Hi folks


Just seen this:

[www.clashmusic.com]


And it got me thinking... is 'Aftermath' the first great Stones 'album'? How do we separate between R&B Stones and original material...?

Lots of fans of the early years on here surely!

Yes, of course it is the first really great Stones album mainly because Mick and Keith wrote all the material themselves and it really reflected their lifestyles rather than presenting a copy of the r'n'b groups from America. The quality of the songs was first class - albeit dark and misoginistic - and they also had the confidence to try out new instruments and tempos.

Yes, I think so. The first album is great fun --enjoyable and spirited blues and rock 'n roll, and they showed a great feel for this music at a very young age. But, as stated above, Aftermath was original and mature and, well, great...

Yes.

Whilst I do like Aftermath, I don’t think it is as strong a record as many here would have you believe: it’s a milestone record – not, a great one. Yes, it is the first LP to feature all Jagger/Richards compositions, but too many of them are, well, only so-so: What To Do, High And Dry, etc, are nice enough ditties, but hardly up to the level they would go on to achieve a couple of years later.

I prefer the first 3 UK release, personally.

the first great Stones album was the debut album. the talent! the hormones! the energy!
no wonder they're still going strong

ahem, i mean: one thing that often gets overlooked about the R&B cover days ...
where did those kids get their brilliant ear for music of lasting value?
i mean: we had the Stones holding those numbers up to the light for us so we could hear them shine -
but the Stones just knew. thanks & praises, and hail hail Rolling Stones :E

i agree with with sssoul - i don't care who writes the songs - there are plenty of great albums by many great artists that are entirely covers. there's greatness in all those albums leading up to Aftermath.

They all great but this was the first Greatest

__________________________

I'm with sssoul: the RnB days are overlooked, somewhat. Their debut release is a sublime slab of Rnb, Rock 'n Roll and blues. I'd take Route 66, Walking The Dog, Honest I Do, et al, over most of Aftermath.

True, they demonstrated great taste and foresight for such youngsters. I don't think Andrew gets enough credit for keeping them on track though.

I think there's a lot more to the covers than meets the eye..

Where some groups just did straight re-treads the Stones had their own voice. Plus when you look at the credits none (well a few) of the original artists wrote their own songs either:

I Just Wanna Make Love To You - Willie Dixon

Not Etta James or Muddy Waters, come to think of it.

Well I think their first album IS their first great album, I see what you're getting at. Kind of like Beatles were known for having great albums, but Rubber Soul was their first recognized classic. Same for Aftermath I suppose. I personally think it is a classic, and that Between the Buttons is damn near classic. Thing is, they seem to get lost in the shuffle more often. There's so much reverence for later records like Exile that I think non-hardcore fans (and even some hardcore fans) forget about those middle period records once in a while. I'll tell you what really got me interested in Aftermath was Doors drummer John Densmore's book "Riders on the Storm". He really raves about Aftermath in there and how when it came out all the other Doors pretty much thought it was the best rock and roll record to be released so far.

I think I will listen to it on my way to work this afternoon!

EVERYTHING up through & including GHS is great.

Quote
ClashMusic
Hi folks


Just seen this:

[www.clashmusic.com]


And it got me thinking... is 'Aftermath' the first great Stones 'album'?

The Stones first album is a classic. The second one is even better.

for me "Aftermath" was their masterpiece" and still is

under the boardwalk---down by the sea

with sssoul and others -- your points about the first album are well-stated, and I do not disagree. Obviously, I mentioned the first album as a possible alternative. Still, I'll hang with my original answer. I appreciate the thoughtful discussion, though, without any insults. It's nice when we're all civilized...

yes it is, though Out of our heads could be if you count not just original stuff

In hindsight, Aftermath is a landmark album and there are some great songs on it, but I think their songwriting was already well on its way to maturity by the time of Out Of Our Heads - I've been listening to the US version a lot recently and the Jagger/Richards songbook on there has among others Satisfaction, Play With Fire and The Spider and the Fly - three of the best.

But in the 1960s as far as I and many others were concerned, the Stones versions of the songs on their early albums WERE the originals - the first version by anybody that we had heard - and their first great album was the first one. Whether the song was written by the Stones or not, there was a spirit in their performance that sounded like nothing else around, and it was there from the very beginning.

Of course the US version had Paint It, Black on it so that makes almost any album a classic right there. Add Under My Thumb, Flight 505, Lady Jane, Stupid Girl and it's great. Jagger's vocals are amazing especially since you can almost isolate them in one speaker. I can just listen to him sing Think and High & Dry all by himself it's that good. I've always preferred the UK version though it does have 2-3 iffy tracks. In the end, it all comes down to whether you like 11 minutes of Goin' Home or not....I do....most of the time...

Quote
with sssoul
the first great Stones album was the debut album. the talent! the hormones! the energy!
no wonder they're still going strong

ahem, i mean: one thing that often gets overlooked about the R&B cover days ...
where did those kids get their brilliant ear for music of lasting value?
i mean: we had the Stones holding those numbers up to the light for us so we could hear them shine -
but the Stones just knew. thanks & praises, and hail hail Rolling Stones :E

I 100% agree. I think the 'originality' is not solely a question of composing own tunes. It was goddamn original for a potential pop band to make in 1964 an album based on pure r&b songs, and The Stones, intentionally or not, had an unique touch to the songs. For example, the way they transformed Muddy's "I Just Wanna Make Love to You" from a slow blues into fast rock number is one of those moments when true inspiration visited the band. Their version of "Mona" is almost magical, the energy level of "Carol" is maybe the biggest ever by any English band. One can hear that the band is investing there all they knew by then. The whole Richmond is there. Even "Tell Me" represents such a strong character. As far as maturity goes I think the next time they really beat the maturity of their first album is BEGGARS BANQUET.

Even though AFTERMATH is a great and important album - and I think their most naturally innovative ever - I think it hasn't pass the test of time as well as their debut album. Especially the b-side (vinyl, UK, sic) is quite faceless collection of mediocre songs. One can sense there a forcement to originals even though the boys've been running out of good ideas. There are songs that two years before would have given away to other artists to record, and in the following years, after BEGGARS BANQUET, would not have seen a day. Think of "What To Do", "Take It or Leave It"... Not exactly Lennon-McCartney or Dylan quality yet. Brian Jones, and the relaxed, earthy atmosphere saves many songs here.

But, of course, "Mother's Little Helper", "Lady Jane", "Under My Thumb", "Goin' Home" provides a strong argument that Jagger-Richard is here to stay.

- Doxa



Edited 3 time(s). Last edit at 2009-11-18 21:34 by Doxa.

The U.S. album The Rolling Stones, Now! is a blues-soaked masterpiece that anticipates Exile.

aftermath is the first album where mick and keith wrote all the songs but it has brian jones fingerprints all over it . is there any instrument the man could not play?

Their first album was their first great album.

Personally, the US edition of Out Of Our Heads is their first excellent album. Aftermath, regardless of US or UK, is second.

Quote
ghostryder13
aftermath is the first album where mick and keith wrote all the songs but it has brian jones fingerprints all over it . is there any instrument the man could not play?

Bagpipes?

Surely this is a thread in itself... ;-)

For sure - UK version has it all over US version!

The US version? No. The UK version? More likely.
Mind you, this was 7 years before I was born. My first 'new' Stones LP I was aware of was Some Girls, so their glory years were already behind for me.

For my tastes, the album of their's that achieves what I call 'greatness' chronologically is (surprise) Beggar's Banquet, followed by their first masterpiece a year later.

Aftermath gave us Under My Thumb, Jady Jane, I Am Waiting and Out of Time, yes - all GREAT classic songs. It is padded with forgettable 3-chord stuff like Doncha Bother Me, High and Dry and It's Not Easy. It also has Mother's Little Helper, What to Do and Stupid Girl, three songs I really don't care for at all (especially Mother's Little Helper).

[thepowergoats.com]

James - I love 5 of the 6 songs that you mention. I can do without What To Do but Mother's Little Helper is a GREAT song! One of their best songs in my opinion! I would classify Afttermath as their first great album. Goin' Home very innovative at the time. We who were not around when these came out have to remember that everything that was coming out was fresh, new and ground breaking and have to look at it in the context tof when it was released. If I had heard Revolver, Aftermath and Pet Sounds when they came out they all would have blown me away. They did blow me away as I went back through all of this music as I was growing up in the seventies and they still blow me away!

Love Aftermath!

I find it really hard to judge Aftermath. It's a good album, but I just can't be convinced that it's a classic album. The only songs I really dig on this album are; Paint it Black, Under My Thumb.

No doubt this album moved the band a lot further. But I just can't listen through the whole album. I just can't...