Tell Me :
Talk
I thought even Keith said that Mick wrote it all on his own.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 02:54 by Silver Dagger.
yeah, I think he does say that in Life. But the discussion is becoming what exactly constitutes the riff and what did Keith add to it. he probably knows best though.
My mistake about the key.
I was a whole step out.
The home key should be C.
The main riff should be Eb, C, Ab, Bb, C
and the song should be (verse) C, F, C, Bb, C, (chorus) G, C, G, C
I've gone back over my previous posts and edited them and corrected them.
Anyway, everything else I said still stands.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 08:19 by howled.
Brian and Bill wrote the Brown Sugar riff in 1968
Brown Sugar is Gomper backwards.
This and the 1970 version ends the debate of who plays the Brown Sugar riff. There never was one, I know, but also there can only be one Keith. This is some of Keiths best work. What is it with that guitar sound?! Strings of diamond and hand of steel. Listen to the perfect, 100% perfect timing with that little thump after the opening riff on the high G chord. In that sense its Keiths riff, the way he played it back then tastes real good.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 12:05 by Redhotcarpet.
YES!
Keith plays the intro properly - he stopped doing it like that in later years.
They also had the tempo right on this one and not the go fast version they did later.
Mick is funny on this video.
He sounds like someone doing a parody of himself.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 12:21 by GravityBoy.
Mesmerizing. I don't care whether Keith wrote the riffs and the hooks. I think Charlie once said that Mick played one of the first versions of Sympathy for him at his house and it was fantastic. The essence of Brown Sugar is there already.
Gomper is ace.
DOnt know why some fans have to say Gomper is bad, when it isnt.
When they started playing BS fast it lost all its appeal for me, Mick rushing the words and destroying the rhythm. The flatbed truck performance being the perfect example.
Drew
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 20:00 by drewmaster.
No worries, it´s an easy mistake to make - as it would be D on the 5th fret in standard tuning
Yes, even though he is just casually playing for Ike and Tina, his genius is a marvel to behold.
Drew
Agreed. And don't forget Taylor.They played Ampegs here.
I only heard it for the first time because it was mentioned in this thread.
I knew 2,000 Light Years and She's A Rainbow though, but I havn't listened to the Satanic Majesties album.
I don't hate Gomper, it just sounds very Sitar 60s and goes on too long for me.
I'm not really into that Sitar Flower stuff to be honest.
There isn't a sitar on Gomper.
The Inner Light.
No, but it sounds as if a sitar would feel right at home there.
Same reason as always, some people just love to hate.
That can be the case for almost anything.
Talk about your favorite band.
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Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
VT22
()
Date: March 9, 2013 01:34
Poor sound quality, best version ever, imo. Passion and fire.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
ryanpow
()
Date: March 9, 2013 02:49
"Did Mick or Keith write the Brown Sugar Riff?" is becoming the next "Taylor Vs. Wood".
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Silver Dagger
()
Date: March 9, 2013 02:53
Quote
ryanpow
"Did Mick or Keith write the Brown Sugar Riff?" is becoming the next "Taylor Vs. Wood".
I thought even Keith said that Mick wrote it all on his own.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 02:54 by Silver Dagger.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
ryanpow
()
Date: March 9, 2013 02:59
Quote
Silver DaggerQuote
ryanpow
"Did Mick or Keith write the Brown Sugar Riff?" is becoming the next "Taylor Vs. Wood".
I thought even Keith said that Mick wrote it all on his own.
yeah, I think he does say that in Life. But the discussion is becoming what exactly constitutes the riff and what did Keith add to it. he probably knows best though.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: March 9, 2013 03:32
He says a lot of things life, much of it not to be taken too seriously.
His claim on the sleeve about remembering it all being the first bump in the road.
His claim on the sleeve about remembering it all being the first bump in the road.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
howled
()
Date: March 9, 2013 06:57
Quote
DandelionPowderman
A D in Brown Sugar? Where??
My mistake about the key.
I was a whole step out.
The home key should be C.
The main riff should be Eb, C, Ab, Bb, C
and the song should be (verse) C, F, C, Bb, C, (chorus) G, C, G, C
I've gone back over my previous posts and edited them and corrected them.
Anyway, everything else I said still stands.
Edited 2 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 08:19 by howled.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
howled
()
Date: March 9, 2013 08:20
Quote
ryanpow
"Did Mick or Keith write the Brown Sugar Riff?" is becoming the next "Taylor Vs. Wood".
Brian and Bill wrote the Brown Sugar riff in 1968
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
GravityBoy
()
Date: March 9, 2013 08:32
Quote
howledQuote
ryanpow
"Did Mick or Keith write the Brown Sugar Riff?" is becoming the next "Taylor Vs. Wood".
Brian and Bill wrote the Brown Sugar riff in 1968
Brown Sugar is Gomper backwards.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: March 9, 2013 11:57
It was inspired by the plants in Keiths garden. Mick and Keith used to watch Keiths gardener and laugh as he cluelessly plocked opium for the boys.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: March 9, 2013 12:04
Quote
VT22
Poor sound quality, best version ever, imo. Passion and fire.
This and the 1970 version ends the debate of who plays the Brown Sugar riff. There never was one, I know, but also there can only be one Keith. This is some of Keiths best work. What is it with that guitar sound?! Strings of diamond and hand of steel. Listen to the perfect, 100% perfect timing with that little thump after the opening riff on the high G chord. In that sense its Keiths riff, the way he played it back then tastes real good.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 12:05 by Redhotcarpet.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: March 9, 2013 12:14
I love the way Mick sang it with that haunted desperate voice in 69/70 but the best vocal is:
and the 1975 versions starting with the best the flatbed, and all 1975ers with Billys excellent and very fitting and completely underrated backup. Last time this song really meant something. This is Mardi Grass Stones style. Awesome kinky genderbending opiatic afro brothel pirate rock.
and the 1975 versions starting with the best the flatbed, and all 1975ers with Billys excellent and very fitting and completely underrated backup. Last time this song really meant something. This is Mardi Grass Stones style. Awesome kinky genderbending opiatic afro brothel pirate rock.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
GravityBoy
()
Date: March 9, 2013 12:18
Quote
Redhotcarpet
This and the 1970 version ends the debate of who plays the Brown Sugar riff. There never was one, I know, but also there can only be one Keith. This is some of Keiths best work. What is it with that guitar sound?! Strings of diamond and hand of steel. Listen to the perfect, 100% perfect timing with that little thump after the opening riff on the high G chord. In that sense its Keiths riff, the way he played it back then tastes real good.
YES!
Keith plays the intro properly - he stopped doing it like that in later years.
They also had the tempo right on this one and not the go fast version they did later.
Mick is funny on this video.
He sounds like someone doing a parody of himself.
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 12:21 by GravityBoy.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Rutger
()
Date: March 9, 2013 13:31
Quote
howled
"I´ve written riffs that people assume are Keith´s. That was the first one I did. I´ve done many since." Mick Jagger 1994
[www.timeisonourside.com]
The very start opening intro pre riff might be a Keith intro add-on, on the recorded version.
Some people, especially non guitar players might not be able to hear or understand what I'm trying to explain, which is fair enough.
Guitar players can easily check what I'm saying by watching Mick's fingers and also by playing along with Mick in the Ike and Tina Turner clip.
The main Brown Sugar riff is in the Mick, Ike and Tina Turner video (open G tuning Eb,C,Ab,Bb,C hope I got the key right) but Mick varies it a bit with 2 Eb,C changes instead of one (Eb,C,Eb,C,Ab,Bb,C) but the next time through the riff, it's the usual Eb,C,Ab,Bb,C.
Mick is playing the riff in a shorter beat way, a more hurried way, that's all.
It's still the Brown Sugar main riff that leads into the verse.
The Stones arrange things in a final way as the song get's recorded or is ready to record.
It's only a casual showing of the song to Ike and Tina but the opening riff, verse (get's changed a bit) and chorus are all there.
Mick also changed the verse to Gold Coast etc etc later on (maybe in the studio) as often happens with Stones songs as they get polished for the final recording.
Mick wrote the riff and the whole song, even Keith says so in his book.
Mesmerizing. I don't care whether Keith wrote the riffs and the hooks. I think Charlie once said that Mick played one of the first versions of Sympathy for him at his house and it was fantastic. The essence of Brown Sugar is there already.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: March 9, 2013 13:56
Quote
GravityBoy
Brown Sugar is Gomper backwards.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
howled
()
Date: March 9, 2013 14:28
If I was Mick and Keith, I would have put only Brian and Bill on the credits for Gomper, and let them take the blame for it
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: March 9, 2013 15:21
Quote
howled
If I was Mick and Keith, I would have put only Brian and Bill on the credits for Gomper, and let them take the blame for it
Gomper is ace.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Redhotcarpet
()
Date: March 9, 2013 18:35
Quote
His MajestyQuote
howled
If I was Mick and Keith, I would have put only Brian and Bill on the credits for Gomper, and let them take the blame for it
Gomper is ace.
DOnt know why some fans have to say Gomper is bad, when it isnt.Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
drewmaster
()
Date: March 9, 2013 19:50
Quote
GravityBoy
They also had the tempo right on this one and not the go fast version they did later.
When they started playing BS fast it lost all its appeal for me, Mick rushing the words and destroying the rhythm. The flatbed truck performance being the perfect example.
Drew
Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2013-03-09 20:00 by drewmaster.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: March 9, 2013 19:53
Quote
howledQuote
DandelionPowderman
A D in Brown Sugar? Where??
My mistake about the key.
I was a whole step out.
The home key should be C.
The main riff should be Eb, C, Ab, Bb, C
and the song should be (verse) C, F, C, Bb, C, (chorus) G, C, G, C
I've gone back over my previous posts and edited them and corrected them.
Anyway, everything else I said still stands.
No worries, it´s an easy mistake to make - as it would be D on the 5th fret in standard tuning
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
DandelionPowderman
()
Date: March 9, 2013 19:56
For a long time, I mistook Gomper for ...See What Happens, and bashed it...
I take that back. It is indeed a mesmerizing tune, filled with emotions and a very, very good riff. The melody line is ace, too.
I take that back. It is indeed a mesmerizing tune, filled with emotions and a very, very good riff. The melody line is ace, too.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
drewmaster
()
Date: March 9, 2013 20:02
Quote
RutgerQuote
howled
"I´ve written riffs that people assume are Keith´s. That was the first one I did. I´ve done many since." Mick Jagger 1994
[www.timeisonourside.com]
The very start opening intro pre riff might be a Keith intro add-on, on the recorded version.
Some people, especially non guitar players might not be able to hear or understand what I'm trying to explain, which is fair enough.
Guitar players can easily check what I'm saying by watching Mick's fingers and also by playing along with Mick in the Ike and Tina Turner clip.
The main Brown Sugar riff is in the Mick, Ike and Tina Turner video (open G tuning Eb,C,Ab,Bb,C hope I got the key right) but Mick varies it a bit with 2 Eb,C changes instead of one (Eb,C,Eb,C,Ab,Bb,C) but the next time through the riff, it's the usual Eb,C,Ab,Bb,C.
Mick is playing the riff in a shorter beat way, a more hurried way, that's all.
It's still the Brown Sugar main riff that leads into the verse.
The Stones arrange things in a final way as the song get's recorded or is ready to record.
It's only a casual showing of the song to Ike and Tina but the opening riff, verse (get's changed a bit) and chorus are all there.
Mick also changed the verse to Gold Coast etc etc later on (maybe in the studio) as often happens with Stones songs as they get polished for the final recording.
Mick wrote the riff and the whole song, even Keith says so in his book.
Mesmerizing. I don't care whether Keith wrote the riffs and the hooks. I think Charlie once said that Mick played one of the first versions of Sympathy for him at his house and it was fantastic. The essence of Brown Sugar is there already.
Yes, even though he is just casually playing for Ike and Tina, his genius is a marvel to behold.
Drew
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
VT22
()
Date: March 10, 2013 00:13
Quote
RedhotcarpetQuote
VT22
Poor sound quality, best version ever, imo. Passion and fire.
This and the 1970 version ends the debate of who plays the Brown Sugar riff. There never was one, I know, but also there can only be one Keith. This is some of Keiths best work. What is it with that guitar sound?! Strings of diamond and hand of steel. Listen to the perfect, 100% perfect timing with that little thump after the opening riff on the high G chord. In that sense its Keiths riff, the way he played it back then tastes real good.
Agreed. And don't forget Taylor.They played Ampegs here.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
howled
()
Date: March 10, 2013 06:58
Quote
71Tele
Why the hate for Gomper?
I only heard it for the first time because it was mentioned in this thread.
I knew 2,000 Light Years and She's A Rainbow though, but I havn't listened to the Satanic Majesties album.
I don't hate Gomper, it just sounds very Sitar 60s and goes on too long for me.
I'm not really into that Sitar Flower stuff to be honest.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
ryanpow
()
Date: March 10, 2013 09:21
Gomper just sounds like something that the Beatles could do better.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: March 10, 2013 14:56
Quote
howledQuote
71Tele
Why the hate for Gomper?
I only heard it for the first time because it was mentioned in this thread.
I knew 2,000 Light Years and She's A Rainbow though, but I havn't listened to the Satanic Majesties album.
I don't hate Gomper, it just sounds very Sitar 60s and goes on too long for me.
I'm not really into that Sitar Flower stuff to be honest.
There isn't a sitar on Gomper.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: March 10, 2013 15:03
Quote
ryanpow
Gomper just sounds like something that the Beatles could do better.
The Inner Light.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Green Lady
()
Date: March 10, 2013 15:14
Quote
His MajestyQuote
howledQuote
71Tele
Why the hate for Gomper?
I only heard it for the first time because it was mentioned in this thread.
I knew 2,000 Light Years and She's A Rainbow though, but I havn't listened to the Satanic Majesties album.
I don't hate Gomper, it just sounds very Sitar 60s and goes on too long for me.
I'm not really into that Sitar Flower stuff to be honest.
There isn't a sitar on Gomper.
No, but it sounds as if a sitar would feel right at home there.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
Max'sKansasCity
()
Date: March 10, 2013 15:19
Quote
71Tele
Why the hate for Gomper?
Same reason as always, some people just love to hate.
Re: Track Talk: Brown Sugar
Posted by:
His Majesty
()
Date: March 10, 2013 15:19
Quote
Green Lady
No, but it sounds as if a sitar would feel right at home there.
That can be the case for almost anything.
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