of the 70's - it saved their career and gave them a new life."

Could/Would you explain that and what "new life" do you exactly mean? And how long did it last? Any opinions on the title of this album?

Tele, you actually said: "SG is smart and fun at the same time". Really? Smart? Smart music?

I'm with you, Kleermaker, i can't warm to 'Some Girls' however many times i listen to it. There is no denying, however, that it's a very well presented album, certainly in terms of the actual sequencing, maybe in that regard it can be compared with Beggars Banquet, where all the pieces fit together perfectly. There is a remarkable freshness to it, but at the same time it does sound incredibly facile and lacking in any real depth. I really don't think it's aged that well in many ways, and the feeling i have is that it is Jagger trying very hard to emulate the attitude of punk. Certainly 'Some Girls' isn't the first time the Stones have been influenced by contemporary sounds, they have spent their career being so, but it is perhaps the first time they have been influenced by a youth culture generation much younger than themselves, who are in many ways out to make a fresh start, by blowing away all those 'tired' old musical dinousaurs. In that regard there are many punk like elements within Jagger's phrasing which sounds incredibly contrived, and songs like 'Lies' for example, sound so derivative from the punk attitude, it is almost laughable in terms of one being expected to be swallowed up with them coming from Jagger's mouth. That's not to say everything with Some Girls contains that punk vibe - i think the element of disco with 'Miss You' works well, in addition to 'Beast Of Burden', and 'Faraway Eyes' is a country novelty song, a while after the Stones had dispensed with that genre on a large scale. I believe in the late seventies the Stones has several optons, because in many ways punk was in danger of making them seem irrelevant. I give them credit in the fact that they rose to the challenge. As Doxa has indicated, Some Girls was the dawning of a new age for the Stones because punk inspired them to shake things up a little, when it appeared their relevance was fading fast. Stripping their sound down and becoming a little less heavy really saw them through to the 81-82 tour, and gave Ronnie a role in the band's sound, apart from just trying to emulate the members that have gone before him.

However, whether Some Girls really touches me is a very different matter, like many of their previous albums tend to do, in terms of stimulating the senses so to speak. Had it not been for the punk explosion, it is doubtful the Stones would ever have envisaged recording such an album. In those terms i'm doubtful Some Girls is really a truly genuine Stones album, at least with regard to it being the group's preferred style (maybe apart from what i read concerning Jagger's view). It's certainly of it's time, for sure, but whether it can transcend time like the big four, i seriously have my doubts.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-08-02 10:01 by Edward Twining.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Come On ()
Date: August 2, 2010 11:47

Couldn't find any track-ratings here so now:

1."Miss You" (Mick Jagger, Keith Richards) - 4:48//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
2."When the Whip Comes Down" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:20//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
3."Just My Imagination (Running Away With Me)" (Barrett Strong, Norman Whitfield) - 4:38//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
4."Some Girls" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:36//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
5."Lies" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:11//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
6."Far Away Eyes" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:24//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileythumbs up Top-number of this album
7."Respectable" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:06//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
8."Before They Make Me Run" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:25//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
9."Beast of Burden" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:25//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
10."Shattered" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:47//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley

1978 Bowie released 'Heroes' and Dylan 'Street Legal'..but it was all the Punk-bands that counted...

smoking smileycool smileysmiling smileycool smileysmoking smiley

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: liddas ()
Date: August 2, 2010 11:51

I first heard SG in the very early 80's. At the time I was really into the Taylor days, and was "slightly" turned off by the lack of that warm acoustic "bed" (piano and guitar) that somehow softend the sound of Fingers to IORR (and Bleed and Banquet before them), by the absence of solos, by those apparently simple structures, etc. etc. The Stones for me could only be the Stones of bursselles Affaire.

Almost 30 years later it is probably one of the albums I've played more and that more I love.

What truly hit hard were those first boots of the 78 tour. They made me see the light. It's as if suddenly I understood what the hell SG was all about. Then all the outtackes ...

What an album!

C

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Nikolai ()
Date: August 2, 2010 17:18

Quote
Come On
Couldn't find any track-ratings here so now:

1."Miss You" (Mick Jagger, Keith Richards) - 4:48//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
2."When the Whip Comes Down" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:20//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
3."Just My Imagination (Running Away With Me)" (Barrett Strong, Norman Whitfield) - 4:38//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
4."Some Girls" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:36//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
5."Lies" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:11//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
6."Far Away Eyes" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:24//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileythumbs up Top-number of this album
7."Respectable" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:06//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
8."Before They Make Me Run" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:25//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
9."Beast of Burden" (Jagger, Richards) - 4:25//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley
10."Shattered" (Jagger, Richards) - 3:47//smoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smileysmoking smiley

1978 Bowie released 'Heroes' and Dylan 'Street Legal'..but it was all the Punk-bands that counted...

smoking smileycool smileysmiling smileycool smileysmoking smiley


The late 70s were about more than punk, you're right - Lou Reed released Street Hassle and Take No Prisoners, Iggy Pop put out The Idiot and Lust For Life, the who made their last album with Keith Moon, and then there were all those great albums ...

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: loog droog ()
Date: August 2, 2010 17:49

Quote
Come On

1978 Bowie released 'Heroes'


"Heroes" was released in '77...

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: stones77 ()
Date: August 2, 2010 18:01

some girls is ok I guess; probably deemed 'important' since they've released nothing to top it since

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: August 2, 2010 18:21

kleermaker, give up already. I understand you don't like Some Girls. I have explained in several posts (quite well I think!) why I think it was career-saving album. Yes, I think it was smart. New York savvy, with some good (and humorous) social commentary. You have expressed the view that you don't think fun and music go together. That explains much about why you don't like the record. I can accept that, but you need to understand that you will not bring those of us who love Some Girls along to your perspective. Cheers.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: pmk251 ()
Date: August 2, 2010 18:38

I understand the appeal of SG. It is an imminently accessible record. And after the previous band releases anything that had some focus was welcome. But it is a record without secrets. You "get it" right away and when you tire of it you are done with it. It's musical fluff. It gave rise to two concert lowpoints for me: Miss You and Imagination. The latter song is as musically tedious as the band ever got while trying to be exciting. Still it was a fun record, for a while a guilty pleasure, but I am never in the mood to hear it again.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Nikolai ()
Date: August 2, 2010 18:48

You tell him Tele!grinning smiley

I always thought a sense of humour was a pre-requisite for being a Stones fan, from Emotional Rescue onwards.

Anyway, back to the track per track review ...

1). Miss You - the album's first highlight; a clever fusion of The Stones sound with then then vogueish four to the floor beat. A deserved hit. 5/5

2). When The Whip Comes Down - lyrically a Lou Reed pastiche, musically a fairly run of the mill Stones album track that wouldn't have been out of place on Black & Blue or IORR, only it was played a little faster. 3/5

3). Just My Imagination - this really shouldn't work, especially if you love the original, but it does. Unfortunately it fades out just as it's getting interesting. The unedited bootleg version is better. 3/5

4). Some Girls - a song which would probably STILL cause a furore if they played it live and didn't reverse the original racial stereotypes. More misogynistic than racist, but the biggest target is the singer himself. Brilliant. 4/5

5). Lies - tosh. 1/5

6). Faraway Eyes - was this Jagger belatedly taking the piss out of Gram Parsons? Probably not. Does he even like country music? Pastiche and irreverence was the order of the day here. Maybe it was an ode to Jerry Hall, a Texan? Either way it's hilarious and a great singalong. 4/5

7). Respectable - Jagger joins the punk ranks and mocks the Stones's status as establishment figures, but then he vents most of his ire on Bianca. Great. 4/5

8). Before They Make Me Run - On the surface, Keith in full on defiant mode, but the defiance has an undertow of regret to it. "Another goodbye to another good friend". 4/5

9). Beast of Burden - Keith's kiss-off to Anita (reputedly). One of The Stones greatest ballads. The album's second masterpiece. 5/5

10). Shattered - After what's come before, Shattered is something of an anti-climax. An anti-love song to the city which fired Jagger's muse, but not really a fitting send off for a great album. 3/5



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2010-08-02 18:49 by Nikolai.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: gimmelittledrink ()
Date: August 2, 2010 19:22

Bubble gum music. Not an authentic sounding song on the entire album. For me, it's the demarcation of when the Stones were great, and when they tried a little too hard to please others.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: 71Tele ()
Date: August 2, 2010 19:32

Quote
gimmelittledrink
Bubble gum music. Not an authentic sounding song on the entire album. For me, it's the demarcation of when the Stones were great, and when they tried a little too hard to please others.

You don't think "Beast of Burden" or "Before They Make Me Run" are "authentic sounding"?

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: August 2, 2010 19:45

Quote
pmk251
I understand the appeal of SG. It is an imminently accessible record. And after the previous band releases anything that had some focus was welcome. But it is a record without secrets. You "get it" right away and when you tire of it you are done with it. It's musical fluff. It gave rise to two concert lowpoints for me: Miss You and Imagination. The latter song is as musically tedious as the band ever got while trying to be exciting. Still it was a fun record, for a while a guilty pleasure, but I am never in the mood to hear it again.

Finally someone who can say in a nutshell where I have to use too many words. His comment is spot on.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: stones77 ()
Date: August 2, 2010 19:52

it was then and remains the bands biggest seller

it opened the band to a whole new, massive record buying demographic; I was one of those people..

I am sure the band must love the record for that reason alone


and I was one of those who then back-surfed and bought up their whole back catalogue .. in multiple formats.. vinyl, remastered vinyl, cd.. remastered cd.. etc etc etc

(still think vinyl sounds best)

anyway it was their last 'great' record..depending on how loosly you apply the term 'great'

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: gimmelittledrink ()
Date: August 2, 2010 19:53

No I don't. They could have been performed by any generic band. Those songs pushed the Stones in a another direction, from which they never recovered. Fake boy band stuff masquerading as the real thing, if you ask me. Everyone loved it because it made them 'relevant', but at what cost?

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: August 2, 2010 20:03

Tele, a serious (not ironically meant) question to you:
Do you understand anything of the comments of Edward, pmk251, gimmelittledrink and myself? Can you imagine that we don't consider this album as "the new Beggars Banquet", like Doxa does, but as "musical fluff" as pmk251 called it, or "bubble gum music" as gimmelittledrink qualified it?

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: liddas ()
Date: August 2, 2010 20:15

My Some Girls song by song review

Miss You. Absolute masterpiece (even if the album version is the "worse" - only because its the shortest). Live (78 and 81) it was one of the highest peaks in the stones career. One of the sexiest bass lines ever. Charlie's drumming (and above all, his work on the Hi-Hat) is just divine. The counterpoint between Ron and Keith's guitars is the definition of Groove. Jagger? One of his best vocals ever, and that killer rap ...

Whip. Another absolute masterpiece and live another of the highest peaks in the stones career (actually, I can never make up my mind if this is better than Miss You or the other way round). The first A / D chords banged by Keith is a deadly hook, but what comes next is just guitars as are played in heaven, with one of the greatest crescendo finale of any stones song.

Imagination. Guess what: absolute masterpiece! It makes the original a 100% stones song. In 78 / 81 this song was another stunning masterclass of rock and roll. It is not an easy song to play the way it's done on SG, because it has a very very delicate structure. The guitars are just perfect. And I particularly love Rons work under the "Every night I hope and pray" bit.

Some Girls. The title track is absolute masterpiece #4 of the album. Everything rotates around JAgger's fat open G strum. Ron's guitarwork in the instrumental breaks is just stunning. One of the best lyrics ever. And so true ...

Lies. No love for this, but make no mistake, it IS a masterpiece. The punkiest punk song the stones ever played. Particularly great is the weave of guitars of that that great intro riff.

Faraway eyes. Best "country" song by the stones, best pedal steel on a stones song, my fav Jagger lyrics ever (thank you jesus, thank you lord) one of the best FOff singing by the same too. In other words, a masterpiece.

Respectable. The album version is a masterpiece. So incredibly good that live the stones never were able to recreate that brillant mix of sexy laid back groove and punk aggressivenes. But that is another reason to love the studio version.

The songs listes so far can be defined the album "fillers".

Before they make me run is Keith's best rocker, so masterpiece is a reductive definition. The weave between guitar and vocals is incredible. Just follow the accents and the loseness of the strums. There is that Tarlè's pic of him sitting on the floor at Nellcote with a wasted grin and a tele in his arm that describes exactly this song.

Beast of Burden is a killer mix of sacre (keith's sublime guitarwork) and profane (jagger's coarse vocals). Live it always is the higlight of the show. One of the best songs ever written by any band.

Shattered. What is this? The stones in 78 came up with something totally original, new, exciting. Keith opens the games with a killer riff, Ron raises the level to heaven. In one word genius!

C

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: marchbaby ()
Date: August 2, 2010 21:02

Quote
liddas
My Some Girls song by song review

Miss You. Absolute masterpiece (even if the album version is the "worse" - only because its the shortest). Live (78 and 81) it was one of the highest peaks in the stones career. One of the sexiest bass lines ever. Charlie's drumming (and above all, his work on the Hi-Hat) is just divine. The counterpoint between Ron and Keith's guitars is the definition of Groove. Jagger? One of his best vocals ever, and that killer rap ...

Whip. Another absolute masterpiece and live another of the highest peaks in the stones career (actually, I can never make up my mind if this is better than Miss You or the other way round). The first A / D chords banged by Keith is a deadly hook, but what comes next is just guitars as are played in heaven, with one of the greatest crescendo finale of any stones song.

Imagination. Guess what: absolute masterpiece! It makes the original a 100% stones song. In 78 / 81 this song was another stunning masterclass of rock and roll. It is not an easy song to play the way it's done on SG, because it has a very very delicate structure. The guitars are just perfect. And I particularly love Rons work under the "Every night I hope and pray" bit.

Some Girls. The title track is absolute masterpiece #4 of the album. Everything rotates around JAgger's fat open G strum. Ron's guitarwork in the instrumental breaks is just stunning. One of the best lyrics ever. And so true ...

Lies. No love for this, but make no mistake, it IS a masterpiece. The punkiest punk song the stones ever played. Particularly great is the weave of guitars of that that great intro riff.

Faraway eyes. Best "country" song by the stones, best pedal steel on a stones song, my fav Jagger lyrics ever (thank you jesus, thank you lord) one of the best FOff singing by the same too. In other words, a masterpiece.

Respectable. The album version is a masterpiece. So incredibly good that live the stones never were able to recreate that brillant mix of sexy laid back groove and punk aggressivenes. But that is another reason to love the studio version.

The songs listes so far can be defined the album "fillers".

Before they make me run is Keith's best rocker, so masterpiece is a reductive definition. The weave between guitar and vocals is incredible. Just follow the accents and the loseness of the strums. There is that Tarlè's pic of him sitting on the floor at Nellcote with a wasted grin and a tele in his arm that describes exactly this song.

Beast of Burden is a killer mix of sacre (keith's sublime guitarwork) and profane (jagger's coarse vocals). Live it always is the higlight of the show. One of the best songs ever written by any band.

Shattered. What is this? The stones in 78 came up with something totally original, new, exciting. Keith opens the games with a killer riff, Ron raises the level to heaven. In one word genius!

C

the whole record is a masterpiece! it was a lightbulb that went on for me, and drew me to the stones in the first place.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: mickscarey ()
Date: August 2, 2010 21:41

Quote
Bimmelzerbott
Terribly overrated. One of my least fav Stones albums, along with turds like Dirty Work and Undercover. Songs like Miss You, Lies, Shattered and Respectable belong to the worst crap that was ever written.

A very very bad album.

EARS - for sale!

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: tussler ()
Date: August 2, 2010 22:09

The album who gave us Before you make me run and some girls...two songs among the greatest of all the Stones have released...in my opinion. And faraway eyes is a really funny song. In generell SG is a good album.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: August 2, 2010 22:30

Quote
kleermaker


Doxa, you said: "Let's just say that it [Some Girls] is the BEGGARS BANQUET of the 70's - it saved their career and gave them a new life."

Could/Would you explain that and what "new life" do you exactly mean? And how long did it last? Any opinions on the title of this album?

I think Tele and myself have given quite a lot of reasons for SOME GIRLS as a career-saving relaese (and I think we are just stating the obvious.), But I try to re-state few points.

Just think of the state of the band in 1977 (and the world around them)... They had released three albums in a row that had made the band quite irrelevant to recent scene. IORR and BAB probably did not gather much new listeners, and you surely didn't find anything on those albums that had the quality of their best days. The sleazy and sloppy LOVE YOU LIVE surely didn't hekp anything either... It's best part - the El Mocambo side - was basically the band justy going on to their roots, which as pointed out by some clever reviewer at the time, sounded like the band having a funeral. Shit, you will not impress anyone by playing "Mannish Boy" - it was no 1963 any more. That's musically as irrelevant as it can be. As tragical as Keith's Toronto bust was (and especially looks nowadays), at the time the musical world, especially new young generations, didn't really care if one rich junkie rock star is facing the jail or not - musically no any big loss. I think Philip Norman put that accurately in his Stones book - in 1977 the world didn't really care any longer whatever will happen to them. The Clash 1977 song hit the nerve of the times: "No Stones in 1977". The point of the claim was: the Stones were totally irrelevant.

Taken that context one cannot under-estimate the importance of SOME GIRLS and the hit song "Miss You". With those releases they left the decadent, dark but tiresome music that once was hottest music around but had lead them to total periphery and irelevance. With SOME GIRLS the Stones - like ten years earlier - showed that they still can re-invent their game, and come up with something totally different and fresh. And win. That is true artistic power, and I think that's the feature that sets the Stones to the class of their own as a rock band. In 1978 they found a new essence to their sound. They won a new audience, and a new generation of Stones fans. For that reason I think Jagger - if anyone - knows the importance of SOME GIRLS. Impressed Mick commented along the 1978 tour that the audiences are younger than ever - over-statement of course, but is shows how impressed they were of the appeal of SOME GIRLS. The Stones were "hip" again, and millions of young people all over the world were moving their asses according to "Miss You" in their local discos. Even the critical punk generation thought that yeah, maybe that particular band ain't that horrible dinosaur after all...

The "new life" accomplished in those following years: A mediocre EMOTIONAL RESCUE was to live by the wave of SOME GIRLS, but TATTOO YOU re-established the "new life". 1981/82 tour was a total triumph, and especially it offered a new hero to rock scene: Keith Richards. Keith came as a true winner out of the junky, decadent seventies, and as a survivor was the coolest guy and rock musician ever. Even young Doxa had a t-shirt that says "Keith Richards Lives". That was a statement.

I think the triumphal 1981/82 tour, and the status of the Stones as the biggest rock band ever, the recognition of the importance of Keith Richards, cemented at the time, was only possible through the "miracle" of SOME GIRLS. Had they continued with their mid-70's ways - trying to perfect the dark landscapes they had perfected in their golden era - the band would have died out (and nobody wouldn't have really mind), and their legend would not have been so confirmed as it is now. I think winning a new, big audience in 1978-82 with a new sound was a sign of true greatness. At least to my eyes the story of the Stones would not have been complete and as impressive as it is if they didn't have once again shown that they can re-invent themselves and that they "still can do it". They really needed that one more effective run. The fact that the dark, dangerous, bluesy sounds of their late-60's- mid-70's days was replaced by a different attitude - that of the ironical, joyful, careless "punky" sound - makes them more impressive as artists. That is almost Bob Dylan-like ability to transformation (and sounds like artistic rocket science to their "recent" Vegas-era routines.).

I would carry the argument further by saying something of the Vegas-era and how SOME GIRLS also made that possible, but I don't think that is needed. (As I have said many times, The Stones could have called the quits after 1981/82 tour and left the building as winners, but that's another issue.). I love the "Some Girls-Era", or "Pathe Marconi-Era", or "Neo-Stones Era" or howewer it is called for its unique character and sound. No way the 1978-82 era - here you have the period of "new life"!- was as impressive as 1968-72 era (and its die-out period to 1977) era but it doesn't matter; it added something substantial and essential to their musical vocabulary.

By 1989 when they "came back", the era I talk about was as historical as anything they had done by then. The difference in their live sound between 1982 and 1989 was almost as distant as it was between 1966 and 1969, and I dont think the generic safe and sure STEEL WHEELS having any particular resemblance to SOME GIRLS. Both live and studio The Stones had lost the groovy, wild, joyful nature they had then.

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2010-08-02 22:49 by Doxa.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: StonesTod ()
Date: August 2, 2010 22:38

sinatra was the coolest guy ever

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Doxa ()
Date: August 2, 2010 23:00

Quote
StonesTod
sinatra was the coolest guy ever

The coolest thing I know about Sinatra comes from Beavis and Butthead; they were watching some Sinatra's latest performances, and the other said "Look, that's dude's old", and the other replied "yeah, he must be one of those Rolling Stones"...

- Doxa

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: Edward Twining ()
Date: August 2, 2010 23:23

Doxa, i believe though that Some Girls was pretty much a one off, it really didn't set the ball rolling like Beggars Banquet - Let It Bleed - Sticky Fingers - Exile On Main Street. The follow up Emotional Rescue like you say was mediocre, and Tattoo You was primarily a collection of 70s outtakes, a number of which were originally recorded well before Some Girls, and could still have been released had Some Girls been recorded or not. After that it was pretty much all down hill. I think the Stones were pretty much already trading on their vast history by the turn of the 80s, irrespective of Some Girls. Post Tattoo You (arguably the last good Stones album) the Stones have been living off their past, now close to 30 years. I think punks power to change the musical landscape was tremendously overestimated, and pretty naive in retrospect - i think there was also a lot of hype involved, not unlike today. Punk was pretty much dying itself by 79, anyway, along with disco. The Stones, like The Beatles, Who and The Kinks are indelibly linked to rocks golden age, the sixties, which is viewed as arguably the most creative and important time in popular music's history - and the Stones were right in the centre of it. That's pretty much why they can go on as long as they're physically able and they'll still get the numbers of fans who are prepared to see them. It all about nostalgia, and it was thirty years ago too.



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2010-08-02 23:31 by Edward Twining.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: August 2, 2010 23:30

Doxa, you certainly can write, but it seems to me that you don't understand anything I've said so far at all. We're talking from totally different points of view. You're constantly mentioning terms like "career-saving relaese", "made the band quite irrelevant to recent scene", "did not gather much new listeners", "the Stones were totally irrelevant", "They won a new audience, and a new generation of Stones fans", "The Stones were "hip" again", "millions of young people all over the world were moving their asses according to "Miss You" in their local discos, Even the critical punk generation thought that yeah, maybe that particular band ain't that horrible dinosaur after all..", "Even young Doxa had a t-shirt that says "Keith Richards Lives" [Old Doxa calls him 'Keef' nowadays]", "the recognition of the importance of Keith Richards, cemented at the time, was only possible through the "miracle" of SOME GIRLS", etc. etc.

My answer to this all is: SO WHAT? Those 'facts' are absolutely irrelevant from a musical point of view, and that's what we're talking about! Besides, you overestimate the influence of SG on the meaning of the Rolling Stones in music history to an enormous degree. As if SG not only 'saved' the RS as a commercial band, by attracting the masses to the big stadiums, but also safeguarded their historic legacy from former eras. That's absolutely not true.

You also say: "I would carry the argument further by saying something of the Vegas-era and how SOME GIRLS also made that possible, but I don't think that is needed." Yes, Doxa, that is needed, because it's the heart of my argument, and you walk along it as if it doesn't matter at all. I said: with SG the Stones chose the wrong way that would end up in nothing (Vegas-era). You actually confirm that, perhaps even without knowing it.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: wee bobby lennox ()
Date: August 2, 2010 23:35

some girls is a good album, its not great and the production makes the songs sound a bit weaker than they could be.

the live version of shattered on still life is great, the studio version not quite as good.

some girls live version on shine a light is good, not so the studio version.

miss you is ok, but nothing special.

before they make me run is ok.

respectable is a very good song.

beast of burden is average at best.

lies is poor

when the whip comes down and just my imagination are ok, better live versions out there.

far away eyes is impressive.

Re: some Girls...Album and track review
Posted by: stones77 ()
Date: August 2, 2010 23:56

I think Tele and myself have given quite a lot of reasons for SOME GIRLS as a career-saving relaese

..career saving? I don't think so..



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2010-08-03 00:02 by stones77.

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