Jason Isbell, formerly of The Drive By Truckers, nominates his favourite songs recorded at Muscle Shoals in today's Guardian:

The Rolling Stones - Wild Horses This is my favourite Stones song: it's so loose and ragged yet so melodic. It was recorded in December 1969, and engineered by one of the Muscle Shoals players, Jimmy Johnson - although when it appeared on Sticky Fingers, Jimmy Miller was credited as producer - and he gave it a real hi-fi feel. One of my favourite guitarists, Wayne Perkins, played on this, and when Mick Taylor left he almost became a Stone. But he wasn't British, so Ronnie Wood ended up getting the job.

[www.guardian.co.uk]

I think he's got his facts wrong regarding Wayne Perkins playing on Wild Horses!


"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"

< One of my favourite guitarists, Wayne Perkins, played on this, and when Mick Taylor left he almost became a Stone. But he wasn't British, so Ronnie Wood ended up getting the job.>

Bobby Keys is an American too,and you might call him sixth Stone.
So what went wrong?

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Amsterdamned


Bobby Keys is an American too,and you might call him sixth Stone.
So what went wrong?

Ian Stewart was the sixth Stone.

I think that any actual member of the Stones would tell us that, though Bobby Keys has been around close to forever and holds a legendary place within the hearts and souls of the band and it's fans, he's still just a hired musician.

An interesting question would be to ask why Mick Taylor's replacement had to be English yet it was OK to replace Bill Wyman with an American. What changed in the thinking of the band in the time between Taylor's departure and Wyman's?

Darryl Jones is not an official Rolling Stone, there's only four Stones after Bill left.

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mr_dja

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Amsterdamned


Bobby Keys is an American too,and you might call him sixth Stone.
So what went wrong?

Ian Stewart was the sixth Stone.

I think that any actual member of the Stones would tell us that, though Bobby Keys has been around close to forever and holds a legendary place within the hearts and souls of the band and it's fans, he's still just a hired musician.

An interesting question would be to ask why Mick Taylor's replacement had to be English yet it was OK to replace Bill Wyman with an American. What changed in the thinking of the band in the time between Taylor's departure and Wyman's?

Yes,I know Stew was the sixth Stone..
I was thinking in terms of musical ability

Stu was the 2nd stone actually, Brian the 1st.

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His Majesty
Stu was the 2nd stone actually, Brian the 1st.

Great point Majesty. After Brian 'left' that would have made Stu the highest ranking of the remaining members? No wonder they were so worried after he passed away about who would keep them in line. The argument can obviously go both ways as to how it's turned out.

It's still an interseting concept, the English vs. American thing. Replacing Brian & Mick T they seemed to deem it necessary to have English guitar players.

However, on Keybords and Bass, it's been OK to have those slots go to Americans (actually starting as early as Billy Preston). Maybe because, even though the bass is a "core band position", when the replacement of Bill was made they weren't worried about having a new "band member", they just needed someone who could fill the musical space between Charlie and Keith in an acceptable manner. Even though legally Ronnie was an employee for decades, I'd have to think that the others, at least Charlie, Bill & Keith thought of him as the fifth band member for all of those years. Chuck & Darryl? Sorry, not Stones, just Stones employees - even though they've both been around for longer than Brian and Mick T combined.

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< One of my favourite guitarists, Wayne Perkins, played on this, and when Mick Taylor left he almost became a Stone. But he wasn't British, so Ronnie Wood ended up getting the job.>

Ehhhhh? Wayne Perkins played on Wild Horses? That's news to me!

Sure it's a great song & all that, but shouldn't it be Mussel Shoals instead of Muscle Shoals?

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Natlanta
Sure it's a great song & all that, but shouldn't it be Mussel Shoals instead of Muscle Shoals?

Nope!:
[maps.google.co.uk]


"As we say in England, it can get a bit trainspottery"

No I meant when they originally named it, they got it wrong. Shoals are mussel-laden, not muscle. No?

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Natlanta
No I meant when they originally named it, they got it wrong. Shoals are mussel-laden, not muscle. No?

Take this for what it's worth (source is Wikipedia) - Native Indians first inhabited the lands bordered by the Tennessee River. There is no record of when the name Muscle Shoals was first used for the area. However, there are several theories as to where the name originated. One theory is that at one time there were piles of mussel shells found along the shoals of the Tennessee River. Another theory is that the shape of the river looks like the muscle in a man’s arm, hence the name 'Muscle' Shoals. The last theory comes from several booklets that were published before Muscle Shoals incorporated. This theory states: “Muscle Shoals, the Niagara of the South, derives its name from the Indians, who, attempting to navigate upstream, found the task almost impossible because of the strong current.” Thus, also, came the word muscle, symbolic of the strength required to “paddle a canoe up the rapids.”

Not only was Wayne Perkins not there - who knows, that could have been taken out of context - neither was Jimmy Miller. Although obviously Wild Horses was not finished in Alabama so it makes sense he was still credited as producer.

I;m still wondering how John Isbell got the idea that Wayne played on Wild Horses...

Easy, he thought he had heard that somewhere & not being a Stones-ologist...he got it wrong.

Easy? I suppose that is relative. To me it's mind boggling that any schooled musician could hear the guitars on Wild Horses and think it was Wayne Perkins playing, especially the electric. I mean, the elements in style are as distinctive as a voice and I do not hear Wayne Perkins "voice" anywhere on that track...

here's part 2 of an interview with jim dickinson who played piano on WH

jim dickinson interview part 2

and part 1 if you're interested in learning more

jim dickinson interview part 1

"One of my favourite guitarists, Wayne Perkins, played on this"


Honest mistake...he should be forgiven. (But as sdstonesguy said, definitely NOT a Stones-ologist)!!!

But this reminds me...what about the rumour of Eric Clapton playing the lead on Sympathy? Many people think it EC.
While I personally don't believe it, there is some validity to it. It's a shredding mutha thats for sure.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-06-20 11:44 by Hairball.

As Wild Horses was basically recorded live in Muscle Shoals Dickinson can hardly be called the producer. All the overdubs were done in London under the direction of Miller, so he is rightfully named the producer.

I never heard of Wayne Perkins playing on WH but there could be a mix up: there's a great version of Wild Horses with pedal steel guitar by Sneaky Pete Kleinow (I actually prefer this version of the released one), but when this version came out through Jimmy Miller it was stated that Al Perkins was the pedal steel guitar player.

Mathijs

Wasnt "Sneaky Pete" affiliated with Gram Parsons via The Burrito Bros?

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Mathijs
As Wild Horses was basically recorded live in Muscle Shoals Dickinson can hardly be called the producer. All the overdubs were done in London under the direction of Miller, so he is rightfully named the producer.

I never heard of Wayne Perkins playing on WH but there could be a mix up: there's a great version of Wild Horses with pedal steel guitar by Sneaky Pete Kleinow (I actually prefer this version of the released one), but when this version came out through Jimmy Miller it was stated that Al Perkins was the pedal steel guitar player.

Mathijs

Does anyone have a clean, good sounding copy of this version with Sneaky Pete? all the one's I've heard sound terrible...

A perfect example of what could have gone on the re-issues a great version out of the Gimme Shelter movie could have gone on Sticky Fingers - but oh darn they would have to pay Klein again. Get over it! They have 100's of millions like it would hurt them!

...nice interview in that it also brings up one of America's most under rated blues/soul singers Bettye LaVette........check her out and especially her 2007 album, The Scene of the Crime, recorded at FAME Studios in Muscle Shoals, Alabama with alt-rockers Drive-By Truckers.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2009-06-21 23:16 by Rip This.

He did not only get Wayne Perkins wrong, but also Jimmy Johnson. It was Jim Dickinson; in house engineer and pianist who assisted them.

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Palace Revolution 2000
He did not only get Wayne Perkins wrong, but also Jimmy Johnson. It was Jim Dickinson; in house engineer and pianist who assisted them.

No, Jimmy Johnson engineered the session, with Jim Dickinson "producing" it, and playing piano on Wild Horses.

[www.jimmyjohnsonmusic.com]

Mathijs

The acoustic guitar that comes in during the intro is such a great addition. I love the 69-72, maybe even 75, 76 school of recording. Glyn and Andy Johns, Jimmy Miller, Bill Levenson, Denny Cordell, and Tom Dowd. Good mikes, well placed mikes and amps, the basic track, a Leslie, lots of percussion, Grand piano,...
I would however not count Jon Landau in this distinguished group.

Wayne Perkins played on some Muscle Shoals stuff - on some Skynryd stuff for example - but not on Wild Horses

[www.cityofmuscleshoals.com]

Legend has it that Mick Jagger wrote ‘Wild Horses’ in the building’s bathroom.