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Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: December 27, 2020 20:01

oWell , I know the acoustic is Keith because the liner notes say so. But I dont know why one of the electric guitars cant be Taylor. Nico in his Complete Works says Taylor plays on Brown Sugar and Bitch also.Taylor also in his interviews over the years usually says what tracks he is not in .I have never heard him say he is not playing on Brown Sugar or Bitch.And I’ve never heard any of the Stones say Keith played all the guitars on those songs



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-12-27 20:36 by Taylor1.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 27, 2020 21:40

Quote
Taylor1
oWell , I know the acoustic is Keith because the liner notes say so. But I dont know why one of the electric guitars cant be Taylor. Nico in his Complete Works says Taylor plays on Brown Sugar and Bitch also.Taylor also in his interviews over the years usually says what tracks he is not in .I have never heard him say he is not playing on Brown Sugar or Bitch.And I’ve never heard any of the Stones say Keith played all the guitars on those songs

We heard the licks and lead lines Taylor played on the earlier versions. That track was wiped, and Keith added the one with Berry-licks.

But the main reason we hear that those two electrics are Keith is all about his idiosyncratic playing style and tone.

Keith has also said he played the acoustic.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: December 27, 2020 22:08

What about Bitch?

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 27, 2020 22:36

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Taylor1
What about Bitch?

I still believe Taylor plays the riff, although it sounds different on the live versions.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: December 27, 2020 23:08

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DandelionPowderman
Quote
Taylor1
What about Bitch?

I still believe Taylor plays the riff, although it sounds different on the live versions.

Listening to the extended version it's obviously Taylor on Bitch. Everybody sounds different on the live versions of most of their songs even when they played on the studio version. For instance, Taylor doesn't play like he does on Rocks Off, Richards has to pick certain parts to play live because he might have played multiple rhythm parts, etc.

I think the best case of what Taylor might have played on the studio version of Brown Sugar is the Altamont version.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 27, 2020 23:54

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TravelinMan
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DandelionPowderman
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Taylor1
What about Bitch?

I still believe Taylor plays the riff, although it sounds different on the live versions.

Listening to the extended version it's obviously Taylor on Bitch. Everybody sounds different on the live versions of most of their songs even when they played on the studio version. For instance, Taylor doesn't play like he does on Rocks Off, Richards has to pick certain parts to play live because he might have played multiple rhythm parts, etc.

I think the best case of what Taylor might have played on the studio version of Brown Sugar is the Altamont version.

Different, as in different right hand-technique.

This is how the Brown Sugar studio version sounded with Taylor.

[youtu.be]

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: December 28, 2020 00:13

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DandelionPowderman
Quote
TravelinMan
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DandelionPowderman
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Taylor1
What about Bitch?

I still believe Taylor plays the riff, although it sounds different on the live versions.

Listening to the extended version it's obviously Taylor on Bitch. Everybody sounds different on the live versions of most of their songs even when they played on the studio version. For instance, Taylor doesn't play like he does on Rocks Off, Richards has to pick certain parts to play live because he might have played multiple rhythm parts, etc.

I think the best case of what Taylor might have played on the studio version of Brown Sugar is the Altamont version.

Different, as in different right hand-technique.

This is how the Brown Sugar studio version sounded with Taylor.

[youtu.be]

Yeah I’m familiar with that. Taylor was more versatile than people care to give him credit for. He drops in a nice solo, but I’m not sure when that was recorded because Richards plays the solo on the Gimme Shelter version in the hotel. So certainly Taylor is on that version as there is testimony he played a Strat on the recording. Unless of course Richards wiped his part right in front of his face, which is highly unlikely for a 1969 Richards.

Studio version of Bitch sounds like it was done on a different guitar with a different amp and those factors go into how one plays a song. The strings could have been a different gauge, which changes right hand technique as well. The fact it’s a studio recording can change one’s approach. They added parts to the live version. To me this is much to do about nothing, especially considering the extended version.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-12-28 00:14 by TravelinMan.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: December 28, 2020 05:49

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DandelionPowderman
Quote
TravelinMan
Quote
DandelionPowderman
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Taylor1
What about Bitch?

I still believe Taylor plays the riff, although it sounds different on the live versions.

Listening to the extended version it's obviously Taylor on Bitch. Everybody sounds different on the live versions of most of their songs even when they played on the studio version. For instance, Taylor doesn't play like he does on Rocks Off, Richards has to pick certain parts to play live because he might have played multiple rhythm parts, etc.

I think the best case of what Taylor might have played on the studio version of Brown Sugar is the Altamont version.

Different, as in different right hand-technique.

This is how the Brown Sugar studio version sounded with Taylor.

[youtu.be]

Holy crap. Glad they kept working on it.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 28, 2020 14:52

Quote
DandelionPowderman

This is how the Brown Sugar studio version sounded with Taylor.

[youtu.be]


Interesting to hear Taylor's different input between this and the early 7-tees live versions. I can imagine he and Keith had arguments in the studio.smoking smiley

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: December 28, 2020 15:08

I personally like the alternate Brown Sugar with Taylor guitar better than the awful version with Eric Clapton

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 28, 2020 15:29

Quote
Taylor1
I personally like the alternate Brown Sugar with Taylor guitar better than the awful version with Eric Clapton

Keith's open G guitar on this only leaves room for melodic counter-play, or rhythm
guitar in the same fashion, as Keith does himself on the official studio version. The Clapton and Taylor version make the song a bit more open, as do the live versions with Taylor. However I'm not surprised that the official release became the bestseller because it's the most danceable version.

All attempts work perfectly well to my taste !



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2020-12-28 15:32 by TheflyingDutchman.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Taylor1 ()
Date: December 28, 2020 16:59

I also like the Brown Sugar they performed with Wood on the flat bed truck in New York City to announce the 1975 tour. The actual live performance, not the overdubbed 1976 Love Yo u Live one which is used on the 25by 5 documentary

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Pietro ()
Date: December 30, 2020 05:05

Love it! IMHO the song is superior to "Brown Sugar," the big hit from "Sticky Fingers."

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 31, 2020 15:43

Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: December 31, 2020 16:04

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TheflyingDutchman
Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

I still wonder why Richards played rhythm on Bye Bye Johnny in Vancouver ‘72 and Taylor took the solo.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 31, 2020 16:55

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TravelinMan
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

I still wonder why Richards played rhythm on Bye Bye Johnny in Vancouver ‘72 and Taylor took the solo.

Maybe they agreed on it on the spot.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 31, 2020 16:57

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TravelinMan
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

I still wonder why Richards played rhythm on Bye Bye Johnny in Vancouver ‘72 and Taylor took the solo.

And why Richards didn't continue to play the Gimme Shelter-solos after the 1969-tour.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: December 31, 2020 22:33

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DandelionPowderman
Quote
TravelinMan
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

I still wonder why Richards played rhythm on Bye Bye Johnny in Vancouver ‘72 and Taylor took the solo.

And why Richards didn't continue to play the Gimme Shelter-solos after the 1969-tour.

Because Taylor was @#$%& good at it? smoking smiley

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: December 31, 2020 22:37

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DandelionPowderman
Quote
TravelinMan
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

I still wonder why Richards played rhythm on Bye Bye Johnny in Vancouver ‘72 and Taylor took the solo.

And why Richards didn't continue to play the Gimme Shelter-solos after the 1969-tour.

Oh how I wish there was an excellent quality 1970 version where Richards, B. Keys, and Taylor all took solos!

Happy new year!

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: January 1, 2021 12:01

Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
TravelinMan
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

I still wonder why Richards played rhythm on Bye Bye Johnny in Vancouver ‘72 and Taylor took the solo.

And why Richards didn't continue to play the Gimme Shelter-solos after the 1969-tour.

Because Taylor was @#$%& good at it? smoking smiley

They're both good in different ways smiling smiley

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Rockman ()
Date: January 1, 2021 12:12





ROCKMAN

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: January 1, 2021 13:30

Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
TravelinMan
Quote
TheflyingDutchman
Quote
Pietro

And that MT guy could play rhythm guitar. He should've played it more often and let the other guy take the lead.

Agreed, but for some reason they only did that on some occasions.Taylor preferred noodling.

There is a saying in the United Kingdom that "if the cap fits you should wear it".

I still wonder why Richards played rhythm on Bye Bye Johnny in Vancouver ‘72 and Taylor took the solo.

And why Richards didn't continue to play the Gimme Shelter-solos after the 1969-tour.

Because Taylor was @#$%& good at it? smoking smiley

They're both good in different ways smiling smiley

Very true. thumbs up

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Rip This ()
Date: January 1, 2021 14:17

who cares what Taylor did or didn't do on Bitch...the driving force on Bitch is Keith...his master class in my opinion...one of his finest moments....Bitch is all Keith.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: January 1, 2021 14:33

Quote
Rip This
who cares what Taylor did or didn't do on Bitch...the driving force on Bitch is Keith...his master class in my opinion...one of his finest moments....Bitch is all Keith.

You don't consider the riff an important part of Bitch?

I agree on Keith being a driving force, though smiling smiley

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: GasLightStreet ()
Date: January 1, 2021 18:54

I don't know if I like the duh duh duh nanananana part or the NEH NAHHHH part better.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 2021-01-04 16:20 by GasLightStreet.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Rip This ()
Date: January 4, 2021 14:19

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DandelionPowderman
Quote
Rip This
who cares what Taylor did or didn't do on Bitch...the driving force on Bitch is Keith...his master class in my opinion...one of his finest moments....Bitch is all Keith.

You don't consider the riff an important part of Bitch?

I agree on Keith being a driving force, though smiling smiley

not as important as Keith's sheer power on this tune...its KR ultimate performance I think...all muscle...everyone else just seems like they are part of the ride...

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Date: January 4, 2021 14:24

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Rip This
Quote
DandelionPowderman
Quote
Rip This
who cares what Taylor did or didn't do on Bitch...the driving force on Bitch is Keith...his master class in my opinion...one of his finest moments....Bitch is all Keith.

You don't consider the riff an important part of Bitch?

I agree on Keith being a driving force, though smiling smiley

not as important as Keith's sheer power on this tune...its KR ultimate performance I think...all muscle...everyone else just seems like they are part of the ride...

Don't forget Jagger on the studio version. The way he sings this song: feeling, power, confidence, and not the least the lyrics.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: TravelinMan ()
Date: January 4, 2021 16:57

It’s obvious the most important aspect of Bitch is...

Haha what a statement. It’s a song recorded by a band as a band. It wouldn’t sound the way it does if everyone weren’t locked in, and even Keef on lead guitar would tell you that.

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: JakeA ()
Date: January 5, 2021 20:47

video: [www.youtube.com]

Here`s a good proof that MT can play aggressively is he wants. Rhythm guitar on Live with me is played exatcly same style as on Bitch.
And if you listen Bitch, extented versions ending and Live with me´s third verse there is almost same guitar riffs on both tracks.
In think case is closed

Re: Track Talk: Bitch
Posted by: Midnight Toker ()
Date: January 6, 2021 12:59

Great guitar work.

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