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Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: ghostryder13 ()
Date: May 31, 2010 16:19

ok i'm not a gifted in explaining things or have great knowlege on musical terms but here goes.i'm not saying the stones suck in concert but it seems like over the past 20 yrs the stones try to make their live set. sound simular to the original studio versions. this is ok if the studio version doesn't have alot of added overdubs or session musicians . but for the most part it seems some songs lose their power when they do it. an example is sympathy for the devil. the studio version is awesome of course but i also love the way the stones performed it during the 69 tour up until 1975-76. i also miss the fact that the live versions would have loud guitar sound and the music was faster than studio versions. what caused this change, age? loss of agression? perfectionism?

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: LeedsLungs71 ()
Date: May 31, 2010 16:28

Quote
ghostryder13
ok i'm not a gifted in explaining things or have great knowlege on musical terms but here goes.i'm not saying the stones suck in concert but it seems like over the past 20 yrs the stones try to make their live set. sound simular to the original studio versions. this is ok if the studio version doesn't have alot of added overdubs or session musicians . but for the most part it seems some songs lose their power when they do it. an example is sympathy for the devil. the studio version is awesome of course but i also love the way the stones performed it during the 69 tour up until 1975-76. i also miss the fact that the live versions would have loud guitar sound and the music was faster than studio versions. what caused this change, age? loss of agression? perfectionism?

Jagger taking over. He likes these big tours of stadiums to be a "jukebox" of the Stones oldies. They don't really play like a band like they did on the 69, 72, 78 tours. Just a big production. I do think Stripped captured some guys trying to play like a band.....that's a gem. But those stadium tour renditions of their greatest hits are not very inspiring.

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: Amused ()
Date: May 31, 2010 17:15

yeah, it was explained in Bill Germans book: since 1989 they "recreate" the songs the way they were on the albums.
it was an experiment and it failed: they need too many side musicians now.
they can't go "back to the roots" like they did in 1978.

this is basically why my favorite version of SftD is from Ya-Ya's. not because it's better than the really challenging version from Beggars Banquet - it's because it's different. it's because they took the risk!

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: kleermaker ()
Date: May 31, 2010 20:45

Quote
LeedsLungs71

Jagger taking over. He likes these big tours of stadiums to be a "jukebox" of the Stones oldies. They don't really play like a band like they did on the 69, 72, 78 tours. Just a big production. I do think Stripped captured some guys trying to play like a band.....that's a gem. But those stadium tour renditions of their greatest hits are not very inspiring.

LeedsLungs71, wasn't there a tour in 1970? And in 1973? Not to speak about 1971, which is in your own moniker? Those tours belong to the very best of the Stones tours imho.

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: ghostryder13 ()
Date: May 31, 2010 21:20

i also think the 81-82 tours have great guitar work as well

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: Marhsall ()
Date: June 1, 2010 08:58

Leeds is a very diff kind of boot i.m.h.o. it's very relaxed and laid back

"Well my heavy throbbers itchin' just to lay a solid rhythm down"

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: JumpingKentFlash ()
Date: June 1, 2010 10:04

But still. Many versions of songs, even warhorses, sound different to the album cut. Rough Justice didn't sound like the album version. Same with j j flash, IORR and many others.

JumpingKentFlash

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: jamesfdouglas ()
Date: June 1, 2010 10:10

There's stuff I've read here, quotes from jagger himself taking about the arrangements. Search for a thread about 'vegas era' stones. Mick explains why they decided to start trying to match the studio versions more closely. It started with the Steel Wheels tour.

[thepowergoats.com]

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: bluesinc. ()
Date: June 1, 2010 17:08

you cannot ruin JJF, the best R&R Riff ever, thanks Bill

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: Big Al ()
Date: June 1, 2010 17:12

Quote
kleermaker
Quote
LeedsLungs71

Jagger taking over. He likes these big tours of stadiums to be a "jukebox" of the Stones oldies. They don't really play like a band like they did on the 69, 72, 78 tours. Just a big production. I do think Stripped captured some guys trying to play like a band.....that's a gem. But those stadium tour renditions of their greatest hits are not very inspiring.

LeedsLungs71, wasn't there a tour in 1970? And in 1973? Not to speak about 1971, which is in your own moniker? Those tours belong to the very best of the Stones tours imho.

Well, that's a bit U.S. centric, I must admit. Is our IORR community becoming like Shidoobie Land??

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: LeedsLungs71 ()
Date: June 1, 2010 19:17

Quote
Big Al
Quote
kleermaker
Quote
LeedsLungs71

Jagger taking over. He likes these big tours of stadiums to be a "jukebox" of the Stones oldies. They don't really play like a band like they did on the 69, 72, 78 tours. Just a big production. I do think Stripped captured some guys trying to play like a band.....that's a gem. But those stadium tour renditions of their greatest hits are not very inspiring.

LeedsLungs71, wasn't there a tour in 1970? And in 1973? Not to speak about 1971, which is in your own moniker? Those tours belong to the very best of the Stones tours imho.

I lump them together....yes, i live in the U.S. LOL

Well, that's a bit U.S. centric, I must admit. Is our IORR community becoming like Shidoobie Land??

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: skipstone ()
Date: June 4, 2010 23:24

Quote
bluesinc.
you cannot ruin JJF, the best R&R Riff ever, thanks Bill

Have you heard how the Stones have played it from 1972 on? They ruined it.

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: windmelody ()
Date: June 4, 2010 23:29

JJF was wonderful from 89-99, and Rio 06 rolled as well.

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: theimposter ()
Date: June 4, 2010 23:43

JKFlash said it well when he pointed out that they do perform songs differently from the album/single renditions on some songs.

But to address the topic of the thread, I don't think it's a failure on the band's part AT ALL to try and more specifically recreate songs as they were recorded. Wasn't the sound and arrangement of those studio recordings what made most of us fall in love with the band's music in the first place? Going back to the thread I started previously about them not necessarily being at their live peak in the so-called Golden Days, consider live versions of "You Can't Always Get..", "Sympathy for the Devil" (Ya-Yas version excluded), or "Let's Spend the Night Together" (the 1981 version still gives me a headache) - would you say those versions were enhanced by not staying closer to the original arrangements? Those songs - and others- were a mess from 72 - 82 for the most part, and they gave me and probably other fans little of the thrill that those studio versions offered. Hearing YCAGWYW live for the first time in 1997 and having it sound more like the version from Let It Bleed brought me back so much to the reason why I love the song. No barking from Mick, no long sax solo, and in place of Keith's admittedly lovable but scruffy backing vox we had those soulful gospel-style singer back again.

So again, there's no definitive answer in my mind. Sometimes it's better to take a chance and stray away, other times it's better to stick with the original formula. The Stones history as a touring band proves both.

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: Justin ()
Date: June 5, 2010 00:05

Quote
JumpingKentFlash
But still. Many versions of songs, even warhorses, sound different to the album cut. Rough Justice didn't sound like the album version. Same with j j flash, IORR and many others.

Well except for "Rough Justice" all those other songs--they've played completely differently than the studio versions.

JJF- Keith eliminates the first part of the intro and goes straight to the main riff. Plus, the "main riff" isn't even played like the studio version. With Keith in open G and he hits that Ba-da-DAH--it's like an accented C# more than an "A" which is what they did in the studio. He's always played it that way.

IORR - pretty radical change. The studio version was in E...with acoustic guitars and only went into the "Chuck Berry" feel during the outro. When played live, it's in the key of B and is now COMPLETELY a Chuck Berry song...from the opening intro to the end.


Rough Justice--is played pretty much the same but it sounds very empty live. There's a huge tightness on the studio cut that is missing when done on stage.

Re: Trying to make live versions sound like the Studio version
Posted by: Slick ()
Date: June 5, 2010 06:06

calculated decision made by mick to maximize profit. in that respect, it was a highly successful move, as it opened the door for many middle-of-the-road stones 'fans' who couldnt and wouldnt support the authentic, hard-rocking style of previous tours. the hardcore fans would not be pleased at all, but mick knew they would still go to the shows.



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